|
So? People misunderstand works of fiction all the time. The Empire ate literally the villains. They die horrible painful deaths. Vader lets himself die because he knows he'd be better off dead. Sorry, Good Fiction = Always Conservative, forgot that. Also forgot about Jessica Jones, an Detective Show that isn't about a cop, doesn't promote cops, and has the incarnation of rape culture as the main villains. Tbf the mcu is problematic as loving hell, but i still need to point it out.
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 19:58
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 29, 2024 17:52 |
|
|
TheNamedSavior posted:So? People misunderstand works of fiction all the time. The Empire ate literally the villains. They die horrible painful deaths. Vader lets himself die because he knows he'd be better off dead. That's not what anyone is saying.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 20:05
|
|
|
Maxwell Lord posted:Funny when that movie came out plenty of people called it fascist. After all the medals scene looks right out of Riefenstahl. (Hell I've heard the same leveled at Raiders of the Lost Ark: sure, Indy fights Nazis, but it's still glorying in the violence.) It's literally a movie that glorifies a trumpian dudebro idology that leads to hundreds of innocent children being slaughtered every day, but its okay that the movie leads to a nuclear war because the airplanes looked cool. gently caress that.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 20:07
|
|
|
TheNamedSavior posted:It's literally a movie that glorifies a trumpian dudebro idology that leads to hundreds of innocent children being slaughtered every day, but its okay that the movie leads to a nuclear war because the airplanes looked cool. You seriously think this film will lead to a nuclear war? Explain this process.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 20:19
|
|
|
TheNamedSavior posted:Look up the effect Jaws had on marine life. the shark actually ate way more people in the movie than fish
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 20:23
|
|
|
TheNamedSavior posted:It's literally a movie that glorifies a trumpian dudebro idology that leads to hundreds of innocent children being slaughtered every day, but its okay that the movie leads to a nuclear war because the airplanes looked cool. How is it going to lead to a nuclear war? Maverick literally destroyed the enemy countries ability to produce nuclear weapons. Keep in mind thousands of Iraqi children were killed due to sanctions in the '90s under the Clinton administration.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 20:35
|
|
|
checkplease posted:A couple things: Thanks. I had an uncharacteristically strong reaction to this movie. Saw it with family on their request not really knowing what to expect, but seeing the almost universal acclaim for it made me feel like an alien like almost no other piece of media has. I don't think I suggested that a movie be analogously "just about an arrow hitting a far away target." The point I was trying to make with the analogy is that our admiration of the archer should of course depend on his/her target; that information could completely retroactively change our opinion of them, but why should it be retroactive? Why not begin from a point of skepticism as to whether shooting the arrow is something we reflexively approve of? Is the target a war criminal? A little child? A mime? Naturally, showing interpersonal and practical struggles can help to humanize the protagonists. But to portray those struggles while almost completely obscuring the context of the goal should give an audience great pause. The idea that struggle independent of its object is laudable in itself is dangerously vacuous. There's nothing inherently moral about striving towards a goal; it depends on what the outcome will be, something the movie is aggressively, conspicuously disinterested in. Again, this goes back to the idea of the "cult of action" which sneers at context and worships bold maneuvers (sound familiar?). I think another poster on edit - the previous page kind of proved my point by suggesting that a country wanting to process uranium (was it even established in the movie that a bomb was necessarily the goal?) was enough of a reason for an attack. None of the pilots showed any interest in the ramifications the attack would have even in the short-term, independent of whether the attack was successful or not; everything was portrayed through the myopic lens of navy politics, intra-team competitiveness, and resolving family issues. For me the conflict within the navy in terms of doctrine/tactics just served to highlight the contrast between the attention allotted to consequences at various levels. (1) Personal/team stuff. Will Cruise receive forgiveness from the kid who holds a grudge against him? Gosh, he even stalled the poor guy's career (as an elite fighter pilot)! How awful! Will he get together with the lady? Can the group overcome their differences and work as a team? Can the pilots shed their personal weaknesses to become more effective in combat? These aspects are given a lot of attention. (2) Doctrinal. Is it acceptable to risk the mission to preserve the pilots' lives? The soul of this branch of the US military is at stake! Again, given grave, serious consideration and weight. (3) The actual military action. Is this mission geopolitically destabilizing? Will it lead to war? Should US military interventionism be reflexively supported? Can we prove the Enemy Country's goal was producing a nuclear weapon that it meant to actual use and not just keep as a deterrent? Nada. Doesn't matter. #1-2 are interchangeable with any gaggle of nazis, and #3 is not. So why is #3 completely glossed over? That's my big beef. (edit: grammar/bad wording) Ceramic Shot fucked around with this message at 21:11 on Aug 3, 2022 |
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 21:07
|
|
|
Yeah I can’t imagine why a Jerry Bruckheimer action movie doesn’t care about #3 lmao
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 21:24
|
|
|
The script is setup such that it’s really about Maverick still proving he’s the best at X and connecting again with past friends and family. X could just be about racing cars or planes or fishing. But they did choose flying fighters jets. So yeah admittedly this does depoliticize what are tools of politics. The original Top Gun does this also and even adds a locker room for that school drama. There’s apparently no such locker room at the actual Top Gun. But fighter jets such as these are the fastest machines humans can pilot and maneuver currently which does add thrills. The film does help normalize military interventions. But would adding more details about the target change that? Genre action films usually have some perfunctory motive: bad guy has a nuke, or virus, or hates kids, or killed a dog. I think when watching such films, we usually just want them to get to the action. It’s why we are here. Of course there are thrillers that get more political, but those feel like different types of films. I guess for me, I don’t see this as anymore propaganda than most action genre films.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 21:59
|
|
|
TheNamedSavior posted:So it's impossible to make a good story based around leftist politics? Got it. I'll pretend Star Wars doesn't exist then. Lol
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 23:16
|
|
|
After watching Armageddon i wanted to be both an oil driller and an astronaut.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2022 23:24
|
|
|
checkplease posted:
I think these are decent points, but with that last line, for me the removal of geopolitical context and consequences in a military movie like this is the creepy part. I enjoyed reading both Generation Kill and My War: Killing Time in Iraq because they offered perspectives, however limited, of the consequences of war and military interventionism, both personal and more broadly. TG: Maverick is utterly uninterested in the geopolitical stuff, and the main character suffers nothing as a result of that lack of curiosity (nor do the vast majority of viewers, it would seem). It implicitly supports reflexively cheering on military action. The inciting incident of Maverick is the reveal of the mission and its parameters, but we're given zero information about the consequences of failure beyond vague stuff about how the Enemy will be able to enrich uranium. As far as I remember, there's practically zero context beyond that. The lack of discussion or even implication about what failure will result in (beyond how it will affect the pilots' personal lives and the funding allocation of the US navy) was the really eerie thing to me. For me a big part of the eeriness was kind of hearing echoes of "depoliticization" used in other regressive ways in the last two years. "All Lives Matter" is an attempt to depoliticize racially motivated police brutality. Anti "taking meaningful measures against COVID" people invoked depoliticization too, whining about virtue-signaling mask-wearers, and ironically deflecting responsibility. But like a mean pet owner, I think we have to reserve the right to shove faces into feces and yell "Look what you did!" especially when it comes to depictions of real-world military interventionism. (I mean analogously of course, be nice to animals.) teagone posted:After watching Armageddon i wanted to be both an oil driller and an astronaut. With my link on the previous page I think I've made a case that the very thing you seem to be mocking does in fact happen. The naval recruiter guy quoted said that the movie did in fact give their numbers a boost. You can argue about degree and significance, but you can't about whether it's happening or not.
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2022 04:03
|
|
|
If you want to see a movie about Hang-Man's grandpa in Korea, this looks pretty good. Better CGI for the flying scenes than Emmerich's Midway. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCDEGP6VjYY
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2022 04:20
|
|
|
Scuffy_1989 posted:If you want to see a movie about Hang-Man's grandpa in Korea, this looks pretty good. Just read the back story on this and drat it's gonna be a tear jerker for sure. Looks great
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2022 05:49
|
|
|
Ceramic Shot posted:
This is a fair point. I’d like to think art should be able to be created without first checking for political impacts. But discussions like this are good to have after. Jets are cool pieces of engineering that fly and go really fast. Yet they are tools of nations too.
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2022 05:56
|
|
|
Ceramic Shot posted:With my link on the previous page I think I've made a case that the very thing you seem to be mocking does in fact happen. The naval recruiter guy quoted said that the movie did in fact give their numbers a boost. You can argue about degree and significance, but you can't about whether it's happening or not. Of course the naval recruiter would say that. They're a naval recruiter.
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2022 06:45
|
|
|
Vegetable posted:I wish they just went alt-universe and named Canada as a target. Isn’t that way more fun and also not likely to piss anyone off at all? The nameless adversary here was fine but also just kinda bizarre. It was canada. All the signs are there. Just enjoy the loving plane movie. The only reasonable complaint about it is that it wasn't ambiguously gay enough because they spent too much time on jennifer connelly and not enough time making rooster and hangman rivals
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2022 09:07
|
|
|
Jennifer Connelly is really hot
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2022 09:18
|
|
|
ilmucche posted:It was canada. All the signs are there. There's only so much they could cram in the movie, but I felt like the new generation of pilots got short shrift compared to Tom Cruise. Though the original didn't spend much time on the group either, you only really got to know Maverick, Goose, and Iceman.
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2022 09:24
|
|
|
teagone posted:After watching Armageddon i wanted to be both an oil driller and an astronaut. I wanted to be a nerdonaut
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2022 21:35
|
|
|
ilmucche posted:just enjoy the loving plain movie.
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2022 21:26
|
|
|
Gaius Marius posted:Jennifer Connelly is really hot She should’ve dropped his rear end at the end of the movie but we live in a post-Captain America and Iron Man get their cake and eat it too world so of course the guy who is envied for killing enemy combatants is going to gently caress the hot girl while discarding the love interest from top gun 1 without comment. ruddiger fucked around with this message at 21:36 on Aug 5, 2022 |
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2022 21:29
|
|
|
ruddiger posted:She should’ve dropped his rear end at the end of the movie but we live in a post-Captain America and Iron Man get their cake and eat it too world so of course the guy who is envied for killing enemy combatants is going to gently caress the hot girl while commentless discarding the love interest from top gun 1. Fighter pilots almost always have hot wives.
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2022 21:32
|
|
|
Maybe it's because I paid extra attention to it somehow but the positional audio in this film in the theatre was better than any film I've seen in my memory. Maybe even exaggerated a bit but it felt like sound mixing/directional audio in this film was excellent and brought extra oomp into scenes.
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2022 22:29
|
|
|
ruddiger posted:She should’ve dropped his rear end at the end of the movie but we live in a post-Captain America and Iron Man get their cake and eat it too world so of course the guy who is envied for killing enemy combatants is going to gently caress the hot girl while discarding the love interest from top gun 1 without comment. it's like 30 years later and the movie was already over 2 hours long, did we need an additional 15 minutes going through tom cruise's past relationships?
|
|
#
?
Aug 5, 2022 23:20
|
|
|
ruddiger posted:She should’ve dropped his rear end at the end of the movie but we live in a post-Captain America and Iron Man get their cake and eat it too world so of course the guy who is envied for killing enemy combatants is going to gently caress the hot girl while discarding the love interest from top gun 1 without comment. Crazy how, nowadays, the hero gets a hot girlfriend at the end of the movie.
|
|
#
?
Aug 7, 2022 15:01
|
|
|
Top Gun: Maverick is back in IMAX this week and the closest screening to me is more than 4 hours away. 
|
|
#
?
Aug 9, 2022 18:20
|
|
|
Sirotan posted:Top Gun: Maverick is back in IMAX this week and the closest screening to me is more than 4 hours away. Time to make a four hour loop of Highway to the Danger Zone, bud.
|
|
#
?
Aug 9, 2022 19:20
|
|
|
That's 4 hours at highway speeds. How about you try going Maverick speeds?
|
|
#
?
Aug 9, 2022 19:22
|
|
|
Mantis42 posted:That's 4 hours at highway speeds. How about you try going Maverick speeds? There's a great balls of fire joke here somewhere. I'm just not clever enough to make it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 9, 2022 20:53
|
|
|
Ride your motorcycle for 4 hours with Aviators on.
|
|
#
?
Aug 9, 2022 22:26
|
|
|
Was the scene of maverick bombing 100s of children daily during a nuclear war a post credit scene or something because I don’t recall it during my viewing.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2022 01:15
|
|
|
My father, who; - Hates paying for anything, let alone going to a smelly cinema with bad chairs, other people who actually might make a sound ("rude fucks"), and WAITING FOR ALL THE GOD drat ADS TO FINISH - Has only taken me to the movies once before when I was like 6, and I'm pretty sure he walked out halfway through (he didn't take me out with him. it might have been the TMNT movie) - Only watches nature documentaries, and has recently acquired a taste for Opera on youtube (gently caress knows how, its not like he sees this via his day job as a plumber / spending hours at the pub) loved this movie, and was actually on the edge of his seat - I wish I took a pic. So gently caress you goons, we enjoyed the plane movie without thinking about jingoism.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2022 07:00
|
|
|
Discourse makes me mad too 😡
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2022 08:15
|
|
|
KajiTheMelonMan posted:So gently caress you goons, we enjoyed the plane movie without thinking about jingoism. gently caress! I’m so owned! Aaaghhhh!
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2022 09:05
|
|
|
Gaius Marius posted:Jennifer Connelly is really hot ilmucche posted:Just enjoy the loving plane movie.
|
|
#
?
Aug 10, 2022 14:51
|
|
|
I ended up driving an hour to a Dolby Cinema screening at AMC which was sick. I'd go watch every loud, bombastic action flick in that format if it was a little closer. Also I got a free poster: 
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2022 03:38
|
|
|
Poster owns I'd get that poo poo fra.ed
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2022 03:40
|
|
|
the faces in the planes tho
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2022 03:59
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 29, 2024 17:52 |
|
|
That’ll look real nice framed next to a poster of a Lamborghini and Spuds MacKenzie.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2022 06:18
|
|