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goethe.cx posted:My guess is Mazrim Taim 
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Jan 4, 2022 22:28
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Glory to the creator for that top of the page post.
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Jan 4, 2022 22:37
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Men only? Long black coats? Suspicious use of 1940s German military ranks? Checks out
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Jan 5, 2022 00:22
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The Notorious ZSB posted:Glory to the creator for that top of the page post. The Light protect us from his majesty
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Jan 5, 2022 01:16
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I'm absolutely digging how Rand keeps accidentally proposing to Avienda with various Aiel customs over and over in Fire of Heaven and The Shadow Rising. "Oh she's pretty upset with me because the Wise Ones keep having her hang out with me despite hating me, I'll go get here some flowers, girls like flowers, that'll make her feel better." Later we learn that the flowers he picked make a bridal wreath and he picked the same ones that another Aiel chose for their spouse and they mean "I'll love you even as the prickly girl you are" And the sword she gives him, which he says he really only wants the blade and she can have the pommel, which they all take as yet another sort proposal to her because of the gems in it. I think there was a third one too, can't remember off the top of my head. All the while Avienda is practically clawing her hair out because she doesn't want to violate the trust Elayne put in her to watch over Rand. It's just wonderful. I really hope the TV series does this well.
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Jan 5, 2022 03:25
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Nitrousoxide posted:I'm absolutely digging how Rand keeps accidentally proposing to Avienda with various Aiel customs over and over in Fire of Heaven and The Shadow Rising. "Oh she's pretty upset with me because the Wise Ones keep having her hang out with me despite hating me, I'll go get here some flowers, girls like flowers, that'll make her feel better." Later we learn that the flowers he picked make a bridal wreath and he picked the same ones that another Aiel chose for their spouse and they mean "I'll love you even as the prickly girl you are" Wasn't it the bracelet he gives her?
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Jan 5, 2022 03:26
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Nitrousoxide posted:I'm absolutely digging how Rand keeps accidentally proposing to Avienda with various Aiel customs over and over in Fire of Heaven and The Shadow Rising. "Oh she's pretty upset with me because the Wise Ones keep having her hang out with me despite hating me, I'll go get here some flowers, girls like flowers, that'll make her feel better." Later we learn that the flowers he picked make a bridal wreath and he picked the same ones that another Aiel chose for their spouse and they mean "I'll love you even as the prickly girl you are" Yeah it's amazing. The third one was the ivory bracelet.
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Jan 5, 2022 03:26
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Oh and then he gets jealous over Egwene (he doesn't realize) giving her a kandori snowflake pattern necklace or something.
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Jan 5, 2022 03:28
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silvergoose posted:Oh and then he gets jealous over Egwene (he doesn't realize) giving her a kandori snowflake pattern necklace or something. That was Mat I thought? But yeah Rand doing everything to basically propose to Aviendha and having no idea he's doing it is hilarious Also doesn't he go to her society (the Maidens) to ask for advice, which again is basically "I am interested in this woman and would like your approval and to let her know" The other great example is him constantly pissing off Lanfear by asking if she's Aes Sedai
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Jan 5, 2022 04:12
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If only Aviendha had, oh, I don't know, explained to Rand what those symbols meant instead of assuming that a wetlander would know all the intricate customs of her absolutely insane culture and then getting angry at him because he didn't know.
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Jan 5, 2022 04:49
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Mad Hamish posted:If only Aviendha had, oh, I don't know, explained to Rand what those symbols meant instead of assuming that a wetlander would know all the intricate customs of her absolutely insane culture and then getting angry at him because he didn't know. She does for most of them. I remember her explaining the bracelet and what asking her former spear sisters meant. She also tells him what the flowers mean, albeit weeks later. It still doesn't change the fact that everyone else sees him basically proposing to her multiple times, and of course she's been raised to consider all of them as proposals so they fluster her regardless. And of course she has her own burgeoning feelings for him that the accidental proposals exacerbated.
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Jan 5, 2022 05:03
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The funniest part of the whole Aviendha Rand situation is when they finally do have sex Rand is like "Well we gotta get married now".
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Jan 5, 2022 05:06
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Mad Hamish posted:If only Aviendha had, oh, I don't know, explained to Rand what those symbols meant instead of assuming that a wetlander would know all the intricate customs of her absolutely insane culture and then getting angry at him because he didn't know. Wasn't she instructing him on aiel customs like the entire time?
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Jan 5, 2022 05:09
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Yeah, Rand was learning a lot of stuff from her about Aiel culture that was more immediately relevant than 'how to woo a lady and propose marriage' and had a ton of other responsibilities and things to learn. Like if I was tasked with teaching a culturally-ignorant messiah the most important beats of my culture I would probably not start with what kinds of gifts are appropriate to ask someone out with or that rings are used to propose marriage.
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Jan 5, 2022 05:12
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Zore posted:Yeah, Rand was learning a lot of stuff from her about Aiel culture that was more immediately relevant than 'how to woo a lady and propose marriage' and had a ton of other responsibilities and things to learn. Also even on the parts where they did discuss at length she appeared to be awful at explaining why things were important and he was too dense to puzzle out why it differed from back home so they just went in circles a lot.
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Jan 5, 2022 05:23
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To be fair, the wise ones didn’t place her with him because she was a good teacher or an excellent spy. They put her there because she was a pretty girl his age and they wanted them to bone to tie him to them.
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Jan 5, 2022 05:28
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Also like 3/4 of the time Avi's explaining Aiel customs to Rand he's not really paying attention, so even if she did cover marriage customs at some point there's a good chance he wasn't listening
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Jan 5, 2022 05:45
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Nitrousoxide posted:Later we learn that the flowers he picked make a bridal wreath and he picked the same ones that another Aiel chose for their spouse and they mean "I'll love you even as the prickly girl you are" He doesn't actually get her flowers. He thinks about it, but doesn't follow through, iirc because he thought she wouldn't like them since she was a maiden. But then he argues with himself about it because he also saw some maidens wearing flowers in their hair. So he doesn't do it because he's not sure if she would like them or not. Then he finds out about the flower meanings later when Melanie makes one.
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Jan 5, 2022 06:20
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Nitrousoxide posted:To be fair, the wise ones didn’t place her with him because she was a good teacher or an excellent spy. They put her there because she was a pretty girl his age and they wanted them to bone to tie him to them. Yeah it works on a bunch of different levels and it's great, and a lot of readers absolutely 100% do not get some of the jokes because they don't look beyond Rand's POV. There's a non-zero amount of people (probably posting on r/whitecloaks) talking about how avi was such a bitch for trying not being happy at his dope presents.
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Jan 5, 2022 09:03
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CainFortea posted:He doesn't actually get her flowers. He thinks about it, but doesn't follow through, iirc because he thought she wouldn't like them since she was a maiden. No, he picks segade blossoms for her and injures himself on the thorns.
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Jan 5, 2022 10:28
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CainFortea posted:He doesn't actually get her flowers. He thinks about it, but doesn't follow through, iirc because he thought she wouldn't like them since she was a maiden. quote:Whatever Aviendha saw, it never stopped her being scathing whenever she chose, which was most of the time.
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Jan 5, 2022 10:42
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Harton posted:Was there a single character without god like powers? From the first book: Crokus, Whiskeyjack, practically all the other Bridgeburners apart from Kalam and Quick Ben. In fact, apart from those two I'd say the only characters in Gardens of the Moon who display godlike powers are Anomander Rake, who is by the definition of the story a god, and Apsalar, who is being possessed by a god. See, the thing about Malazan is it approaches godhead from two directions. Gods are ultimately mythic heroes writ large, and Malazan plays with that by having its heroes actually develop the powers that are ascribed to the heroes in our stories. At the same time, it also plays with the notion that as they are just elevated people, gods can and do remain human and thus fallible. This is never better illustrated than in the conversation between Kallor and Caladan Brood, where Kallor boasts of how he has raised and destroyed great empires again and again through his hundred thousand years of life and Brood replies "yes, you never learn". And when it comes to it Kallor gets schooled by Whiskeyjack - not because Whiskeyjack is a godlike fighter, but because Kallor has never tried to learn or grow beyond himself. It's the ongoing theme - having godlike powers doesn't make you a god, being a god doesn't make you godlike.
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Jan 5, 2022 12:10
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Another fun one was how Aviendha tried to buy him off with a bejeweled power-wrought sword, an insanely valuable gift, and Rand just takes off all the gilt and gems and gives them back to her because he doesn't want to make her feel bad And she's tearing her hair out because he's accepted her gift, but given back most of what made it valuable (in Aiel terms) and so now she's somehow even more in debt than she started Jaxyon posted:Yeah it works on a bunch of different levels and it's great, and a lot of readers absolutely 100% do not get some of the jokes because they don't look beyond Rand's POV. The Wise Ones force her to sleep in his room too and they both hate it, and Rand trying to be nice about it just makes her angrier. It's great
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Jan 5, 2022 13:20
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I found all that Aiel/Aviendha/ji'e'toh stuff to be impenetrable and tedious when I read through it originally, but now I'm looking forward to going through it again knowing what to be watching for
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Jan 5, 2022 14:05
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DarkHorse posted:Another fun one was how Aviendha tried to buy him off with a bejeweled power-wrought sword, an insanely valuable gift, and Rand just takes off all the gilt and gems and gives them back to her because he doesn't want to make her feel bad It's great because as part of a sword, those gems and such were not nearly as valuable (though it did probably take her entire life savings to get) even though it was the Tree Killer's sword, because no Aiel wanted to have the hassle of keeping it without being able to touch it. But when Rand extracted the part that made it a sword suddenly it's incredibly valuable and regifted back to her so she's so outlandishly in his debt that she could never hope to get out. On top of the fact it's probably one of the most valuable proposals ever given and everyone knows about it. Edit: Speaking of cancelling debt, I also love when she gives him her belt buckle made from her spear blades she says she was supposed to give it to people she like and 3 people she hated the most to teach her humility. And she tells Rand that he's one of the three. But later you learn she's doing penance because she violated Aiel honor by lying to somebody, though they never say who. If you're paying attention though you'll notice it's probably for lying to Rand because she doesn't actually hate him when she said that. So she ends up even more in his debt for lying to him because she gave him the gift. Everything she tries to do to cancel the debt so she can protect both her Aiel honor and her pledge to Elyane just keep making it worse. Nitrousoxide fucked around with this message at 15:22 on Jan 5, 2022 |
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Jan 5, 2022 15:15
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Nitrousoxide posted:The Fires of Heaven: Chapter 4 Lol, well poo poo. I just read that book like a week ago and missed that.
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Jan 5, 2022 15:27
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Shadows/Fires absolutely is Jordan at his best, so much cool stuff going on and totally mindblowing events out of nowhere. Like "Boop! Here's Birgitte in the flesh!" had me completely flabbergasted to name just one, and of course the pillars at Rhuidean with the huge reframing of the Aiel and peek at the Age of Legends. Woof. It really is a shame how the use of the Power becomes less interesting as the series goes on, less space for subtleties as the scale keeps increasing.
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Jan 5, 2022 15:51
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Dysgenesis posted:They found the fossilized remains of a metal band? Lol Yes?
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Jan 5, 2022 15:57
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goethe.cx posted:EVERY MORNING I WAKE UP AND OPEN PALM SLAM A STREAMING VIDEO ON AMAZON DOT COM. ITS THE WHEEL OF TIME AND RIGHT THEN AND THERE I START DOING THE MOVES ALONGSIDE WITH THE MAIN CHARACTER, RAND. I DO EVERY MOVE AND I DO EVERY MOVE HARD. FINDING THE FLAME AND THE VOID WHEN I CUT DOWN SOME TROLLOCS OR EVEN WHEN I CHANNEL SAIDIN. NOT MANY CAN SAY THEY FOUGHT THE DARK ONE AT SHAYOL GHUL. I CAN. I SAY IT AND I SAY IT OUTLOUD EVERYDAY TO PEOPLE IN MY COLLEGE CLASS AND ALL THEY DO IS PROVE PEOPLE IN COLLEGE CLASS CAN STILL BE IMMATURE JERKS. AND IVE LEARNED ALL THE LINES AND IVE LEARNED HOW TO MAKE MYSELF AND MY APARTMENT LESS LONELY BY TUGGING MY BRAID. 2 HOURS INCLUDING SKIRT SMOOTHING EVERY MORNING. THEN I SNIFF
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Jan 5, 2022 17:24
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Nitrousoxide posted:Edit: Jordan did a good job with these scenes where you get some information but also know or learn enough context to know why it's wrong. There's also a good scene where she gets punished for something similar and tells someone that she had to beat all of the rugs even if it took her the whole night and later Bair says something like, "I told her to beat some rugs until she had worked out some of her temper." I also like the conversation with Barthanes in TGH because you can interpret all of Rand's statements as being both extremely politically subtle or as something a hillbilly sheep farmer in over his head would say.
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Jan 5, 2022 17:34
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Nitrousoxide posted:On top of the fact it's probably one of the most valuable proposals ever given and everyone knows about it. It's not a proposal, it's an interest gift. Only women can propose among the Aiel, it's what they make the bridal wreath for.
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Jan 5, 2022 17:38
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Nitrousoxide posted:It's great because as part of a sword, those gems and such were not nearly as valuable (though it did probably take her entire life savings to get) even though it was the Tree Killer's sword, because no Aiel wanted to have the hassle of keeping it without being able to touch it. But when Rand extracted the part that made it a sword suddenly it's incredibly valuable and regifted back to her so she's so outlandishly in his debt that she could never hope to get out. On top of the fact it's probably one of the most valuable proposals ever given and everyone knows about it. She explained that she got it because it was so cheap, no one wanted it anymore but young Aiel who didn't know better. Giving her back the gems and gilt probably was the expensive part, but she got it cheap.
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Jan 5, 2022 18:07
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Not quite "who didn't know better", exactly. Laman's sword was an honorable trophy of their just vengeance for a horrific insult. It was also a sword, a weapon which Aiel have a deeply ingrained disgust and contempt for. By this time, the latter had outweighed the former for most.
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Jan 5, 2022 18:35
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seaborgium posted:She explained that she got it because it was so cheap, no one wanted it anymore but young Aiel who didn't know better. Giving her back the gems and gilt probably was the expensive part, but she got it cheap. She didn't say it was cheap. She said it was less expensive than it used to be when it was first taken. When Rand took off the blade and returned the rest to her as a gift (as she saw it) she got all the stuff that still had the honor of being taken as the Tree Killer's trophy without all the baggage of it being a sword anymore. So not only were the gems and such valuable in their own right, but they had the value of being the unencumbered trophy of Tree Killer, making it a huge gift. One she could probably never cancel out.
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Jan 5, 2022 18:57
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Ah yes Ebour Dar now, it's a pretty vile society, suited for the seanchan really.
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Jan 5, 2022 19:33
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Lool the show thread is referring to the Seanchan as the "sea folk", yeah sure let's go with that
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Jan 5, 2022 23:06
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Huh, didn't remember or expect a speech from Birgitte to Nynaeve about not disempowering her of her own choices in a book written in the early 90's in the Fires of Heaven.
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Jan 5, 2022 23:08
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Nitrousoxide posted:Huh, didn't remember or expect a speech from Birgitte to Nynaeve about not disempowering her of her own choices in a book written in the early 90's in the Fires of Heaven. For all the poo poo people give Jordan, much of it deserved, he was trying. Sometimes in every sense of the word, but still, just making the effort is so much more than so many authors.
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Jan 5, 2022 23:12
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Data Graham posted:Lool the show thread is referring to the Seanchan as the "sea folk", yeah sure let's go with that that's me, in part because people kept calling them the seanchan 
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Jan 5, 2022 23:18
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Pro move then, I like
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Jan 5, 2022 23:18
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