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American McGay
Feb 28, 2010

by sebmojo
lol the controls screen one of the buttons was for "accept call" and I'm not sure if it meant in the game or IRL.

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Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011

American McGay posted:

lol the controls screen one of the buttons was for "accept call" and I'm not sure if it meant in the game or IRL.

Which you kept unbound, I hope? Everyone knows that real Third Echelon agents screen their calls

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

*accepts call*
Mom: Hello, dear
Me: LAMBERT IS THAT YOU?! I'M BEING HUNTED!

Sub-Actuality
Apr 17, 2007

American McGay posted:

lol the controls screen one of the buttons was for "accept call" and I'm not sure if it meant in the game or IRL.

lol

 




Pablo Nergigante
Apr 16, 2002

American McGay posted:

lol the controls screen one of the buttons was for "accept call" and I'm not sure if it meant in the game or IRL.

Lol

Fungah!
Apr 30, 2011

American McGay posted:

lol the controls screen one of the buttons was for "accept call" and I'm not sure if it meant in the game or IRL.

lol

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Dishonored: Death of the Outsider







If you were getting sick of Emily and/or Corvo, have I got the DLC for you! In Death to the of the Outsider, you play as Billie Lurk, former henchperson to magic assassin extraordinaire Daud. You embark on a quest with Daud to eliminate the one source of misery and anguish on the isles: that guard who really wants a pear soda The Outsider. DotO overall feels like Arkane had gotten tired of the formula by this point, but there are glimmers of light here and there. I thought it was interesting that Lurk will actually argue with the Outsider, as opposed to previous games, where you really did nothing but sit there and listen to his emo buddhist sermonizing. The story isn't too bad, actually. They were wise to set up events in the form of a mystery, especially since the title kind of gives everything away. You start off rescuing an aged Daud from a bunch of cultists. When you free him, he engages in a frenzy of Blink-murder on his former captors, then tells you about a lead he has - he's heard tales of a knife that made the Outsider who/what he is, and this magical ginsu number should be able to unmake him as well.

The Man in Black Who Is Not Johnny Cash pays you a visit, but he doesn't give you his mark. Probably because you're trying to kill him, I assume. Somehow you still get some powers, but just a few. Really if one of your complaints is that the previous Dishonored games made you too OP, then you might want to give DotO a try. You get a power called Semblance that lets you steal someone's appearance for a while. This allows you entrance into places you wouldn't normally be allowed to go, but the deal is off if you start a stabbing rampage. Foresight will freeze time and cause you to roam about, ghostlike, and scout ahead. You can mark targets a la Splinter Cell Conviction and keep track of them via a highlighted silhouette. I'm still trying to decide whether this is more or less broken than Dark Vision or not. Finally, you have a Blink-a-like called Displace. It's like a two-step Blink: first you mark the spot that you want to teleport to, then you actually zip there. I think it feels like they're trying too hard, since in Dishonored 2, Emily had a Blink-a-like too. It's like Arkane couldn't stand that the Blink in Dishonored was so perfect so they kept trying to up their game, to less-than-spectacular results. I guess the advantage of Displace is that you can set your mark first, then run around like a noisy lunatic and when the guards start taking notice, you can just bamf up to a rooftop or something. There are even a few puzzles that require this. I guess in the Shindaerey Mines, the developers were in a Valve-esque mood because there's no shortage of physics puzzles that require some inventive use of Displace.

With Death of the Outsider, you get a pretty good chunk of game for your money (and it's currently on sale as part of Quakecon until the 16th!), although there is a bit of map reuse: the Royal Conservatory from D2 makes an appearance, as well as the bank map from earlier in the game. Usually for DLC a bit of map copying is expected, but the bank map appears immediately after you cleared it out in the previous level. It gets kind of tedious to see a map you just visited, especially if you're the kind of stealthnik that likes to exhaustively clear a map of all its inhabitants. In the final map, you get to sneak around the Void, which is a bit interesting. Enemy placement is rather sparse, but since they're creatures who also have void powers, they can pose a compelling challenge. In typical fashion, you have the option to spare the Outsider, making him a mortal man walking the streets of the isles once again. I thought this was amusing...you'd think that a guy who hasn't had anything to eat for 4000 years would be running into the nearest tavern yelling, "give me some Pratchett jellied eels RIGHT NOW!" Oh well. DotO keeps things just fresh enough that you may want to check it out if you're not yet sick of the Dishonored gameplay loop. There are lots of varied challenges and the twist of having few powers but a large arsenal is a good one. Also, I think there's some sort of standing obligation to buy any stealth game that has a bank level.

Seventh Arrow fucked around with this message at 03:44 on Aug 11, 2023

Thief
Jan 28, 2011

:420::420::420::420::420::420::420::420::420::420::420:
a friend gifted me Shadows of Doubt and it's pretty great if you're looking for something a bit different

it's a sandbox detective game where you extensively snoop around a randomly generated city that is full of npcs that live their lives. it feels pretty immersive and difficult at first

eventually murders happen and you can go investigate them with little to no handholding

they're not always realistically solvable. one of the things i see a lot when looking up this game is that there are apparently bugs that prevent some cases from being solved. but also your character isn't a cop and you'll find yourself showing up to taped up crimescenes while personally organizing Pepe Silvia cases like a hobbyist that just won't come together until you get a feel for the game anyway. this is kind of awesome if you actually want to dive into it and when you finally solve a case it's quite impressive for procedurally generated content.

and yeah, there are massive apartment buildings that you can break into and steal stuff then creepily go through innocent NPCs emails or whatever. the game doesn't really stop you from playing like a piece of poo poo if you want to lol

stuff like combat can feel clunky at times but there's really a great amount of detail put into the stuff that actually matters for something like this

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Thief posted:

a friend gifted me Shadows of Doubt and it's pretty great if you're looking for something a bit different

it's a sandbox detective game where you extensively snoop around a randomly generated city that is full of npcs that live their lives. it feels pretty immersive and difficult at first

eventually murders happen and you can go investigate them with little to no handholding

they're not always realistically solvable. one of the things i see a lot when looking up this game is that there are apparently bugs that prevent some cases from being solved. but also your character isn't a cop and you'll find yourself showing up to taped up crimescenes while personally organizing Pepe Silvia cases like a hobbyist that just won't come together until you get a feel for the game anyway. this is kind of awesome if you actually want to dive into it and when you finally solve a case it's quite impressive for procedurally generated content.

and yeah, there are massive apartment buildings that you can break into and steal stuff then creepily go through innocent NPCs emails or whatever. the game doesn't really stop you from playing like a piece of poo poo if you want to lol

stuff like combat can feel clunky at times but there's really a great amount of detail put into the stuff that actually matters for something like this
I'm really excited about this game but I'm going to wait for full release because early access procedurally generated crime investigation sounds like a frustrating experience lol. I have frequent "has this game bugged out or are am I just too dumb to put two and two together" in, like, Phoenix Wright never mind something like that

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Avast mateys, Shadow Gambit be released on Steam! Yarrrr, etc., etc.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1545560/Shadow_Gambit_The_Cursed_Crew/

oddium
Feb 21, 2006

end of the 4.5 tatami age

if desperados wasn't already established mimimi would have called their commandos wild west game shadow riders or something

Sub-Actuality
Apr 17, 2007

Seventh Arrow posted:

Avast mateys, Shadow Gambit be released on Steam! Yarrrr, etc., etc.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1545560/Shadow_Gambit_The_Cursed_Crew/



oh hell yeah

 




Subjunctive
Sep 12, 2006

✨sparkle and shine✨

Seventh Arrow posted:

Avast mateys, Shadow Gambit be released on Steam! Yarrrr, etc., etc.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1545560/Shadow_Gambit_The_Cursed_Crew/



This looks so good, but maybe a little too similar to the game loop for BG3 for the moment. Taking a break from that one.

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Aragami







Let's see:

✅ Review Aragami 2
✅Talk up Aragami 1
❌ Review Aragami 1

I said all kinds of nice things about the first Aragami game, but never gave it a proper review! Time to rectify that! The setting is sorta-feudal Japan, and you are an Aragami - a summoned shadow spirit who is beckoned to do a bunch of stabby murder in the name of justice. Or, so you think. The story is merely ok, it at least kept me moderately interested here and there. I don't think any of the story beats (including the obligatory signlit twist at the end) will come as a surprise to anyone who's watched any anime before. The main thing is that you're a ghostly ninja up against a bunch of light-wielding samurai. The visuals opt for a watercolor-inspired look, and this strikes me as a welcome decision; not only does it comport with the setting, but as an indie game developed with five guys, it made sense not to go for some sort of nvidia-melting GPU-intensive monstrosity. Even more than the graphics, however, the audio and sound design are far more crucial to stealth games. Aragami doesn't disappoint in this regard. Most of the music is subdued and stays out of your shadowy footsteps. Enemies make just enough noise so that you know where they are if you listen. Sloppy kills are also noisy kills and bad guys will sound a booming horn if a body is discovered. The game does what a stealth game needs to do audio-wise, which is let you make Informed Decisions about Stabbing©️, based largely on audio cues.

The gameplay is compelling, but, having just played Dishonored, I find it interesting that a growing cache of mystical powers makes you a bit too OP the more you acquire. I mostly used them just in scenarios where they would be interesting. Also like Dishonored, you get a teleporting "Blink" type power, but there's a catch - you can only teleport to shadowy areas and it takes up some 'shadow energy'. That's basically mana: using powers or staying in lit areas will drain your energy and you have to move back into a shadowy area to replenish it. One thing that's cool is the diegetic way the interface handles this...the coloration on your cape will indicate how much shadow energy you have, as well as how many charges of each power. Although, the default coloration is black & red = empty and icy blue = full. I wish it were the other way around, because having black and glowy red ninja jammies is badass. Because of the aforementioned muted graphics style, the levels have a certain amount of charm, but will not have you mashing the printscreen button. They're great from a 'functional stealth' perspective, though - they give you all sorts of neat nooks and crannies to hide in and then emerge like a trapdoor spider to perforate fools. It's also worth noting that being in the shadows does not render you totally invisible. You'd think an inky ninja spirit hiding in the shadows would be extremely invisible, but you can still be spotted. Fortunately, it's usually trivial to teleport behind the interloper and either dispatch them or slink away. You can also go through the game without killing anyone, by the way.

I mentioned the powers and then kind of wandered off: you have the aforementioned Blink, as well as the ability to turn invisible. There's an ability similar to Dark Gaze or Batman Vision, although I think the game is better when you scout around using your ears and natural eyesight alone. Probably the most ridiculous power is the ability to summon a mini-black hole that immediately devours any nearby victims. It's rather amusing to gather a bunch of enemies in one place using a distraction sound, then conjure a yawning cosmic horror that instantly consumes them. Good times. I have to give credit to the boss fight design here. Boss fights can be a challenge in stealth games, because the concept has become aligned with images of epic combat. So a stealth game needs to rethink the traditional boss battle, and the one with Mr. Freeze in the Arkham games is usually cited as a good example. Aragami's first boss is a light-wielding samurai who is protected by shields, and its only by stealthily taking out the shield's emitters can you get in close. The second boss is a teleporting archer whose bow emits a beam of light that can highlight your location if you're not careful. The last boss is also intriguing, but I'll leave that for those who play through the game. Enemies are kind of dumb, but they can see far - and unlike Dishonored, they also look up. The game also has no manual saves...I wouldn't mind it so much, but the autosave checkpoints are few and far between. Getting caught sometimes means having to replay rather large sections of the level and that can be annoying. Aside from that, Aragami is a good stealth game to chill out to and discover solutions to stealth puzzles. It doesn't quite have the replayability that Aragami 2 does, but there are some Steam Workshop levels if you want to extend your gameplay a bit. There's also some content DLC which is more of the same. Overall, Aragami is a welcome addition to any stealthnik's library.

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Goddamn Mimimi is closing

https://www.mimimi.games/our-final-game/

Least they're going out on their own terms but working in games seems like absolute hell lol

Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011

Lunchmeat Larry posted:

Goddamn Mimimi is closing

https://www.mimimi.games/our-final-game/

Least they're going out on their own terms but working in games seems like absolute hell lol

Oh, drat! That's sad news :( At least they're going out on their own terms though, as you said

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Wow, that's crazy and unexpected, the games they put out were always great. I'll post a full review later, but Shadow Gambit is fantastic so far.

Sub-Actuality
Apr 17, 2007

Lunchmeat Larry posted:

Goddamn Mimimi is closing

https://www.mimimi.games/our-final-game/

Least they're going out on their own terms but working in games seems like absolute hell lol

poo poo that sucks. their games have all been amazing

 




Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Shadow Gambit: The Cursed Crew








I have good news and I have bad news: the good news is that Shadow Gambit delivers everything you could ever want in a stealth tactics game and more. The bad news is that it delivers everything you could ever want in a stealth tactics game and more. The question is whether you're in the mood for a stealth tactics game or not. SG doesn't do anything vastly different from previous Mimimi games, so if you're burned out on the genre or simply not interested, the game will likely not sway you. Aside from that, if you have any interest in the developer's favored brand, you need to pick this up immediately. It's very clear that Mimimi has worked very hard to patch up the hull, right the sails, and slap a fresh coat of paint on this eminently seaworthy vessel. The new, original setting is very lively, taking you on a zany journey with your cursed pirates as they cross swords and trade barbs with the fanatical Inquisition. Your merry band of buccaneers is as follows:
  • Afia Manicato (The Navigator): Has a sword in her chest that is, we're told, the source of her powers. How? Unknown. Afia is the first character you're introduced to and is instrumental in getting the plot started. Somehow, this is the third stealth game in a row I've played that has a "Blink" ability. This one does pretty much what it says on the tin, teleporting you to a targeted location, although the range is admittedly underwhelming. If an enemy is at the terminus of your Blink ability, then a stabby murder effect is added. Also has a sorcerous stop watch that will stop time for affected enemies, even higher level ones
  • Toya of Iga (The Ship Cook): A Japanese one-armed skeleton who is somehow your best swordsman and your best swimmer. Has the ability to set down a paper doll that he can teleport to; as with Afia, if a bad guy happens to wander in range of said doll, then he is susceptible to cutlass perforation. One thing that's interesting to note is that there's no range on this thing. You can put it way on the other end of the island if you want a quick escape available. Also has a whistle that will lure enemies, very much like Yuki from Shadow Tactics. A final note of trivia: apparently when he was alive, Toya was in the same ninja clan as Hayato from ST
  • John Mercury (The Shipwright): A Scottish skeleton who, of course, has a big red beard. Carries around a gigantic anchor which he uses to brain unsuspecting land-lubbers. John has one of the most incredibly OP powers in the game - the ability to "hide" under a given point in the ground, remaining completely indetectable. Once hidden, he can resurface at any point (at level) in a wide range, killing anyone at that point and submerging the body out of view. Can also use his pet ghost fish, Sir Reginald, as a distraction. They can be combined in a one-two maneuver that allows John to solo many of the maps
  • Suleidy (The Ship Doctor): A Poison Ivy-esque plant lady who can create her own cover: she can toss a seedling pod within a generous radius that will grow into a bush at the targeted location. This acts like any other leafy cover in the game, allowing your crew to hide within it and also use it for stashing bodies. Can also fling Wander Dust at enemies, causing the lower-level flunkies to mindlessly wander away from their post for a few seconds. Of course, higher-level enemies are merely distracted for a bit
  • Teresa de la Ciega (The Sharpshooter): An ex-Inquisition lady of gruff demeanor, the sniper of the group - much like Takuma and Dr. McCoy before her. She has a single magical bolt that she uses to snipe zealots from afar, but it must be retrieved after every shot. If that sounds like an annoying hassle, it is, although it can be mitigated by way of upgrades. Also has a long-range powder shot that lets you blind enemies from afar, which can be insanely useful
  • Gaëlle le Bris (The Cannoness): Lugs around a giant cannon and scrawls poems which she recites in her thick Breton accent. This is probably the most unique character that Mimimi has come up with - she carries a massive Kanol (cannon) on her back, using people as ammo. She will merrily stuff dead or unconscious guards into the mouth of her iron beast and then noisily fire them at a targeted enemy in range, knocking them out cold and probably doing inestimable damage to their self-esteem. Then she can stuff that guard into her cannon and start the process all over again. You can solo some entire maps like this. She also has a set of firecrackers, one of the best distractions in the game
  • Quentin Aalbers (The Treasure Hunter): This guy is not a first-rate killer-of-bad-guys, but boy does he make up for it in utility. He has a magic fishing rod that can activate environmental traps, hide bodies, interact with switches, pickpocket guards, and move crewmates to your location. He also has one of the best other distractions in the game: he can remove his (golden, jewel-encrusted) skull and toss it on the ground, whereby lower-level enemies will walk over to it and seal their fate. More of a lure than a distraction, but yeah, it's pretty sweet. The skull also glows in the dark, so you can use it on night missions.
  • Pinkus von Presswald (The Quartermaster): Similar to Isabelle from Desperadoes 3, he can mind control enemies and make them do his bidding (within a certain range). Once an enemy is possessed, he can do menial tasks with them, and also has the ability to converse with guards (as with Kate and Aiko before them) - although if he lingers, they will get suspicious

The adventure begins with you in command of Afia, who battles the inquisition to free The Red Marley, a sentient phantom ship. Once freed, she is the main base of your operations...yes, a literal ghost ship with a literal skeleton crew. The rest of your swashbuckling adventures involve such piratey affairs as decoding a riddle left by the Marley's former captain, in search of a grand treasure while crossing cutlasses with the maniacal Inquisition. I won't go into it much more than that, because it's a delightful affair that is best for you to discover on your own. The characters are all lively and charming with plenty of backstory, and many of them have hilariously offensive accents. Compared to previous Mimimi games, Shadow Gambit might seem a bit...I don't want to simplify it into 'easier', but I think that they made a serious effort to give you many more options when it comes to completing your objectives. By this I mean that your crew has some abilities that are decidedly OP, but still have some limitations - so you may not (thankfully) be able to wipe an entire map out with ease, but the individual challenges seem to be more digestible this time around. This is good news if the hair-pulling difficulty of the previous games stealth puzzles put you off. There are also some new enemy types that breathe a bit of life into the genre: one of them has the ability to stun whoever attacks him (this includes distraction abilities), so you have to find a way to gang up on him. There are also enemies who are connected by a visible mental link. If you kill one, the other will resurrect them, so you have to devise ways to dispatch them both at the same time.

One thing that I really appreciated is that each character has their own tutorial. They're added to your party one-by-one over the course of the story, so the opportunity to go through training challenges really helps the player get familiar with their abilities before heading out to battle. As in previous Mimimi games, quicksave abuse is here in full force and heartily encouraged. At this point, I'm starting to wonder if the developer is in collusion with a company that makes replacement F5 keys. They do add a neat twist, however, in that your saves are presented as "memories" - a supernatural ability of Marley to recall the past, to the crew's advantage. There are levels where you can pick up memory shards left behind by the enemy, so it was like being able to access the villain's savegames - a really neat twist! It even becomes a bigger part of the story later on. As usual the game will remind you on a regular basis to save - fortunately, you can set the interval at which this happens (or turn it off altogether).

One of the downsides is that there is a bit of grinding - each crewmate that you want to revive requires a black pearl and some soul energy, so you will need to repeat some islands in order to obtain these rewards. However, usually the second approach will be at a different time (night or day), so that will give you a bit of variety. Your crew will consist of three members and you'll be pleased to know that any combination is viable - you'll never be trapped in an unwinnable state because you brought some bilge-sucking scurvy dog. A lot of Mimimi mainstays are present here: bodies "dissolve" when you hide them in the bushes or water, clicking on a destination will draw a visible line that the character will follow, you can put a mark on an enemy or location to see who is looking at it, etc. But there are now many improvements to the formula as well: many crew members have enhanced mobility options, disposing of bodies is much easier, alarms are less punishing, and a characters abilities can be upgraded throughout the course of the game. The voice-acting is superb, the music is excellent, the visuals are dazzling, and the writing is engaging while not particularly deep. If you're in the mood for a stealth tactics game, then Mimimi's latest and final adventure is a most seaworthy man-o-war.

oddium
Feb 21, 2006

end of the 4.5 tatami age

game owns, rip mimimi

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

one thing that I forgot to mention is that there's a guide on Steam that's a really good introduction to all of the characters and their abilities:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3022751935

In Training
Jun 28, 2008

Lunchmeat Larry posted:

Goddamn Mimimi is closing

https://www.mimimi.games/our-final-game/

Least they're going out on their own terms but working in games seems like absolute hell lol

why didn't they just take a vacation or let someone else run the company or something. It doesn't sound like they ran out of money, they just don't want to make more games rn?

trying to jack off
Dec 31, 2007

In Training posted:

why didn't they just take a vacation or let someone else run the company or something. It doesn't sound like they ran out of money, they just don't want to make more games rn?

they say right in that post that future production costs risk overtaking their potential income. i guess they could have sold the company, but honestly what is it worth without the two lead devs?

trying to jack off
Dec 31, 2007

i guess it makes sense that games are getting more expensive to make, and probably the exact same number of people by every one of the games they release.

CountryMatters
Apr 8, 2009

IT KEEPS HAPPENING
Honestly I wish games would just go all in on being cheaper, less graphics, less crunch. I am not playing a mimimi for real time shadows and water rendering, none of that makes it more fun to distract a guard with a thrown coin and then stab him. I'd still happily play all their games if they looked just like desperados 1

trying to jack off
Dec 31, 2007

CountryMatters posted:

Honestly I wish games would just go all in on being cheaper, less graphics, less crunch. I am not playing a mimimi for real time shadows and water rendering, none of that makes it more fun to distract a guard with a thrown coin and then stab him. I'd still happily play all their games if they looked just like desperados 1

thats not the cost of making the game, all that poo poo.comes in engine now

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Honestly a lot of issues in game development could be resolved with actual competent project managers. Either you're at a bit developer who doesn't care until poo poo really hits the fan and you end up with a UbiSoft skull and bones situation, or you're at a small developer where they feel they can't justify having an extra person in that position until all of a sudden they realise why it was a good idea

Pablo Nergigante
Apr 16, 2002

And now Unity is gonna start charging developers a fee based on number of installs lol

trying to jack off
Dec 31, 2007

Pablo Nergigante posted:

And now Unity is gonna start charging developers a fee based on number of installs lol

jesus

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Pablo Nergigante posted:

And now Unity is gonna start charging developers a fee based on number of installs lol

This will include pirated installs meaning that some board executive read this post and little jackpot noises went off in his head

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

No One Lives Forever 2: A Spy in H.A.R.M.'s Way







So one thing that you may notice is that, like Escape from Butcher Bay, No One Lives Forever (1 & 2) is not available on any digital storefronts. Like Escape from Butcher Bay, this is due to a nefarious licensing snarl. Unlike EfBB, for a long time the game series was in a legal twilight zone, where nobody knew which of the numerous corporate entities involved actually held the rights. In the video linked below, you'll see that it actually seems to be Warner Bros Interactive, but they apparently have zero interest in doing anything with the property. So the adventures of Cate Archer & co. have been put on hold indefinitely and if you want to play it, you'll either have to find a hard copy somewhere or resort to :filez: Mind you, a game this old with an extremely dubious legal status is probably exempt from the usual forum rules about :filez: but I'll leave it to others to figure it out.

You start off in the black leather boots of the aforementioned Cate Archer, 60's British superspy extraordinaire. To UNITY's great interest, the Director of H.A.R.M. is making an appearance in Inotakimura - a pastoral village in Japan, which will serve as a springboard for newbie-conscious tutorial objectives. The first thing that you might notice here is that the kind of stealth gameplay you've probably been accustomed to over recent years is in sharp relief from what we find here. Simply put, sneaking around is quite a bit trickier - whether this is due to old-school grognard game design or clunky implementation is up in the air. I may have to admit the latter, because issues with the former were addressed already in the Thief games. You'll find that enemies are very, very perceptive. It's necessary to start sneaking or crouching from far away and getting spotted can happen even when you're being careful about leaning around corners. Furthermore, only a few of the weapons (like the crossbow and utility launcher) are quiet enough for serious consideration in stealth takedowns. Also, there are shaded areas where you're considered 'hidden', but these seem largely arbitrary and not really useful for sneaking up on enemies. Part of this may be due to Monolith expanding on the gameplay vision from NOLF 1, which provides a combination of stealth and run & gun concepts. As such, neither is really allowed to flourish over the course of the game. This is highlighted by the fact that numerous other gameplay types are thrown in the mix, including the now infamous level where you shoot at one of the bosses while chasing him on a tricycle.

Of course, this isn't to say that NOLF 2 is a bad game - far from it. It's just that you have to temper your expectations with regard to stealth going in. Monolith's goal seems to be to offer the player a lot of different gameplay types to keep them interested, and they largely succeed at this. NOLF 2 doesn't seem to have as many locations as the first game (mostly Japan, Siberia, India, and a tropical island at the end), but the levels are varied enough to maintain player engagement. It really excels at story and atmosphere, almost outdoing Austin Powers and Get Smart at their own game. i especially liked the overwrought spooky theremin music in the submarine bay. The humor of the series is back in full force and is a definite highlight of the game. I won't ruin the humor by trying to explain all of the jokes and droll conversations - you can look them up on youtube. However, I'll note that the goofiness can even work itself into the gameplay, like in the Siberia mission where you have to find a vacuum tube and password for a mainframe that turns out to be a front for an even larger computer! You'll find memos from superiors warning flunkies to 'Remember what H.A.R.M. stands for!', even though the game never lets you know, in fact, what H.A.R.M. actually stands for. Also, after a run-in with super soldiers, you are given a weapon that uses Anti-Super Soldier Serum, or ASSS ammo. I'm venturing into 'explaining the joke' territory, so I'll just stop here.

However, the mention of super soldiers leads me to mention the Antarctica level. In a game that's packed with zany hijinx, this level stands as a testament to using a mounting level of suspense in a video game. When you first arrive at the Antarctica base, there are no purple-suited H.A.R.M. agents taking potshots at you with wacky one-liners. In fact, the whole base is abandoned and eerily silent, except for monstrous thumps that you occasionally hear in the distance. When you finally reach a certain point, a powerful, unkillable enemy busts out and you must make your way back to the exit without attracting its attention. I remember the first time I played it, the tension was unbearable. It's not quite 'Shalebridge Cradle' levels of spooky, but I daresay that if it were longer it could come pretty close. Most of the levels are indeed well-designed and work beautifully with the gameplay - whether it's of the sneaking or running/gunning variety. However, although the music is exemplary, it does have a nauseating tendency to repeat over and over again over the course of a level. Despite this minor complaint, No One Lives Forever 2 fully deserves its status as a classic and, although the stealth gameplay could have been more fully realized, it's still an extremely rewarding game to play overall. Remember what H.A.R.M. stands for!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eDs93O-5ck

Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011
Man, NOLF2 is one of my favourite games of all time. I'd love nothing more than for it to be remastered and put on Steam (or at least, just released on Steam. It might be a case of 'the fewer changes the better'), but I highly doubt it.

Also, what's everyone's opinions on NOLF vs NOLF2? The original seemed to be geared more towards a linear stealth experience, while NOLF2 tries to encourage various playthroughs - with the consequence that stealth-only isn't quite as deep an experience. NOLF2 has to be my favourite though. Especially with the ability to pin soldiers to walls, with crossbow bolts! :D

Sub-Actuality
Apr 17, 2007

Major Isoor posted:

Man, NOLF2 is one of my favourite games of all time. I'd love nothing more than for it to be remastered and put on Steam (or at least, just released on Steam. It might be a case of 'the fewer changes the better'), but I highly doubt it.

Also, what's everyone's opinions on NOLF vs NOLF2? The original seemed to be geared more towards a linear stealth experience, while NOLF2 tries to encourage various playthroughs - with the consequence that stealth-only isn't quite as deep an experience. NOLF2 has to be my favourite though. Especially with the ability to pin soldiers to walls, with crossbow bolts! :D

Love these games too. I played through them both again last year thinking that I’d enjoy 2 more, but for some reason the first one was a lot more fun. I think I prefer the simplicity of the first one, even though the second is a lot more open

 




Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

NOLF 2 introduced skill points, which is interesting but a bit of a missed opportunity because New Game+ would have been fantastic. Alas, it was a concept whose time was yet to come. Still, the NOLF 1 gag about perverted passphrases was pure gold and I think it still tops anything in 2.

Also the level in 1 where you're in free fall out of a plane and you have to grab someone's chute. 2 tried to get a similar effect when you fight a boss in the middle of a tornado...I think it works, but only when you factor in everything that leads up to it.

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Also, this is one of the funniest gags in the game:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLF4WA2buoI

hamsauce666
Apr 11, 2018

Absolutely love this series, too. I tried to replay the original half a dozen years ago, but I just couldn't get it running on modern computer hardware. I've heard that the sequel's quite a bit easier to get running, especially with some community patches, etc., but I haven't had the spare time / motivation to take a run at it. Ideally, the schmucks at WB & Disney would figure out the rights issue and let Nightdive make a remaster.

Seventh Arrow posted:

Also, this is one of the funniest gags in the game:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLF4WA2buoI

Honestly, probably a solid pick for "funniest joke in a video game". The writing in these games was just delightful.

Also, love the reviews! Definitely going to mine this thread the next time I get a stealth game hankering.

Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011
Hey, there's a stealth Humble bundle going brw, in case anyone is after some sneaky action

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

Deus Ex







When it comes to this review, my fellow stealthniks, I hope that I don't have to repeat the obvious - that is, that the making of Deus Ex is far and away mankind's greatest achievement. The transistor? Ridiculous. Brain surgery? Nonsense. Hadron Colliders? Don't make me laugh. Deus Ex gave the world the one thing that it really needed - a first-person immersive conspiracy simulator that offers a level of meaningful choice not seen before or since.

You see, even the nature of choice itself can provide meaning, as this has been a topic of debate for millennia. It is a concept central to ethical, metaphysical, and epistemological discussions. Through a comprehensive review of various philosophical perspectives, I will examine the nature of choice, its implications for human agency, and the moral responsibilities associated with it. Drawing on the works of prominent philosophers, such as Kant, Mill, Sartre, and Frankfurt, we explore the multifaceted dimensions of choice and its role in shaping human existence. It is an essential aspect of human existence that raises profound questions about agency, freedom, and moral responsibility. For example, Immanuel Kant, a foundational figure in modern philosophy, argues that choice is a manifestation of human autonomy and rationality. In his "Critique of Practical Reason," Kant emphasizes the moral significance of choice, asserting that moral actions are those grounded in rational choices made by autonomous agents (Kant, 1788). Kantian ethics posits that individuals are morally responsible for their choices, which are guided by the categorical imperative, a principle that demands universality and consistency in decision-making.

We see this especially in an early cutscene where German agent Gunther Hermann exhibits woe over choosing orange from the soda vending machine, only to have lemon-lime foisted upon him. He thinks that it's a trick, that the maintenance man is out to get him by way of stocking the machine with lemon-lime soda. This is an apt metaphor for the role of choice in our lives, since Gunther believes he has free will, but yet the fates have decided to overrule any decision he makes. I find a similarity here to the Irish disputes involving the Orange of the Protestants and the Lemon-Lime (green) of the Catholics. The Lemon-Lime (Catholic) represents a hierarchical foundation, orderly, and based on the sovereignty and vision of the Pope. Orange (Protestantism) on the other hand, signifies a certain amount of chaos and self-determination, but yet with just enough structure to place one under a higher power. So we see that Gunther subliminally wants to, like fellow German Martin Luther, be a part of the Protestant Reformation, but in the grand scheme of things, he has a Catholic structure imposed on him and is compelled to serve an all-powerful Pope, one who adheres to the ideology of Aquinas (Bob Page).

Utilitarianism, championed by John Stuart Mill, emphasizes the ethical consequences of choice. Mill argues that choices should be guided by the principle of maximizing overall happiness (Mill, J. S. (1861), Utilitarianism). From a utilitarian perspective, choices are morally evaluated based on their outcomes, with the aim of achieving the greatest good for the greatest number. This consequentialist approach to ethics poses challenges regarding the nature of moral decision-making. On the other hand, existentialist philosophers like Jean-Paul Sartre explore the existential dimension of choice. Sartre contends that individuals are condemned to be free, meaning that they are burdened with the responsibility of creating their own values through authentic choices (Sartre, J.-P. (1946), Existentialism Is a Humanism). Choice, according to existentialism, is a defining feature of human existence, and individuals must grapple with the anguish and uncertainty inherent in making authentic choices. At this point, I feel like I need to mention how Harry Frankfurt's work on choice and personal identity introduces the notion of second-order desires (Frankfurt, H. G. (1971), Freedom of the Will and the Concept of a Person). Frankfurt distinguishes between first-order desires, which reflect our immediate wants, and second-order desires, which pertain to the desires we want to have. The ability to reflect on and endorse second-order desires is central to responsible choice-making. Frankfurt's ideas challenge simplistic notions of free will and underscore the complexity of choice.

In navigating the complexities of choice, philosophers continue to grapple with fundamental questions about human nature, ethics, and the nature of reality itself. The study of choice reminds us that the decisions we make are not only a reflection of our values but also a testament to our capacity for rationality, autonomy, and moral responsibility.

Also, you can blow open just about any door with the GEP Gun - the game's best lockpick.

Seventh Arrow fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Oct 3, 2023

Major Isoor
Mar 23, 2011
Lemon-Lime! :argh:

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Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005

I never asked for this! (and by "this", I mean Lemon-Lime)

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