|
Yeah that's why I groaned at the prophesy reveal at the end of the episode. We know how it ends, and it's pretty underwhelming.
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 14:34
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 06:35 |
|
|
The Jon Snow series is gonna be GRRM and HBO’s incredibly stupid attempt to try and salvage everything about the White Walkers. I guarantee it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 15:04
|
|
|
Jon Snow goes north and finds the snow babies from Craster's Keep that got turned zombie in that one episode before they dropped that whole plot.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 15:48
|
|
|
Why were they using real weapons during the tournament? It seemed like they were killing each other on purpose, like the dude who got the axe to the face. Didn't they use blunted tourney weapons, and let people live when they were on the ground, beaten? I know Daemon was allowed to yield, but nobody in the crowd seemed like it was anything but normal to have folks fight to the death in what was at the time basically sports.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 16:10
|
|
|
A Knight's Tale remains the best depiction of tilting. Who the hell knows how accurate the rules actually are but at least that movie gets that the joust was a sporting event and treats it like a proper sports movie. I feel that the tourney blood sports angle is supposed to emphasize "oh even peaceful westeros has got all the tits and violence you want from your premier HBO show" and to emphasize how cutthroat the kingdoms are without a war to fight.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 16:15
|
|
|
Even in the original series sir hugh getting got in the throat and killed was a huge deal and a big part of the conspiracy lmao
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 16:24
|
|
|
RoboChrist 9000 posted:As an aside and on some dumb Targ writing things, I was talking about this the other day with a friend and like, I feel like the Blackfyre Rebellion is kind of comically understated? Like what i mean is that if Aegon IV legitimizes all his bastards, the ensuing succession crisis when he died should have been far worse than the First Blackfyre Rebellion. Like it should have been a clusterfuck of open war or mass assassinations to make the Dance seem small scale. Succession crisis tend to be the most destructive when you have major power basis within the country backing multiple claiments During the DoD the 7 kingdoms were split, the Starks/Arryns/Tullies etc all supported Rhaenyra while the Lannisters/Baratheons and Hightowers supported Aegon. The balance of power between the two factions were pretty even and the participation of the great houses meant a lot of military power got sucked into the fighting. During the Blackfyre rebellion none of the major houses backed Daemon. His base of support seemed to be some medium-sized houses in the riverlands and the great houses stayed loyal. That's prob why it was a lot less descructive and easier to defeat.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 17:14
|
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:The Jon Snow series is gonna be GRRM and HBO’s incredibly stupid attempt to try and salvage everything about the White Walkers. I guarantee it. I remember before the finale, the leaks seemed to imply one bright light at the end of the tunnel, which was an ending where North of the Wall, Jon found a bunch of fresh bodies arranged like they had been in the prologue. It was a cheesy and cliche way to end, but it was miles more interesting than anything else in the final scenes. It figures that in their quest to create just the worst loving sequence of events, that D&D pulled out the one good idea they had. I'm starting to think that the Snow pitch is kind of the child to that whole mess. My guess is that they really thought that they were doing something with Arya and they didn't want to take away from her NK kill.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 17:18
|
|
|
It was honestly pretty OK. Better than it should have been. gently caress it at least someone is trying to do something with GoT cause fatman sure as poo poo isn’t.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 19:54
|
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:This show takes place 100% in the TV show canon. Is inseparable. It’s like the Hobbit prequel trilogy in relation to the LoTR trilogy. There is no getting around that ultimately all these plots in HoTD end in stupid unsatisfactory bullshit. I think this analogy doesn't hold up, at least in relation to Lord of the Rings, because in that instance the work that came earlier yet later in the chronology is the superior product and utterly unaffected by the prequel material. You can just ignore the Hobbit movies and it doesn't make a lick of difference that they suck because they took and already good thing and just shat all over it, yet that poo poo does not actually stain the preceding material in an appreciable way. With House of the Dragon though, the diarrhea stain already exists in the form of Game of Thrones, and the show needs to find a way to mount the hurdle of making something good out of an already pre-poo poo bed that cannot be just ignored for the sense of one's own solipsistic mental safe space.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 20:38
|
|
|
nine-gear crow posted:I think this analogy doesn't hold up, at least in relation to Lord of the Rings, because in that instance the work that came earlier yet later in the chronology is the superior product and utterly unaffected by the prequel material. You can just ignore the Hobbit movies and it doesn't make a lick of difference that they suck because they took and already good thing and just shat all over it, yet that poo poo does not actually stain the preceding material in an appreciable way. I just mean that you can’t argue that HoTD is book canon.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 21:12
|
|
|
There's literally nothing at stake in this show. it starts with a LOTR like narration but... LOTR starts with like, the rings being forged, a dark being on the verge of enslaving the world, it's dope, what the gently caress do we get here? the son of the king who whatever who gives a poo poo, what are the stakes? does GRRM not see this is completely artistically bankrupt? I seriously don't get it, what's wrong with the dude he clearly had art in him once, can't he tell the difference? Such a shame to waste the talents of so many clearly talented people on this garbage, and this includes GRRM himself, adapting something like "A song for lya" or "and a seven times never kill man" would have been far more ambitious and actually had the chance of being actually good.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 23:45
|
|
|
I know that on some level every TV show is just high production value cosplay but this whole show is just cosplay and memberries, they just had the sets lying around and wanted to make use of them, even the music constantly using the GOT opening motive, just manipulative nostalgia baiting. For a show that aired like what, 4 years ago? gently caress.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 23:48
|
|
|
I'm fine with a low stakes political intrigue court drama myself, rather than something apocalyptic or some cosmic danger
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 23:49
|
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:The Jon Snow series is gonna be GRRM and HBO’s incredibly stupid attempt to try and salvage everything about the White Walkers. I guarantee it. I just want a show where Jon Snow is traveling the frozen north and discovering all sorts of crazy poo poo. Give us the Ice Spiders. He's a literal savior to the wildlings too so HBO can have all the tits and rear end it wants by having spearwives throw themselves at him constantly or whatever when he isn't finding ice wyrms or the tombs the white walkers were imprisoned in until Mance hosed everything up. RoboChrist 9000 posted:Even if it's not true, it would be trivial for some ambitious lord to claim that they are one of Aegon's many bastards. At which point a giant target is on their back from all the other pretenders and every lord who just doesn't want to deal with this poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Aug 23, 2022 23:56
|
|
|
Punkin Spunkin posted:I'm fine with a low stakes political intrigue court drama myself, rather than something apocalyptic or some cosmic danger At this point I am tuning in for the most shallowly nihilistic of reasons: I want to see just how many people Daemon Targaryen kills, how brutally does he kill them, and just how bugfuck crazy does Matt Smith act while portraying all of that. And if the goldcloaks massacre in the middle of Episode 1 is anything to go on, the answer to all of those questions is going to be "A lot".
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 00:09
|
|
|
I think most people are tuning in for the shallowly nihilistic reasons. Fantasy that Fucks is the main reason the majority of people watched the original show.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 00:20
|
|
|
If the Kit vehicle delivers a hound-sized ice spider it might be ok.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 00:26
|
|
|
screw that, give me an ice spider played by The Hound.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 00:41
|
|
|
I think the fact that this show isn’t giving us an ending to a great book series that we all liked that will never be finished will give it a lot more leeway in the quality department. I didn’t have high hopes but the first episode seemed… fine. It doesn’t have to be GoT seasons 1-3 quality to be watchable. Just give me some cool scenes and a decent story line and I’ll watch it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 01:01
|
|
|
Yeah, as long as it isn't as bad as the last four seasons I'm fine with it just being solid.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 02:13
|
|
|
incidentally, is Daemon supposed to be some sort of Darkstar-esque super badass? I don't really remember much of his feats since ive only just read the first part of fire and blood (and I guess I dont really remember it) and some asoiaf wiki bullshit. I only ask because it seems like some ASOIAF fans are kinda disappointed about the Matt Smith casting. I thought he pulls off "petulant sadist well-versed in tourney fighting" well enough, but if he's also supposed to be one of George's super badass guys maybe it's for the best that the casting deflates that a little bit.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 03:41
|
|
|
My wife made this in honor of Game of Thrones coming back:
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 04:38
|
|
|
Punkin Spunkin posted:incidentally, is Daemon supposed to be some sort of Darkstar-esque super badass? I don't really remember much of his feats since ive only just read the first part of fire and blood (and I guess I dont really remember it) and some asoiaf wiki bullshit. Darkstar the badass knight who hit an 11 year old girl and only wounded her ear?
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 05:58
|
|
|
Only those who are of the night understand how cool that was, actually.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 07:39
|
|
|
Punkin Spunkin posted:incidentally, is Daemon supposed to be some sort of Darkstar-esque super badass? I don't really remember much of his feats since ive only just read the first part of fire and blood (and I guess I dont really remember it) and some asoiaf wiki bullshit. As far as I understood it, he is basically a Joffrey that got to grow up. He's a petulant little entitled shithead, but you are pretty much inevitably going to be decent at fighting if you're the son of a rich noble house. Your only job is really learning how to fight since childhood, and you've got the best trainers, weapons, and armor that money can buy. It's not completely ridiculous that he knows what he is doing because he has had every possible advantage to do it, and he still gets clowned on in the tournament by prematurely celebrating victory. The only reason Joffrey didn't get good at fighting was that his mom was overly protective and wouldn't allow anyone to hurt her widdle baby, but if King Robert had his way then that kid would have been out jousting and bashing poo poo with axes. It probably would have made him an even bigger rear end in a top hat if he had the power to gently caress people up himself instead of just ordering his goons to do it.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 09:28
|
|
|
I read Fire and Blood when it came out and I had to go back to look up what happens in this TV series since I feel like this scenario plays out several times in the book. It'll be interesting to see how it goes down because this saga takes place over 20 years, Daemon ends up marrying Rhaenyra, and then dies later in the civil war that happens 10 years after that. Rhaenyra is 23 at the time they marry so it's not that yikes but it's still pretty yikes considering the depiction so far.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 13:28
|
|
|
Mr. Grapes! posted:As far as I understood it, he is basically a Joffrey that got to grow up. He's a petulant little entitled shithead, but you are pretty much inevitably going to be decent at fighting if you're the son of a rich noble house. Your only job is really learning how to fight since childhood, and you've got the best trainers, weapons, and armor that money can buy. It's not completely ridiculous that he knows what he is doing because he has had every possible advantage to do it, and he still gets clowned on in the tournament by prematurely celebrating victory. Yeah, whipping someone nearly to death for bad news is definitely Joffrey-like and honestly Daemon isn't that smart either.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 18:26
|
|
|
Mr. Grapes! posted:As far as I understood it, he is basically a Joffrey that got to grow up. He's a petulant little entitled shithead, but you are pretty much inevitably going to be decent at fighting if you're the son of a rich noble house. Your only job is really learning how to fight since childhood, and you've got the best trainers, weapons, and armor that money can buy. It's not completely ridiculous that he knows what he is doing because he has had every possible advantage to do it, and he still gets clowned on in the tournament by prematurely celebrating victory. Realistically an heir and future ruler's main job would be to learn how to rule, not just how to fight, but GRRM never did a good job of portraying that either.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 19:20
|
|
|
Kylaer posted:Realistically an heir and future ruler's main job would be to learn how to rule, not just how to fight, but GRRM never did a good job of portraying that either. He wasn't expected to be a heir for most of his life. Viserys was. Then their dad died and the succession crisis happened. Before that Daemon had already given Dark Sister in recognition of his skill by Jaehaerys I. Everyone expected Viserys, young as he was, to have sons of his own (and he will eventually have three). Makes sense for him to have focused just on fighting.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 20:14
|
|
|
kaworu posted:If that whole “prophecy” scene really is just a way for them to disavow the horribly lovely, rushed, botched and incomplete ending that was offered to us by Season 8 of the TV show, then quite frankly I am *all for it*; and more power to them. I’m not really sure that’s what the actual intention is, but I don’t see that as being creatively bankrupt or disingenuous or one more “the ending is still coming keep buying my poo poo!” scam from GRRM. Mostly because that ending offered by the TV show was really and truly awful, nonsensical, and unsatisfying in nearly every imaginable way. If I were in his shoes, I’d want to disavow it and label it is non-canon, which is what I sincerely hope he officially does. Actually I think it is the opposite. They are going this route with the prophecy retcon to validate the GoT show ending, in the sense of "well of course you were disappointed with the ending, because you don't know/haven't seen the whole story". GRRM, HBO, etc have surely by now heard the criticism that the show ending retroactively ruined everything that preceded it - obviously bad for many reasons but implicitly a big problem because if that's how a majority of the fanbase feel then they are not going to revisit the series, recommend to friends, etc. Anecdotally I can count on one hand how many people I know bothered with a re-watch during the pandemic and the show definitely didn't get the sort of revisiting push in the media that other big IPs did. Beyond juicing subscription numbers, seems like the intent of the spinoffs is in part at least to wash the stink off the original series in order to redeem it - which is necessary if GOT is ever going to be a global cultural juggernaut again - and the most straightforward way is to introduce some new context or concept that (in theory) shifts how audiences understand and engage with all the previous material. The new prophecy, and the supposed mechanism for how it is shared from generation to generation in the Targ dynasty, isn't the worst idea but I think it creates more problems than it solves just within the context of the themes of the story and the events as written in the books. HoD is only one episode in, so maybe they resolve this in a satisfying way by the end of the season but I'm very dubious. Mat Cauthon fucked around with this message at 23:45 on Aug 24, 2022 |
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 20:38
|
|
|
DarkCrawler posted:He wasn't expected to be a heir for most of his life. Viserys was. Then their dad died and the succession crisis happened. Before that Daemon had already given Dark Sister in recognition of his skill by Jaehaerys I. Everyone expected Viserys, young as he was, to have sons of his own (and he will eventually have three). Makes sense for him to have focused just on fighting. Oh, I was talking about Joffrey, I don't care about the expanded universe nonsense.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 21:07
|
|
|
Robert was a really poo poo dad.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 21:25
|
|
|
Great fighter, poo poo father.
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 23:33
|
|
|
Kylaer posted:Oh, I was talking about Joffrey, I don't care about the expanded universe nonsense. Uh, both of Joffrey's parents sucked, kind of hard to miss
|
|
#
?
Aug 24, 2022 23:43
|
|
|
Mr. Grapes! posted:As far as I understood it, he is basically a Joffrey that got to grow up. He's a petulant little entitled shithead, but you are pretty much inevitably going to be decent at fighting if you're the son of a rich noble house. Your only job is really learning how to fight since childhood, and you've got the best trainers, weapons, and armor that money can buy. It's not completely ridiculous that he knows what he is doing because he has had every possible advantage to do it, and he still gets clowned on in the tournament by prematurely celebrating victory. The Hound (or whomever) being allowed to beat the poo poo out of Geoffrey via "training" might've got him in line since he acts exactly how you'd expect from a kid spoiled rotten by his mother who doesn't allow him to be hurt by anyone. Robert hit him once and Cersei mentioned how she outright threatened to murder him if he ever did it again so he grew up feeling untouchable because he basically was. He'd have probably still turned out badly though since Robert and Cersei were just god awful parents.
|
|
#
?
Aug 25, 2022 00:11
|
|
|
I think blaming Joffrey’s behavior strictly on his upbringing, or making comments like “his father just needed to beat him more often then he’d have been less evil” is sort of missing the point? I thought that Joffrey was just the way he was because that’s how he was, and being part of the noble class really just enabled him to act on those dark feelings with impunity. Tommen had the same parents and the some overprotective privileged upbringing, but he wasn’t a murderous and sociopathic little monster and never would have been one. Joffrey was just rotten because that was his nature. As for Daemon, I don’t think he’s really going to end up as the Joffrey of this series - that role is bound to go to either Aegon II or his younger brother Aemond (future sons of Alicent and Viserys) both of whom are monstrously spoiled, entitled, easily manipulated ignorant little shits who are each responsible for scores of awful and monstrous actions, at least in the book. Not that Rhaenyra and Daemon aren’t almost as bad in their own ways by the end, but I feel like they are definitely setting them up to the marginally more sympathetic party in the upcoming civil war, at least based on that first episode.
|
|
#
?
Aug 25, 2022 11:21
|
|
|
Considering that Ramsay was just 'Joffrey but louder and infallible' and Euron was also a clear attempt at a Joffrey, I'd be shocked if HBO doesn't mandate the show have a Joffrey. Like I think it's pretty clear that D&D and probably HBO thought 'a Joffrey' is part and parcel of the GOT experience.
|
|
#
?
Aug 25, 2022 11:37
|
|
|
It's wild that teenage Renee Ra's actress is 22 (21 during filming?). Some people truly age unusually.
|
|
#
?
Aug 25, 2022 14:05
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 06:35 |
|
|
I assume the Joffrey-esque character will be Aemond One-Eye once they get around to introducing him (unless they have already, haven't watched the dragon show)
|
|
#
?
Aug 25, 2022 14:21
|
|
