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Today I was playing some ring. I sat down with twenty and flopped a flush draw with ace high. Some guy bets, another guy raises almost 40% of his stack. Knowing that this guy is probably going all in and the guy after me gets to make a decision, what was I supposed to do? I folded, but I thought it was a hard decision, with 35% chance to hit the flush and win 40 bucks, Should I have pushed all in?
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Jul 4, 2007 19:29
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Jabe posted:Today I was playing some ring. Is this a joke post? You really need to give a LOT more details. Blinds, actual stack sizes, how many players are involved, etc. You basically just asked "How do I play poker?". You're quite likely to find some help in this thread but you gotta give us something to go on....
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Jul 4, 2007 19:55
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Hand here Flop raise because I read the half pot as a feeler bet with KK/QQ/JJ, and I was hoping to make him drop it, and then after that I had odds. I think. Did I screw up?
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Jul 6, 2007 17:54
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Ranma4703 posted:Hand here Without reads I think the flop raise is spew.. I'm too lazy to do the math right now but I think calling the 3b is close because you probably need your 9 and 7 outs to be good a large portion of the time, which again, against an unknown they probably aren't.
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Jul 6, 2007 18:06
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Perhaps I am being results oriented but you seem to be suffering from Fancy Play Syndrome against opponents that are typically straight forward and simple.
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Jul 6, 2007 18:54
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I'm going to add on to what CJ is saying and comment that most bets on cake are half pot or pot sized just because of the buttons. If someone actually sizes a bet I usually make a note on them, it's a rare occurrence though. Sometimes I find myself doing it 
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Jul 7, 2007 19:33
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Knightmare posted:I'm going to add on to what CJ is saying and comment that most bets on cake are half pot or pot sized just because of the buttons. If someone actually sizes a bet I usually make a note on them, it's a rare occurrence though. Sometimes I find myself doing it 9/10 times when someone does other than 1/2 pot or pot at Cake it's the retarded "bet a random amount that makes a big pile of chips to trick the other person into thinking you're all in". But maybe I'm just bitter because I keep falling for it 
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Jul 7, 2007 19:38
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7 days ago, I dropped $50 on Stars. The next week went a little something like this: July 2nd: $50.00 I started by playing $0.01/$0.02 July 3rd: $47.00 Had a dip July 4th: $64.00 Moved to $0.02/$0.05 droppingJuly 5th: $88.00 Solid night of the usual. Felt like my actions were intelligent. July 6th: $60.00 Big dip. July 7th: $59.00 More dippage. Started playing $1.20+0.20 SNGs with mild success. July 8th: $57.00 Poop. July 9th: $32.00 Play went to the gutter completely. I couldn't get a break at all tonight. Just dropped buy-in after buy-in. ------------ I have read a few books and I feel like I have a decent handle on strategy. I just always seem to lose big with the second best hand and make NO MONEY when I do actually have a hand that stands up. My trips always get drawn out by flushes, and when I play hard, I can never get a call (despite the occasional bluff and all at disguising my holdings). I know there are a lot of great players here. Can any of you offer any advice? Am I being too "results-oriented"? Should I move the remainder of my money to Cake? I still have 400 points left on my Stars deposit bonus but I fear that I may not survive long enough at this rate.
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Jul 10, 2007 05:50
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The 1.20+.20 SNG's have a steep rake that hardly makes it winnable, I'd give up on those for a while. If you're playing underrolled you should be playing pretty conservative. If you only play the best hands then you'll have the easiest decisions post flop. With this strategy you'll need to work on extracting the most value, though. It's hard to help you when the only information you give is "a few days ago I had $88, now I have $32; halp!". I hear you with the flush draw problem, and I've noticed at lower limits people are tempting to chase any draw on the flop but usually not the turn. For some reason people have no problem calling a pot size bet of a dollar on the flop but not a pot size bet of 3 dollars on the turn, so try experimenting around with that a bit. Also post some hands that you want some help on.
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Jul 10, 2007 06:15
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perfmode posted:7 days ago, I dropped $50 on Stars. The next week went a little something like this: quote:I just always seem to lose big with the second best hand and make NO MONEY when I do actually have a hand that stands up. My trips always get drawn out by flushes, and when I play hard, I can never get a call (despite the occasional bluff and all at disguising my holdings).  quote:Am I being too "results-oriented"? Maybe. I don't mind being outdrawn if I made it so expensive that I won EV. The $1.20 Sit&Go's might not be a bad idea. I made half my bankroll with them. A friend of mine who always lost in the ring switched to SNGs too. After 10 SNGs or so he has a ROI rate of like 80% (SAMPLE SIZE). Pretty cool for a guy who only lost in ring games.
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Jul 10, 2007 08:31
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Does anyone have any opinions on how I could've extracted more money in these hands? No real reads here. I guess you could view them in a vacuum. http://www.pokerhand.org/?1251926 http://www.pokerhand.org/?1251933
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Jul 11, 2007 01:50
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perfmode posted:Does anyone have any opinions on how I could've extracted more money in these hands? No real reads here. I guess you could view them in a vacuum. Okay 1st hand, whatever you are betting on river is pretty transparent don't you think? 2nd hand, bet flop, bet more on turn, bet river depending on how you feel, only 2 cards beat you if they were drawing to a flush.
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Jul 11, 2007 04:11
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perfmode posted:Does anyone have any opinions on how I could've extracted more money in these hands? No real reads here. I guess you could view them in a vacuum. I'm usually folding A6 offsuit in early position. The way it played out, there's not a whole lot more you could've done. Bet the turn to allow people to fold while building a pot for your OESD (which you did), and then bet the river. My river bet would probably be half the pot to offer 3:1 odds. On the second hand, I bet the flop for a few reasons. You want to chase people out, you want to see if anyones drawing to the flush, and you want to build the pot if your flush card hits. You did this on the turn which is one street too late, and it turns out your opponent wasn't after a flush when he folds on the river.
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Jul 11, 2007 17:55
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Cactus Jack posted:2nd hand, bet flop, bet more on turn, bet river depending on how you feel, only 2 cards beat you if they were drawing to a flush. agree. bet flop bet turn bet river (fold to a big raise obv).
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Jul 11, 2007 20:02
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blah_blah posted:agree. bet flop bet turn bet river (fold to a big raise obv). check-call river is better
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Jul 11, 2007 20:09
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voltron posted:check-call river is better it's 0.01/0.02; I think there is definitely some value in a river bet. villain will probably call with any heart.
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Jul 11, 2007 20:29
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Is there any difference in skill level between 0.01/0.02 and 0.02/0.05? If not, when does the field begin to change significantly?
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Jul 12, 2007 05:30
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http://cakepoker.com/HandHistory/?Hand=xcXNxsTFxcbNwMTExMLCwYjHwMfHxsM%3d Was folding here the right call? I feel I should have bet more on the turn though.... Edit- I am Wubanga with KK. InfuriatedMicrowave fucked around with this message at 07:41 on Jul 12, 2007 |
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Jul 12, 2007 07:36
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InfuriatedMicrowave posted:http://cakepoker.com/HandHistory/?Hand=xcXNxsTFxcbNwMTExMLCwYjHwMfHxsM%3d Did you have the king of spades? It's a tough call, you'd be calling 12 to win 24 so you're getting 2:1, but if the villain has an ace I can see him doing that with the ace of spades so even if you did have a spade you might still be drawing dead. After considering all that I would say I fold as well.
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Jul 12, 2007 08:20
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Consider check/check turn and call a non pot-sized bet, maybe fold to a half-pot bet on up, on the river. There is no real point in betting here on the turn since he can bluff you off lots of hands that you beat but you can pick off lots of bluffs on the river if you just check through. (Although I don't see too many players at .10/.20 that will try to bluff the river if they don't even have an A at minimum). Fake Edit: Just realized he called a pot-sized bet on the flop with 3 spades to it, that should be sending alarm bells off in your head. Easy turn check and possible river fold.
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Jul 12, 2007 12:49
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perfmode posted:Is there any difference in skill level between 0.01/0.02 and 0.02/0.05? If not, when does the field begin to change significantly? probably nl50? I doubt there is hardly any difference between 0.01/0.02 and 0.02/0.05
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Jul 12, 2007 13:56
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perfmode posted:Is there any difference in skill level between 0.01/0.02 and 0.02/0.05? If not, when does the field begin to change significantly? I saw your post in the bonuses thread about clearing your bonus. If that's why you want to move up you probably need to go up to 0.05/0.10. Maybe you're getting better results for FPPs than me but I think even at 0.02/0.05 you don't get enough FPPs (of course I don't know how many points you have to clear). Also: About the differences between 0.01/0.02 and 0.02/0.05   (In those 9000 hands I received like 150 FPP)
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Jul 12, 2007 17:35
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InfuriatedMicrowave posted:http://cakepoker.com/HandHistory/?Hand=xcXNxsTFxcbNwMTExMLCwYjHwMfHxsM%3d I think this is a definite fold and it's important to see why. His call on the flop there and then the turn check/shove reeks of a monster. Note that big turn raises are rarely draws and big turn checkraises are even scarier. The only thing that you're beating is a flush draw or a 78 with maybe a spade, both of which at .10/.20 are rarely raising that turn. Remember that all the hands you are beating still have a good chance of hitting on the river as well. Now think about all the hands that are beating you(any ace, two pair, a flopped flush, a set) and you are either drawing completely dead or to two outs assuming you don't have the king of spades. I think betting the turn is borderline, you don't want to give away a free card but you also don't want what happened to happen. If the turn came anything but an ace I think it's a bet, but since the ace came, checking behind and probably calling a medium sized bet on any non spade river is likely the best play here. It is very very important to remember that getting raised on the turn like that means very often that any one pair is not good, let alone second pair. If there were no draws on the board and you got raised like that it would be a quick fold. I think the only time this would be a call is with a good read on the opponent. Also no perfmode, there probably isn't much of a difference between .01/.02 and .02/.05 and if you're rolled there is no reason not to move up.
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Jul 12, 2007 21:07
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Rheingold posted:Also: About the differences between 0.01/0.02 and 0.02/0.05 That's just variance, I've had 10k breakeven stretches in games I'm beating for 5+ptBb/100
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Jul 12, 2007 21:46
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I'm apparently a huge fish. I do alright in small live games, and on some other sites, but cake it just destroying me. It's the first time I've ever really done cash games for anything other than yahoo play money, and I keep getting hit with poo poo like this http://cakepoker.com/HandHistory/?Hand=xcXNwMTFxsTHwMTExMfCxojHwMbGwcE%3d I am themindreels. against that small of an all-in, should I have laid it down? the guy seemed to not be able to let his overcards go so I figured it could have been any two face cards. or is that just a pretty standard beat and I'm just tilting because i'm up to my tits in runbad? I had no illusions about being a great player, but I was shocked by just how badly I'm doing. Any general advice for someone who's read HOH and plays about 20 hours a week and just not hitting it?
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Jul 13, 2007 19:46
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in what ways do you think you played that hand poorly?
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Jul 13, 2007 19:53
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Never fold a set. Especially on that board. He got lucky, end of story. VV I'm not telling you to stop whining or anything, just that it's a pretty simple hand. Morphius22000 fucked around with this message at 20:03 on Jul 13, 2007 |
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Jul 13, 2007 19:55
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edit: ^^^^ got it. I'll suck it up and stop whining. I don't even know if I did. It was the lowest possible set and I was facing an all-in, is a set just something that should be played almost all the time, unless you have some really bad feeling? I'm honestly just frustrated because I'm not winning, and not understanding why, I guess.
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Jul 13, 2007 19:56
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ixo posted:edit: ^^^^ got it. I'll suck it up and stop whining. Yeah, sets should almost always be played, especially if there are no straight or flush possibilities. They are deceptive since it is really hard to place someone on a set. When you flop one, people will play back at you hard with an overpair or 2 pair. If this hand is any indication of why you are losing, you are just on a downswing for now. You got it in with way the best of it.
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Jul 13, 2007 20:08
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I'll even go as far to say that on Cake you should never fold a set on any flop for any amount of money below about $20NL
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Jul 13, 2007 21:11
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I'm having a hard time finding some info on this. My local card room just opened a small nl game with 1/3/3 blinds 60min and 200 max buyins. I'm looking on ways strategy must be adjusted to playing this game with the extra blind, specifically if you're the second blind. Should you just play it like you have a straddle on? Normal live poker scenarios apply (everybody's a retard fish playing live, nobody folds to a raise pf etc). I'm not sure what the rake is yet, but I'm assuming it's going to suck because their 3/6 game plays 3/3 blinds and they rake $4 before a flop is even seen. Their 6/12 game plays 4/6 blinds and they rake the same $4 before flop. Should this nl game be played like any other live one except you're BB twice? And does this affect position value as much, i.e. late position becomes more valuable with extra blind since utg starts at utg+1 (I believe table plays 9 handed)?
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Jul 14, 2007 02:02
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HIM posted:I'm having a hard time finding some info on this. My local card room just opened a small nl game with 1/3/3 blinds 60min and 200 max buyins. I'm looking on ways strategy must be adjusted to playing this game with the extra blind, specifically if you're the second blind. Should you just play it like you have a straddle on? Normal live poker scenarios apply (everybody's a retard fish playing live, nobody folds to a raise pf etc). I'm not sure what the rake is yet, but I'm assuming it's going to suck because their 3/6 game plays 3/3 blinds and they rake $4 before a flop is even seen. Their 6/12 game plays 4/6 blinds and they rake the same $4 before flop. Should this nl game be played like any other live one except you're BB twice? And does this affect position value as much, i.e. late position becomes more valuable with extra blind since utg starts at utg+1 (I believe table plays 9 handed)? I'd raise a bit more preflop with your premium hands with the extra person always in the pot, especially if they think their blind 'commits' them to it.
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Jul 14, 2007 21:29
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http://cakepoker.com/HandHistory/?Hand=xcXNwcTFxc3DzMTExcfDwojFzMXHwsY%3d should i call this? i have 99. my only read is that i saw him float with ace high, then check behind unimproved on the river after the other guy called the turn.
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Jul 15, 2007 05:52
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ultimatemike posted:I'll even go as far to say that on Cake you should never fold a set on any flop for any amount of money below about $20NL How about this situation I had tonight. NL4, I'm in LP with KK. I raise to .50, folds to my right who calls. Flop comes KT9 all spades. He bets 1. What do you do?
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Jul 15, 2007 06:09
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darkeye posted:How about this situation I had tonight. Assuming $4 stacks I shove..
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Jul 15, 2007 06:14
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p0isonxfree posted:Assuming $4 stacks I shove.. I have $13, he has $11.20
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Jul 15, 2007 06:19
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sdfsdf posted:http://cakepoker.com/HandHistory/?Hand=xcXNwcTFxc3DzMTExcfDwojFzMXHwsY%3d I'm a pretty big station but I think this is a fold.
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Jul 15, 2007 06:20
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blah_blah posted:I'm a pretty big station but I think this is a fold. Calling 150 to win 330? I realize there isn't a whole lot that he's ahead of here but I can see him being ok one out of three times making this a profitable call. Note my normal game is cake NL20 though, where I call this all the time.
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Jul 15, 2007 08:43
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sdfsdf posted:http://cakepoker.com/HandHistory/?Hand=xcXNwcTFxc3DzMTExcfDwojFzMXHwsY%3d I'd fold I think. Is the flop raise standard? It seems to me that you'll get called by hands that are ahead of you, a fold from worse hands, and maybe shoved on from hands like Asxs? If I raised the flop, i'd fire again on the turn. Or i'd just call the flop and call the turn if I think he can 2-barrell with overs. My game's hosed though so I may be way off here.
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Jul 15, 2007 13:13
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Knightmare posted:Calling 150 to win 330? I realize there isn't a whole lot that he's ahead of here but I can see him being ok one out of three times making this a profitable call. Note my normal game is cake NL20 though, where I call this all the time. by this logic you should call a pot sized bet every time you have an overpair! (you are getting 1/3 any time someone pots it) this line just looks way too much like a big pair or a set going for a stackadonk line, whiffing, and then making a bigger than normal river bet out of frustration.
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Jul 15, 2007 18:42
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