|
Strong Sauce posted:Hand 1: Unless you have some sort of insane history with villian it is pure spew. Have you ever seen this line taken with an FD? Why would he "draw to his flush cheaply" by minraising instead of just flatting? If he wants to semi bluff why wouldn't he minraise flop? I've never seen this line with a flush draw before, so I'm not worried about it. I'm trying to get his stack in. The only reason to reraise turn or shove turn is if I think his line is so strong that he is calling a 3-bet shove on the turn and I don't want an action killing card on the river. No?
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 01:03
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 00:18 |
|
|
AT hand is spew, what they said. AA hand is fine. flat and let him bluff/value bet instead of relying on him to call with worse. call/shove any river.
|
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 01:37
|
|
|
niknik posted:Have you ever seen this line taken with an FD? Why would he "draw to his flush cheaply" by minraising instead of just flatting? If he wants to semi bluff why wouldn't he minraise flop? I've never seen this line with a flush draw before, so I'm not worried about it. I'm trying to get his stack in. The only reason to reraise turn or shove turn is if I think his line is so strong that he is calling a 3-bet shove on the turn and I don't want an action killing card on the river. No? People are capable of playing flush draws in really strange ways, and I think in the villain's mind, a turn minraise is specifically intended to look less flush draw-y than a check/call, check/call line so he can bluff or make a valueshove on the river depending on whether he hits or not without being completely transparent. Especially since some people at NL100 and lower absolutely refuse to believe agressive players can get actual hands on the button, I think that the turn is an easy shove to get value from any kind of ace, combo draw, or a stubborn naked flush. As played, this is a really close decision with no reads, but I think that in the end I have to lay it down. If the flop had been rainbow and he minraises a 2nd flush card on the turn, I don't mind slowing down and tanking his bet trying to telegraph AT or something and letting him bluff off his stack out of position, but what are you beating when the 3rd flush card hits and he instashoves? That's all just my opinion though, and it looks like a much better player directly above me has a completely different opinion of the hand  I know a couple people have mentioned it already, but first hand probably would have been spew even if you were on the button and had been stealing his blind nonstop for the last 2 hours. post-feminist rimjob fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Feb 7, 2008 |
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 01:47
|
|
|
I've been getting back into online poker after a big hiatus, and I was wondering what my stats should be on PT at microstakes (NL10). I used to play something like 22/8 when I was playing full ring at pokerroom. After I recently started playing again, I was getting killed when I tried to implement the strategy that I use while playing live where most people alternate from being either hyper agressive or super passive. I switched to a more tight strategy for around 10k hands (18/8 with pf AF of 0.6 and flop AG of around 1.6) Am I being too passive pre flop and too agressive post flop or should I be playing something more like 15/10 with a more balanced AF? This is 6max BTW
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 02:00
|
|
|
niknik posted:Have you ever seen this line taken with an FD? Why would he "draw to his flush cheaply" by minraising instead of just flatting? If he wants to semi bluff why wouldn't he minraise flop? I've never seen this line with a flush draw before, so I'm not worried about it. I'm trying to get his stack in. The only reason to reraise turn or shove turn is if I think his line is so strong that he is calling a 3-bet shove on the turn and I don't want an action killing card on the river. No? People are morons sometimes. Maybe he has 6c9c and is doing this as his valueraise. Maybe he has 2 pair and thinks he is valueraising. Some people only minraise because they don't know how to move a slider. I mean, is he good enough such that he can bluff the club river but suck so much as to minraise the turn here? I guess thinking about it flat calling isn't bad but I would rather get more money in on the turn.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 02:10
|
|
|
niknik posted:Have you ever seen this line taken with an FD? Why would he "draw to his flush cheaply" by minraising instead of just flatting? If he wants to semi bluff why wouldn't he minraise flop? I've never seen this line with a flush draw before, so I'm not worried about it. I'm trying to get his stack in. The only reason to reraise turn or shove turn is if I think his line is so strong that he is calling a 3-bet shove on the turn and I don't want an action killing card on the river. No? the only problem with this is that your line looks like a draw if you just flat the turn and he may not vb any club, or any card completing a straight. I would probably make it $52 to go or so and hope he just sticks the rest in there.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 02:15
|
|
|
Lote posted:I've been getting back into online poker after a big hiatus, and I was wondering what my stats should be on PT at microstakes (NL10). I used to play something like 22/8 when I was playing full ring at pokerroom. After I recently started playing again, I was getting killed when I tried to implement the strategy that I use while playing live where most people alternate from being either hyper agressive or super passive. I switched to a more tight strategy for around 10k hands (18/8 with pf AF of 0.6 and flop AG of around 1.6) Am I being too passive pre flop and too agressive post flop or should I be playing something more like 15/10 with a more balanced AF? I think 15/10 is too tight for 6max, but maybe still profitable depending on other factors. You're definitely not aggro enough though on all streets. I don't know what "optimal" numbers are. I do have these 2 stats of Ryan Daut and CTS. I mean yeah we're not CTS but he can beat up 25/50 6max playing some ridiculous 34/28/4. I don't think it's worthwhile to try to shape your stats to be something specfic, instead start opening up your game as you feel more comfortable, and play more aggressive in general. Ryan  CTS  edit: Blah_blah is right, I didn't consider that CTS's 6max stats are probably from 3-4 handed games. HKS fucked around with this message at 03:00 on Feb 7, 2008 |
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 02:53
|
|
|
that last table is one of the 10 sickest pt screenshots in the history of online poker, but most of it is like 3 players or less I think (seriously? 100 BI in 44k hands at 25/50 in one month? really?)
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 02:55
|
|
|
god drat I need to drop out of school and play 200k hands a month so I can move up to 5knl
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 03:18
|
|
|
Preflop game is only a small fraction of poker, don't overthink your preflop game too much. A nit can be highly profitable if he knows what he's doing.artard posted:Hand 1: Spew. The only thing you're ahead of is someone way overplaying a flush/straight draw or worse ace and if you're behind you don't even have any backdoor outs or anything. Basically, don't play TPGK for stacks unless you have a strong read that your opponent is retarded. But what's an alternative line? You think this is always a set? I just call turn and re-eval, prob folding to a good sized bet.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 04:07
|
|
|
I think it's usually 2 pair, a set or a stronger ace. Unless he had really nitty stats I'd prob call the flop raise and re-evaluate turn.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 05:13
|
|
|
NL10 home game hand, just need someone to tell me that I'm a retard. 6-handed, effective stacks ~10, game plays very loose, especially postflop. I'm UTG+1 with 98o and limp (I just announced that I'd leave after this hand and who doesn't want to see the last flop, maybe I'll flop a boat and stack someone right  )5-way limped to the flop of 89T, two hearts. SB bets 0.50, BB folds, UTG makes it 1.50, I??? Reads: SB is loose but mostly straightforward, UTG is completely insane LAG maniac, one tight&straightforward player to act after me. My image is pretty tight and they know I know what I'm doing most of the time. I ended up shoving 9.80 or something, and I pretty much immediately felt bad about it. What I'm asking is, what's the cheapest way to find out where I'm at without committing myself? schlaufux fucked around with this message at 13:44 on Feb 7, 2008 |
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 10:30
|
|
|
http://www.pokerhand.org/?2061372 I was gonna raise the turn but decided to let him bet the river then push over his river bet but than he pushes the river. Would you have raised the turn 100% of the time or is a smooth call here ok sometimes to raise/push the turn? And the river is an instacall here? He went all in for 61 here, only thing im afraid of is the higher flush. Will I see higher flush here a lot with the all in?
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 13:14
|
|
|
souLjah posted:http://www.pokerhand.org/?2061372 I would raise pre to isolate & prevent someone else doing so. Raise the turn for value and on the river I would have to be at least 250bb deep and it would need to be a similar ridic overbet for me to fold. You're not even 100bb deep so what are you worried about?? And yes he will show up with a higher flush sometimes but not always.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 17:17
|
|
niknik posted:I would raise pre to isolate & prevent someone else doing so. Raise the turn for value and on the river I would have to be at least 250bb deep and it would need to be a similar ridic overbet for me to fold. You're not even 100bb deep so what are you worried about?? And yes he will show up with a higher flush sometimes but not always. perfect
|
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 18:02
|
|
|
A curious hand... what do you do when someone pot bets into you on turn? Full ring NL100. Hero has A  K on button with about $70 and is covered. Villian plays hands, but nothing crazy from what I can tell. A little looser than pure TAG.UTG calls, Middle raises to $4, hero calls, everyone else folds. Pot $10. Flop is Q  7 A Villian checks, Hero bets $7, villian calls. Pot $24. Turn is a 3 Villian bets $24, hero ?I have no idea what is going on here. If he's bluffing, why make the bet pot sized? If I called this, it's all going in on the river. If he has something good like AQ or A3 or better, why not let me bet and checkraise me?
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 19:11
|
|
|
$100 NL, 5 handed. My stack is $95, villain has me covered by a few dollars. Villain has not made any remarkable plays nor has he been involved in any big pots. I am dealt KK in the small blind. Folded to me I make a standard raise to $4, which I have been doing aggressively for approx 30 hands. Villain calls. Flop comes 5A4 rainbow. I lead $8, which again I have been doing aggressively. Villain raises to $20. What would you do?
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 19:12
|
|
|
I know it's pathetically small stakes, but did I REALLY overestimate the strength of my hand here? https://cakepoker.com/HandHistory/?Hand=xcDEx8TFxc3MwcTExcLHwIjAxsDFxcI%3d To be honest the only thing I was worried about was an ace with a higher kicker.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 21:12
|
|
|
Kempo posted:I know it's pathetically small stakes, but did I REALLY overestimate the strength of my hand here? You should be folding almost always PF, unless villain is really aggro and you want to try a play in position. A5o is really susceptible to being dominated so after a bet and raise on the flop, folding is probably your best bet, and calling is better than raising because a raise of that size you're probably only going to be called by better hands. The turn you cant really go wrong getting it in with trips and having almost 1/2 your stack in already. That said, Propoks line looks REALLY REALLY STRONG, pretty much like a set so if stacks were deeper you could fold the turn with a good read, although the biggest problem with that hand was how you arrived at the turn. So pretty much, fold everywhere except the turn.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 21:48
|
|
|
Yea that's one of those sorts of hands where it's correct to make the call once you're faced with the decision but you made mistakes to get yourself in that situation
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 21:50
|
|
|
BEHOLD: MY CAPE posted:$100 NL, 5 handed. I would fold. It's a small raise but you are probably crushed, that board is not very drawy and you said villain hasn't been making plays or been in a big pot. He probably has two pair, a set or a good ace. Unless villain has been raising a lot I would never do anything but fold here, villain would have to be realllly tricky for me to call/raise.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 21:52
|
|
|
NarkyBark posted:A curious hand... what do you do when someone pot bets into you on turn? I think that he leads the turn like that to try and fool you? Maybe he wants to make you pay if your on the draw? Im def confused but I have no idea where you are at in the hand, he is probably pushing the river or a big bet. Maybe I fold this and watch him more closely.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 22:14
|
|
|
niknik posted:I would raise pre to isolate & prevent someone else doing so. Raise the turn for value and on the river I would have to be at least 250bb deep and it would need to be a similar ridic overbet for me to fold. You're not even 100bb deep so what are you worried about?? And yes he will show up with a higher flush sometimes but not always. I don't know what the threshold is for folding here, but you probably should be folding 150BB deep, the pot is only $26 going into the river and he shoves for $60 or so. If the pot is $26 going into the river and he's shoving for $140, then I think it's definitely a fold. As played, it's a pretty marginal call, I expect him to show up with a flush a lot, though probably enough to call against a Cake unknown. Raising turn is better and you can stack off with a lot less guilt that way. BEHOLD: MY CAPE posted:KK gets raised You have to peel once here a lot in blind battles or you are going to get poo poo on a lot, especially when your opponent makes smallish raises like that.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2008 22:17
|
|
|
Did I chicken out here or would you have made the same move? Looking back I realize I should have raised the button preflop. http://www.pokerhand.org/?2064140 My fear was that he had made the straight on the river. Been at the table for a few orbits. Hadn't seen the guy go to showdown very often but it seems he was involved in a lot of hands. unoplank fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Feb 8, 2008 |
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 00:00
|
|
|
quote:Dealt to imaSCATMAN [ Jh 9h ] I was unaware you were a goon until reading that last page. I've played with you a few times and it always pisses me off because I get that song in my head (like i do now  )quote:
Why not re-raise pre-flop? As played, I think you have to push.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 01:36
|
|
|
http://www.pokerhand.org/?2065690 Too keen to get it in here? I have an aggressive image at the table and this guy was weak/tightish. I thought I had a ton of fold equity against top pair type hands, and was expecting fold most of the time. He had a10 as shown at the bottom, not ak 
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 05:04
|
|
|
Villain in this hand is 18/15 over 400 hands. His turn aggression is 13 while river is only 2.0. I was really in 2 minds about betting this river and didn't because I felt that getting shoved on would suck and didn't really see much that would call my bet given the action so far in the hand. Should I be vbetting? Sorry I can't figure out how to make the converter not suck. PokerStars Game #15137702894: Hold'em No Limit ($0.50/$1.00) - 2008/02/08 - 00:34:02 (ET) Table 'Valborg II' 6-max Seat #5 is the button Seat 1: fullhouse86 ($78.65 in chips) Seat 2: JigGa43 ($127 in chips) Seat 3: imeasy2read ($98.55 in chips) Seat 4: esther lim ($18.85 in chips) Seat 5: nicknick552 ($141.85 in chips) Seat 6: avalonia777 ($31.50 in chips) avalonia777: posts small blind $0.50 fullhouse86: posts big blind $1 *** HOLE CARDS *** Dealt to nicknick552 [Jc Js] JigGa43: calls $1 imeasy2read: raises $4 to $5 esther lim: folds nicknick552: calls $5 avalonia777: folds fullhouse86: folds JigGa43: folds *** FLOP *** [Ts 4h 7c] imeasy2read: bets $7 nicknick552: calls $7 *** TURN *** [Ts 4h 7c] [6s] imeasy2read: bets $18 nicknick552: calls $18 *** RIVER *** [Ts 4h 7c 6s] [6h] (Pot $60) imeasy2read: checks nicknick552: checks
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 06:53
|
|
|
Biggy_ posted:http://www.pokerhand.org/?2065690 Make your continuation bet a bit higher, over $3. You're a 35/65 dog when called by TT-QQ, AT, 55 and 88. So you have to be folding out a small number of hands to make this at least break which I think you probably are if your read is correct. As a plus you can play your set the same way next time and be a huge favourite. niknik - Yeah there's not much that will call your vbet on the river but you might get bluffed at by a missed flush draw so checking is great. EDIT: woops I misread your hand I thought you were the one betting on the flop and turn so yeah value bet the river like blah_blah suggests. dsquash fucked around with this message at 09:52 on Feb 8, 2008 |
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 08:39
|
|
|
niknik, that's an easy river vbet; make it like $35 or something for biggy's hand, sometimes I like the weak lead flop/3bet shove line, it's kinda opponent dependent but it's never that bad
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 09:19
|
|
|
blah_blah posted:for biggy's hand, sometimes I like the weak lead flop/3bet shove line, it's kinda opponent dependent but it's never that bad Is the weak lead used to get the opponent to raise a non premium hand that they wouldn't be able to call a shove with? Or?
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 09:58
|
|
|
dsquash posted:Is the weak lead used to get the opponent to raise a non premium hand that they wouldn't be able to call a shove with? Or? that's about all there is to it. when you b/3b, you usually want some fold equity (when you have a draw) or no fold equity (when you have a set), so you need to size your bets accordingly.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 13:48
|
|
|
I just started playing for cash for the first time about 5 days ago, so go easy on me. These are the few notable hands I had today. http://www.pokerhand.org/?2067499 I had just sat down, and the BB comes around and greets me with this. I didn't have a good read on the other player. I bet on the flop to scare away any flush chasers, but I am not sure if I bet too much. http://www.pokerhand.org/?2067518 The guy had been playing pretty loose, and was chasing a lot of flushes. I had figured he was chasing again on this one. I only went in preflop cause it was a minraise, and I was getting kind of bored with the bad cards I kept getting. http://www.pokerhand.org/?2067569 This was going to be my last hand of the session, so the cards I got looked good enough to me. I figured with the reraise and then the low card flop he missed completely. Should I have called to see the turn? I'm just looking to see if I played these well or if I got lucky. I felt good winning them and finishing the day at 26$ after starting with 10.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 16:16
|
|
|
aRemissMinotaur posted:3 hands hand 1 pot it preflop, don't overbet the flop, bet for value 3 times. 3 2/3 pot sized bets is good. hand 2 is fine if you have this read i guess hand 3 is ok but dont show your hands
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 17:07
|
|
|
blah_blah posted:niknik, that's an easy river vbet; make it like $35 or something I'm def leaning towards vbetting the river now but assuming he is a solid player, which he seemed to be - do you see him calling with 99-88, 55 or worse on a [Ts 4h 7c 6s 6h] board? Maybe he can talk himself into a call with AT or 99. I prolly would in his spot because I'm a station. At the time though I figured he is in EP, raising a limper and betting 2 streets strongly, I don't think a check is terrible vs him but if it was a worse player I would def bet and might even shove. He had 99 fwiw.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 18:08
|
|
|
NL $100, 6 handed. I have just sat down with a full stack and am dealt QQ in the CO. Folded to me I raise $4. Villain calls in BB. Villain is relatively unknown but a recognized multitabler. Flop comes 9QT unsuited. I bet $9, Villain check raises to $26. Easy shove? In my experience this check raise is often a blind-battle bluff. Is it worth it to call and give him a shot to bet again on the turn?
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 21:44
|
|
|
You have position so call and let him put the rest of his stack in on the turn (or bet if he checks).
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 21:54
|
|
|
BEHOLD: MY CAPE posted:NL $100, 6 handed. I have just sat down with a full stack and am dealt QQ in the CO. Folded to me I raise $4. Villain calls in BB. Villain is relatively unknown but a recognized multitabler. I think a shove is best here for a couple reasons. First of all, I think that a call on this type of board looks just about as strong as a shove, so a shove is good because you can get more money in the pot with a great hand without narrowing your range in villain's eyes. It also lets pair+straight draws and the odd 2pair hand get it in, both types of hands probably slow down if they dont hit the turn. Also, if you call and a J/K/8 comes, you have to kind of turn your set into a bluff if you're checked to because you're going to get bet into on any river by most decent players if you check behind. Basically, I think a lot of turns kill your action or put you behind, and villains a lot more likely to get it in (somewhat) lightly on this flop than after you flat his c/r. If you call, best case scenario, you're basically hoping he has air and will double barrel a blank turn, which will probably be pretty rare considering you called his c/r (unless he's unusually aggro in which case I think you can call sometimes).
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 23:15
|
|
|
M E A T Y posted:If you call, best case scenario, you're basically hoping he has air and will double barrel a blank turn, which will probably be pretty rare considering you called his c/r (unless he's unusually aggro in which case I think you can call sometimes). also this is not a board that a lot of people will bluffraise, because it usually hits the PFRs range pretty hard. i'd raise to $66 or so (which is essentially a shove, but sometimes he can talk himself into calling with a pair + oesd where he would fold to a shove).
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 23:35
|
|
|
Lote posted:I've been getting back into online poker after a big hiatus, and I was wondering what my stats should be on PT at microstakes (NL10). I used to play something like 22/8 when I was playing full ring at pokerroom. After I recently started playing again, I was getting killed when I tried to implement the strategy that I use while playing live where most people alternate from being either hyper agressive or super passive. I switched to a more tight strategy for around 10k hands (18/8 with pf AF of 0.6 and flop AG of around 1.6) Am I being too passive pre flop and too agressive post flop or should I be playing something more like 15/10 with a more balanced AF? I'm 18/13 at NL10, not sure if this is good or bad though.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2008 23:47
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 00:18 |
|
|
Live $1/2, 3 handed. The game is going to break within an orbit or two, and I am the big winner. SB is stuck and wants to get even; I think he is sitting on about $90 BB is about $150 deep and I cover. BB is kinda weak tight but runs like god and has owned me super super hard in the past. He will fold good hands to big bets but has snapped off some of my bluffs in the past, but never with really marginal holdings. My image was bad earlier in the session but I've shown down some nutty hands recently which I haven't played that fast and I just stacked someone with a set of jacks in the biggest pot of the evening. Anyways, I have Kh 8x otb, and I open to $6. Both SB and BB call. Flop is Jh Tc 9h, SB checks, BB bets $8, I call, SB folds. Turn is the 2c, BB checks (BB has definitely done this with nutty-type hands in the past thinking that I am overaggro); I reach for some chips but decide to check. River is the 3c completing the backdoor flush, BB leads for $15, I make it $80 right away.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2008 03:04
|
|