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Deteriorata posted:https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1505613225525665794 https://twitter.com/VictorSiemonsma/status/1505614260742901760 Tankies gonna be upset.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:05
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Deteriorata posted:https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1505613225525665794 Yes, the 6th would be the same regiment seen about a week ago retreating under artillery fire from Brovary after losing their CO. Dunno how literally to take this claim of "destroying" it though. A regiment is a big formation and deleting one outright would be a massive victory. On the other hand, there's been plenty of word the past several days about the Ukrainians retaking ground east of Kyiv, so maybe they really did decisively overrun part of the Russian line.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:08
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Doccers posted:https://twitter.com/VictorSiemonsma/status/1505614260742901760 Is this really true, though?
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Mar 20, 2022 20:09
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Paladinus posted:Is this really true, though? Yes, tankies will be upset
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Mar 20, 2022 20:13
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Tijuana Bibliophile posted:Shot in the back then Zampolit on fleet is a well respected position as evidenced by the fate of zampolit Putin in Hunt for Red October https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jh69p8E8CAQ
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Mar 20, 2022 20:13
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Shut the gently caress up about tankies nobody cares. At all.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:14
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Paladinus posted:Is this really true, though? Good chance it isn't. There were also those 2 cargo planes that were not shot down and the ship that was not sunk and so on. We don't know.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:15
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Owling Howl posted:Good chance it isn't. There were also those 2 cargo planes that were not shot down and the ship that was not sunk and so on. We don't know. I was asking about the Prague bit. Couldn't find what tank regiments were deployed there.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:20
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Mr. Mercury posted:Shut the gently caress up about tankies nobody cares. Why do you hate tank enthusiasts? Despera fucked around with this message at 20:31 on Mar 20, 2022 |
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Mar 20, 2022 20:23
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Paladinus posted:I was asking about the Prague bit. Couldn't find what tank regiments were deployed there. I was also curious. The 6th Tank Brigade was deployed in 68, but what relation that has to the 6th regiment is unknown. Edit: Though going back someone seems to have added this bit of news on that page so who knows. (I do not take it as confirmation any which way)
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Mar 20, 2022 20:24
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Fray posted:Yes, the 6th would be the same regiment seen about a week ago retreating under artillery fire from Brovary after losing their CO. Dunno how literally to take this claim of "destroying" it though. A regiment is a big formation and deleting one outright would be a massive victory. On the other hand, there's been plenty of word the past several days about the Ukrainians retaking ground east of Kyiv, so maybe they really did decisively overrun part of the Russian line. Could just mean that they are out of usable tanks. Which I could certainly believe.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:27
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Nenonen posted:Just spent a few hours doing voluntary work for Red Cross at the local refugee reception center. My original task was to assist refugees in filling out forms and informing them what to do, which I was supposed to do with English, rusty Russian, and Google Translate. Once I was there, though, it turned out that today was a quiet day as there weren't any newcomers, so I instead participated in sorting IKEA blankets, bedsheets, pots and utensils for people arriving. It was a really therapeutic job, mind was focused on what goes in next and every complete aid bag gave a feeling of being able to help. You rock, well done! Just Another Lurker posted:This is just the start and it will get dirtier. Wife spoke to a Ukrainian girl from Kherson living in Budapest today. She said her relatives still in Kherson are saying they are running out of food. They asked the Russians to provide some but been told to gently caress off, now they are trying to buy from them. Also she said that the running joke now that the only part of Херсон the Russians managed to actually control is Хер. 
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Mar 20, 2022 20:32
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Given his Ukrainian background and the fact that he's in charge of military-political affairs and was killed in Mariupol, seems plausible that he might have been helping to set up local civilian liaisons (read: collaborators) in occupied areas. Which in turn would explain why someone had a bullet specifically for him.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:34
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Despera posted:Why do you hate tank enthusiasts? You let them gush about their setup at home, and it sounds fun. Then fast forward three months and you're taking out a second mortgage to build a custom habitat for exotic fish and a mini ecosystem where your dinner table used to be I ain't got that kinda scratch lying about
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Mar 20, 2022 20:35
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with a rebel yell she QQd posted:Also she said that the running joke now that the only part of Херсон the Russians managed to actually control is Хер.  I hope the russians hear this one
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Mar 20, 2022 20:36
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cinci zoo sniper posted:With respect to your Marxism, please bear in mind history of Latvia, if you want to suggest that I may not have the requisite context to understand how some political parties may be too dangerous to exist. I simply draw distinction between the executive will and the popular will (e.g., party gets banned by the court or parliament, or via referendum). I understand where you are coming from; and for the record, I do not believe in the authority position, nor do I believe in 'special' political parties with the right to monopolize state power. At the risk of getting too much into the weeds, my personal political position is that I am in favor of plural multiparty democratic states. The only difference in how I conceptualize governance is that democratic principles extend to all aspects of life--including the workplace. In addition to this, because I believe in socialist economics and would do away with capitalist economics entirely, my version of a democratic state is one in which political parties work exclusively to serve the people--never business or industry. Capitalist 'economics' where the world--all of the people, land, resources, the environment, and all the things in the heavens and earth exist to exploited for the private profit of a few--should be done away with completely. From that point of view, in such a future world, I can see how having a political party advocate for the return of capitalist economics could be problematic; and if you read between the lines, I think such parties would be problematic in the exact same way that the continued existence of the NSDAP (the Nazi party) in Germany is problematic, so I would not necessarily be opposed to--again in some future socialist world--banning parties advocating for capitalism in a similar way to how Germany has a blanket ban in its constitution on the NSDAP. quote:To that end, I think the act in question is immoral in the general sense, since neither every party nor each individual politician affected is rabidly pro-Russian I honestly do not know enough about Ukrainian internal politics to really comment on this, other than to say just because you are banning a party who, in general, has been advocating for and supporting the nation whose army is currently on Ukrainian soil killing Ukrainians and not at all constrained by norms around human rights, it does not follow that they are rounding up every member of the party and putting them in a camp--I would never ever advocate for something like that. From a pragmatic and common sense point of view, however, in the middle of a war, banning the organized political activity of parties who have a history of advocating for and aiding your enemy not only makes a lot of sense, but it actually protects the lives of Ukrainian civilians and soldiers. As we have seen, again, this is behavior that multiple democratic states have engaged in during their histories--particularly during the Second World War--and it never led to the long term degradation of democratic norms after the conclusion of hostilities. This alone is why I am reluctant to embrace the adjective 'authoritarian' in this case because context matters--both the context of the current situation and the context of history. quote:Whether if it is unjust or not it’s not up to me to claim, especially not until we see if the suspended parties are able to return to political life without obstacles from the establishment. As Paladinus noted, there have been some background plays in the lead up to this decision, where certain affluent opposition politicians did very clearly (and safely) bail the ship before the hammer went down. Generally speaking I trust people's litmus on whether or not something is 'unjust.' While we can all think of instances where people claim injustice for stupid reasons, for the most part I think we as a species have a pretty good feel for being to empathize with others and making a determination whether or not a law, or an action taken by a state, feels correct or 'just.' I am only mentioning this because I do not want you, or anyone else, to feel like they have to abdicate making judgement calls about the behaviors of state actors. Justice, much like the US Supreme Court's take on obscenity, is hard to pin down with necessary and sufficient conditions... but often as not we know injustice when we see it. ZombieLenin fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Mar 20, 2022 |
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Mar 20, 2022 20:36
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ninjoatse.cx posted:The denial of the war to even their own family members is appearing all over in newsfeeds. Not a single one that’s touched on the Russian perspective has failed to mention horrible things happening to their family members at the hands of the Russian military being denied by their family members in Russia. I've got family across Russia and Ukraine. The Russian side is now well aware of what's going on (early on they were not) and is terrified of being drafted to fight, or arrested for speaking against the war. Honestly I can forgive their initial denials due to their brains just not wanting to believe such a horror and so reflexively denying it as a coping mechanism. Right now the men in our family who are facing the possibility of being made to go are trying to find ways out of the country. And if they can't escape trying to figure out how to surrender quickly without being shot by either side.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:39
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spacetoaster posted:
This is the part that fucks with me the most. How many Russian soldiers were just conscripted and shoved into Ukraine only to try and surrender unsuccessfully? It's just tragedy on top of tragedy.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:42
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Deteriorata posted:https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1505613225525665794 This is in line with earlier claims (from March 10) about killing their commander under Kyiv (supposedly during that video where tank column gets ambushed by drones in Brovary). If that's true, then it's time to go back to my post about name structure for Russian units. Remember the guards bit, and the medals, as a measure of the prestige of units? This would then be 6th Guards Lviv's Order of Lenin, Red Banner, Orders of Suvorov, Kutuzov, and Bogdan Khmelnitsky Tank Regiment. The "Lviv's" bit is an honorary nickname, which is a rare and prestigious sight (think of it like brotherly cities poo poo). They're part of 90th Guards Vitebsk-Novgorod Twice Red Banner Tank Division, which was 6th Guards Motor Rifle Division between 1965 and 1985 - which participated in Operation Dunay (the tankies bit). cinci zoo sniper fucked around with this message at 20:45 on Mar 20, 2022 |
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Mar 20, 2022 20:42
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Paladinus posted:I was asking about the Prague bit. Couldn't find what tank regiments were deployed there. It got a bit messy with units after the split of the Soviet Union and subsequent army reforms. For instance: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/128th_Mountain_Assault_Brigade_(Ukraine) quote:The 128th Mountain Assault Brigade is a formation of the Ukrainian Ground Forces.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:44
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When oil companies think your country is doing something immoral and don't want to be involved  https://twitter.com/DAlperovitch/status/1505628552296902661?s=20&t=xWwAjCdfUbngJ_gH3EtLLQ I'm not sure if this will have many consequences in the immediate short term, but medium and long term it's some bad news. Seems like not being able to service oil field equipment will turn into a serious issue for a petro-state
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Mar 20, 2022 20:45
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Apparently Germany has reached a deal to buy gas from Qatar in order to reduce their reliance on Russia: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-03-20/germany-reaches-deal-to-buy-qatari-gas-in-pivot-from-russia?srnd=premium-europe quote:Germany on Sunday reached a deal to obtain gas from Qatar as Europe’s biggest economy looks to replace part of its gas needs currently supplied by Russia. Not terribly clear about when this would happen or how much it would be, but the speed that they reached a deal here is encouraging at least.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:48
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Chalks posted:Not terribly clear about when this would happen or how much it would be, but the speed that they reached a deal here is encouraging at least.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:49
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Doccers posted:https://twitter.com/VictorSiemonsma/status/1505614260742901760 Given the state of Russian army, might even be the same tanks.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:52
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cinci zoo sniper posted:This is in line with earlier claims (from March 10) about killing their commander under Kyiv (supposedly during that video where tank column gets ambushed by drones in Brovary). As a side note, Ukraine recently dropped most of those designations from its units. (Perhaps most noticeable on the 24th, which somehow seems to not have been Guards?).
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Mar 20, 2022 20:53
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Xarn posted:Given the state of Russian army, might even be the same tanks. They belonged in a museum!
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Mar 20, 2022 20:54
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Can someone explain to me the whole "Zelensky is being held hostage to stay in Ukraine by nazis" talking point?
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Mar 20, 2022 20:54
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:Can someone explain to me the whole "Zelensky is being held hostage to stay in Ukraine by nazis" talking point? Presumably it's the sound of someone's spine snapping as they bend over backwards to explain how Russia is fighting Nazis
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Mar 20, 2022 20:56
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:Can someone explain to me the whole "Zelensky is being held hostage to stay in Ukraine by nazis" talking point? 'Obviously the Nazis allowed him to take this meaningless role as a ruse! uhh... and he's not being ALLOWED to flee, so he's making the best of it, but really, it's all nazis. Talk about the Nazis not the exploding schools, please'
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Mar 20, 2022 20:56
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KitConstantine posted:When oil companies think your country is doing something immoral and don't want to be involved huh, i heard from a friend a while back that schlumberger was pulling all of their people out, but they also said that they had a small footprint in russia to begin with. knowing everyone else is pulling out as well makes it seem more impactful
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Mar 20, 2022 20:57
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Chalks posted:Presumably it's the sound of someone's spine snapping as they bend over backwards to explain how Russia is fighting Nazis Yeah, I waded into some other forums and was really taken aback by what was being thrown around. it was like being immersed in a vat of nihilism, disinformation, and complete assholery.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:57
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:Can someone explain to me the whole "Zelensky is being held hostage to stay in Ukraine by nazis" talking point? Certain privileged, comfortable people can't fathom the idea of somebody standing up to aggression and fighting for their existence, and also the fact that he's resisting and has universal support among his own people is ruining their role-playing session as anti-imperialists (which is a worse crime than shelling hospitals).
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Mar 20, 2022 20:58
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KitConstantine posted:When oil companies think your country is doing something immoral and don't want to be involved I doubt it's the ethics, it's more likely the nationalization moves Putin has made. No point in investing in a nation if everything you invest is gonna get yoinked.
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Mar 20, 2022 20:59
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ik edit:  tank gets blown up while a dude crawls on itAnother Stugna hit on a tank. You can see in the reflection that the operator crosses himself multiple times before he fires. https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1505618403838599175 (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) Somebody fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Mar 20, 2022 |
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Mar 20, 2022 21:01
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I was genuinely surprised a few years ago to learn that the art of digging a hole for oil, while obviously a technical exercise requiring expertise, is still a developing science. This does actually cause Russia exploitation problems.
Alchenar fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Mar 20, 2022 |
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Mar 20, 2022 21:01
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:Can someone explain to me the whole "Zelensky is being held hostage to stay in Ukraine by nazis" talking point? Western governments supports Ukraine so Ukraine must be bad and the worst you can be is a nazi but since Zelensky is jewish that's a difficult sell but if he is controlled by nazis then his government is as illegitimate as if it was all nazis.
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Mar 20, 2022 21:02
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eXXon posted:Insisting that Ukraine retain all of Donbass - let alone Crimea - at any cost, really does not seem like the path to a peaceful resolution. You may as well ask for retaking Transnistria or South Ossetia. I'm certainly not insisting Ukraine do anything. If Ukraine wants to a referendum about the sovereign status of these areas, that's perfectly fine. If they don't want to retake them, but want to appeal to the UN while Russia occupies them, that's up to Ukraine. But I strongly oppose that the EU in any way try to undermine the territorial sovereignty of Ukraine - and I dearly hope that Ukraine is not put in a position of being forced to cede territory to an invader. Russia unlawfully annexed this territory and it is not recognized by the UN as part of Russia or as independent republics. When I talk about 'at any cost' (except nuclear escalation) I am talking about our support for Ukraine against the invader. I do not have any wish for my government to try and impose any outcome on the Ukrainians - be that surrender or reconquest. I am saying we should not under any circumstances accept that Russia impose its will on Ukraine through invasion. Not that we ourselves should impose anything. The entire point is that Ukraine should remain a sovereign and free nation. Sadly, the Russian regime has escalated what was at one point a conflict into something else entirely. This is no longer a territorial dispute. The Russian regime has proven to be fundamentally unwilling to co-exist peacefully with the rest of Europe. What the Russian regime has done to Ukraine they will not hesitate to do to the rest of Europe. We do not know if the next American president will be our ally. Thus the Russian regime poses an existential threat to the nations of Europe - in particular those bordering Russia. The bridges have been burned by this heinous invasion, and until the Russian regime is removed from power, we have a hostile nation at our border. So not only is it morally right to support the Ukrainian people against an unlawful invasion and the atrocious acts that have followed, it is also in our own best interest that the Russian regime is defeated and eventually overthrown. I know the road to a better Russian government is not an easy one as the entire power structure seems to be corrupt and imposing democracy doesn't work. But that is a matter for the future - currently we are faced with an enemy and need to act accordingly. Not by letting Ukraine suffer on our behalf - this is not a proxy war. Helping Ukraine and opposing Russia are two separate concerns that currently overlap. One is not the means to the other. Russian aggression against Ukraine made them our enemy - not the other way around.
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Mar 20, 2022 21:02
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KitConstantine posted:When oil companies think your country is doing something immoral and don't want to be involved I don't think ethics and morality are high on the list of oil company priorities.
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Mar 20, 2022 21:02
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Owling Howl posted:Western governments supports Ukraine so Ukraine must be bad and the worst you can be is a nazi but since Zelensky is jewish that's a difficult sell but if he is controlled by nazis then his government is as illegitimate as if it was all nazis. It seemed that simple, but I figured I would ask for some clarity. This conflict really has caused the mask to slip for many.
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Mar 20, 2022 21:04
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Owling Howl posted:Western governments supports Ukraine so Ukraine must be bad and the worst you can be is a nazi but since Zelensky is jewish that's a difficult sell but if he is controlled by nazis then his government is as illegitimate as if it was all nazis. Hear me out though: What if the current president of Ukraine is actually just two small nazis wearing a Zelenskyy costume?
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