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It doesn't matter if the words arrive in his ears or straight into his head: 'I told you, you talk too much'
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Feb 10, 2022 11:28
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New type communication isn't telepathy. You aren't hearing words spoken at you, you're feeling them inside you
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Feb 10, 2022 11:32
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:g against any other gundam is unfair because they are different genres. machine specs don't matter to a giant windmill in space. They've put G Gundam in a ton of games with other Gundams. Gaius Marius posted:Counter to that, with a powerful enough Newtype, or GN particle bullshit. How is Mika going to react to feeling not just the Barbatos but also the thoughts and feelings of his enemies. Given how emotionally hosed he is it might gently caress him right up. "You're in the way. Die."
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Feb 10, 2022 11:43
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Amuro would absolutely kill Mika because outside of a couple characters he does not gently caress with half measures, he would realize Mika is most dangerous at close range and then make it his absolute priority to end that man’s career, and given that it’s Amuro he’d probably find some batshit way to get around beams being devalued.
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Feb 10, 2022 12:51
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Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:Amuro would absolutely kill Mika because outside of a couple characters he does not gently caress with half measures, he would realize Mika is most dangerous at close range and then make it his absolute priority to end that man’s career, and given that it’s Amuro he’d probably find some batshit way to get around beams being devalued. Amuro usually carries a bazooka. Point blank shot to the cockpit, and he'd be able to secure the kill. Now, getting that point blank shot, that would be much more difficult. But Amuro could do it. Mika would just make him know he'd been in a fight.
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Feb 10, 2022 13:14
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I don't even know if a point blank bazooka shot would actually disable the Barbatos. The PD mobile suits are shown getting smashed by some pretty ridiculous stuff without hitting mission kill status. The Barbatos itself was still functional and operational after eating direct Dainsleif hits.
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Feb 10, 2022 13:19
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RevolverDivider posted:No at the first Ramba Ral fight Mika with normal Barbatos rips Amuro into loving pieces and it isn't even really that close. I think Amuro is someone who rises to meet his competition as a pilot. He can scale almost any difference very quickly, and does so in the show. His biggest growth spike as a pilot had already taken place before the Ramba Ral fight really for instance, and he goes from "no idea what to do beyond making the Gundam move in basic ways" to "stabbing an enemy trying to sneak up on him from behind with his off-hand while fighting Char" in the space of 3 or 4 episodes right at the start of the show. The Gouf was a better melee unit than the Gundam, and all the Gundam's advantages were rendered pretty much moot by the context, but Amuro still beat Ral even if he took damage in the effort. As the show goes on he faces more competent pilots with greater ability in more dangerous machines, and having to overcome them gives him the incentive to grow as a pilot. Both because he wants to survive, and, early on, because he wants to prove his worth by being the best pilot. If Amuro did run into Mika then Mika would probably have the upper hand initially, but I would doubt how long that upper hand would last; even with the benefit of better defensive technology. It's possible that it would be so severe and last long enough for Mika to immediately terminate Amuro, but I don't think Mika could do that by the time of the Ramba Ral fight personally, and I do think Amuro could overcome that difference in strength even within one fight. Or, if not overcome it, at least grow enough to guarantee his own survival until the next fight. Stairmaster posted:Also I think ALEX is the only OYW suit that is dexterous enough to do close quarter combat with barbatos. I will not stand for this slander on Doan's custom Zaku II  chiasaur11 posted:I'd say that Newtypes would have a bit of difficulty because instant empathetic connection to Mika would lead to an instant "What the gently caress is WRONG with this person?" I don't even think that's true, to be honest. I'm aware it's certainly how people present it in the setting, but I don't think it's actually true and I think it's just one of those things that people overestimate about Newtypes in order to fit their own narrative. Amuro does form an empathic connection with Lalah, but I don't think he had any kind of empathic connection with the Black Tri-Stars, Dozle or even Char; people he faced in battle after awakening as a Newtype. I don't think he knew anything about them on any kind of subconscious level, and I think the instant empathic connection is just a thing that happens occasionally between Newtypes. Kamille formed such connections with Haman, Judau and one or two others, but even as someone who formed more of those connections on screen than other Newtypes I don't think he was forming them with everyone he ever met or fought by any stretch. I wouldn't take it that said connection was all that perfect in terms of what it communicates either. Amuro and Lalah had an instant connection for instance, but Lalah initially thought it was with Char and didn't realize it was with someone she couldn't even see for a start. They still make mistakes about each other when they know who they are in contact with though, and Lalah has to actively explain why she supports Char to Amuro because he has no idea of why, while Lalah thinks Amuro has no one to fight for and misses his connection to the crew of the White Base entirely. chiasaur11 posted:while most suits can't fly, the manuals confirm that as a matter of priorities, not an innate weakness. Grazes have full flight units available, and the Schwalbe was easily capable of it. I don't see how that matters on an individual level. If the Barbatos is facing off against a unit that can fly like the Shining, Turn A, Exia etc. it's cold comfort for Mika that theoretically someone, somewhere could make his unit fly in the future. Kanos posted:I don't even know if a point blank bazooka shot would actually disable the Barbatos. The PD mobile suits are shown getting smashed by some pretty ridiculous stuff without hitting mission kill status. It's worth noting that even when Amuro runs out of weapons or has no good weapon that he'll just take it off an opponent. So even in a case where he's fighting a unit invulnerable to the RX-78-2's normal weapons, he'll just take a weapon that does work off an enemy and use that on them instead. Which doesn't require damaging them, and could just be knocking it out of their hands using momentum.
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Feb 10, 2022 14:44
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tsob posted:I don't even think that's true, to be honest. I'm aware it's certainly how people present it in the setting, but I don't think it's actually true and I think it's just one of those things that people overestimate about Newtypes in order to fit their own narrative. Amuro does form an empathic connection with Lalah, but I don't think he had any kind of empathic connection with the Black Tri-Stars, Dozle or even Char; people he faced in battle after awakening as a Newtype. I don't think he knew anything about them on any kind of subconscious level, and I think the instant empathic connection is just a thing that happens occasionally between Newtypes. Kamille formed such connections with Haman, Judau and one or two others, but even as someone who formed more of those connections on screen than other Newtypes I don't think he was forming them with everyone he ever met or fought by any stretch. I don't think chiasaur was talking about "is Amuro going to have a newtype space brain conversation with Mika" style connection, I think chiasaur is more talking about the kind of thing where Amuro mentally saw Dozle as a hulking monster because the dude was so intense. It's pretty commonly depicted that newtypes can sometimes get somewhat overwhelmed with pressure when there's some person who is just absurdly intense on the field, even if they've never met or interacted with that person(to the point where this kind of thing shows up as a mechanic in Gundam video games). The momentary "holy poo poo what the gently caress?" flinch when they passively touch the boiling murder-cauldron of an angry Mika's mind might be enough to matter, is what I think chiasaur was getting at.
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Feb 10, 2022 14:58
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Kanos posted:The momentary "holy poo poo what the gently caress?" flinch when they passively touch the boiling murder-cauldron of an angry Mika's mind might be enough to matter, is what I think chiasaur was getting at. Has it ever actually made a difference in a fight on it's own? It mostly shows up in Zeta from what I recall, and I don't remember a lot of the individual fights in that too well.
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Feb 10, 2022 15:02
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A UC mobile suit bazooka has roughly the same specs as heavy PD cannons like the Barbatos's 300mm howitzer or a Reginlaze railgun like the one Iok uses. That's probably a decent guide to what it can do to PD machines.
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Feb 10, 2022 16:21
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Kanos posted:I don't know how many Gundam pilots could not instantly die to full on "Barbatos burn out my brain cells" Mika. Maybe like, CCA Amuro and Full Plot Armor Destiny SEED Mode Kira. Nobody wants to admit that the most evenly matched fight would be Mika vs Sekai
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Feb 10, 2022 16:37
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Kanos posted:They've put G Gundam in a ton of games with other Gundams. This is a very strange argument to make when SRW is right there, featuring Gundam right alongside absolutely ludicrous "planets are collateral damage" stuff like Gunbuster and still expecting said MS to potentially be useful. Even in pure Gundam games equivalizing suits is needed, because something like God Gundam, Qan[T] or ∀ Gundam would dumpster almost any suit in any Gundam series.
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Feb 10, 2022 16:39
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Lord Koth posted:This is a very strange argument to make when SRW is right there, featuring Gundam right alongside absolutely ludicrous "planets are collateral damage" stuff like Gunbuster and still expecting said MS to potentially be useful. Even in pure Gundam games equivalizing suits is needed, because something like God Gundam, Qan[T] or ∀ Gundam would dumpster almost any suit in any Gundam series. SRW isn't the yardstick I'm using, I'm looking at stuff like G Gen, which is operating from the same broad power pool instead of trying to work out a status quo where you've got the Nu Gundam hanging out with the Ideon and the Gunbuster. God Gundam is always a strong suit but it's not in the same bracket as stuff like Qan[T].
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Feb 10, 2022 16:40
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What are Amuro and Mika's respective power levels?
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Feb 10, 2022 16:43
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They're both at the "too much high power, man!" level. Any protagonist is, basically. Depending on who's in charge of the fight.
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Feb 10, 2022 16:44
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tsob posted:They're both at the "too much high power, man!" level. Any protagonist is, basically. Depending on who's in charge of the fight. Amuro is gonna win, because he's the most popular, and also because neither of them is allowed to die in crossovers so Mika can't be allowed to win.
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Feb 10, 2022 17:08
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Technowolf posted:What are Amuro and Mika's respective power levels? Well, that depends on if you mean Form 1 Amuro, Form 2 Amuro, or Final Form Amuro. It also depends on what multiplier of Kaioken Mika is using.
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Feb 10, 2022 17:10
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Kanos posted:Well, that depends on if you mean Form 1 Amuro, Form 2 Amuro, or Final Form Amuro. It also depends on what multiplier of Kaioken Mika is using. Mika going Kaioken is asking if he wants a half body stroke or a full body stroke.
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Feb 10, 2022 17:33
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Framing IBO stuff as "immune to all beams ever" also isn't necessarily backed up. They resist beam weaponry but we only really see one specific example of ranged weaponry Like to use one example from a lovely series Gundam AGE Vegan suits are immune to beam weaponry at the start until the DDOD Rifle was invented at which point it tears through armor like butter. So odds are pretty good that Flit Asuno could gently caress Mika's poo poo hard. Just utterly wreck his day. And since we are talking about "nuke civilians and loving hates Mars" Flit Asuno he'll be perfectly glad to kill asap. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Feb 10, 2022 |
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Feb 10, 2022 17:33
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I dunno, nanolaminate is seemingly so beamproof that the entire "beam weaponry" technology chain dead ended in PD - and we know that pre-calamity war PD had some insane ridiculous technology. We only see one beam weapon in use but it's a city-killing beam weapon that levels an entire town after the beam is diffused/partially blocked by a nanolaminate-equipped mobile suit, and that suit was completely and utterly unscathed(aside from its arm, which got hosed up only because the magazine in its weapon detonated from the heat). It's like a better I-Field except it has no power draw and is just passively on at all times and can't be disabled. The Hashmal's beam weapon is definitely a lot more impressive/devastating than the dinky beam guns that the Earth forces were using prior to the DODS rifle in AGE.
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Feb 10, 2022 17:57
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But the dods is a Beam that drills!
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Feb 10, 2022 18:02
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It’s also known that nanolaminate can be stripped off by fire and buddy, you know what one of the lesser known OG Gundam weapons is?
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Feb 10, 2022 18:06
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Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:It’s also known that nanolaminate can be stripped off by fire and buddy, you know what one of the lesser known OG Gundam weapons is? Now I actually want to see a battle between the RX-78 and a PD era mobile suit where Amuro wins by using Super Napalm.
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Feb 10, 2022 18:11
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Kanos posted:I dunno, nanolaminate is seemingly so beamproof that the entire "beam weaponry" technology chain dead ended in PD - and we know that pre-calamity war PD had some insane ridiculous technology. We only see one beam weapon in use but it's a city-killing beam weapon that levels an entire town after the beam is diffused/partially blocked by a nanolaminate-equipped mobile suit, and that suit was completely and utterly unscathed(aside from its arm, which got hosed up only because the magazine in its weapon detonated from the heat). It's like a better I-Field except it has no power draw and is just passively on at all times and can't be disabled. The same thing applies to AGE. It has absurd tech that was sealed away and the machines at the start are mostly using ancient versions of it. They have very similar settings which is weird if you think about it too long. "City Killing Beam Weapon" is horrifyingly not that impressive. Hashy is in many ways just a more effective Big Zam. Mika would wreck Dozel's poo poo no question.
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Feb 10, 2022 18:18
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Kanos posted:Now I actually want to see a battle between the RX-78 and a PD era mobile suit where Amuro wins by using Super Napalm. You know it's better because it's SUPER. Hope Mika added some heat sinks. Only thing I really want to add is that if you can't play keep-away with Mika, you're probably dead. As Kanos points out Mika tends to kill through blunt force trauma. Stuff like Phase Shift prevents penetrations, but it's gotta do gently caress all against the Barbatos spiking you like a volleyball using a mace the size of your chest. Your suit doesn't have a scratch, but you have a really nasty concussion and severe internal bleeding now. Ironically I think this might be where suit specs trump pilot skill, since if you can just move faster you're going to be at a huge advantage in staying away from the paste-maker.
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Feb 10, 2022 18:28
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A lot of protagonist units can fly, which makes it pretty easy to keep out of reach within any kind of atmosphere. I think a lot of them have pretty good protection against blunt trauma on their pilots too though, frankly. The Oz forces in Wing and various blocs in 00 use blunt force against the Gundams when nothing else is working, and while the pilots are knocked around a lot, and even blank out once or twice if I recall, I don't recall any of them taking actual damage from it. Ironically enough, the Turn A might actually be really vulnerable to that, at least early in the show, since Harry puts a dent into the Turn A's head around the mid-teens of the show using a simple punch from his custom SUMO that appears to slow down it's reaction speed for a while, as well as knocking out the cameras and some electronics in the immediate aftermath. The Turn A has already gotten pretty agile by that point, but if a simple punch can gently caress it up, then Barbatos could theoretically wreck it if it pinned it down. The problem is that later on in the show it appears to be a lot hardier, and stands up to missile strikes among other things without issue. Mind you, between the blinding speed it displays by the end, overall agility and nanomachines then there's really no reason the Turn A should lose if the pilot has some familiarity with the unit's capabilities. Or possibly has unlocked enough of it's own, and/or it's "healed" up enough. Turn A is weird like that. tsob fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Feb 10, 2022 |
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Feb 10, 2022 18:44
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Given PD's propensity for melee combat I'd like to see a dedicated fisticuffs suit like the Schuzrum Gallus fight the Barbatos.
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Feb 10, 2022 18:50
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The main issue there is that Loran, iirc, is exactly the kind of person who wouldn’t take Mika’s threat seriously and try to talk him down, which is basically the worst possible thing you could do
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Feb 10, 2022 18:50
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Pretty sure mika would turn pre-newtype awakening amuro into a fine paste They're both highly adaptable and have great reaction time but barbatos is so powerful that mika destroys his brain utilizing barbatos' full potential. Before the end of the OYW amuro was already finding the gundam too slow for him, and that would definitely get him murdered by the dude who has a direct neural link to his robot's motors. After Lala completely awakens amuro's newtype potential things get a lot harder to call, amuro is a monster after that point, but the amuro who could just barely eek out a win against ramba ral would definitely lose to mika, who demolished crank in the third episode of his show and only got more powerful from there. Amuro would definitely figure out that he has to keep his distance and play keepaway very fast, but mika actually has a fairly good track record there. He performed pretty well against mcgillis and lafter, both of which were exploiting the range advantage to the fullest. I dunno if mika is amuro levels of adaptable but he's pretty cunning when he needs to be, definitely enough to keep pace.
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Feb 10, 2022 18:51
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One big IBO disappointment is there were not nearly enough battles where lafter got to kick rear end after her incredible first showing against mika. I don't think she really got much battle time at all after that (that wasn't just cutaways to her shooting something offscreen, the "technically participated and presumably did something" level of fight contribution).
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Feb 10, 2022 18:56
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Her contributions after that were boobs
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Feb 10, 2022 19:04
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Let's meet up at the Last Shooting balloon. https://twitter.com/oricon_anime_/status/1491624484373405696?s=20&t=oPb9FaoAGBIlPNKi3IUjZg
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Feb 10, 2022 19:05
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Just also remembered that in this theoretical matchup, Amuro (and also probably Heero for that matter) would be entirely willing to just ditch their mobile suits entirely and cap mika while he was in a wheelchair or something between missions because they do not give a single gently caress about playing fair.
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Feb 10, 2022 19:15
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So that's how Amuro would clutch out the win. He'd Last Shooting the Barbatos in the one place where the nanolaminate was left off for economy purposes... the taint!Babysitter Super Sleuth posted:Just also remembered that in this theoretical matchup, Amuro (and also probably Heero for that matter) would be entirely willing to just ditch their mobile suits entirely and cap mika while he was in a wheelchair or something between missions because they do not give a single gently caress about playing fair.
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Feb 10, 2022 19:17
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with the wing boys, poo poo always gets weird.
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Feb 10, 2022 19:19
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Nessus posted:So that's how Amuro would clutch out the win. He'd Last Shooting the Barbatos in the one place where the nanolaminate was left off for economy purposes... the taint! The Barbatos would somehow end up with the Zero System
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Feb 10, 2022 19:21
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Gripweed posted:The Barbatos would somehow end up with the Zero System
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Feb 10, 2022 19:24
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I feel like Wing is the only other setting where people would be willing to give the AV a try voluntarily.
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Feb 10, 2022 19:33
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there'd be no risk as long as the procedure was sufficiently dramatic.
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Feb 10, 2022 19:35
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| # ? May 20, 2024 18:11 |
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zechs would absolutely do it
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Feb 10, 2022 19:38
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