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TheImmigrant posted:Belgian French uses the more logical numbers too. Screw logic, a number like "quatre-vingt-dix-neuf" (for the uninitiated, it's literally "four-twenty-ten-nine" for 99) is a thing of beauty
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Jun 1, 2016 14:21
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System Metternich posted:Screw logic, a number like "quatre-vingt-dix-neuf" (for the uninitiated, it's literally "four-twenty-ten-nine" for 99) is a thing of beauty The Gauls (like other Celts - Irish and Scots Gaelic still have vigesimal forms) used a vigesimal counting system before the Roman conquest. Quatre-vingt is a vestige of that, like 'score' in English.
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Jun 1, 2016 15:12
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Saladman posted:Do you mean the Dachstock, like a five minute walk northeast of the Bern HBF? I've been there a couple times but "anarchy colony" seems like a weird way of calling "[un?]licensed independent nightclub / squat". These are exactly the kind of places I was looking for. I didn't know how else to describe them, as I've only ever heard rumors about them (again, that's what got me interested in that Swiss Sub culture). Saladman posted:I know that one in Zurich has a license to use the property for 10 (-ish) years after which they will have to move out. The one in Bern has been there so long I am sure they also have legal papers by this point. This kind of info is interesting, again I just heard that "Direct Democracy" was their methods of organization. poty posted:These are both non-stories. If the "Anarchy Colonies" are just random places where a bunch of anarchists decided to move into like Saladman said, then yeah there are some, Again, it's this Swiss Subculture that I'm interested in. If there are areas/buildings/groups like this, I'm pretty interested in them. bollig posted:So I think you're thinking of the Reitschule, which is pretty close to the HBF. I wouldn't exactly call it an Anarchist colony. It's the place to go for concerts at night, and if you go during the day, you will almost certainly meet an anarchist. It is also about a block away from the methadone clinic, which I'm sure is in no way a coincidence. These are exactly the kind of places I'm interested in. They exist in Switzerland, but there's no "lists" that I can find on the internet or anything about them, which is why it might help to have stories and perspectives from people living in each Kanton. bollig posted:using Direct Democracy isn't really very anarchist. That having been said, I don't consort with anarchists because I don't want to get tetanus. Direct Democracy does not need leadership, which favors some anarchist principles. I'm working on rumors I've heard about the country. I thought tetanus shots where given out liberally in Swiss Hospitals and Emergency rooms? Heck, you can end up in a US immigration camp and get free tetanus tests if you're really worried about the spread of tetanus through association with Anarchists! Mexico must be tetanus free, thanks in part to the US Government. bollig posted:I am a bit busy at the moment, but I'm going to look around for some specific, non-federal groups and how they might be targeting foreigners. Thanks for looking into it. I couldn't find much online, so as always, forums and people are sometimes more reliable. As I've already said some times before, I'm very interested in these Swiss Subcultures. I don't think anyone has started or posed a list online. This is generating some great discussions. Switzerland being such a linguistically diverse country, with such untouched beauty is really impressive (I guess their major cities where never bombed to poo poo during World War 2, so all the naturally developed Architecture still exists). ON TOPIC: HERE ARE SOME EXAMPLES I COULD FIND OF BUILDINGS HOUSING "ANARCHISTS COLONIES"* ON BING MAPS. THIS IS THE KIND OF SWISS SUBGROUP I WAS ORIGINALLY POSTING ABOUT. *These places might not be Anarchist (some places being supported by local Gemeinders/Councils, host night clubs and concerts) but this is the best description I could come up with from the rumors I heard BERN  BASEL  I hope this helps clarify the kind of subcultures I'm talking about.
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Jun 2, 2016 10:06
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I remember there was one in Zürich near the main station some years ago with the slogan "ZUREICH" (too rich), a play on Zürich -> Zuerich -> zureich. ah, there, Wohlgroth. http://www.zureich.ch/ or google for "zürich zureich" for some pics.
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Jun 2, 2016 10:18
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Did you find those places just by searching around on Google Maps for weird-looking buildings? You also will have a hard time finding lists because the locations shift constantly. For instance there was an artist 'squat' on the corner of Idastrasse and Gertrudstrasse from May 1 until May 31 just now. Maybe it got extended, I haven't been in a couple weeks after going to an opening party there, but I heard it's going to be renovated and turned into a shop or restaurant or something. Actually you can see it on Google Streetview, it looks like it's called Uhl & Olf on Google Maps and it's directly across the street from a still-extant place called Da Michelangelo. It's obvious on street view -- it's the first floor building one covered in graffiti. A lot of times buildings are temporarily unoccupied so people go by and ask the landlords if they can use the space (or just move in). Sometime the landlords allow them to use the space on agreement for just paying electricity/water since then it keeps other squatters moving in who might be more aggressive. Nothing stays derelict and unoccupied in central Zurich for very long (nor in the center of any other major Swiss city, for that matter). If you live in Zurich or want to come by, I could introduce you to people who are part of that subculture and would be glad to show you around (German and English speaking). I don't know anyone personally involved with those things in Lausanne or Bern even though I've been to them. Unlike similar places in many countries, the ones here are not heroin dens--you can just walk around and talk to normal people in them if you see one. I mean I'm sure you can score drugs there, but no one's going to have a needle sticking out of their arm drooling in the inside corridor. For that, it's better to look in the Riponne bathrooms (Lausanne) and I'm sure there's somewhere similar near Langstrasse* in Zurich. If you look for where the Distribus goes (needle distribution bus) I'm sure you can find the real heroin shitholes not too far. I've seen so many bloody rags and spent needles in the Riponne bathroom, ugh. *if you ever want to shatter someone's opinion that Swiss are all upstanding and foreigners cause all the problems, take them to Langstrasse on a weekday morning and watch the drunk old Swiss men go by pissing on themselves at 10am on a Tuesday. The Coop on Langstrasse is one of the grossest things I've ever seen in Switzerland. 50% chance of a drunk person yelling or talking to themselves in there, reeking of poo poo and piss, regardless of when I enter. One of my roommates saw an old guy just pull out his dick and piss all over the floor. Now that I live on Langstrasse, I'm actually really glad Migros doesn't sell alcohol. I can buy groceries without some old creep vomit on me and my girlfriend. These are NOT the types of people you will find in squats in Switzerland. Actually I have no idea where they live, as they're not homeless and aren't on the streets in winter mornings.
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Jun 2, 2016 11:19
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There's a "squat" or "collective" or whatever they're calling it now in Lugano at the CSOA Molino, but it's really just a bunch of middle class hippies getting high. Didn't meet a single socialist or anarchist activist proper when I was there, they were all hanging out at the Irish pub round the corner.
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Jun 2, 2016 17:21
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There's nothing worse than middle class lefties eh.
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Jun 3, 2016 23:49
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Saladman posted:It's not hard to learn Swiss German if you speak High German, or so I hear. Ahaha Ahahahaha AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Pffftttttt.... For English speakers: Take the most backwoods hillbilly accent you can think of, add a healthy amount of different expressions and words being used (think 100 years back for some cases), cube that and then maybe you'll be getting within a 1000 miles of how Schwyzerdütsch (Swiss German) feels to Germans. Not to mention that the way they talk feels beyond ridiculous to somebody from Northern Germany and that you'd never want to sound like that or would be able to. It's infinitely easier for someone from, say, Brooklyn to sound like they're from rural Texas. I've seen German TV use subtitles for Swiss German. What I'd be interesting in knowing is if the French and Italian is more "reasonable"  to French and Italian speakers from France and Italy, respectively.
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Jun 4, 2016 00:33
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flavor posted:Ahaha Italian definitely, unless it's mountain dialect. French less so but still miles ahead than Swiss German.
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Jun 4, 2016 00:49
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Coohoolin posted:Italian definitely, unless it's mountain dialect. French less so but still miles ahead than Swiss German. Ah, interesting. I also want to quickly address the reverse of what I said: I'm sure that some other German dialects sound ridiculous to Swiss German speakers, and they would also sound off when trying to speak them. It's generally very easy to tell whether someone comes from Switzerland, since their accent tends to be extremely different from High German. I also like Yello.
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Jun 4, 2016 01:11
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I remember meeting plattdeutsch speakers in Hamburg and I couldn't make out a thing. I'm fluent in Swiss German and high German btw. The Italian thing is interesting because I was taught at school in Ticino that the Italian spoken there is essentially the most proper fiorentine derived correct Italian, better than most of what's actually spoken in Italy. Then again, check out some of the dialect examples: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ticinese_dialect English One makes nothing out of nothing Ticinese chi gha al goss al gha quaicoss, se l gha nagot al gha al goss da carez Italian Con niente si fa nulla
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Jun 4, 2016 01:22
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Coohoolin posted:I remember meeting plattdeutsch speakers in Hamburg and I couldn't make out a thing. I'm fluent in Swiss German and high German btw. Yeah, Platt and Swiss German are probably as far from each other as you can get within contemporary German. Coohoolin posted:chi gha al goss al gha quaicoss, se l gha nagot al gha al goss da carez Who carez?  . This looks very complicated compared to the standard Italian way of phrasing it. Also lots of words in there that don't look Italian to me with my very limited knowledge of Italian. (What's "goss"? Same as "cosa"?)
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Jun 4, 2016 01:57
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flavor posted:Yeah, Platt and Swiss German are probably as far from each other as you can get within contemporary German. I don't speak Ticinese so I'm not sure but I think ghoss is cosa, yeah. Chi ha ghoss ha già qualcosa, chi non ha niente (i do like na ghot being niente) ha qualcosa da... Boh. In any case Ticinese dialect is only spoken by people who learned it from their parents so it's slowly but surely dying out. Except in the mountains.
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Jun 4, 2016 02:13
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Jun 4, 2016 03:05
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Coohoolin posted:I remember meeting plattdeutsch speakers in Hamburg and I couldn't make out a thing. I'm fluent in Swiss German and high German btw. It's like Quebec's attitude about its bizarre* dialect of French, where they claim it's more pure because it derives from an older, less modified version of the French language that was spoken in the 1700s or some nonsense. I don't get why some places are so precious about not just maintaining their language, but asserting its superiority over other dialects. I can't imagine ever saying that Canadian dialectical differences in English are somehow better than some other form of English. Isn't it enough to just be different without being better or worse? * I say bizarre because, given my limited education in the French language, I find it less intelligible than any European dialect of French, and even worse than Haitian and West African dialects (apart from creoles) in some cases. It's not necessarily worse, I just wonder why I have such trouble understanding it when spoken.
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Jun 4, 2016 06:16
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PT6A posted:It's like Quebec's attitude about its bizarre* dialect of French, where they claim it's more pure because it derives from an older, less modified version of the French language that was spoken in the 1700s or some nonsense. I don't get why some places are so precious about not just maintaining their language, but asserting its superiority over other dialects. I can't imagine ever saying that Canadian dialectical differences in English are somehow better than some other form of English. Isn't it enough to just be different without being better or worse? You're not getting me- Italian spoken in Ticino is for the large part a proper, Florentine derived Italian, not a dialect, but the most correct form of the language. Ticinese dialect is that weird gibberish spoken by mountain people. Two different things. Scots is still cooler than English though.
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Jun 4, 2016 06:27
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Coohoolin posted:I remember meeting plattdeutsch speakers in Hamburg and I couldn't make out a thing. I'm fluent in Swiss German and high German btw.
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Jun 4, 2016 06:31
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Coohoolin posted:You're not getting me- Italian spoken in Ticino is for the large part a proper, Florentine derived Italian, not a dialect, but the most correct form of the language. Ticinese dialect is that weird gibberish spoken by mountain people. Two different things. Oh, okay, I totally misunderstood the first time, but I get what you're saying now. On a personal note, I found it interesting that I found spoken Galician to be more intelligible as a (not-great) Spanish speaker, than I found Quebecois to be having learned some French in school. I guess the vocabulary and grammar is more similar between Quebecois and Parisian French, but holy hell is the accent ever different.
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Jun 4, 2016 06:34
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Are there really any noticeable downsides to Switzerland's demographics swinging to such an extent that it becomes part of the Umma?
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Jun 4, 2016 06:45
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Maybe it's because I'm from Bavaria and therefore also part of the Upper German dialect subgroup, but I initially had a hard time understanding people in SW Germany (where they basically speak Swiss German) when I moved there, but after three years my understanding had gotten significantly better, so I think that given enough time and exposure that learning to at least understand Schwyzertütsch shouldn't be that much of a problem. No idea about actually speaking it, though  de_dust posted:Are there really any noticeable downsides to Switzerland's demographics swinging to such an extent that it becomes part of the Umma? Personally I can't wait for the ensuing merger of Swiss and Arab cuisine 
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Jun 4, 2016 08:59
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de_dust posted:Are there really any noticeable downsides to Switzerland's demographics swinging to such an extent that it becomes part of the Umma? Hahaha lol nope. France and Germany would be a part of it hundreds of years before that ever happens here. Where do you get your numbers that this is the case?
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Jun 4, 2016 09:06
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Helios Grime posted:Hahaha lol nope. France and Germany would be a part of it hundreds of years before that ever happens here. *Sweats racistly*
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Jun 4, 2016 09:21
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Switzerland seems to be a cool place to live if you're white and have some money
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Jun 4, 2016 15:43
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Wengy's post in the Ray Parlour thread for the Swiss Euros team rings truequote:The cool thing about Switzerland and their system of 'direct democracy' is that there's simply no way to deny or whitewash the general population's endemic stupidity, xenophobia and callousness - just look at the result of any given recent vote or election in Switzerland and it's plain to see that you're officially dealing with a nation of assholes and lunatics. As someone who actually has to live here, that's both dispiriting and helpful, because it forces you to face the facts about peoples' inherent terribleness: that nice old lady on the bus? Probably voted to deport immigrants last weekend. That helpful taxi driver? Probably a member of the SVP. And so on. I mean, we all sometimes suspect that we're surrounded by hateful morons. In Switzerland, that suspicion turns into certain knowledge. It's refreshing (but mostly depressing).
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Jun 4, 2016 15:59
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DOOP posted:Switzerland seems to be a cool place to live if you're white and have some money I'm not sure where this wouldn't apply. But I guess it would also be a cool place to live if you are a crazy mountain person with an attraction to yodelling and a phobia against minarets?
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Jun 4, 2016 16:19
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I found another squat in Zurich just randomly. On Kernestrasse near intersection with Kanzleistrasse. Not sure why I never noticed it before, I've probably walked by it 50 times. What's interesting is how much more common these are in the Swiss German parts of Switzerland than the French-speaking parts. I've never seen a squat in Geneva (I'd be kind of surprised if they even exist) and the only one I knew in Lausanne is gone. I can't remember ever seeing one elsewhere either although I haven't spent all that much time in Fribourg or Neuchatel. Yverdon probably has some squats. Why are you so interested in this anyway, OP? Edit: The Zeughaushof / Kasernenareal area is also kind of a 'squat' (except for the police station / prison area, which IIRC is getting moved out in a couple years too). No one lives there but there's a lot of the same vibe and public 'alternative' events are hosted there pretty much every weekend. I'm sure that's all legal and with proper permits because it gets a lot of older rich-looking people too, of whom I haven't seen very many of at the other squats mentioned in this thread. I guess Switzerland is probably the only place where the squats are officially registered and have their paperwork in order. Saladman fucked around with this message at 22:22 on Jun 5, 2016 |
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Jun 5, 2016 22:18
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Ahahahaha TRP is leaking! Nice to see a Switzerland thread here. Gotta say, I'm happy with the results of yesterday's vote (apart from the BGE/UBI being rejected, but that was a foregone conclusion anyway), and our new Asylgesetz actually seems about as sensible as it's ever going to get, so maybe not everything is terrible. As a resident of Switzerland's capital and regular commuter to la Romandie, I'm happy to offer up ignorant screeds in response to any questions you might have about this fair land.
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Jun 6, 2016 08:00
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Why does Romandie and the Italian bits speak mostly standard language while the Germans speak the hosed up racist gnome language?
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Jun 6, 2016 08:23
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icantfindaname posted:Why does Romandie and the Italian bits speak mostly standard language while the Germans speak the hosed up racist gnome language? So we can detect german speaking foreigners better and be more racist against them of course. And yesterdays votes were good, too bad that it only had like 46% participation. I like all the back peddling the SVP is doing trying to explain why they failed so hard this time again.
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Jun 6, 2016 09:10
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I'm not a linguist, but basically Swiss German dialects are just alemannic variants of German, like Bavarian, Swabian etc. Have you ever heard those guys speak? We're not the only weird gnomes around. In terms of standardization, the German language was a bit of a latecomer; for the longest time it was considered an uncouth idiom for stupid poors. It took Luther's translation of the bible and Martin Opitz' influential baroque poetics (1624) to truly establish German as a written, respectable language considered suitable for poetry, scientific treatises etc. On a systematic level, there were also radical shifts in the historical development of the language, most notably from Middle High German to early modern German in the 16th century (the two stages of German aren't really mutually intelligible, so a speaker and reader of early modern German might not have been able to understand a poem written in Middle High German merely 150 years earlier). Obviously, throughout that time English, French and Italian were already much more stable languages, spoken at royal courts all across Europe and used in some of the most celebrated works in world literature. Any educated Italian today will still be able to read and understand Dante, while it takes a specialist to parse a German text from the same era. The point of all this is that German is a weird language with a complex history and there are many variants of it. The Germans are just as fractured as the Swiss when it comes to dialects (look up the "Benrather Linie", for instance), but they have a much more monolithic 'standard' variant that they speak and write and teach. We have that too, our actual official German obviously isn't any of the dialects, but normal German with a few tweaks. We're just weird in that the dialects sound strange to Germans, occupy a very prominent position in everyday communication and aren't really thought of as markers of class or education. This is actually a pretty recent development, btw. Up until WW1 or so, the dominant standard languages spoken by educated and rich people were French and standard German. You were considered a horrible rube if you only spoke dialect. However, for obvious reasons the Swiss felt a need to differentiate and consolidate their national identity throughout the 20th century, usually by emphasizing whichever tiny difference one could discern between us and our northern neighbors. Out of this need arose a significant valorization of our dialects. Wengy fucked around with this message at 09:25 on Jun 6, 2016 |
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Jun 6, 2016 09:11
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Wengy posted:The point of all this is that German is a weird language with a complex history and there are many variants of it. Wengy posted:You were considered a horrible rube if you only spoke dialect. Anyway, I've looked up "linguistic distance" and couldn't find anything that showed the linguistic distances between individual German dialects, everything was either very superficial or someone's book or dissertation with nothing in between. This was about the most useful I could find. It shows that Swiss German is barely closer to German than Dutch, which feels about right. It's fine, it's not like there's anything of value to be missed when these guys talk, and Yello sings in English anyway. 
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Jun 6, 2016 09:55
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flavor posted:Which kinda applies to all somewhat important spoken languages with a history. Well yes, but it applies to German to a heightened degree. Germany's cultural and literary history makes more sense if you conceive of it as a "belated nation" in more than one sense, including linguistically. When German poets first started to write some decent sonnets and were like "hey, maybe we can actually do this in German you guys  ", the Decamerone was already 300 years old. This haunted German artists and intellectuals until the 18th century, when they suddenly turned into Europe's literary avantgarde, but it didn't stop then (remember that Germany as a nation was only founded in 1871, whereas, say, France has been a nation with a centralized government, bureaucracy and literal "lingual franca" since the 16th century or so). All I'm saying is that the history of the German language is quite fractured and inextricably linked to the history of and discourse on German culture as a "belated" and inferior one - hence the survival of so many highly specific and regionalized variants of German. quote:Anyway, I've looked up "linguistic distance" and couldn't find anything that showed the linguistic distances between individual German dialects, everything was either very superficial or someone's book or dissertation with nothing in between. This was about the most useful I could find. It shows that Swiss German is barely closer to German than Dutch, which feels about right. An actual linguist should chime in here, but there are some well-researched German isoglosses. I mentioned the Benrather Linie, but there's also... Um... *checks Wikipedia* the Speyerer Linie for instance. These are decent measures of (localized) linguistic distance, or rather difference.
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Jun 6, 2016 12:46
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OfficialGBSCaliph posted:There's nothing worse than middle class lefties eh. I think the anarchist principles apply to a lot of young people with overbearing parents, so I can see how places like this could attract middle class teens. The messages that some of these Swiss Sub cultures display all link into anarchist ideals (Switzerland has a historically conservative outlook on family. Principles like precision and punctuality are taught because they prevent people exploiting you and your family, but breed an Anarchist tenancy in some). Although these slogans all point towards "Middle class teen lefties" sticking it to the man, in reality they set up systems in place that make it easier for people to commit crime without being prosecuted in a court (again, that falls in line with "Direct Democracy" and Anarchism, which is why I described them like that in a previous post). Instead of evidence and court hearings, issues are dealt with directly once popular opinion has been achieved. I remember there being some weird internet clauses in the Swiss Constitution around home protection and security (making it sound like if you're being hacked over the internet or any other external service into your home, you have the right to investigate the origins of the hacking by yourself, which of course could be exploited if a case came to court "I was hacking them because they where hacking me"), but I just looked at the Swiss Constitution right now I can't see any reference to it, so I might have been mistaken. As far as constitutions are concerned, the Swiss Constitutions is pretty awesome (no "right to bear arms" bullshit*), but if groups are practicing direct democracy, the Constitution is just a bunch of guide lines, something that might affect migrants and immigrants. Saladman posted:...If you live in Zurich or want to come by, I could introduce you to people who are part of that subculture and would be glad to show you around (German and English speaking)... Oh hell yes, that would be awesome. I might not be in Switzerland anytime soon, but I will definitively hold you to that. When visiting a new country, it's always good to know a local: I don't want to go looking for a sub culture in a Swiss town and end up in some red room basement in an anarchist colony. Wengy posted:Ahahahaha TRP is leaking! Feel free to contribute! I'm interested in collecting a list of Swiss Sub Cultures in each Kanton but as you can see this has become a general Switzerland thread. If you've got any stories from Switzerland, feel free to add them! Saladman posted:I found another squat in Zurich just randomly.... This is exactly the kind of thing I'm interested in. [Your Picture related] They're not big on having an internet presence, so finding out information about them over the internet is quite difficult. They are a whole section of Swiss Culture that seems to go unnoticed. If these are places where concerts and club atmosphere take place let me know. I'm interested in that aspect as well. Nosfereefer posted:I'm not sure where this wouldn't apply. But I guess it would also be a cool place to live if you are a crazy mountain person with an attraction to yodelling... Again, this is only rumors I've heard, but don't "Swiss Mountain People" have a whole host of separate cultural issues that no one is talking about? I hear they're (or used to be) the nicest people on the planet, but city slickers and governance policies interfere with their way of life? I thought "Mountain People" was a Swiss way of addressing those issues without actually owning up to what is being done to "mountain people" in Switzerland. Nosfereefer posted:...and a phobia against minarets? Islam recognizes that a culture is linked to Architectural design, so do the Swiss. Stating that "your minarets need to be Swiss" is the soundest advice I've heard from any country dealing with integration. Having a healthy and integrated Swiss Muslim community, instead of a ghetto, just sounds like smart policy making. Making it to "Third Generation Swiss immigrant" is a feat, something that Swiss Muslims should be trying to achieve. Any country or town without Architectural guidelines is missing out on an aspect to expand their national culture. GOT ANY MIGRATION/IMMIGRATION STORIES FROM YOUR KANTON? *Switzerland's a pretty cool country. I mean they're planning on creating a network of underground transport routes to transport goods around the country, to reduce the need for trucks overground, cutting down on congestion and pollution. I mean they will be a top tier country in the future with that kind of active application of innovative ideas (where as other countries become stuck in politics). It's a country with the population of London, but with it's poo poo together zomgcatsonfire fucked around with this message at 12:15 on Jun 7, 2016 |
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Jun 7, 2016 12:12
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quote:lotsawords Now don't take this the wrong way but your post almost kinda reads like your being a bit of a fanboy for Switzerland. A cheeseaboo if you want to say. Anyhow I think you are getting the direct demoracy a bit wrong. You posted: quote:Instead of evidence and court hearings, issues are dealt with directly once popular opinion has been achieved. Which just reads like lynch justice and that is totally not the way things work here. Are you just meaning in those groups itself without any outside intervention? Direct Democracy is just that the population can vote on larger issues by themselfs ( as in do we want to buy these very expensive Jet fighter, or should this schoolhouse be renovated or change the law about pre implementation diagnostics for embryos etc.) and not have to depend that their politician they voted months ago hopefully votes the way they would have done. Regarding Internet the closest I can think of is the situation is that if something illegal is done over your network you cannot get prosecuted for it as long as they cannot prove that it was literally you and your computer that was doing it. This is just on the top of my head so I may not be 100% correct. quote:Again, this is only rumors I've heard, but don't "Swiss Mountain People" have a whole host of separate cultural issues that no one is talking about? I hear they're (or used to be) the nicest people on the planet, but city slickers and governance policies interfere with their way of life? I thought "Mountain People" was a Swiss way of addressing those issues without actually owning up to what is being done to "mountain people" in Switzerland. When we talk about mountain people it just means that it is someone living in the alps, they aren't some kind of old subculture or anything. Mostly farmers as there isn't much else to do also maybe working in the tourism sector during winter. There is of course some rivalry between people from the city and people living in the mounains but the same is between the french speaking and the german speaking part or simply between two villages across from each other from a lake. I think you romanticize the whole thing a bit too much as the same thing can be found all over the world. Also for your list of Squat places here is this: https://goo.gl/maps/Za1wTzKUkd12 It is called "Denk-mal" (Monument or Think About It)was a brothel years back but now is used as kind of as an autonomous school. So all teachers are volunteers and there are yoga courses, cooking courses, also language courses especially for immigrants.
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Jun 7, 2016 12:58
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Man, when Ambrí Piotta play HC Lugano, all the mountain people and city people get really rowdy with each other, drat sure.
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Jun 7, 2016 15:06
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zomgcatsonfire posted:Oh hell yes, that would be awesome. I might not be in Switzerland anytime soon, but I will definitively hold you to that. When visiting a new country, it's always good to know a local: I don't want to go looking for a sub culture in a Swiss town and end up in some red room basement in an anarchist colony. Did you ever live in Switzerland? I figured you did or must have at some point. If not, what's your particular interest in Switzerland? Germany has a lot -- well, way more -- of the 'alternative' movement for instance. They're actually big on having an Internet presence, it's just largely on Facebook. For instance, this is the squat at the UBS headquarters: http://www.kochareal.ch/ or https://www.facebook.com/pages/Besetztes-Koch-Areal/1476177149271070 . The one at the Bern hbf also has something like this, and I bet many of the others do too. Like Mountain People everywhere, the Swiss Mountain People are only nice if you're (a) not a member of their community -- in which case they're insular and domineering, (b) don't live near them, and (c) aren't affected by how they vote. If you're hiking through it's great, but otherwise it's West Virginia with less moonshine and a far longer period of inbreeding. Government in Switzerland is incredibly minimal. The only thing the mountain people have to bitch about is that "immigrants are ruining our country" when in fact they never even see a brown person because they live in some valley that's 80 kilometers from the closest immigrant, and just like in the US, they get far, far more money in farm subsidies than they pay in taxes. Although in any cases taxes are incredibly low — I pay 16% total off my raw salary, and if I moved half an hour south I could cut that down to 10%. Saladman fucked around with this message at 10:34 on Jun 8, 2016 |
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Jun 8, 2016 10:04
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zomgcatsonfire posted:I think the anarchist principles apply to a lot of young people with overbearing parents, so I can see how places like this could attract middle class teens. The messages that some of these Swiss Sub cultures display all link into anarchist ideals (Switzerland has a historically conservative outlook on family. Principles like precision and punctuality are taught because they prevent people exploiting you and your family, but breed an Anarchist tenancy in some). Sorry that was just a cheap jab at coohoolin not an invitation for a good post.
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Jun 8, 2016 12:27
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