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The urban-rural death divide is getting alarmingly wider for working-age Americans https://arstechnica.com/science/2024/04/the-urban-rural-death-divide-is-getting-alarmingly-wider-for-working-age-americans/ The Dept of Agriculture did a study comparing urban and rural working-age mortality between two time periods: 1999-2001 and 2017-2019. The mortality gap widened quite a bit. The study didn't focus on the particular causes, but speculated that factors exacerbating the situation in rural areas may include lessened access to healthcare, behaviors, and poverty (shocker). These plots are pretty compelling:  The mortality rate among rural residents increased:  The gap widened more among women than men. I wouldn't have guessed that. cat botherer fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Apr 11, 2024 |
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Apr 11, 2024 00:11
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mobby_6kl posted:All meat is stolen, if you think about it Except that one guy in Germany
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Apr 11, 2024 00:41
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:Bunch of people including a 15 yo shot up a Ramadan prayer group in Philly Looks like it was a gang violence that happened to be near the Eid event. “Two groups that were in the park started exchanging gunfire, but police do not believe the shooting was connected to the religious celebration, the commissioner said.” https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/04/10/us/philadelphia-shooting I don’t anticipate there will be much more media coverage of this, just like the Super Bowl party shootout in Kansas City.
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Apr 11, 2024 02:46
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cat botherer posted:The urban-rural death divide is getting alarmingly wider for working-age Americans Interesting, though I'd like to see something with data that isn't five years old. How the covid years impacted the divide would be interesting to see. I know lots of rural doctors are leaving because...shocker...rural states don't want to fund medicare expansion because Obamacare.
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Apr 11, 2024 03:33
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Cimber posted:I know lots of rural doctors are leaving because...shocker...rural states don't want to fund medicare expansion because Obamacare. Medicare = Federal program providing health insurance for Americans 65 and older regardless of means as well as those with certain qualifying conditions (end stage renal disease for example) Medicaid = Health insurance program targeted at low income Americans, administered by the states. Medicaid (which has different names depending upon the state) is the program expanded by the Affordable Care Act, an expansion which was blocked by various red states even though it would have been mostly funded by the federal government.
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Apr 11, 2024 08:36
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Well, thanks for that bit of clarification.
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Apr 11, 2024 14:20
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Digging in a little further on that report, the big drivers seem to be increases in lung disease, heart disease, and substance abuse (drugs and alcohol). For women, pregnancy complications are also a big outlier. A lot of it really boils down to poor access to healthcare, poor environmental conditions, and rural areas just being poorer overall. The report doesn't really get into speculation on causes, just reporting the numbers. The one bright spot for rural areas compared to metro is HIV related deaths are way lower than metro areas. Then you look at hepatitis and see that rural areas went from being lower than metro areas in 2000 to way worse in 2017. This table took me a minute to parse, but this is the percent difference for rural areas vs. metro areas by disease. So for rural females, Brain Vascular deaths in 2017-2019 were 53% worse than for metro females.  Things like Septicemia to me are just poor access to healthcare. Kidney, and liver disease sounds like substance abuse, and lung disease is either environmental or a lot more smoking, probably a bit of both. Bird in a Blender fucked around with this message at 15:01 on Apr 11, 2024 |
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Apr 11, 2024 14:41
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Something I'd like to tack on, having grown up in a rural area, is that getting to the doctor is physically harder and involves a lot more planning than it would in a more urban area. You very well might have to drive 45 minutes to get to your local physician, and getting to a hospital that is equipped to do major tests might be a day off of work for the two or three hour drive. So do you miss a day's pay and have to potentially pay a few hundred dollars out of pocket to do a 'useless' test, or do you go to that hospital. When you are poor, have lovely insurance from your work pace and working a hard manual job the choice is a very difficult one to make. Obamacare was supposed to help with these choices, but thanks to Leiberman, the public option went poof and a lot of states are more interested in political ideology rather than helping their citizens.
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Apr 11, 2024 14:50
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cat botherer posted:The urban-rural death divide is getting alarmingly wider for working-age Americans American healthcare is in a state of collapse on the whole, but I imagine every rural hospital shutting down didn’t help things here.
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Apr 11, 2024 15:33
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Cimber posted:Something I'd like to tack on, having grown up in a rural area, is that getting to the doctor is physically harder and involves a lot more planning than it would in a more urban area. You very well might have to drive 45 minutes to get to your local physician, and getting to a hospital that is equipped to do major tests might be a day off of work for the two or three hour drive.
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Apr 11, 2024 15:42
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Bird in a Blender posted:Digging in a little further on that report, the big drivers seem to be increases in lung disease, heart disease, and substance abuse (drugs and alcohol). For women, pregnancy complications are also a big outlier. A lot of it really boils down to poor access to healthcare, poor environmental conditions, and rural areas just being poorer overall. The report doesn't really get into speculation on causes, just reporting the numbers. The one bright spot for rural areas compared to metro is HIV related deaths are way lower than metro areas. Then you look at hepatitis and see that rural areas went from being lower than metro areas in 2000 to way worse in 2017. Dobbs isn’t going to help that pregnancy complication problem at all 
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Apr 11, 2024 15:52
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Halloween Jack posted:I work for a hospital and have better insurance than most people, and I still can't afford multiple appointments and tests that can cost a few hundred bucks a pop. And my doctor is still in a bedroom community 45 minutes from the hospital. This sounds like the kind of thing that isn't captured in all those statistics about how great the economy is going. All of that was just as true in 2020 as it was now, though. "The economy is getting better, with unemployment way down and real wages rising" and "poo poo that's been notoriously unaffordable for decades is still unaffordable" are not mutually exclusive. In fact, this study was actually working with pre-COVID numbers. It's looking at stats from 2017-2019, during the Trump administration.
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Apr 11, 2024 16:03
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Not everything needs to instantly turn to Biden vs. Trump, dude. Legions of psychotic Boomers are having that argument on Twitter all day every day, and I'll go there if I want to participate.
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Apr 11, 2024 16:11
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Halloween Jack posted:Not everything needs to instantly turn to Biden vs. Trump, dude. Legions of psychotic Boomers are having that argument on Twitter all day every day, and I'll go there if I want to participate. Actually, this is the most important election of your entire lifetime with everything on the line! (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Apr 11, 2024 16:25
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I know people say that as a joke, but honestly, isn't every upcoming election the most important? It's part of the process where you exercise whatever power you have to determine your own fate. You don't get to stop voting and think everything's going to be the same unless you're in a very fortunate position of privilege.
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Apr 11, 2024 16:43
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Here's some current rear end events: https://twitter.com/TMZ/status/1778432021095653868 So much of this, the "live streaming" of the chase during an NBA finals game, the entertainment journalism tone of the wall to wall coverage, the trial, the ubiquitous jokes and comments on basically every show, the stark contrast in opinions between black and white Americans - it all feels like a lo fi harbinger of things to come. You could argue he was the seminal cultural figure of the mid 90s.
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Apr 11, 2024 16:46
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I would wager that there are millions of working-class people who don't vote, or do vote, with the expectation that nothing will perceptibly change. I don't know if they "get" to do that, but they do it nonetheless.
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Apr 11, 2024 16:46
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zoux posted:Here's some current rear end events: The Juice is Loose! (From this mortal coil)
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Apr 11, 2024 16:47
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If I Died It
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Apr 11, 2024 16:50
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Eric Cantonese posted:I know people say that as a joke, but honestly, isn't every upcoming election the most important? It's part of the process where you exercise whatever power you have to determine your own fate. If we lived in a place where one party had pretty good ideas and one party had mildly lovely ideas, then the election probably wouldn't matter that much. Instead we live in a place where one party (in the aggregate) has a few good ideas and some mildly lovely ideas and a handful of absolute turd ideas and the other party has no ideas except fascism.
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Apr 11, 2024 16:50
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Halloween Jack posted:I work for a hospital and have better insurance than most people, and I still can't afford multiple appointments and tests that can cost a few hundred bucks a pop. And my doctor is still in a bedroom community 45 minutes from the hospital. This sounds like the kind of thing that isn't captured in all those statistics about how great the economy is going. Is this better insurance than most people? I can't easily find numbers on what different kinds of things cost people out of pocket but I've never had insurance where a (covered) test costs hundreds if I've met the deductible. I guess hitting the deductible alone is a big deal for most people as I understand most employers don't give their employees money in an HSA to meet it every year. Feel like I'm being a bit 3 Olives with this post, I may be out somewhat of touch here.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:11
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A lot can happen when things are 'out of network'. When my daughter was born, she was born via C-section. Our OB-GYN was in network. The hospital was in network. We got pre-approval for the birth from the insurance company (LOLWHUT?!). But because she was technically premature (36 weeks, 6 days) she had to go into NICU as she was having some breathing issues. (Not to be gross, but being born C-section can cause that. Natural birth squeezes the chest of the baby and expels a lot of the fluid in the lungs that C-section doesn't do). The NICU doctor was OUT of network and not preapproved. Even though she was in the NICU for 2 days before being released, we got smacked with a 50,000 bill. When I complained to the insurance company they said "Well, we didn't pre-approve this charge and the doctor you decided to use wasn't in network. There isn't anything we can do." I wanted to reach through the phone and choke that rear end in a top hat. There was only one NICU doctor, it's not like we could have shopped around. We got done paying that bill on her 3rd birthday. That's even after the hospital gave us a break.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:18
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haveblue posted:If I Died It Ouch, that’s a deep cut.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:18
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Halloween Jack posted:Not everything needs to instantly turn to Biden vs. Trump, dude. Legions of psychotic Boomers are having that argument on Twitter all day every day, and I'll go there if I want to participate. My apologies. Usually when people start talking about "the kind of thing that isn't captured in all those statistics about how great the economy is going" in this thread, they're making a reference to the fact that pollsters are consistently finding that a majority of voters say that the economy is lovely under Biden and that they're gonna vote Trump to bring back economic prosperity. With the election just over six months away, though, you're gonna see a lot of Biden vs Trump stuff in politics spaces no matter where you go.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:19
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Eric Cantonese posted:I know people say that as a joke, but honestly, isn't every upcoming election the most important? It's part of the process where you exercise whatever power you have to determine your own fate. I remember the 2000 being considered pretty  at least by normies since it seemed that both candidates were pretty middle of the road with some good and bad thing. In retrospect this is absolutely hilariously wrong but it wasn't like Dubya was promising to deport all Mexicans and ban Muslims in his platform.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:19
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Kagrenak posted:Is this better insurance than most people? I can't easily find numbers on what different kinds of things cost people out of pocket but I've never had insurance where a (covered) test costs hundreds if I've met the deductible. I guess hitting the deductible alone is a big deal for most people as I understand most employers don't give their employees money in an HSA to meet it every year. Nah, it's accurate to say that a big problem with the US system is that you have to proactively prepare your situation and educate yourself on your own time in order not to get hosed by unforeseen health issues because there are so many wrinkles and pitfalls and no one is incentivized to help you around them Cimber posted:A lot can happen when things are 'out of network'. When did this happen? They did pass an anti-surprise-billing law in 2020 and it should be in effect by now, so it may be that this can't happen to anyone else, but I'm not really up on the latest developments
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Apr 11, 2024 17:25
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haveblue posted:When did this happen? They did pass an anti-surprise-billing law in 2020 and it should be in effect by now, so it may be that this can't happen to anyone else, but I'm not really up on the latest developments Oh, this happened in 2011.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:31
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Kagrenak posted:Is this better insurance than most people? I can't easily find numbers on what different kinds of things cost people out of pocket but I've never had insurance where a (covered) test costs hundreds if I've met the deductible. I guess hitting the deductible alone is a big deal for most people as I understand most employers don't give their employees money in an HSA to meet it every year. For a small family you're paying either >$2,000/month with no deductible or <$1,600/month with a $5-8,000 annual deductible. Going to the doctor when you should instead of when you need to is just impossible for a huge number of people. We recently had a large hospital bill (north of $500,000) which instantly maxed our deductible and one of the perks to getting nailed with the huge bill was I could now go to the doctor for everything and anything free of charge for around 6 months until my deductible reset. It was like living in a real country for a few months, absolutely amazing.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:33
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Cimber posted:A lot can happen when things are 'out of network'. Did he actually say "decided to use"? Because I would have lost my poo poo.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:39
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Bird in a Blender posted:Digging in a little further on that report, the big drivers seem to be increases in lung disease, heart disease, and substance abuse (drugs and alcohol). For women, pregnancy complications are also a big outlier. A lot of it really boils down to poor access to healthcare, poor environmental conditions, and rural areas just being poorer overall. The report doesn't really get into speculation on causes, just reporting the numbers. The one bright spot for rural areas compared to metro is HIV related deaths are way lower than metro areas. Then you look at hepatitis and see that rural areas went from being lower than metro areas in 2000 to way worse in 2017. vascular deaths would be due to the decline in primary care services, and people not getting on OAC/plavix/ASA and getting their cholesterol under control in time. Kidney is most likely hypertension not related to drug use. Rhabo from people passing out from fent happens, but not enough to overcome stuff like hypertension. If someone is doing enough meth to blow out their kidneys, they're going to stroke out or have a heart attack first. I really can't overstate how dire rural healthcare is in this country. I did a rotation in Jamestown, Tennessee which is in the poorest county in america with a population over 30k. The only money coming into the town was medicare/medicaid/SS, both through the residents and the people working in home health which was really the only jobs. Most of the town's budget went to maintaining the rural hospital that had been closed for multiple years. Buildings like that cost a fortune just to keep in working condition, and they did it with the hopes that someone would buy it and reopen it. the closest hospital was in crossville about an hour away, so if you had a heart attack you were basically hosed. We tested almost every patient that came through for lyme disease as part of their workup for whatever else, because that was an easy way to get on state benefits in tennessee.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:39
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Main Paineframe posted:My apologies. Usually when people start talking about "the kind of thing that isn't captured in all those statistics about how great the economy is going" in this thread, they're making a reference to the fact that pollsters are consistently finding that a majority of voters say that the economy is lovely under Biden and that they're gonna vote Trump to bring back economic prosperity.
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Apr 11, 2024 17:46
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20 years later now we have no hope, no cash, no jobs, and no juice. you can keep your change.
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Apr 11, 2024 18:00
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Blue Footed Booby posted:Did he actually say "decided to use"? Because I would have lost my poo poo. I don't remember the exact verbiage since it was 13 years ago, but that was basically the gist of the conversation. The NICU doctor wasn't in network at our in network hospital, and the closest in network NICU doctor was at a hospital an hour away from where we were. So apparently the idea is we were supposed to take a baby born not 6 hours ago having breathing issues, ship her to another hospital that had an in-network doctor? Thanks Joe Leiberman, you did us all a solid.
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Apr 11, 2024 18:14
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zoux posted:Here's some current rear end events: I still think it was wrong for the Los Angeles Police Department to put so much time and effort into framing a clearly guilty man. Nucleic Acids fucked around with this message at 18:27 on Apr 11, 2024 |
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Apr 11, 2024 18:18
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Nucleic Acids posted:I still think it was wrong for the Los Angeles Police Department to put so much time and effort into framing a clearly guilty man. Excuse me, that's Fox News legal expert Mark Fuhrman you're talking about
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Apr 11, 2024 20:02
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Aztec Galactus posted:Excuse me, that's Fox News legal expert Mark Fuhrman you're talking about You cannot lay the blame for one officer on the entire force. That’s a logical fallacy.
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Apr 11, 2024 20:50
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Nucleic Acids posted:I still think it was wrong for the Los Angeles Police Department to put so much time and effort into framing a clearly guilty man. I can't believe the real killer finally got around to taking care of OJ as well.
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Apr 11, 2024 21:24
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C. Everett Koop posted:I can't believe the real killer finally got around to taking care of OJ as well. ...entropy?
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Apr 11, 2024 21:29
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Cimber posted:Thanks Joe Leiberman, you did us all a solid. I would like to think that the myth that "Lieberman killed the public option" died when he did, but I guess that's not the case. Max Baucus, chair of the Finance Committee & who was given the task of creating the Senate ACA bill by Obama, killed the public option in committee; it never got a floor vote in the Senate (by design). Lieberman voted against lowering the Medicare age to 55, which was as opposed by the health-insurance industry at the time as the public option was (and currently is), but for some reason the notion that Lieberman "killed the public option" is on up there with teflon myths like "Obama voted against the Iraq war." (I'm ready for my posting punishment, Mr. DeKoos, but as my longtime D&D fans know, this has been an issue close to my heart, and I cannot let such myths prevail among meaningful debate & discussion.)
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I don't see a forumban on your rap sheet, so I don't know why you think you'd be probated for a civil, on-topic post with some effort and content put into it.
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