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Did anyone else get the feeling like Hillary was just saying "This isn't our problem..."?
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Feb 23, 2011 22:07
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Keeping Up With The Gaddafisquote:Saadi Gaddafi, one of the colonel's seven sons, tells the Financial Times newspaper that his father is planning to work with any new regime as the "big father". quote:Saadi, a former professional footballer, also said his brother Saif al-Islam is currently writing a new constitution for the country. quote:Col Gaddafi's son Saif al-Islam appears on state TV to declare that life is "normal" in Libya's western regions: "The ports, schools and airports are all open. The problem lies in the eastern regions." quote:More bad news for the Gaddafi family: the colonel's daughter Aisha has been axed as a UN goodwill ambassador.
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Feb 23, 2011 22:13
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Brown Moses posted:Keeping Up With The Gaddafis Maybe that's what the world should do with them - Detain them in a reality show or the Big Brother house so we can all watch them eventually kill one another for our entertainment. edit: A "Full House" type sitcom with a deposed dictator living with his seven crazy kids to make ends meet sounds like a good show BIG HORNY COW fucked around with this message at 22:23 on Feb 23, 2011 |
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Feb 23, 2011 22:20
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Brown Moses posted:
What a loving complete disconnect from reality if they honestly think this will return everything back to normal. "Oh... A new constitution written by the same guys. Hey! Everyone! Let's get these bodies in the ground and get back to our lives. Everything is fine now."
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Feb 23, 2011 22:23
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I can't wait for the new constitution written by this lunatic. (if he makes it that long)
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Feb 23, 2011 22:27
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BIG HORNY COW posted:edit: A "Full House" type sitcom with a deposed dictator living with his seven crazy kids to make ends meet sounds like a good show Bonus points if the Series finale ends like a mix of the Sopranos and Ceausescu.
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Feb 23, 2011 22:27
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BIG HORNY COW posted:Maybe that's what the world should do with them - Detain them in a reality show or the Big Brother house so we can all watch them eventually kill one another for our entertainment. Man, Gaddafi's got the style to out-ugly Cosby's sweaters.
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Feb 23, 2011 22:30
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Ewan posted:From the Guardian live blog
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Feb 23, 2011 22:39
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davebo posted:Didn't someone say Obama was going to speak like an hour ago? Did that happen yet? Looks like he's now scheduled to speak in about half an hour.
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Feb 23, 2011 22:44
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Slantedfloors posted:Bonus points if the Series finale ends like a mix of the Sopranos and Ceausescu. Maybe it can be like hes hiding in exile trying to fit in with the rest of society trying to make sure nobody knows he's really a deposed dictator Kind of like if Hannah Montana was a war criminal.
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Feb 23, 2011 22:47
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quadratic posted:Looks like he's now scheduled to speak in about half an hour. I am waiting in breathless anticipation for his soaring oratory in which he states no concrete... anything. I love maps. VVVVVVVV Cartouche fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Feb 23, 2011 |
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Feb 23, 2011 22:48
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The Guardian has put up this pdf of what they think the situation in Libya is.
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Feb 23, 2011 22:49
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Paddyo posted:Hopefully this resolution will result in a meeting. And with any luck that will lead to a second, even more strongly-worded statement. It's even possible that they may threaten some sort of sanctions on the Libyan government should they continue killing their own civilians. Although if you actually take the time to look at UN peacekeeping operations you will see that they have deployed military forces at least 40 times over the last 20 years. This whole "UN is lovely" attitude is a hangover from the US not getting it's own way with the UN, and more recently the Iraq war, when bush couldn't get authorisation to start a war. Jut fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Feb 23, 2011 |
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Feb 23, 2011 23:01
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Brown Moses posted:The Guardian has put up this pdf of what they think the situation in Libya is. I refuse to believe VW has sold that many Touaregs in western Libya.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:05
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Obama is speaking now.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:08
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Slantedfloors posted:Bonus points if the Series finale ends like a mix of the Sopranos and Ceausescu. Honestly if this whole college thing doesn't work out being a writer for this show would be my dream job.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:09
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Jut posted:Although if you actually take the time to look at UN peacekeeping operations you will see that they have deployed military forces at least 40 times over the last 20 years. Peacekeeping operations take weeks or more to put together, though and usually suffer from serious problems.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:12
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So basically: We're gonna have some serious meetings about this...
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Feb 23, 2011 23:13
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Jut posted:Although if you actually take the time to look at UN peacekeeping operations you will see that they have deployed military forces at least 40 times over the last 20 years. Peacekeeping is the key thing here, almost all of those missions were dealing with the post conflcit phase and most of them were absolutely stricken with corruption and ineffectiveness. You then have the few attempts at active intervention to prevent loss of life which led to things like Srebrenica and well, Rwanda. The UN has some great goals but it's effectiveness at dealing with violent conflict in much of the world is minimal.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:13
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Guardian has Obama as saying unilateral action is not off the table. Not included is the fact it's a really big table and we're all around this one end and unilateral action is all the way down at the other... man I'll just take another helping of doing gently caress all.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:15
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To be fair to the President, he has a good point. "The events taking place in the region are the result of actions by the people of the region, not by the US or any foreign power." And what's the real point of imposing sanctions now? Half the military has joined the opposition. They will either get him out soon or there will be a short civil war. Why impose sanctions that will hurt the people more than they hurt the regime?
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Feb 23, 2011 23:18
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Wonder how many more will be dead by the time Clinton travels to Geneva on Monday. Glad to see we're really on the ball with all of this.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:19
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XCPuff posted:Wonder how many more will be dead by the time Clinton travels to Geneva on Monday. Glad to see we're really on the ball with all of this. Bureaucracy is a bitch, and so are birthing pains. Revolution has never been easy.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:21
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breaklaw posted:To be fair to the President, he has a good point. I'm not in favor of sanctions, but saying all options are on the table is, at best, a polite lie. There is one maybe two options truly on the table, the rest are occluded by the horizon.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:23
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breaklaw posted:To be fair to the President, he has a good point. By events I assume he means the protests and overthrowing of dictators. The evil dictators... well those are actually the fault of the US and other foreign powers.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:25
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XCPuff posted:Wonder how many more will be dead by the time Clinton travels to Geneva on Monday. Glad to see we're really on the ball with all of this. Unless we have real targets for a military strike, there's logistically little to nothing we can do as an intervenor. We're not exactly HELPING the people of Iraq and Afghanistan and we've been TRYING for the better part of a DECADE.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:25
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XCPuff posted:Wonder how many more will be dead by the time Clinton travels to Geneva on Monday. Glad to see we're really on the ball with all of this. The US being on the ball would be bombing more civilians than Gaddafi has and being a recruiting commercial for Al Queda, sadly. Doing nothing is a step up.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:26
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The real question, the only real question at this point, is how long CQ can keep this lunacy up. If he falls this week, there's no long-term problem (though the tragic deaths of thousands of Libyans is of course still an issue we need to remember). If he keeps fighting and slaughtering Libyans for the next month and tries to start an actual civil war like he's been calling for, Libya might end up with scars that will take generations to heal. On the plus side (and I need to think about this in a positive way or I'll go as crazy as Qaddafi from depression at the human condition), this will leave the Libyan people with a permanent distaste for autocracy and dictatorship, even more of one than Egypt. A people that associates dictatorship with "governments organizing bomb runs on their own cities, shipping in mercenaries to shoot their own people, and blasting their citizens with anti-aircraft weaponry" will be devoted to keeping a non-dictatorial government.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:26
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From the BBC:quote:Tripolitanian tweets: "#Misrata: Protesters seemed to have the upperhand in this battle, almost prepared, managed to defeat mercs/army despite use of tanks." That's a city about 210km east of Tripoli. Early there was news that there was a column of military vehicle on the way their, seems like they got hosed up.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:26
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J33uk posted:Peacekeeping is the key thing here, almost all of those missions were dealing with the post conflcit phase and most of them were absolutely stricken with corruption and ineffectiveness. You then have the few attempts at active intervention to prevent loss of life which led to things like Srebrenica and well, Rwanda. The UN has some great goals but it's effectiveness at dealing with violent conflict in much of the world is minimal. The UN isn't mandated to intervene in conflicts unless genocide is taking place, so peacekeeping is pretty much all they can do. And with nearly 100,000 UN Troops deployed at the moment, they are hardly afraid to try and keep peace. And thanks to Stalin blocking the definition of Genocide to include systematic destruction of political groups, what's going on in Lybia is not technically genocide, and the UN's hands are pretty much tied.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:27
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Brown Moses posted:From the BBC: How the gently caress do protesters manage to beat TANKS?!
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Feb 23, 2011 23:29
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I would assume mercs are really not that well trained in vehicles like jets and tanks, if at all, so every real soldier defection is really putting this closer to the end. If the defector army pushes through fast, it could be over in days.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:31
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They had a report on the BBC from Benghazi where there were a number of abandoned armoured vehicles. Guess the army are either really poo poo, or the protesters are really good.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:33
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Jut posted:How the gently caress do protesters manage to beat TANKS?! Well, they have spears.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:33
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Jut posted:How the gently caress do protesters manage to beat TANKS?! Ewok Tactics
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Feb 23, 2011 23:34
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VROOM VROOM posted:Well, they have spears. drat you Civilization! Tanks really aren't magic people defeating weapons.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:34
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Jut posted:How the gently caress do protesters manage to beat TANKS?! Hustle, heart, and tenacity my friend.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:36
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Started a pool with a few friends in my political science class on how Qaddafi dies. If he kills himself Hitler-style, I get forty bucks but if he dies any other way, I lose ten. Either way, there's no way this dude lives out the year. I don't see him entering the 'Oh poo poo, my people are going to kill me.' mode that most dictators do when their people go after them. He's definitely going down the Hitlerbunker lunatic path.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:38
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Has there been any more solid info regarding the claims on mercs being flown in? What I've managed to find so far has been pretty inconsistent in terms of reporting, in terms of numbers, training and where the hell these people are coming from. The Guardian apparently came close to getting to interview with one of them but he was then ushered away. I've got to admit, some of the reports of 5000 mercs flying in on 20 big rear end cargo planes seem to be a little over the top.
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Feb 23, 2011 23:39
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Toadofsky posted:Hustle, heart, and tenacity my friend. And explosives e:in reality they probably just defected. Can't imagine many people wanting to throw their lives away for that guy now Ireland Sucks fucked around with this message at 23:43 on Feb 23, 2011 |
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Feb 23, 2011 23:39
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