|
Darth Walrus posted:Cecily from F91 probably counts, too. And she and Relena were clear riffs on Sayla, so... Huh. It looks much more organic as a development put in that light. Never really thought of it like that.
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 00:18
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 20:19 |
|
|
Darth Walrus posted:Cecily from F91 probably counts, too. I thought about her, Sayla, and Minerva but I excluded them. For the standard Peace Princess archetype in Gundam I believe we should go by this rubrick Are they radically inclined towards peace? Does their station in life give them an outsized impact on the politics of the world regardless of their actual abilities? Are they primarily non combatants Does their identity need to be kept secret to keep the political situation from boiling over? Cecily hits a few, but her combat impact actually outstrips her political value in F91 and her political utility is almost useless in crossbones aside from making her the only rallying point for the Vanguardist remnants. Mineva in ZZ is too under Hamans thrall to be independent politically nor does she advance any real peace agenda.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 00:37
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:it's an extremely stupid way to criticize media.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 00:40
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:Fridging originally referred to the trend from American comics of having superheroes' girlfriends get horribly murdered just to motivate the hero. With the term coming from the time Green Lantern came home to find his girlfriend in the fridge. These were characters who existed for no reason beyond to be sexy and then get murdered. That was what the term was describing and criticizing. It has to mean more than just "women dying to motivate the protagonist" because if that's all it means the it's an extremely stupid way to criticize media. It's fiction, most things that happen to motivate the protagonist. Flay was one of the best realized characters in the whole show, she had her own arc, and her death was a conclusion to her own arc. If that's fridging, then who gives a poo poo about fridging? imo an especially important detail about that specific comic is that the girlfriend only existed for like, 2-3 issues. She never got to be her own character, she's just Green Lantern's girlfriend, she was immediately killed in a violent way and there's nothing you can say about her except her death. If instead of dying she broke up with him and left town never to be seen again nobody would remember her.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 01:20
|
|
|
the violence of what happened to her is also an important aspect. theres a difference between a female character dying and a female character being cut up and stuffed into a fridge. there's a certain level of cruelty or brutality that's often reserved for female characters in an attempt to make their deaths even more upsetting or shocking. seed i think is relatively fair about this in that every death in the show is bizarrely graphic.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 01:26
|
|
|
Endorph posted:the violence of what happened to her is also an important aspect. theres a difference between a female character dying and a female character being cut up and stuffed into a fridge. there's a certain level of cruelty or brutality that's often reserved for female characters in an attempt to make their deaths even more upsetting or shocking. seed i think is relatively fair about this in that every death in the show is bizarrely graphic. The problem is that while edgy content has always had a place in Gundam, SEED handles it in a very incompetent fashion that is distracting and feels out of place when compared to everything else about SEED aesthetically
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 01:37
|
|
|
I think you can make an argument that there's some value to Tolle and Nichol's deaths being shockingly graphic to hammer in the point to Kira and Athrun, but then the show has stuff like the microwave weapon that kills a bunch of mooks in a horrific way for no real narrative reason.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 01:56
|
|
|
the funny thing about sayla is that she probably could have become a peace princess. she had all the elements available. but sayla made her own decisions in life and had no interest in being a symbol, public or otherwise. and everyone just left her alone!
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 02:20
|
|
|
gimme the GOD drat candy posted:the funny thing about sayla is that she probably could have become a peace princess. she had all the elements available. but sayla made her own decisions in life and had no interest in being a symbol, public or otherwise. and everyone just left her on safari!
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 02:22
|
|
|
gimme the GOD drat candy posted:the funny thing about sayla is that she probably could have become a peace princess. she had all the elements available. but sayla made her own decisions in life and had no interest in being a symbol, public or otherwise. and everyone just left her alone! the universal century descended into cannibalism and then apocalypse shortly after coincidence??
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 03:16
|
|
|
gimme the GOD drat candy posted:the funny thing about sayla is that she probably could have become a peace princess. she had all the elements available. but sayla made her own decisions in life and had no interest in being a symbol, public or otherwise. and everyone just left her alone! That's part of what I found interesting here. You have a chain of development from Sayla to Cecily to Shakti to Relena to Diana that's a clear development for the archetype, making "Gundam Peace Princess" a clear archetype. Clear enough that, when SEED was released, they split the main Peace Princess and the Sayla into separate characters (Cagili still had some of the later archetype baggage attached, mind, but Lacus had the bulk of it), and later shows just kept the Peace Princess around. Kudelia, for example, isn't a pilot, has no connection to anyone else important in the plot (her dad vanishes from the story once she disowns him) and isn't remotely secretive.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 03:23
|
|
|
The one from 00 is the worst one of that archetype, like she's so unimportant that if you chopped her scenes out of Season 1 you would lose nothing of note or worth(and indeed it would tighten things up if you're like me and prefer treating 00 Season 1 as a standalone work and ignore the existence of either Season 2 or Awakening of Trailblazer)
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 03:27
|
|
|
drrockso20 posted:The one from 00 is the worst one of that archetype, like she's so unimportant that if you chopped her scenes out of Season 1 you would lose nothing of note or worth(and indeed it would tighten things up if you're like me and prefer treating 00 Season 1 as a standalone work and ignore the existence of either Season 2 or Awakening of Trailblazer) She's important for Setsuna's story, their relationship shows Setsuna's growth from being anti-war to pro-peace, if that makes sense. At the start of the armed interventions, Setsuna is committed to Celestial Being's mission and still full of anger at the general state of things. You see this with how he interacts with Marina, he doesn't blame her specifically but he's clearly angry with her. Over the course of the show, and partly due to his interactions with Marina, he loses that anger and becomes more concerned with Celestial Being's ideals.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 03:36
|
|
|
drrockso20 posted:The one from 00 is the worst one of that archetype, like she's so unimportant that if you chopped her scenes out of Season 1 you would lose nothing of note or worth(and indeed it would tighten things up if you're like me and prefer treating 00 Season 1 as a standalone work and ignore the existence of either Season 2 or Awakening of Trailblazer) She is the absolute worst. I know 00 has some big, big fans here and elsewhere but I've never heard anyone say "oh man, I loved Marina."
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 03:37
|
|
|
I think Marina really suffers from the politics of the show being very shallow and not very thought out. Theoretically, the leader of a war torn poor little country could be a fantastic way to show the audience how Celestial Beings' actions were affecting the globe politically. But that wasn't a focus of the show. So Marina is just there for the benefit of Setsuna's character
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 03:55
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:I think Marina really suffers from the politics of the show being very shallow and not very thought out. Theoretically, the leader of a war torn poor little country could be a fantastic way to show the audience how Celestial Beings' actions were affecting the globe politically. But that wasn't a focus of the show. So Marina is just there for the benefit of Setsuna's character and setsuna barely seems to care about her either half the time
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 03:56
|
|
|
Endorph posted:and setsuna barely seems to care about her either half the time Setsuna was too busy still fighting to care.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 04:00
|
|
|
there was some gundam crossover game where you could use a lot of non-pilot characters as pilots in any gundam you pleased. just about everyone had unique lines for god gundam, including marina. it was funny as hell and i wish i could find that youtube video again.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 04:06
|
|
|
Ss Gundam cross rays
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 04:25
|
|
|
gimme the GOD drat candy posted:there was some gundam crossover game where you could use a lot of non-pilot characters as pilots in any gundam you pleased. just about everyone had unique lines for god gundam, including marina. it was funny as hell and i wish i could find that youtube video again. Literally everyone in the God Gundam in SD Cross Rays. The first comment of the video has timestamps for everyone, including Marina.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 04:27
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:She's important for Setsuna's story, their relationship shows Setsuna's growth from being anti-war to pro-peace, if that makes sense. At the start of the armed interventions, Setsuna is committed to Celestial Being's mission and still full of anger at the general state of things. You see this with how he interacts with Marina, he doesn't blame her specifically but he's clearly angry with her. Over the course of the show, and partly due to his interactions with Marina, he loses that anger and becomes more concerned with Celestial Being's ideals. Again sure if you're including Season 2 but I'm specifically excluding anything after Season 1 and Season 1 Marina is extremely pointless as a character
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 05:11
|
|
|
I don't even know if "Setsuna starts as an angry robot desperate to destroy what he sees as the distortion in the world, but eventually becomes a less angry robot desperate to destroy what he sees as the distortion in the world" actually qualifies as meaningful development or an arc, too. Even if Marina successfully makes him less angry about it - which is extremely debatable, given that she basically loses the ability to interact with him after S1 - it doesn't really change anything meaningful.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 06:37
|
|
|
All this debate about how meaningful she is to Setsuna reminds me of this gem https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgVM9NOk3Dw
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 07:47
|
|
|
Is Gundam Reconwhatever in G any good?
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 12:16
|
|
|
it's very divisive. you can probably finish watching it before the argument in this thread you just incited is over.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 12:24
|
|
|
Synthbuttrange posted:Is Gundam Reconwhatever in G any good? Top 3 gundam
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 12:38
|
|
|
Synthbuttrange posted:Is Gundam Reconwhatever in G any good? It's a very pretty show with lots of extremely odd writing choices that you're going to have to decide for yourself whether you vibe with or not.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 12:40
|
|
|
Synthbuttrange posted:Is Gundam Reconwhatever in G any good? It is fantastic. It just requires you to pay more attention than most anime. Lots of important world building done through casual dialogue and important character work you have to put together yourself based on the character's actions.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 13:11
|
|
|
and that’s why!
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 13:39
|
|
|
Reconguista has some big ideas and also has a sense of adventure to it but I'm also not sure it's able to pull them together to be a great show like Gainer or Turn A. It's worth a watch though as it's not a boring show as stuff is happening and the cast is fun
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 15:35
|
|
|
G-Self is one of my favourite Gundams and its addons are cool.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 16:11
|
|
|
G-Reco has a good Haro
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 16:22
|
|
|
Hot drat, I just finished December Sky and that may have been my favorite bit of Gundam content ever. Top tier themes, music, animation, everything really. My only minor gripe is that a lot of the scenes felt a bit underbaked or abbreviated, which I have to assume isn’t a problem in the OVA version? Wondering if I should watch the next movie or catch it in episodic form instead?
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 16:43
|
|
|
The movie only has additional animation over the OVAs to my knowledge, there is no value in going back to those
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 16:46
|
|
|
SatoshiMiwa posted:Reconguista has some big ideas and also has a sense of adventure to it but I'm also not sure it's able to pull them together to be a great show like Gainer or Turn A. It's worth a watch though as it's not a boring show as stuff is happening and the cast is fun I just started on Gainer and cannot stop myself from constantly singing the King! King! King! Gainer bit of the OP out loud.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 16:49
|
|
|
I see the last G-Reco movie came out a few months ago are they worth watching if you’ve already seen the show?
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 17:00
|
|
|
hatty posted:I see the last G-Reco movie came out a few months ago are they worth watching if you’ve already seen the show? I watched the movies a few weeks ago and they were solid
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 17:09
|
|
|
Is there an option for watching the last two movies that isn't piracy or importing the super-expensive Japanese disks?
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 17:25
|
|
|
hatty posted:I see the last G-Reco movie came out a few months ago are they worth watching if you’ve already seen the show? There's some new stuff and some added explanations but it's not major changes so while I think they're a decent watch it's not must see if TV was enough G-reco for you. Plus the run time is almost the same as the TV series over the 5 movies lamo
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 20:25
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 20:19 |
|
|
Is there a notable bump in the animation in spots? Might be worth checking out for that alone.
|
|
#
?
Aug 12, 2023 20:28
|
|