3D Printers: You can anneal some posts in a sous vide cooker

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Sagebrush: Feb 26, 2012

MDF is a garbage material, literally. There are a couple of specific cases where it's useful but anything aesthetic is not one of those. A thin laser-grade plywood will look nicer, cut better, be stronger, and won't generate poisonous fumes (other than minor amounts of CO, natch)

Also don't be a poo poo who does something the supervisor specifically told you not to do because you think you're smarter than her. Follow the rules.

# ? Feb 22, 2023 16:45

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# ? May 30, 2024 05:10

Slyphic: Oct 12, 2021; All we do is walk around believing birds!

Sagebrush posted:

Also don't be a poo poo who does something the supervisor specifically told you not to do because you think you're smarter than her. Follow the rules.

Read better. She has no idea why no MDF and invited me to figure it out.

If I can find a material that lasers and cuts better than MDF for a similar price and comparable strength, that's a win. But I also have to wonder why none of these professional outfits just used that 'one weird trick' to save themselves money before now.

# ? Feb 22, 2023 16:52

Chainclaw: Feb 14, 2009

Slyphic posted:

Read better. She has no idea why no MDF and invited me to figure it out.

If I can find a material that lasers and cuts better than MDF for a similar price and comparable strength, that's a win. But I also have to wonder why none of these professional outfits just used that 'one weird trick' to save themselves money before now.

Some sort of do, Glowforge specifically doesn't call their draftboard MDF for whatever reason. Maybe to charge a little more for it?

# ? Feb 22, 2023 17:05

Slyphic: Oct 12, 2021; All we do is walk around believing birds!

Chainclaw posted:

Some sort of do, Glowforge specifically doesn't call their draftboard MDF for whatever reason. Maybe to charge a little more for it?

Draftboard is literally just MDF with a more marketable name.

The one place that got back to me with an SDS sent me this link - https://www.roseburg.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Medite-MDF-English-SDS-2022-05-12.pdf

Which if I'm reading section 5 correctly, is no more dangerous than any other wood when burned.

> Products of combustion may include, and are not limited to: oxides of carbon.
Toxic fumes. Nitrogen oxides

ctrl-f formaldehyde only has two hits, and both of those seem to be basically yet another CA prop 65 warning.

Not sure about that section 15 though. Does that only apply if you store those weights of the material in one space?

Edit: Second reply
The apparently source theirs from McMaster-Carr, which ain't all that surprising. https://www.mcmaster.com/2726N61/ SDS there looks like above, complies with the new EPA regs and has no significant combustion hazards beyond regular wood.

Slyphic fucked around with this message at 19:18 on Feb 22, 2023

# ? Feb 22, 2023 19:11

NewFatMike: Jun 11, 2015

So they�re using the McMaster SDS for a size McMaster doesn�t even carry?

Idk what your attachment to this MDF hill is, there�s so much less sketchy composite wood out there for cheap.

# ? Feb 22, 2023 20:37

EVIL Gibson: Mar 23, 2001; Internet of Things is just someone else's computer that people can't help attaching cameras and door locks to!; Switchblade Switcharoo

Slyphic posted:

Laser cut MDF is ubiquitous in the tabletop wargaming space.
https://ttcombat.com/collections/sci-fi-x/products/meller-heights
https://uncertainscenery.com/collections/10mm-scale-boards/products/8-10mm-sunken-motorway-with-bridge
https://www.tymeagain.co.uk/store/district-xxii-hab-block-3

I want to try my hand at making my own.

The price is kinda the point. But also the strength to weight ratio.

As someone that goes to tabletop/wargame conventions I can verify the above statement.

Sometimes you can sniff the air and just know some laser cut items are close... somewhere.

# ? Feb 22, 2023 20:42

The Eyes Have It: Feb 10, 2008; Third Eye Sees All
...snookums

Laser cut wood products invites leveraging the dark color of the cut sides somehow but I never really figured out anything that satisfied me.

It takes a while for laser-cut wood to off-gas and stop smelling like a campfire (and getting the smell on your fingers, etc). Setting it out in bright summer sunlight helps a lot, but I really just over time came to consider laser-cut wood products to be not really worth the effort as I never dialed in to any real sweet spot.

Plus any serious production is a pain in the rear end because of inconsistencies in the insides of plywoods. A knot here or there will mean your laser doesn't actually cut completely through, which may or may not kind of ruin a piece. It's really hard to re-work something like that, it's more a toss & try again situation. Not so bad for something small, but if you're cutting out something complex it's a real downer.

Acrylics are wonderful in how they laser cut SO CLEANLY, though. It's a shame they're a pain in many different ways (they stink, peeling protective film after cutting is a pain in the rear end, but without protective film the surface frosts up like a motherfucker, it attracts dust and fingerprints, etc.)

I spent a shitload of time at my laser in the past but these days, if I can at all avoid laser cutting something, I do.

# ? Feb 22, 2023 20:57

Slyphic: Oct 12, 2021; All we do is walk around believing birds!

NewFatMike posted:

So they�re using the McMaster SDS for a size McMaster doesn�t even carry?

They had 1/4" 12x20 sheets, which I presume they cut from larger sheets for shipping.

NewFatMike posted:

Idk what your attachment to this MDF hill is, there�s so much less sketchy composite wood out there for cheap.

I want to understand why all the backyard hobby shops are using MDF if it's such a terrible material. From the opposite direction, I'm trying to figure out why they don't use other materials instead.

I'm starting to wonder if maybe 'MDF' is just a catchall phrase and they actually use something totally different like matte board or hardboard, but at the same time these pieces sure as gently caress look like MDF and not something else.

As for why not the ones you listed, OSB, plyboard, and chipboard are totally inappropriate for the the scale I want to work at. Unless you mean special kinds that aren't at all what I'm thinking of and finding searching online and at the local hardware stores.

Take a look at this piece, thumb for scale.

You really think I can get that level of detail and quality out of OSB? Seriously?

# ? Feb 22, 2023 21:04

Nerobro: Nov 4, 2005; Rider now with 100% more titanium!

EVIL Gibson posted:

Sometimes you can sniff the air and just know some laser cut items are close... somewhere.

That smell is enough to stop me from doing laser cut things. It's frigheningly persistant.

# ? Feb 22, 2023 21:37

The Eyes Have It: Feb 10, 2008; Third Eye Sees All
...snookums

Slyphic posted:

Take a look at this piece, thumb for scale.

That looks like a really nice design. Looks like what we called (and was sold as) "Hardboard" (1/8"). Very common to laser cut that stuff. Nice and cheap and readily accessible. Usually sold in two flavors if from a hardware store: one side coated in white melamine, or without. Without is what I always used.

It vector engraves well (that's the brick lines, etc) and it cuts well (no worries about running into a knot or something like with plywood) but -- as you can see there in that pic -- around the cuts the surface gets sort of scorchy-looking. The high amount of detail and small scale on that design really masks that well and even kind of works with it, though. Does not paint well, tends to act like a dry sponge whose smoothness goes away the instant it gets wet.

The Eyes Have It fucked around with this message at 21:53 on Feb 22, 2023

# ? Feb 22, 2023 21:51

NewFatMike: Jun 11, 2015

The Eyes Have It posted:

That looks like a really nice design. Looks like what we called (and was sold as) "Hardboard" (1/8"). Very common to laser cut that stuff. Nice and cheap and readily accessible. Usually sold in two flavors if from a hardware store: one side coated in white melamine, or without. Without is what I always used.

It vector engraves well (that's the brick lines, etc) and it cuts well (no worries about running into a knot or something like with plywood) but -- as you can see there in that pic -- around the cuts the surface gets sort of scorchy-looking. The high amount of detail and small scale on that design really masks that well and even kind of works with it, though. Does not paint well, tends to act like a dry sponge whose smoothness goes away the instant it gets wet.

Seems like the best contender.

Slyphic posted:

They had 1/4" 12x20 sheets, which I presume they cut from larger sheets for shipping.

1/4� is twice as thick as the 3mm you mentioned earlier, 1/8� or 3mm.

quote:

I want to understand why all the backyard hobby shops are using MDF if it's such a terrible material. From the opposite direction, I'm trying to figure out why they don't use other materials instead.

People, especially makers, do a lot of dumb poo poo because it�s cheap and because they don�t value their time or health. I�ve got a couple thousand hours of professional laser jobs under my belt, and I�m trying to help you out.

quote:

I'm starting to wonder if maybe 'MDF' is just a catchall phrase and they actually use something totally different like matte board or hardboard, but at the same time these pieces sure as gently caress look like MDF and not something else.

As for why not the ones you listed, OSB, plyboard, and chipboard are totally inappropriate for the the scale I want to work at. Unless you mean special kinds that aren't at all what I'm thinking of and finding searching online and at the local hardware stores.

Take a look at this piece, thumb for scale.

You really think I can get that level of detail and quality out of OSB? Seriously?

I absolutely have on plywood, and you can laser cut painted surfaces with a mask, which is the general workflow if you want high detail out of a laser.

Anyway, I�m gonna quit helping you because you�re a dick. I sincerely hope you don�t treat everyone you ask for help this way.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 00:08

Bondematt: Jan 26, 2007; Not too stupid

Just had a power outage 11 hours into a print.

Thankfully it was for an electronics case so it's just a touch shorter and the edge that mate's with the other side is open, but should be workable.

Does anyone have their printer hooked up to a UPS?

# ? Feb 23, 2023 00:15

Rexxed: May 1, 2010; Dis is amazing!
I gotta try dis!

Bondematt posted:

Just had a power outage 11 hours into a print.

Thankfully it was for an electronics case so it's just a touch shorter and the edge that mate's with the other side is open, but should be workable.

Does anyone have their printer hooked up to a UPS?

I have mine on UPSes but you have to keep in mind they're meant to cover short outages so that you can shut down equipment safely, like 5-15 minutes, not necessarily a long one. It can get you to an alternate power source if the print is essential, like generator or battery wall, but that's a bit more costly.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 00:37

Effective-Disorder: Nov 13, 2013

Where does masonite fall into laser cutting safety territory?

# ? Feb 23, 2023 00:37

BlackIronHeart: Aug 2, 2004; PROCEED

HDF can also contain formaldehyde and sucks considerably more (in terms of manufacturing efficiency) than MDF when laser cutting.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 00:43

Slyphic: Oct 12, 2021; All we do is walk around believing birds!

NewFatMike posted:

1/4� is twice as thick as the 3mm you mentioned earlier, 1/8� or 3mm.

Yes, I was looking at a different thickness of sheet from them.

NewFatMike posted:

People, especially makers, do a lot of dumb poo poo because it�s cheap and because they don�t value their time or health.

You sound really full of yourself here. Definitely not possible they know more than you, like how to do it safely or efficiently.

NewFatMike posted:

I absolutely have on plywood

I can't find this magical completely smooth 3mm plywood that isn't just fiberboard by another name. It's all wood grained which doesn't work for me. And I still think it's hilarious you suggested OSB.

NewFatMike posted:

Anyway, I�m gonna quit helping you

Please do! Nothing you've said has been any real help so far. Certainly not compared to other people that responded.

NewFatMike posted:

because you�re a dick. I sincerely hope you don�t treat everyone you ask for help this way.

You called me a weasel in your first response. Get what you give.

Effective-Disorder posted:

Where does masonite fall into laser cutting safety territory?

Looks to be perfectly safe, if hard to work with. It's a type of hardboard or HDF, from what I've read so far.

BlackIronHeart posted:

HDF can also contain formaldehyde and sucks considerably more (in terms of manufacturing efficiency) than MDF when laser cutting.

Yeah, I'm finding that the formulation of fiberboards varies over time and between manufacturers, and you have to figure out the emissions hazard per lot.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 00:46

Roundboy: Oct 21, 2008

How does all of this off gassing and fumes talk work when you use an enclosure and vent it outside/out a filter?

Worse then doing the same with abs fumes?

I'm done working with scrap wood ATM but I want to test some slate coasters and some proper hard wood when I get some samples in before I make some final products. But I'm due to make sure the machine axis is proper and lubed, and clear out everything in anticipation of new tables incoming

# ? Feb 23, 2023 01:04

BlackIronHeart: Aug 2, 2004; PROCEED

Also we've been talking recently about laser cutting in the 3D Printing for the Tabletop thread which might suit this conversation better.

In my experience, MDF is much better to laser cut for tabletop stuff than plywood simply because it tends to be way more flat and less warped. I've gotten some 1/8" Baltic birch that looked like a sail in the wind and that's a real pain in the rear end for focus distances.

Roundboy posted:

How does all of this off gassing and fumes talk work when you use an enclosure and vent it outside/out a filter?

The main worry once you have adequate and proper ventilation is getting crud on your mirrors and surfaces that parts move on or along.

BlackIronHeart fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Feb 23, 2023

# ? Feb 23, 2023 01:06

NewFatMike: Jun 11, 2015

Slyphic posted:

Yes, I was looking at a different thickness of sheet from them.

You sound really full of yourself here. Definitely not possible they know more than you, like how to do it safely or efficiently.

I can't find this magical completely smooth 3mm plywood that isn't just fiberboard by another name. It's all wood grained which doesn't work for me. And I still think it's hilarious you suggested OSB.

Please do! Nothing you've said has been any real help so far. Certainly not compared to other people that responded.

You called me a weasel in your first response. Get what you give.

Looks to be perfectly safe, if hard to work with. It's a type of hardboard or HDF, from what I've read so far.

Yeah, I'm finding that the formulation of fiberboards varies over time and between manufacturers, and you have to figure out the emissions hazard per lot.

Dude, I�m not claiming to be the god emperor of laser cutting, you keep providing half the information anyone needs to give you any informed assistance, and the half you *do* provide makes you look bad.

Truly not gonna react differently when safety is involved, and I have already apologized for jumping the gun.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 01:46

IncredibleIgloo: Feb 17, 2011

Chainclaw posted:

There are tons of laser safe MDF out there, but it makes sense to me for a library to have a hard policy of "no MDF at all" because if you laser cut the wrong MDF you get poison air.

Maybe if you show the librarian the website you buy MDF from that shows it's specifically laser safe and intended to be laser cut, you'll be fine?

So just pull up like https://shop.glowforge.com/collections/all-materials/products/draftboard and see if the librarian is OK with it?

Also, I'm not a big fan of laser cut terrain. I cut a bunch myself and now I want to get rid of it all, but it's so unwanted I literally can't give it away. No one will take me up locally on this ugly garbage for free:

I haven't thrown it out yet because I'd feel bad doing so, but I probably should.

Maybe you can turn the buildings into a "Book Nook", maybe even print some other facades and whatnot to go with them to make a little scene or vignette. If you are not familiar with "Book Nooks" you should do a quick google on them, they are fun and easy to make with the laser.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 02:08

Slyphic: Oct 12, 2021; All we do is walk around believing birds!

NewFatMike posted:

Dude, I�m not claiming to be the god emperor of laser cutting, you keep providing half the information anyone needs to give you any informed assistance, and the half you *do* provide makes you look bad.

Truly not gonna react differently when safety is involved, and I have already apologized for jumping the gun.

I know that I don't enough yet to ask good question, so yeah, fair assessment of me. I tried to link to exactly what I'm trying to accomplish, and I don't know how to be clearer about that. I can provide exact specs on the laser setup.

quote:

The Library has two Full Spectrum laser cutters, the 45W Hobby Laser and the 45W Muse. The lasers can cut materials up to 1/4" thick, 12" wide by 20" long. Both are water cooled with active ventilation through a carbon filter into an HVAC space that vents to the roof.

Just about anything can be made safe with the correct precautions and mitigations. That's what I'm trying to figure out here, does my library have sufficient ventilation to cut very tiny pieces or thin perfectly smooth and flat pieces of wood? It looks like no formaldehyde added fiberboard is actually sufficiently safe to cut with active ventilation of an enclosed laser cutter, which is what I've got to work with.

I'll have to ask about dust accumulation and whether that's something I can cleanup on my own at the end of an appointment, or something they routinely do, or some other way not to make a nuisance of myself. There's not much in the way of advice at the branch worryingly.

MDF and maybe hardboard (can't find a source with two smooth sealed sides, and apparently it deforms with moisture or glue or paint which makes it kind suck for what I want to do) are the only materials I've identified to use. Links please for something with the same properties as MDF that's safer without being wildly more expensive like acrylic, because I straight up can't find it, and none of the hardware or specialty wood working stores in my town (Austin) have something better.

https://www.woodcraft.com/ and https://www.finelumber.com/ and https://www.rockler.com/ have locations near me, as well as all the usual big box hardware stores.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 02:16

IncredibleIgloo: Feb 17, 2011

Also, laser cutting MDF is totally fine because you can get stuff that is safe to cut, is inexpensive, and is typically very flat. It has some drawbacks of course, but no show stoppers. If you are making stuff for miniatures it is totally fine, especially if you use the mdf for the inner pieces of something or as filler, or whatever and then use the more expensive wood as the outer layer.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 02:17

Serenade: Nov 5, 2011; "I should really learn to fucking read"

One selling point of MDF is that the price of good plywood (Baltic Birch) is completely hosed right now. Whatever mechanical properties one has over the other might not matter if the supply is completely unreliable for the next few years.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 05:51

queeb: Jun 10, 2004; m

anyone use an ultrasonic cleaner for doing minis? Trying to find a way to streamline that part of the selling process, being able to dump a bunch into a baggie, toss into the ultrasonic for a few mins and have a clean model would be dope rather than thoothbrushing them. I added 5 printers to my setup this week (fdm/resin), trying to find a way to keep it all manageable lol.

queeb fucked around with this message at 18:54 on Feb 23, 2023

# ? Feb 23, 2023 18:49

Bodanarko: May 29, 2009

Thankful this Bowden coupler failed while changing filaments and not in the middle of the print! I think it was a result of a wisp of filament stuck in the Capricorn tubing causing a jam that led to the coupler failing instead of grinding the filament I guess.

# ? Feb 23, 2023 20:47

mattfl: Aug 27, 2004

Air Jordan 1 finished!

https://imgur.com/gallery/2mvHwRw

Completely useless but absolutely killer print. 44 hours and 1144 filament changes lol.

# ? Feb 24, 2023 00:03

The Eyes Have It: Feb 10, 2008; Third Eye Sees All
...snookums

Holy jeezus that's a print and a half!

# ? Feb 24, 2023 00:13

poverty goat: Feb 15, 2004

I tried to print something for the first time in a few weeks today and it failed with error "Heater extruder not heating at expected rate." From the log, the temp is stable +/-1 and then this happens, at different points in the print, once during preheat:

code:

target=250 temp=249.3 pwm=0.757
target=250 temp=230.1 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=225.3 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=231.5 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=230.4 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=231.1 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=235.5 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=235.7 pwm=1.000
Heater extruder not heating at expected rate
Transition to shutdown state: Heater extruder not heating at expected rate
See the 'verify_heater' section in docs/Config_Reference.md
for the parameters that control this check.

Google says I might need a new heater cartridge? Is there anything else to check?

# ? Feb 24, 2023 02:11

Cory Parsnipson: Nov 15, 2015

mattfl posted:

Air Jordan 1 finished!

https://imgur.com/gallery/2mvHwRw

Completely useless but absolutely killer print. 44 hours and 1144 filament changes lol.

Wow, even the texture shows through. That's amazing

# ? Feb 24, 2023 02:22

Roundboy: Oct 21, 2008

poverty goat posted:

I tried to print something for the first time in a few weeks today and it failed with error "Heater extruder not heating at expected rate." From the log, the temp is stable +/-1 and then this happens, at different points in the print, once during preheat:
code:
target=250 temp=249.3 pwm=0.757
target=250 temp=230.1 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=225.3 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=231.5 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=230.4 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=231.1 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=235.5 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=235.7 pwm=1.000
Heater extruder not heating at expected rate
Transition to shutdown state: Heater extruder not heating at expected rate
See the 'verify_heater' section in docs/Config_Reference.md
for the parameters that control this check.
Google says I might need a new heater cartridge? Is there anything else to check?

it could be your thermistor wire is going. or yes your heater cartridge. I lean towards the former because in the case of a bad cartridge, you get no heatup / slow heating . This seems to be a reporting error. There is no scenario where your heater rises and drops several degrees each tick

# ? Feb 24, 2023 03:15

IncredibleIgloo: Feb 17, 2011

poverty goat posted:

I tried to print something for the first time in a few weeks today and it failed with error "Heater extruder not heating at expected rate." From the log, the temp is stable +/-1 and then this happens, at different points in the print, once during preheat:
code:
target=250 temp=249.3 pwm=0.757
target=250 temp=230.1 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=225.3 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=231.5 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=230.4 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=231.1 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=235.5 pwm=1.000
target=250 temp=235.7 pwm=1.000
Heater extruder not heating at expected rate
Transition to shutdown state: Heater extruder not heating at expected rate
See the 'verify_heater' section in docs/Config_Reference.md
for the parameters that control this check.
Google says I might need a new heater cartridge? Is there anything else to check?

Perhaps the PID loop or verifying that the silicone sock is on. Another item might be that the part cooling fan is too powerful and overpowering the heater. There could be a problem with the thermistor, but I rate that as very unlikely since if it was loose the values would probably be jumping a lot more. The log seems to show that the heater could not maintain temperature, so it could also be a failing heater. But probably easiest to check the fan and sock situation first.

Edit to add, what is the time interval between the logs?

# ? Feb 24, 2023 03:21

poverty goat: Feb 15, 2004

IncredibleIgloo posted:

Edit to add, what is the time interval between the logs?

Here's the unedited log:

code:

Stats 426484.4: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.172 mcu_task_avg=0.000394 mcu_task_stddev=0.000288 bytes_write=246628 bytes_read=81366 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5398 receive_seq=5398 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=25 stalled_bytes=2526 freq=15996103 heater_bed: target=70 temp=70.0 pwm=0.378 sd_pos=65440 sysload=1.55 cputime=319.532 memavail=2756884 print_time=448.495 buffer_time=2.416 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=249.3 pwm=0.757
Stats 426485.4: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.172 mcu_task_avg=0.000394 mcu_task_stddev=0.000288 bytes_write=249835 bytes_read=81740 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5451 receive_seq=5451 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=56 stalled_bytes=2255 freq=15996101 heater_bed: target=70 temp=70.0 pwm=0.319 sd_pos=65670 sysload=1.55 cputime=319.563 memavail=2760312 print_time=449.460 buffer_time=2.381 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=249.3 pwm=0.757
Stats 426486.4: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.172 mcu_task_avg=0.000394 mcu_task_stddev=0.000288 bytes_write=253003 bytes_read=82095 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5503 receive_seq=5503 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=32 stalled_bytes=2128 freq=15996101 heater_bed: target=70 temp=70.0 pwm=0.228 sd_pos=65901 sysload=1.55 cputime=319.597 memavail=2758948 print_time=450.425 buffer_time=2.346 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=230.1 pwm=1.000
Stats 426487.4: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.172 mcu_task_avg=0.000394 mcu_task_stddev=0.000288 bytes_write=255992 bytes_read=82449 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5552 receive_seq=5552 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=38 stalled_bytes=2030 freq=15996101 heater_bed: target=70 temp=70.0 pwm=0.339 sd_pos=66132 sysload=1.55 cputime=319.629 memavail=2758624 print_time=451.388 buffer_time=2.309 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
Stats 426488.4: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.169 mcu_task_avg=0.000397 mcu_task_stddev=0.000296 bytes_write=258959 bytes_read=82819 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5601 receive_seq=5601 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=14 stalled_bytes=1964 freq=15996098 heater_bed: target=70 temp=70.0 pwm=0.327 sd_pos=66361 sysload=1.55 cputime=319.661 memavail=2755516 print_time=452.301 buffer_time=2.222 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
Stats 426489.4: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.169 mcu_task_avg=0.000397 mcu_task_stddev=0.000296 bytes_write=261858 bytes_read=83168 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5649 receive_seq=5649 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=51 stalled_bytes=1895 freq=15996096 heater_bed: target=70 temp=70.0 pwm=0.327 sd_pos=66611 sysload=1.59 cputime=319.691 memavail=2755044 print_time=453.107 buffer_time=2.027 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=225.3 pwm=1.000
Stats 426490.4: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.169 mcu_task_avg=0.000397 mcu_task_stddev=0.000296 bytes_write=265038 bytes_read=83523 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5702 receive_seq=5701 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=37 stalled_bytes=3880 freq=15996094 heater_bed: target=70 temp=69.9 pwm=0.493 sd_pos=67379 sysload=1.59 cputime=319.734 memavail=2751960 print_time=454.263 buffer_time=2.183 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=231.5 pwm=1.000
Stats 426491.5: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.169 mcu_task_avg=0.000397 mcu_task_stddev=0.000296 bytes_write=268553 bytes_read=83922 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5760 receive_seq=5759 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=13 stalled_bytes=3273 freq=15996097 heater_bed: target=70 temp=69.9 pwm=0.565 sd_pos=67765 sysload=1.59 cputime=319.770 memavail=2758080 print_time=455.190 buffer_time=2.109 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=230.4 pwm=1.000
Stats 426492.5: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.169 mcu_task_avg=0.000397 mcu_task_stddev=0.000296 bytes_write=273527 bytes_read=84441 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5842 receive_seq=5841 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=22 stalled_bytes=2317 freq=15996095 heater_bed: target=70 temp=69.9 pwm=0.313 sd_pos=68464 sysload=1.59 cputime=319.815 memavail=2757292 print_time=456.235 buffer_time=2.153 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=231.1 pwm=1.000
Stats 426493.5: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.199 mcu_task_avg=0.000412 mcu_task_stddev=0.000294 bytes_write=276723 bytes_read=84817 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5894 receive_seq=5894 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=40 stalled_bytes=2795 freq=15996095 heater_bed: target=70 temp=69.9 pwm=0.411 sd_pos=69242 sysload=1.59 cputime=319.855 memavail=2756444 print_time=457.387 buffer_time=2.305 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=235.5 pwm=1.000
Stats 426494.5: gcodein=0  mcu: mcu_awake=0.199 mcu_task_avg=0.000412 mcu_task_stddev=0.000294 bytes_write=280478 bytes_read=85231 bytes_retransmit=9 bytes_invalid=7 send_seq=5956 receive_seq=5955 retransmit_seq=2 srtt=0.001 rttvar=0.000 rto=0.025 ready_bytes=7 stalled_bytes=1915 freq=15996093 heater_bed: target=70 temp=70.0 pwm=0.152 sd_pos=70764 sysload=1.54 cputime=319.903 memavail=2753004 print_time=458.740 buffer_time=2.657 print_stall=0 extruder: target=250 temp=235.7 pwm=1.000
Heater extruder not heating at expected rate
Transition to shutdown state: Heater extruder not heating at expected rate
See the 'verify_heater' section in docs/Config_Reference.md
for the parameters that control this check.

I have no idea how to read this. maybe a second? Is it conceivable for it to drop that much in 1 second? I print fairly fast, 10-15mm^3/s with a .6 nozzle.

I think I can rule out the part cooling fan being a factor since one of 3 consecutive failures happened near the end of preheat before the part cooling fan would have activated. And FWIW I have a lot of part cooling, and I do the PID tuning with the fan at 50% because otherwise it cools the block too much during an actual print. It's been absolutely reliable since I upgraded the whole hotend/carriage/cooling situation a year ago. The sock is on and fitting well, there seems to be no change there, and it prints fine until it fails.

The thermistor and heater are genuine e3d v6 stuff from a real e3d supplier, if it matters. As far as replacements go, is there value in staying first party here? Or can I just grab cheap stuff from amazon?

poverty goat fucked around with this message at 03:47 on Feb 24, 2023

# ? Feb 24, 2023 03:43

Roundboy: Oct 21, 2008

ok that last log is helpful.

its every second, and this says:

pre:

extruder: target=250 temp=249.3 pwm=0.757
extruder: target=250 temp=249.3 pwm=0.757
extruder: target=250 temp=230.1 pwm=1.000
extruder: target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
extruder: target=250 temp=224.7 pwm=1.000
extruder: target=250 temp=225.3 pwm=1.000
extruder: target=250 temp=231.5 pwm=1.000
extruder: target=250 temp=230.4 pwm=1.000
extruder: target=250 temp=231.1 pwm=1.000
extruder: target=250 temp=235.5 pwm=1.000
extruder: target=250 temp=235.7 pwm=1.000

Your controller is sending max power to your extruder heater (pwm=1.000) because you want the hot end to be 250c ( target=250)
but the temp is not going up. Reading this log it looks like a proper heating, using 75% power to maintain a 249.3/250 temp but then in the next second your hotend reads 230.1c, and you now are sending max power (pwm=1.000) to bring it back up. but its not working.

until the end its starting to pick back up.. was the heater unplugged for a bit? its very odd

# ? Feb 24, 2023 03:59

poverty goat: Feb 15, 2004

it shouldn't have been, but I can work over all the plugs and wires to make sure everything is snug

e: still weird that it would happen during warmup, though, with nothing moving, if it was a loose connection

poverty goat fucked around with this message at 04:06 on Feb 24, 2023

# ? Feb 24, 2023 04:02

Dr. Fishopolis: Aug 31, 2004; ROBOT

poverty goat posted:

The thermistor and heater are genuine e3d v6 stuff from a real e3d supplier, if it matters. As far as replacements go, is there value in staying first party here? Or can I just grab cheap stuff from amazon?

Just grab cheap stuff from amazon, they're very simple parts. It's good to keep spares around, just make sure you're getting the same kind of thermistor.

It is a minor pain in the rear end to re-do the cabling, but they do fail from time to time due to wire strain or encasement in the blob of death.

# ? Feb 24, 2023 04:04

insta: Jan 28, 2009

poverty goat posted:

it shouldn't have been, but I can work over all the plugs and wires to make sure everything is snug

e: still weird that it would happen during warmup, though, with nothing moving, if it was a loose connection

I've had this before, a failing thermistor in the worst way. The values are Real Enough that the safeties don't trip.

# ? Feb 24, 2023 05:57

poverty goat: Feb 15, 2004

Thanks for the help, everyone. I'll start w/ a new thermistor and go from there

# ? Feb 24, 2023 06:51

poverty goat: Feb 15, 2004

I wasn't sure I was going to get the old thermistor out, and in the end it came out in two pieces, but I got the new one in and that seems to have done it :toot:

# ? Feb 26, 2023 00:03

Talorat: Sep 18, 2007; Hahaha! Aw come on, I can't tell you everything right away! That would make for a boring story, don't you think?

mattfl posted:

Air Jordan 1 finished!

https://imgur.com/gallery/2mvHwRw

Completely useless but absolutely killer print. 44 hours and 1144 filament changes lol.

Holy gently caress that looks amazing. They should use that to advertise the printer on Bambu's site, I'm drooling.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 01:32

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 30, 2024 05:10

FilthyImp: Sep 30, 2002; Anime Deviant

It's kind of funny that MDF guy is up in arms about "being called a weasel" (not even close to what the other poster said) when they routinely post like this:

quote:

The lady managing the lasers and printers and cutters and stuff was very clear, she's simply the least clueless person there and doesn't really know what she's doing.

# ? Feb 26, 2023 01:54

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Hobbies, Crafts, & Houses > 3D Printers: You can anneal some posts in a sous vide cooker

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