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excellent bestiary though
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Jun 16, 2022 12:45
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Cleretic posted:Worth bringing up: while it's true that Vaan wasn't originally intended to be in the game, the original plan actually had Basch as the protagonist. Ashe was always intended to be a prominent but non-leading role similar to Yuna, I suppose. This is both true and not quite true. The initial plans were for the protagonist to be "big and tough," though not necessarily Basch specifically. The idea to instead have a youthful, energetic lead character like Vaan came fairly early in development, despite the common idea that he was forced into the game at a late stage. But the general idea of what you're saying is right--in the earliest drafts, someone like Basch would've been the lead. Cleretic posted:I've always found Vaan interesting in that he's a completely different kind of character to the rest of the cast, and indeed most of the recent FF games at the time. I've described it before that most of XII's party is Somebody Special; they either have a predefined role within the world the game takes place in, or have a centrally defining relationship, that means that they're by nature an integral part of the story. Ashe is the princess of an occupied country, Basch is a central part of that country's deposed military, Basch and Balthier both have familial relations to core villains, and Fran is heavily involved with Balthier's story. This is why I ultimately like Vaan's inclusion, yeah. While Ashe is the protagonist once the story really gets rolling, Vaan (and Penelo but yeah the story forgets about her sadly) has a perspective that's really important for the story, and he plays a huge role in Ashe's character arc. Honestly I think people would have liked him more upfront if he wore a shirt and had a less whiny-sounding voice. Hell, maybe just the voice. Don't even have to change any of his actual lines or any of what he does in the story. Give him his brother's voice actor (Yuri Lowenthal IIRC) and I would bet the character would've had a notably better reception with western audiences just from that one change.
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Jun 16, 2022 12:52
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FFXII has very lofty highs, but also very long and monotonous lows. The story has some really cool moments, the world has some pretty interesting locations, and the soundtrack has some total bangers (the boss battle theme is epic, Phon Coast and Ozmone Plain always make me smile), but they're intercut with some of the most boring, bland scenery serving relatively unimportant plot points in the whole series. It's admittedly tough to make a really interesting area that's just "a huge desert" but at least in, say, FFX, they railroad you through there pretty quickly. Add to that the above-mentioned extremely bland zone music and it just sucks any momentum out of the game a lot of times. TBH the gambit system I think at least mitigates this to a point - yes, you can set up the game to basically autoplay a lot of the time, which at least removes a bit of the monotony of repeatedly hitting Attack etc., but in the tougher areas you often end up doing a lot more manual input.
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Jun 16, 2022 14:01
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Y'know that probably explains why I like FFXII so much. I'm the kind of person for whom a game's highs can often outweigh its lows, especially if they're really great highs. Even some really terrible lows in a game I can sometimes forgive if the highs are high enough, and I think that's the case in FFXII for me. It does have some parts that really drag, but the majority of the actual story IMO is real good, and I also love doing hunts and tracking down optional espers and just exploring around. That carries the game through the lows for me. If you enjoy the core gameplay loop of exploration and combat, the low parts of FFXII aren't that low either. If you don't, though, then hoo boy some of those long overworld or dungeon stretches between plot points are really gonna drag. And even as someone who loves the game, there is definitely a specific point in the story where I think almost everyone can notice that the game loses its way (immediately after Mt. Bur-Omisace) and it isn't until relatively close to the end that the story picks up steam again. If you like the core gameplay, enjoy hunts and fighting espers and dungeon crawling, that will carry you happily through the valley. If not, you're probably going to get bored and stop playing.
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Jun 16, 2022 14:13
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Yeah I personally didn't have a major issue with the boring parts but I can see how they would kill someone's interest in the game, especially since they throw arguably the longest and worst one very early in the game. It wasn't as bad for me personally on the first playthrough at least, for example I spent a lot of time in the first Sandsea slog learning about the kill-chain system, how often the drops upgrade, etc. I also appreciated how even early on the game was like "this area is huge and boring yes, but you still need to be careful because we're allowing you access to late-game areas that you may stumble upon and get immediately murdered." Can't you access Zertinan Caverns right from the get-go?
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Jun 16, 2022 14:30
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I think the game prevents you from reaching the Esper there until you've already gotten the first one in the story, but you can still enter the early parts of it right away with solo Vaan and get blown the hell up. FFXII has very few guardrails. There are some, but really not many. It's very funny how early you can stumble into the Necrohol of Nabudis for example.
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Jun 16, 2022 14:33
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Harrow posted:I think the game prevents you from reaching the Esper there until you've already gotten the first one in the story, but you can still enter the early parts of it right away with solo Vaan and get blown the hell up. My first time I was all "it can't be that bad right?" And then I stepped on the bomb traps and died.
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Jun 16, 2022 14:37
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Snow Cone Capone posted:Yeah I personally didn't have a major issue with the boring parts but I can see how they would kill someone's interest in the game, especially since they throw arguably the longest and worst one very early in the game. Yeah that's why I stopped playing the original when it came out on PS2, wandered into a high level cave and got one shot before I had chance to realise I shouldn't have been there yet. I'd spent ages wandering killing stuff and exploring and in the base game you could go well over an hour without ever seeing a save point if you were just pressing on to next area. So I turned it off and didn't touch it for another 15 years. Turned out I found it dull as dishwater even played at 4x speed so I didn't miss much.
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Jun 16, 2022 15:08
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On one hand, you're basically walking into fantasy Chernobyl and you really should realize that BLOWOUT SOON FELLOW STALKER on the other hand, while FF12's setting can be neat, the way it gives out information is absolute dogshit so you might not even know that fantasy Chernobyl happened or that this second (of 3) magical jungles is right next door to it. But seriously I know it's his shtick but holy hell for as little actual Plot that happens to and directly around the main party you think they could have filled in some time with more direct setting/lore building instead of flinging that off into side content and Singluar lines of NPC dialogue and hunter's primer datalog entries. ZenMasterBullshit fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Jun 16, 2022 |
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Jun 16, 2022 15:08
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FF12 could have really used a Maechen.
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Jun 16, 2022 15:18
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Fister Roboto posted:FF12 could have really used a Maechen. just put maechen in every game like gilgamesh
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Jun 16, 2022 15:32
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My biggest barrier to enjoying 12 isn't the characters but that every single character build is boring as gently caress. Autoattacking gets absurdly dull.
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Jun 16, 2022 15:33
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Yeah, that's fair. It's why I'm a big fan of creating "leader" characters that I directly control who generally have more to do. Shikari/White Mage, for example, makes a reliable tank and healer all in one and can often benefit from being directly controlled to keep everybody healed up, buffed, etc. Then I spend most of my time piloting each group's leader while the other two DPS-focused characters can just run on gambits. The Struggle for Freedom mod helps somewhat with this by making more technicks actually worth using and increasing the difficulty enough that you often need to take control and improvise in fights, though your best DPS is still going to come from characters being hasted and berserked and then just attacking.
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Jun 16, 2022 15:37
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Well, Garuda is NOT an airship in FFXII. She also gave me my first game over (other than my very first excursion in the desert as a new baby Vaan and I tried to fight a T-Rex) because I was so used to fighting even bosses on autopilot that I wasn't paying enough attention and everyone died. Second try, however, was smooth as silk. Know how I said this game reminds me of Star Wars? It still does. But I also get some Disney vibes from it, too. the FFXIII battle music is still stuck in my head. It's not bad but I did not like it enough to enjoy hearing it in every non-boss fight and it is embedded in my brain 
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Jun 16, 2022 22:44
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It's true that XII did not benefit from having its first many hours all in the desert environment. It has lots of interesting environments, but you have to wait a while before you see any of them.
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Jun 16, 2022 22:49
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The stretch from the Feywood through the Great Crystal is some of my favorite FF environmental goodness.
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Jun 16, 2022 22:51
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Schwartzcough posted:It's true that XII did not benefit from having its first many hours all in the desert environment. It has lots of interesting environments, but you have to wait a while before you see any of them. All of the cities you visit and explore are my favorite part of the FFXII environments.
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Jun 16, 2022 22:59
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dinal dantasy
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Jun 16, 2022 23:00
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stream startin
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Jun 16, 2022 23:01
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FrostyPox posted:Well, Garuda is NOT an airship in FFXII. To be fair, Garuda's only been a Summon in recent games, traditionally it's just a big feathery boss.
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Jun 16, 2022 23:02
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I love FF7 so much omg I am literally crying right now
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Jun 16, 2022 23:05
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Is there a mod that makes the controls for XII on PC not, well, crap? That is the only that has been preventing me from getting into it.
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Jun 16, 2022 23:05
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VII-Remake on steam tomorrow.
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Jun 16, 2022 23:06
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This stream sure is something!
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Jun 16, 2022 23:08
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Crisis Core remake. Time for the Gackt renaissance.
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Jun 16, 2022 23:14
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I’m watching on IGN and it sucks rear end
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Jun 16, 2022 23:15
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FF7 REBIRTH (remake part 2) Winter 2023
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Jun 16, 2022 23:18
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The non Gackt parts of CC are really good and I'm glad people will be able to play the only non FF7, FF7 product that doesn't suck
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Jun 16, 2022 23:18
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Crisis Core remaster is pretty hype ngl
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Jun 16, 2022 23:19
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:FF7 REBIRTH (remake part 2) Winter 2023 Is that what they were implying by "Next Winter," because I was worried they meant 2024 lol
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Jun 16, 2022 23:19
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Oh they are going full weird with Part 2.
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Jun 16, 2022 23:19
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Are they? I couldn't tell because the stream was rear end
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Jun 16, 2022 23:21
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Two new FF games next year? No way.
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Jun 16, 2022 23:21
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Called it: three parts, each one with a different "Re" title And yeah, poo poo is going to get weird from here
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Jun 16, 2022 23:22
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Arist posted:Is that what they were implying by "Next Winter," because I was worried they meant 2024 lol How do you get that from Next Winter?
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Jun 16, 2022 23:22
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That was Tifa who was quoted saying “I died? Are you saying I’m some kind of imposter”? That didn’t sound like Aerith’s VA. Or maybe I’m just an idiot.
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Jun 16, 2022 23:22
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SyntheticPolygon posted:How do you get that from Next Winter? I just figured they would say "this winter." I'm happy to be wrong.
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Jun 16, 2022 23:23
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Winter lasts until the end of March.
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Jun 16, 2022 23:24
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I assumed they meant winter 2023, meaning like November/December 2023
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Jun 16, 2022 23:24
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| # ? Jun 2, 2024 17:39 |
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Arist posted:I just figured they would say "this winter." I'm happy to be wrong. So did you think the Crisis Core Remake is next year when they said that one is "this winter"?
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Jun 16, 2022 23:24
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