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Marshal Prolapse posted:I’d say the rest of the Baltics are likely to as well. Already the case de facto, this may be a coordinated move. https://www.lsm.lv/raksts/zinas/ekonomika/conexus-kops-aprila-sakuma-uz-baltijas-valstim-vairs-neplust-krievijas-gaze.a450779/ Russian gas flow to Baltics has ceased as of yesterday (detailed reason is not stated clearly), and all 3 are being supplied by gas from Lithuanian LNG terminal and Latvian gas reserves (we have the only depot in Baltics). mobby_6kl posted:Jesus Christ I'll wait for confirmation but that's horrific. My mom's friend lives there and their son was staying put waaay too long, but he got out eventually. Wtf. fnox posted:Is there confirmation of this? I don't think they would straight up execute every able bodied man remaining in the village and then just leave their bodies in the street but gently caress, at this stage everything is possible. I’d like a separate confirmation as well, but Politico Europe chief editor is credible enough for me to post this.
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Apr 2, 2022 20:48
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It would be exactly the same kind of poo poo that went down in the balkan wars so if found it horrifyingly unsurprising yet damning at the same time. Just a whiff of it is too much, even if its some random Russian major doing a dollar store Srebrenica.
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Apr 2, 2022 20:50
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SlowBloke posted:Post war EU procurement has been a lot of projects that ended up under delivering while being over budgets, with the main reaction being cutting orders so the kit is under developed. Most european armies have been cut to the bone so i fear anything ground level would help but not be decisive, esp if after a russian full mobilization. Nah. Greece and Germany alone have combined more Leopard2s (~600) than Russia has T90s (active 350+storage200).
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Apr 2, 2022 20:51
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vuk83 posted:Is EU airforce capable of mounting a dead/sead campaign? This is one of the biggest holes in non-US NATO capabilities that is hopefully filled by the addition of dedicated European F-35s. The Dutch will be the first to bring SEAD/DEAD capabilities back to non-US NATO forces.
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Apr 2, 2022 20:54
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mawarannahr posted:Source? He has a pretty big loving table. At last, a worthy opponent
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Apr 2, 2022 20:59
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Regarding whether this is a disorderly retreat or not, is there possibly some confusion of technical military terms? My impression is that an “orderly retreat” refers not to tidiness but to unit cohesion - that is, do the officers know where their men are, are the men still listening to their officers, are they all roughly where they’re supposed to be, and above all, if they were attacked right now could they turn around and put up an organized fight? If so, one can be untidy and leave junk everywhere while still conducting an orderly retreat. Can anyone with military experience weigh in and let me know if I’m wrong here?
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Apr 2, 2022 21:04
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with a rebel yell she QQd posted:I'm told Erdogan said he can't host the meeting between Putin and Zelensky, because they don't have a table long enough. Embarrassingly, he have a big enough table, but only 2 chairs.
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Apr 2, 2022 21:10
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I have started watching Servant of the People (Слуга народу), the Zelensky show. I've only made it to episode 5/51 now but it's definitely worth taking a look at if you can (in Finland it's in Yle Areena). One of the locations seen in it is the residence of Viktor Yanukovich, which was turned into a public park when he was ousted. More specifically the luxurious Honka club house, called so because it was built by Finnish Honkarakenne construction company. They have also built stuff for Vladimir Putin, Dmitri Medvedev and Elizabeth II. 
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Apr 2, 2022 21:10
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Tomn posted:Regarding whether this is a disorderly retreat or not, is there possibly some confusion of technical military terms? My impression is that an “orderly retreat” refers not to tidiness but to unit cohesion - that is, do the officers know where their men are, are the men still listening to their officers, are they all roughly where they’re supposed to be, and above all, if they were attacked right now could they turn around and put up an organized fight? If so, one can be untidy and leave junk everywhere while still conducting an orderly retreat. Can anyone with military experience weigh in and let me know if I’m wrong here? Yeah that's pretty much correct. However, a unit conducting an orderly retreat will not be leaving working vehicles and personal poo poo like helmets and guns behind.
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Apr 2, 2022 21:14
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Nenonen posted:I have started watching Servant of the People (Слуга народу), the Zelensky show. I've only made it to episode 5/51 now but it's definitely worth taking a look at if you can (in Finland it's in Yle Areena). Arte has it with German or French subtitles https://www.arte.tv/de/videos/104351-002-A/diener-des-volkes-1-23/
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Apr 2, 2022 21:15
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Relevant Tangent posted:colonizers always expect to be forgiven eventually, it's a huge blind spot I mean, we're not talking about colonizers, we're talking about their descendants. I would expect, at some point, that people would not be held responsible for the misdeeds of their far distant ancestors. Especially because 99% of humans are descended from some group that took land or other resources by force from some other group. It's not reasonable to say that Istanbul should be given back to Eastern Orthodox Christians to be the seat of a reformed Byzantine Empire, or that one area of tribal land in the US in abject poverty needs to cede it to another tribe living in abject poverty because their oral traditions say it was stolen before the arrival of Europeans. The idea that you can go arbitrarily far back in history when determining who has a right to an area is actually one of the twisted justifications Israeli settlers use. That's not to say determining who should have a right is always simple, because there can be a gray area between an act of colonialism that took place a decade ago where it should obviously be given back and one that took place a millenium ago where trying to do that would do more harm to humanity than good. But saying there's no statute of limitations isn't the way to solve that. Dog King fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Apr 2, 2022 |
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Apr 2, 2022 21:15
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Winks posted:This is one of the biggest holes in non-US NATO capabilities that is hopefully filled by the addition of dedicated European F-35s. The Dutch will be the first to bring SEAD/DEAD capabilities back to non-US NATO forces. Air support is costly on missiles, given the last time European forces went hard they ran out of ordnance in a week or so, those f35 would have to start dropping barrel bombs quick. Having f35 doesn't fix having stupid small stock of missiles and bombs.
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Apr 2, 2022 21:21
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Tomn posted:Regarding whether this is a disorderly retreat or not, is there possibly some confusion of technical military terms? My impression is that an “orderly retreat” refers not to tidiness but to unit cohesion - that is, do the officers know where their men are, are the men still listening to their officers, are they all roughly where they’re supposed to be, and above all, if they were attacked right now could they turn around and put up an organized fight? If so, one can be untidy and leave junk everywhere while still conducting an orderly retreat. Can anyone with military experience weigh in and let me know if I’m wrong here? During an orderly retreat, you carry your equipment with you, and anything you can't take with you, you render inoperable.
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Apr 2, 2022 21:21
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https://twitter.com/szescstopni/status/1509638049810030599?s=20&t=nNeuJw1KSNIiLhGOliPzNg
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Apr 2, 2022 21:22
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Feliday Melody posted:https://twitter.com/szescstopni/status/1509638049810030599?s=20&t=nNeuJw1KSNIiLhGOliPzNg 99% of Turkish men come back from military service saying “there were dudes there who’d never seen a toilet before. What a country” for my and my dads lifetime
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Apr 2, 2022 21:24
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GaussianCopula posted:Arte has it with German or French subtitles https://www.arte.tv/de/videos/104351-002-A/diener-des-volkes-1-23/ It's also in Netflix iirc.
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Apr 2, 2022 21:28
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https://twitter.com/jimsciutto/status/1510343433570897929 Now I wonder how updated they are. Besides the Kharkiv tank plant there are some facilities in Lviv though I would be surprised if they are not bombed to pieces yet, but maybe some orphanage was higher on the Russian priority list. (Ukraine does operate some T-72AMT though it prefers the 64 family... Come to think of it, did Warsaw pact countries get solely the cheaper 72 instead of the more expensive 64?)
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Apr 2, 2022 21:31
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slowdave posted:It's also in Netflix iirc. Only on select countries. Italy will start broadcasting on la7 on the 4th, blocking netflix here.
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Apr 2, 2022 21:32
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OddObserver posted:https://twitter.com/jimsciutto/status/1510343433570897929 The t72 was exported to a alot of warpac country's. The t64 were kept in the ussr, of which ukraine was apart.
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Apr 2, 2022 21:39
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Deteriorata posted:This seems to be a common theme. Each side says the other has accepted its version of the negotiations. Yeah, I very much doubt it unless there's been some significant shift in their wish list from Istanbul where they basically wanted every major power on the planet to give them security guarantees above and beyond Article 5 (and support their bid for the EU). And there's certainly no way the Russians are agreeing to anything like the former. OddObserver posted:Here is the Ukrainian position:
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Apr 2, 2022 21:47
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OddObserver posted:(Come to think of it, did Warsaw pact countries get solely the cheaper 72 instead of the more expensive 64?) Correct, T-64/80 was never exported.
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Apr 2, 2022 21:49
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 later in the thread are photos of tanks which are husks and may have bodies. https://twitter.com/OzKaterji/status/1510281020712624133 I wonder if these are really new wrecks
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Apr 2, 2022 21:51
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OddObserver posted:https://twitter.com/jimsciutto/status/1510343433570897929 I think we should be careful with holding our breaths, after all those “jets will be arriving within hours” tweets. PerilPastry posted:Yeah, I very much doubt it unless there's been some significant shift in their wish list from Istanbul where they basically wanted every major power on the planet to give them security guarantees above and beyond Article 5 (and support their bid for the EU). And there's certainly no way the Russians are agreeing to anything like the former. We also have public statements from US and U.K. that they’re not hot on providing such guarantees.
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Apr 2, 2022 21:53
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Just Another Lurker posted:I can just imagine them flinging olives & paper Bayraktars at each other across that monstrosity. Gentlemen! You can't fight in here, this is the war room!
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Apr 2, 2022 21:56
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cinci zoo sniper posted:
Which means if this war ends with Ukraine substantially intact there will be another war in a few years, and they'll be morally culpable for it.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:04
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Russia is actually mass murdering civilians in ukraine, not only by air but by soldiers as well. Come nuclear war but im starting to think there should be an armed intervention against russia.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:06
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OddObserver posted:Which means if this war ends with Ukraine substantially intact there will be another war in a few years, and they'll be morally culpable for it. poo poo, they were doing that in Syria. Where was the outrage then? [e] wrong quote:P
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Apr 2, 2022 22:07
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Nice of russia to make things extremely morally clear whenever given the opportunity
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Apr 2, 2022 22:08
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OddObserver posted:https://twitter.com/jimsciutto/status/1510343433570897929 Ukraine has T64s because they had the only real factories that could produce them. The only other nations that use them are Russia, Congo, and Transnistria. The last two barely have any. T72s are kind of the modern "good enough" tanks. Coquito was trying to explain to me what made them and the T90s particularly meh-to-bad, but a lot of it went over my head.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:11
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Cimber posted:poo poo, they were doing that in Syria. Where was the outrage then? Ah yes, seems like we should just let it slide, then! Also, there was plenty of moral outrage about Syria.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:15
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the popes toes posted:Rephrase the question Eh, the Biden admin said multiple times that if Poland wanted to hand their planes over directly they were welcome too. What Biden didn’t want it Poland to hand them to the US to give to Ukraine.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:15
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https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1510298120118325257?t=IgsqUvfBsq3QG69icet6fA&s=19 Seems to be confirmation of a full on massacre.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:16
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Dog King posted:I mean, we're not talking about colonizers, we're talking about their descendants. I would expect, at some point, that people would not be held responsible for the misdeeds of their far distant ancestors. Especially because 99% of humans are descended from some group that took land or other resources by force from some other group. It's not reasonable to say that Istanbul should be given back to Eastern Orthodox Christians to be the seat of a reformed Byzantine Empire, or that one area of tribal land in the US in abject poverty needs to cede it to another tribe living in abject poverty because their oral traditions say it was stolen before the arrival of Europeans. The idea that you can go arbitrarily far back in history when determining who has a right to an area is actually one of the twisted justifications Israeli settlers use. Yeah except in case of Eastern Europe, the descendants of the descendants of the shitheads still believe putting people on trains to ship them off to Siberia was the right thing to do.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:25
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Winks posted:This is one of the biggest holes in non-US NATO capabilities that is hopefully filled by the addition of dedicated European F-35s. The Dutch will be the first to bring SEAD/DEAD capabilities back to non-US NATO forces. Both Italy and Germany have dedicated SEAD aircraft and munitions. Not sure about Germany, but Italian Air Force trains a lot for that mission.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:26
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So the Ukrainian army found a mass grave, with four visible bodies, one of them with his hands tied behind his back near Motyzhyn in Kyiv Oblast. The follow up tweets contain similar pictures of executed civilians, some of them with their hands tied from Bucha. Just such a senseless slaughter. Russia needs to at minimum be sanctioned to hell. Obviously  https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1510336248526909447
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Apr 2, 2022 22:33
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The Village Elder(? --- not sure how to really translate Starosta) of Motyzhyn and her husband, who have earlier been reported as taken by Russian soldiers have also been reportedly found dead. I don't know if it's the same location of found bodies or a different one. https://www.pravda.com.ua/news/2022/04/2/7336699/
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Apr 2, 2022 22:37
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@Osinttechnical is doing a thread at the moment too. Report of five women, disposed of naked on the side of the road, doused with fuel and lit. These are the most directly bloody handed images I think I've ever seen.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:40
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Would it maybe be a QCS thing to ask for an alternate NMS tag/smilie? It's always bothered me that the same little crying face is the same image we use to tag dead bodies as we do weird DeviantArt posts. I'm willing to get told I'm wrong on this, but it's bugged me for years.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:43
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Pennsylvanian posted:Ukraine has T64s because they had the only real factories that could produce them. The only other nations that use them are Russia, Congo, and Transnistria. The last two barely have any. There's a big difference between the T72 and the various NATO tanks, but not that much of gap between the T64 and T72. The divide between the various tank lines within the USSR had much more to do with internal USSR politics than any sort of military strategy. The T64 and T72/T90 perform about the same if they have the same crew training, leadership, supply, and modernization levels. Ukrainian troops have all been training for this exact war since 2014, meanwhile Russia pulled many soldiers who never expected to get involved in a large conventional war. The Ukrainian officer corps have prepared heavily for this and signed up for their roles knowing that war might come and that junior officers suffer some of the highest casualty rates in a peer war. The Russian officer corps are full of failsons. The Russians have obviously failed at logistics in ways Ukraine clearly hasn't. Finally, Russian corruption meant that most of the money allocated to upgrade 40-year-old tanks instead bought fancy mansions. Ukraine still has corruption issues, but most of the money poured into their military seems to have gotten there. Now Ukrainian tanks have fancy things like good night vision, add-on armor that wasn't replaced with cheaper cardboard, ect.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:45
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Murgos posted:Eh, the Biden admin said multiple times that if Poland wanted to hand their planes over directly they were welcome too. What Biden didn’t want it Poland to hand them to the US to give to Ukraine. gently caress's sake, just give them to me and I'll tow them over the loving border.
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Apr 2, 2022 22:52
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