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Book was a decent wrap up for the wax and Wayne series. Book:this really felt like Wayne’s story and I’m happy sad about how it ended. Interesting threads for the future about kelsier and harmony coming head to head with some conflict which seems like it will come to a head in the next series. To me it still really feels like kel is on the good side of anti-hero which makes me happy. Also sazed straight up lying to him is interesting. Cosmere: really great to see some more magics and some worldhoppers we have seen before, also interesting to see that the roshar ghost bloods are loose units and not representative of the main group.
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Nov 17, 2022 09:17
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So I'm starting to re-read Wax and Wayne. Only went through them once years ago but I wanna check out LM. Luckily these books are all a fraction of the size of even Era 1, let alone Stormlight. My memory is that Staris is absolutely the best character. I've also heard Sanderson said at some point he tried too hard with Vin to make her a strong female character or something. Never really understood that but Steris is pretty much the total opposite. She exemplifies typical stately femininity while still being totally badass. The first book really baits and switches you about her.
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Nov 17, 2022 18:43
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NikkolasKing posted:So I'm starting to re-read Wax and Wayne. Only went through them once years ago but I wanna check out LM. Luckily these books are all a fraction of the size of even Era 1, let alone Stormlight. Yeah, Steris has a really good character arc. She's vital to any success the team has, but everyone else in their little group makes it clear to her quite often.
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Nov 17, 2022 19:20
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Hard spoilers for The Lost Metal, DO NOT CLICK if you haven't read it. So big talk, we were all right speculating about Wax creating Lerasium and Atium from splitting Harmonium, and it seems to be intent related to be able to create the other god metals vs just a huge explosion. I think it's unlikely the Set created them as a byproduct, since they should have been analyzing everything and would have found them. Wax is potentially a mistborn, I would say almost certainly but there's a sliver of doubt as to whether he burned the Lerasium he accidentally ingested. Since you're supposed to intentionally burn the metal, maybe not, but Vin burned metals instinctively as a child so still 95% sure Wax is a full mistborn, if only a weak one. On top of that, he's at least spiked with duralumin, though I also suspect he probably grabbed a pewter spike at the least to survive the duralumin push. I wonder if the "genetic" manner of allomantic ability inheritance is still rooted in the spiritual realm enough that Wax becoming a full mistborn would have any effect on his kids. Harmony is trying to throw Kelsier off the trail, but someone will probably figure out making more Lerasium at some point, so it's only a matter of time until full mistborn exist again, albeit likely in very small numbers. There's also the Set creating slightly, neutrally invested spikes from normal people, which seems similar to Nalthian's, but maybe not as bad as being a drab? This also seems to be a likely component of creating the required people to make more unkeyed metal minds, since if you can make whatever you need from stabbing normal people a few times, having whatever sort of allomantic or feruchemical abilities to put into unkeyed metalminds would be easy. Also, I think duralumin + time metal grenades will be part of the FTL travel, though that's probably been a theory for a while.
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Nov 17, 2022 19:31
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In the ending wayne detonated ettmetal next to trellium - and replicated wax's accidental lerasium production on a massive scale. so there is now a huge plume of vaporized lerasium and atium blowing over the most population dense city on the planet
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Nov 17, 2022 20:18
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stramit posted:Cosmere: really great to see some more magics and some worldhoppers we have seen before, also interesting to see that the roshar ghost bloods are loose units and not representative of the main group. Ghostbloods they seem to follow Kells concept of "crime, for the greater good", while without supervision Mraize and his group seem to be "crime, for my good". I'm sure the Scadrial Ghostbloods themselves also get End of The Lost Metal Physics It really bothers me that Harmony told Wax the boat bomb would destroy both cities. A few hours apart by ship is 75ish miles, and a massive explosion loses more of it's energy to the upper direction as it grows. To do even what the water + Harmonium reaction did at that distance would still be around 5MT. Even if each of the bombs was a Gigaton of TNT equivalent it still probably wouldn't destroy both cities. Sterris was very wise to be concerned about tidel waves though.
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Nov 17, 2022 20:31
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M_Gargantua posted:Ghostbloods they seem to follow Kells concept of "crime, for the greater good", while without supervision Mraize and his group seem to be "crime, for my good". I'm sure the Scadrial Ghostbloods themselves also get nukes don't cause tidal waves, but it at least is something people were thinking about irl before it was tested so she gets a pass. I'd assume these are closer to a theoretical antimatter bomb when detonated fully, instead of the 'fizzle' wayne caused Tunicate fucked around with this message at 21:06 on Nov 17, 2022 |
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Nov 17, 2022 20:40
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M_Gargantua posted:End of The Lost Metal Physics It really bothers me that Harmony told Wax the boat bomb would destroy both cities. A few hours apart by ship is 75ish miles, and a massive explosion loses more of it's energy to the upper direction as it grows. To do even what the water + Harmonium reaction did at that distance would still be around 5MT. Even if each of the bombs was a Gigaton of TNT equivalent it still probably wouldn't destroy both cities. Sterris was very wise to be concerned about tidel waves though. The water + Harmonium was a lesser explosion to render the larger one useless. The actual bomb was a Harmonium + Trellium bomb, and the energy comes from the Investiture released - he was concerned about it igniting atmosphere, and mentioned he didn't think the Set realised just how much explosive force the bomb would produce. Seems reasonable it could take out that kind of area.
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Nov 17, 2022 20:41
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Tunicate posted:In the ending wayne detonated ettmetal next to trellium - and replicated wax's accidental lerasium production on a massive scale. so there is now a huge plume of vaporized lerasium and atium blowing over the most population dense city on the planet my understanding is that he literally stops this specific thing from happening Wax accidentally makes it by doing full on Cosmere Fission to a tiny amount, Wayne specifically stops that from happening and only detonates the Harmonium ensuring that Cosmere Fission does not actually happen
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Nov 17, 2022 21:42
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eke out posted:my understanding is that he literally stops this specific thing from happening Wax got his powers from the accidental second explosion in his basement, which was due to detonating ettmetal next to trellium, rather than the first bigger explosion which involved the polarized electrified ettmetal. This is also probably why the Set didn't figure it out - they were all in on polarized ettmetal and didn't futz around with splitting vapor from normal ettmetal blasts Tunicate fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Nov 17, 2022 |
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Nov 17, 2022 21:59
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Cosmere physics Yes, I am of the opinion that much like creating anti-stormlight and anti-voidlight Intent is integral to the process. Tunicate posted:nukes don't cause tidal waves, but it at least is something people were thinking about irl before it was tested so she gets a pass. Probably more real world physics? Wigwam proved they could cause some major waves. Surface detonation tests were rare. But yeah, you're right about it being a step above.into annihilation, which has implications for the escallation in the coming era. Still something with a 100mi 5psi radius is so monumentally huge you're going to lose a lot of it to space and you're now modeling something orders of magnitude beyond our validated blast models. Better to use meteoroid strike models at that point M_Gargantua fucked around with this message at 22:11 on Nov 17, 2022 |
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Nov 17, 2022 22:07
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Is there a place to get a good Wax and Wayne summary for everything up to the latest book? Spoiler’s obviously fine, I just don’t have time to reread them.
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Nov 17, 2022 22:27
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KKKLIP ART posted:Is there a place to get a good Wax and Wayne summary for everything up to the latest book? Spoiler’s obviously fine, I just don’t have time to reread them. I read the coppermind summary for bands of mourning and it jogged my memory https://coppermind.net/wiki/The_Bands_of_Mourning
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Nov 17, 2022 23:36
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ROW Spoilers I really can't get over Taravangian as Rayse. I don't know how I forgot this. Rayse Odium Taravangian pretending to be Rayse Kramer is just responding to the writing: I noticed your touch on the contract, a dramatic voice said in his head. I hate you. I shall have my vengeance, Odium said. Even if it takes an eternity, Cephandrius, I will destroy you. It matters not. Whomever I pick, they will destroy Dalinar’s champion! Then I will use him, and my minions on this planet, to finally do whatever I wish! I can just see him shaking his fist and going "I'll get you next time, Gadget!" That is how Taravangian perceives and presents Rayse. And that fooled Wit.
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Nov 18, 2022 00:11
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NikkolasKing posted:ROW Spoilers Hoid has a low opinion of Rays and he's not free of biases. Also, he lost Perfect Pitch when Taravodium messed with his Breaths to delete the memory of their meeting, which he might have relied on for too long, making him less able to distinguish voices and tonal structures when not having Perfect Pitch.
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Nov 18, 2022 00:25
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Torrannor posted:Hoid has a low opinion of Rays and he's not free of biases. Also, he lost Perfect Pitch when Taravodium messed with his Breaths to delete the memory of their meeting, which he might have relied on for too long, making him less able to distinguish voices and tonal structures when not having Perfect Pitch. Is there WoB on whether perfect pitch has an effect on non verbal communication?
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Nov 18, 2022 03:42
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The Lost Metal:I find it hilarious that Hoid was relegated to a chauffeur that was mostly ignored/not used the entire book. I just imagine him thinking "ok I can swoop in and give Wax a hand after his very public fight with his not-clone" and then just being ghosted by Wax every time aside from the boat save at the end. Also, I had a hunch that Moonlight was Shai from Emperor's Soul but was kind of hoping she was a new character. The Coppermind confirmed it. Still kind of cool. Also, I thought TwinSoul was from Ashyn for sure since him always leaning on something seemed like an ailment and he also mentioned his planet was uninhabitable, but Coppermind says he's not. Next, did I miss the part of the story where Marasi collapses the perpendicularity? I kept waiting for Trells army to come through and then at the end it mentions that she stopped it. Finally, how does the Ghostblood's main tenet of protecting scadrial jive with their apparent mission in RoW to export Stormlight off Roshar? More fuel to fight Autonomy or has Kelsier become an antagonist at this point? I'm glad we get the 4 novellas next year to tide us over until fall 2024 for stormlight 5
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Nov 18, 2022 08:46
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Synesthesian Fetish posted:The Lost Metal: More LM spoilers: You must have, but it’s a pretty brief section. She gathers the allomancers from the cavern and has them burn off the perpendicularity. She dumps her power into an allomantic cube that she thought would explode, and had others dumping their power wherever they could.
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Nov 18, 2022 09:23
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Synesthesian Fetish posted:The Lost Metal: Lost metal: Guessing Kelsier (and the ghostbloods) are trying to get as much investiture as they can to support their endeavours. They had jars of pure Dor for example that were used during this book for example. You have the investiture you can fuel a lot of magic. I'm still not on board with people thinking that Kelsier is a bad guy or even going to become the bad guy. He's quite amoral about a lot of things but he's a pragmatic 'for the greater good' kind of guy. He'll do some bad poo poo but only so long as it makes the lot of the people he is fighting for better. He did this with the ska, and now he's doing it for scadrial as a whole. TBH I would not be surprised if he evolves more to realise that he needs to look after more than just his planet even if his method don't change too much. He's a pretty good anti-hero type guy and I really like that. cosmere: with the rumors of the last shard being 'survival' or something similar... would be interesting to see kelsier pick that one up at some stage... kind of ties in with his whole thing. Even autonomy would kind of fit that as he's forged a very unique path so far
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Nov 18, 2022 11:29
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Lost metal: Marasi used the supercharged investure on that grenades she tossed into Automomy’s army. How much would that slow them down, and for how long? Did she perhaps pull a reverse Wayne and freeze that army for a very, very long time?
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Nov 18, 2022 18:15
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Tunicate posted:nukes don't cause tidal waves, but it at least is something people were thinking about irl before it was tested so she gets a pass. Lost Metal Spoilers Harmony did specifically say it might ignite the atmosphere, which was an actual concern of the initial nuclear tests especially once they got to fusion bombs. It was considered very unlikely, but even that was considered as a possibility. Not too hard to believe that even Shards wouldn't be sure exactly how much energy would be released, just that it would be a lot.
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Nov 18, 2022 22:02
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NikkolasKing posted:ROW Spoilers Are we 100% sure taravodium fooled Wit? If I recall correctly, I got the impression that he may not have been totally fooled when I read it. May be misremembering though.
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Nov 19, 2022 00:32
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Calumanjaro posted:Are we 100% sure taravodium fooled Wit? If I recall correctly, I got the impression that he may not have been totally fooled when I read it. May be misremembering though. It's a little ambiguous. Wit notices something is a little off but kind of shrugs it off. However, the whole time he's talking about the art of misdirection. It gave the feeling that Wit was prepared for something like that happening but I guess we'll have to see. Maybe he only kept expendable memories/ breaths on hand rather than a metalmind just in case of such an incident?
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Nov 19, 2022 02:02
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ConfusedUs posted:Lost metal: Lost Metal: her regular charge lasts about 10 minutes, right? So it would def last a lot longer. But Wayne pulled his move off by compounding metals to create a super speed bubble. Which does make me wonder what a compounded slow bubble would do…
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Nov 19, 2022 02:11
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Calumanjaro posted:Are we 100% sure taravodium fooled Wit? If I recall correctly, I got the impression that he may not have been totally fooled when I read it. May be misremembering though. Rhythm of War he was doing the "I'm moving coins around in my pockets 100% of the time" powergaming rogue routine to check for influence, presumably he knows *something* maybe he didn't have a contingency pre-set message set for "Uhhh this isn't Rayse wtf?" but we'll see
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Nov 19, 2022 02:31
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Calumanjaro posted:Are we 100% sure taravodium fooled Wit? If I recall correctly, I got the impression that he may not have been totally fooled when I read it. May be misremembering though. Synesthesian Fetish posted:It's a little ambiguous. Wit notices something is a little off but kind of shrugs it off. However, the whole time he's talking about the art of misdirection. It gave the feeling that Wit was prepared for something like that happening but I guess we'll have to see. Maybe he only kept expendable memories/ breaths on hand rather than a metalmind just in case of such an incident? ROW Epilogue spoilers continued I'm no theory guy, I miss all sorts of subtle or even semi-subtle things. It never even occured to me Wit might have been faking it all but I did find this thread on just that matter yesterday. The reason it never even occurred to me though is because the chapter is written from Wit's perspective. We see what he is thinking. He is described as being "terrified" when Todium talks about his memories and breaths. Not an affect, not an act, this is what's going through his mind. Furthermore, the first version of this event we see, he's talking to his Cryptic. After Todium messes with his mind, he tries to redo the same conversation with her only she's not there, having departed in the first convo but he wouldn't know or remember that now. Maybe I've missed a whole bunch of things. I almost assuredly have. But I figured Brandon really wanted to hammer home his new villain. "Holy poo poo, he's outsmarted loving Wit. Be terrified!" That's kinda what bugs me. The last few chapters are trying so hard to establish Taravangian as way better than Rayse. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 02:39 on Nov 19, 2022 |
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Nov 19, 2022 02:36
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TLM epilogues I'm surprised Kelsier immediately accepts Sazed's claim that any lerasium produced from the splitting experiments is "destroyed by the explosion". Granted that Sazed has had hundreds of years to become more practiced at lying, but it still strikes me as the sort of thing Kelsier would want to investigate himself just in case.
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Nov 19, 2022 06:57
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Anshu posted:TLM epilogues I'm surprised Kelsier immediately accepts Sazed's claim that any lerasium produced from the splitting experiments is "destroyed by the explosion". Granted that Sazed has had hundreds of years to become more practiced at lying, but it still strikes me as the sort of thing Kelsier would want to investigate himself just in case. Kelsier knows Sazed is lying because Sazed turned Spook into a mistborn already
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Nov 19, 2022 10:07
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Anshu posted:TLM epilogues I'm surprised Kelsier immediately accepts Sazed's claim that any lerasium produced from the splitting experiments is "destroyed by the explosion". Granted that Sazed has had hundreds of years to become more practiced at lying, but it still strikes me as the sort of thing Kelsier would want to investigate himself just in case. Honestly... are we sure that Sazed isn't trying to do some things of his own to bring "harmony" to the other shards? I feel like Kelsier and him may have more going on
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Nov 19, 2022 17:09
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Langolas posted:Honestly... are we sure that Sazed isn't trying to do some things of his own to bring "harmony" to the other shards? I feel like Kelsier and him may have more going on Harmony/Cosmere/mild LM: Was this also the first book to acknowledge that Harmony is potentially the strongest shardholder? I know it was stated as a logical conclusion, but had the first in-cosmere statement I can think of
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Nov 19, 2022 17:23
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Brutor Fartknocker posted:Hard spoilers for The Lost Metal, DO NOT CLICK if you haven't read it. Continuing Lost Metal spoilers: I guess the effects on any future children depends on whether Lerasium rewrites your DNA, which seems probable. But it's never been 100% certain that Mistborn will have children who are Metalborn, just more likely? The book was good and cool. I'm proud of having predicted several of the story beats, but also happy to have been surprised by some things and learned more about the state of the Cosmere.
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Nov 19, 2022 17:28
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LM end spoiler I’m really surprised I haven’t seen anyone else mention this so maybe I was just reading too much into it but I wasn’t expecting Wayne to die for real at the end of this book because I was really expecting him to wind up with the Whimsy shard at some point. Especially because of these two interactions. This one between Wayne and Moonlight: “Curious,” she said. “And what do you add to the team?” “Comic relief.” She cocked an eyebrow. “Maybe a little whimsy,” he said. “Improvisation. Vision.” This one is between Wax and his sister: “Autonomy is … odd. She respects those who are bold, strong, able to survive on their own. But she also wants them to obey her. I suppose that is the irony of godhood. Half the time, being ‘autonomous’ means following her plan. And there’s no Whimsy to her—that’s a different god. But I’m probably wrong and he’s really dead.
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Nov 19, 2022 17:34
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Daric posted:LM end spoiler yeah i read this as Brandon just trickling out some more mentions of a Shard we've only barely heard about existing
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Nov 19, 2022 17:36
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Ok a couple more Lost Metal thoughts - one that isn't even a spoiler! Does anyone else think that moving long distances via Steelpush would actually look really stupid on film? Like someone just being kind of bounced through the air. A Superman pose wouldn't really work well, Coinshots aren't immune to gravity. Couldn't do a jumping motion either, there's no surface to plant your feet on. Flipping and tumbling probably would make it hard to make sense of what to Push on to stay in the right direction. How do other people visualize this? Theories on who drained the bands? It seems pretty well telegraphed that the Malwish are behind it, but given their established opposition to using the bands, do we think they broke that tenet for the purpose of reclaiming them? It's clearly going to be important later, otherwise it would have been fully explicated in this book. Might the whole Malwish nation be serving the Ghostbloods' purposes?
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Nov 19, 2022 18:03
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I think it was the person who first touched them, who immediately left with the Malwish afterwards
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Nov 19, 2022 19:08
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CK07 posted:Ok a couple more Lost Metal thoughts - one that isn't even a spoiler! You can do a lot with good camera angles. But more it's why they all wear mistcloaks
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Nov 19, 2022 20:02
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Not very far into The Lost Metal yet, and I haven’t read any of the spoilered text, but I want to throw a prediction out there for people to laugh at: Wayne winds up on Roshar and bonds a spren. Maybe meets the Lopen, but I forget how the timelines overlap. There. I guess I will check back in when I finish.
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Nov 19, 2022 20:09
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Tlm was good.
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Nov 19, 2022 20:10
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Major TLM spoilers My number 1 complaint is that since he got immolated, MeLaan won't have Wayne's bone's to bring with her for the backhalf of Stormlight. Which means no adventures of Lopen and Wayne unless she gets Harmony to get her some aluminum bones modeled after him. My second complaint The death of Telsin was done poorly. Was 'defeated' her, but then Harmony just yanks her connection with Autonomy and she just keels over and dies a little later. It really needed more of Wax's direct involvement, like he should have at least shot her once her connection was pulled instead of just letting her fade out. Its not even clear at the time that she's dying, Wax just leaves.
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Nov 19, 2022 21:39
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M_Gargantua posted:My second complaint The death of Telsin was done poorly. Was 'defeated' her, but then Harmony just yanks her connection with Autonomy and she just keels over and dies a little later. It really needed more of Wax's direct involvement, like he should have at least shot her once her connection was pulled instead of just letting her fade out. Its not even clear at the time that she's dying, Wax just leaves. No way. Having Wax kill his sister would be cruel. Dude has had enough suffering in his life. Plus, of course he's going to just leave. The mission is what's important, not his making sure his sister dies.
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Nov 19, 2022 21:45
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