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Watching AJE livestream on their Youtube page and Ghadaffi is not in Benghazi. In fact he's in Tripoli with sheets hung up that keep blowing in a breeze to reveal small piles of rubble when they show wide angles. He's giving another long speech about how he hasn't shot any Libyans, only a few hundred filthy rats. He then went on to dare the western imperialists in France and England to invade so he can defeat them in honourable battle as he has done in the past.
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Mar 15, 2011 22:59
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Verizian posted:Watching AJE livestream on their Youtube page and Ghadaffi is not in Benghazi. His forces are going to be moving in on Benghazi. I also saw when AJE cut to his speech, i turned it off, because why would anybody want to listen to his speeches.
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Mar 15, 2011 23:00
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Nonsense posted:His forces are going to be moving in on Benghazi. I also saw when AJE cut to his speech, i turned it off, because why would anybody want to listen to his speeches. because lol (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 15, 2011 23:01
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So, who exactly is winning in Libya? Every other post switches between: "Oh no, Gaddafi's definitely going to win this really soon" "BREAKING NEWS: Libyan Rebels capture several fully operational tanks" How is this actually going?
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Mar 15, 2011 23:15
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ChaosSamusX posted:So, who exactly is winning in Libya? Every other post switches between: Things are going poorly for anti-Gaddafi forces, but it can still be turned around.
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Mar 15, 2011 23:18
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Nonsense posted:His forces are going to be moving in on Benghazi. I also saw when AJE cut to his speech, i turned it off, because why would anybody want to listen to his speeches. His speeches are getting drat predictable. He probably dehumanized the opposition (called them dogs or whatever), bitched about al-qaeda, rambled about drugs and people being drugged, threatened the West and everyone else with death, accused the West and the opposition of lying, denied the mass protests, and generally threw around more ridiculuous conspiracy theories. I think he said earlier in an interview that he was disappointed with Sarkozy and other European rulers who condemned him. Yeah, people don't like it when you commit atrocities on innocent people. Imagine that.
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Mar 15, 2011 23:26
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ChaosSamusX posted:So, who exactly is winning in Libya? Every other post switches between: This could just be a Wag the Dog scenario and nothing is actually happening.
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Mar 15, 2011 23:28
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quote:Update: A trusted source has confirmed to us this story: The pilot who flew his plane into Baab Al Aziziyah took off as part of a 2 plane team with the mission of bombing strategic points in Al Guradibya base in Sirte. Their orders were to return immedietly after completing the mission. One pilot followed orders while the other flew to Tripoli where he emptied what he had left of ammunition on Baab Al Aziziyah and then crashed his plane into it Welp, that answers that question. Sounded like a good strategy, before, you know, that last part.
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Mar 15, 2011 23:31
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ChaosSamusX posted:So, who exactly is winning in Libya? Every other post switches between: I think AJE summed it up perfectly; Gaddafi has the weapons and the experience, but they lack the manpower and it seems that at any conflict there are defecting troops. The rebels have the manpower but lack the weapons and military training, although that deserves the comment that the organization and skill of the defecting military officers (now the rebel military command) isn't really known. Anything beyond this is essentially speculation. If you ask me Gaddafi can't win this. Not just because he lacks the manpower but because he lacks the loyalty. This shows itself in even his 'elite' brigade defecting in groups and it will eventually make it impossible to occupy the entire country, fundamentally a government can only rule if it's citizens obey. e; Normally a dictatorship overcomes that last part by fear, but Libya has probably passed the point of no return as soon as your citizens are prepared to die en masse to defy you.
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Mar 15, 2011 23:32
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Dr. Habibi posted:Welp, that answers that question. Sounded like a good strategy, before, you know, that last part. "Either tortured to death or gently caress YOU YOU CHARLES BRONSON-LOOKING MOTHERFU--" I wouldn't recommend it, but given how Gaddafi has treated 'prisoners' of war, gently caress it.
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Mar 15, 2011 23:33
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ChaosSamusX posted:So, who exactly is winning in Libya? Every other post switches between: Seems to me like parts of both sides (well, maybe parts of whatever rebel army exists and all of Ghadaffi's high command) are encouraging the reporting of propaganda as fact.
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Mar 15, 2011 23:40
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Staggy posted:Well it might not have been the original plan. It may have been a case of someone getting hit, realising they can't land/get back safely, and deciding to make the most of it. Mad Doctor Cthulhu's interpretation only makes sense if that aircraft was actually stricken; the description from Freigeist suggests that the aircraft didn't even try for the bombing run, as opposed to the other one (ya know, if it even did).
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Mar 15, 2011 23:41
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Mad Doctor Cthulhu posted:"Either tortured to death or gently caress YOU YOU DRAG QUEEN-DRESSING MOTHERFU--" I will not have the name of cinematic hero Charles Bronson sullied in this thread. 
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Mar 15, 2011 23:47
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Is it out of the realm of possibility, that someone could kamikaze this human being?
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Mar 16, 2011 00:01
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Some choice quotes from Twitter: evancehill quote:Our team in Tobruk confirms ship (reportedly with 25,000 tons of fuel) was intercepted by #Libya rebels en route to Tripoli via Greece. Liberty4Libya quote:Heavy sustained gun fire in #Sirte amid news of raising the independence flag #Libya #Feb17 Confirmed quote:Confirmed: #Sirte has joined #Feb17 revolution raising the independence flag. #Libya @AJELive @AJEnglish @AJArabic RT RT RT LibyanDictator quote:Burns hospital in Tripoli completely surrounded by security, reports that Gaddafi's sons were hurt in attack earlier. #Libya #feb17 quote:Reports that a group of #Gaddafi's personal security forces are from #Zwara and have defected after Gaddafi's attack on city. #Libya #Feb17 quote:Brigades that were surrounding #Misrata and #Zawia have retreated. Completely disappeared. #Libya #feb17 quote:Via Libyanfsl: The Firjaan tribe in Sirte organised an attack on the #Gaddafi forces in the city. #Libya #feb17 quote:Reports that 300 of the Gaddafi forces (Saadi brigade) surrender to people of #Ajdabya. #Libya #Feb17 LibyanYouthMovement quote:The ship Revolutionaries captured is owned by Hanibal Gaddafi, on its way to Zawia from Greece containing fuel supplies #Libya #Feb17
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Mar 16, 2011 00:03
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Pajser posted:Is it out of the realm of possibility, that someone could kamikaze this human being? I highly doubt he is out sunbathing. He's probably 20 feet deep in a reinforced bunker 24/7.
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Mar 16, 2011 00:06
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So there's claims some of the military in Sirte have rebelled and taken over an army base, and that Gaddafi's family were injured on the attack on his compound. The Libyan rumour mill is going into overdrive at the moment.
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Mar 16, 2011 00:10
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Pajser posted:Is it out of the realm of possibility, that someone could kamikaze this human being? There are plenty of fitting words to describe Colonel Gaddafi, perhaps you could refrain from including homophobic slurs in that list?
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Mar 16, 2011 00:15
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Brown Moses posted:So there's claims some of the military in Sirte have rebelled and taken over an army base, and that Gaddafi's family were injured on the attack on his compound. The Libyan rumour mill is going into overdrive at the moment. While I don't believe anything that Gaddafi or StateTV says regarding their victories over the rebel, I'm pretty skeptical about all these sudden victories. It's 1:15am in Benghazi now, so we'll probably have to wait until tomorrow and see if an independent new source can tell us what's actually going on.
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Mar 16, 2011 00:17
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Meanwhile on the Europeans being dicks front:The BBC posted:Italy blocks ferry of Moroccans fleeing Libya Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-12743356 Yes, turning people back at the ports because they almost drowned on the way there is a perfectly valid way of discouraging illegal immigration. 
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Mar 16, 2011 00:30
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Narmi posted:While I don't believe anything that Gaddafi or StateTV says regarding their victories over the rebel, I'm pretty skeptical about all these sudden victories. It's 1:15am in Benghazi now, so we'll probably have to wait until tomorrow and see if an independent new source can tell us what's actually going on. If the plan of the generals in charge of the rebels was indeed to stretch out Ghadaffi's forces as much as possible before mounting a major counter-attack, now would be about the best time to do it, right before the main force reaches Benghazi. It is also possible that all these reports are total bullshit in the hopes that it will make Ghadaffi hesitate for a moment, but until shown otherwise I prefer to believe in the former 
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Mar 16, 2011 00:31
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Other Twitter news:quote:Firjaan tribe and Awlad Suleiman tribe both announce they have joined the revolution. #Libya #Feb17 quote:Al Manara media reports the fighter pilot who flew his aircraft into Bab Azizia took off from Matiga base in Tripoli #Libya #Feb17 quote:To clarify our early tweet, what we understand is the Libyan independence flag was lifted at one point today in Sirte, since been taken down quote:Reports that 2 more #Gaddafi fighter jets land in #Benghazi and surrender to the Libyan people. #Libya #Feb17 quote:The shooting being reported and heard in #benghazi is from a villa where pro-Gaddafi spies were surrounded by revs. today #libya #feb17
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Mar 16, 2011 00:36
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Is Al Manara the same as the Lebanese Al Manar? If so it's a Hezbollah mouthpiece and I am not sure if it can be considered trustworthy. The Twitter rumor mill always runs hot during the night in Libya, who knows what's really true? Though it's pretty funny how the number of troops supposedly captured at Ajdabiya keeps climbing, up to 500 now, why not?
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Mar 16, 2011 01:03
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This should be interesting:quote:Libya: UK, France and Lebanon table no-fly zone plan source I guess they realize it's now or never. Now that the rebels are using their own planes does that complicates things? If this does somehow manage to pass, does that mean they won't be able to use them against Gaddafi?
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Mar 16, 2011 01:03
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All the activity in the middle east last 6 weeks or so has really helped open my eyes to some stuff I've read about the 60s. I read a bunch of stories/tales of college students leaving everything behind to go support socialist revolutions in south/central america, and always wondered why they would go so far away for something like that. Reading about these revolutions has really made it hit home; if I had any illusion I would be useful there (I'm a total goon that doesn't speak arabic, etc, I would be dead weight) I would be tempted to try and participate. I guess the best I can do is stay informed and spread the good word as best I can, but I feel like I have a better understanding on why people would go so far out of their way in other countries affairs - revolution is contagious.
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Mar 16, 2011 01:12
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Chade Johnson posted:There are plenty of fitting words to describe Colonel Gaddafi, perhaps you could refrain from including homophobic slurs in that list? Well, he dresses like one.  Yeah, sorry about that. Just kind of agitated.
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Mar 16, 2011 01:15
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Narmi posted:This should be interesting: Not necessarily. It would require coordination with the militaries that are enforcing the NFZ to ensure that they allowed rebel aircraft to fly without harassment, though. However, if a NFZ is set up I can't imagine that the rebels would want to bother with keeping their own aircraft in the mix. Compared to what France and the UK could bring in, practically everything in Libya that is capable of flight is a living fossil and even maintaining them has got to put a massive strain on already limited resources.
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Mar 16, 2011 01:16
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Narmi posted:This should be interesting: To avoid confusion for my fellow Americans the verb "to table" means the exact opposite in the UK from what it means in the US.
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Mar 16, 2011 01:16
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Soviet Commubot posted:To avoid confusion for my fellow Americans the verb "to table" means the exact opposite in the UK from what it means in the US. Edit: Right now is what people were talking about before. The rebels can lose every single battle they fight, but still end up winning. The power of rebellions are not their military, it's all down to how much they want what they are fighting for. The only way for Gadaffi to win the war is to kill or lock up every single person that does not support him. It may be some time before we find out what is and is not true though, possibly well after the end of the fighting. Yaos fucked around with this message at 01:30 on Mar 16, 2011 |
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Mar 16, 2011 01:19
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edit: /\/\/\ beatenDammit, journalists need to figure out that they should never use the phrase "tabled" in international press. It has opposite meanings in British English vs. American English. In British English, it means to raise a matter for discussion. In American English, it means to withdraw a matter from discussion. So that article is immediately confusing to anyone familiar with the American meaning.
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Mar 16, 2011 01:20
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Yaos posted:I'm in the US and I've never heard of using the term "to table" to mean "to suspend" it's always meant the same as "put on the table", "lay on the table", etc. I've heard "file it away" to mean "to suspend" though. I'm in Canada and we use it the same way (e.g. Harper's going to table his budget on March 22). I think I might've heard of using "table" to suspend something in a movie or on TV, but as far as I know we've always used it like in the article. Maybe there's two meanings depending on where you live in the US? Seems odd that the same thing has the exact opposite meaning in the same language in the same country though.
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Mar 16, 2011 01:32
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This is from the US Senate referencequote:
No idea why they use it that way but it is the meaning I'm familiar with, although the British one makes literal sense.
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Mar 16, 2011 01:37
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Leperflesh posted:In American English, it means to withdraw a matter from discussion. As a native speaker of 'merikan, I've never heard it used that way.
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Mar 16, 2011 01:42
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Narmi posted:Now that the rebels are using their own planes does that complicates things? If this does somehow manage to pass, does that mean they won't be able to use them against Gaddafi? The rebels would have to stop using planes too, unless we were willing to straight up say our mission is regime change rather than simply implementing a no fly zone (at which point we may as well be bombing them ourselves).
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Mar 16, 2011 01:44
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Thundarr posted:Not necessarily. It would require coordination with the militaries that are enforcing the NFZ to ensure that they allowed rebel aircraft to fly without harassment, though. However, if a NFZ is set up I can't imagine that the rebels would want to bother with keeping their own aircraft in the mix. Compared to what France and the UK could bring in, practically everything in Libya that is capable of flight is a living fossil and even maintaining them has got to put a massive strain on already limited resources. If an actual No-Fly zone is set up, it makes a lot more sense for the Rebels to just push for it to shoot down any armed plane, then just mothball their air assets and watch as Ghadaffi orders his Air Force to take off and commit suicide trying to run the blockade so he feels like a big man. You know he'd order his pilots into certain death, too. He's just that type of cockbag.
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Mar 16, 2011 01:44
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Verizian posted:I heard an amusing story the other day. The "SAS" unit captured a couple weeks back was actually SBS and they never got off the ship they were returning on. The same person who told me this story also claimed the SBS is a bunch of officially sanctioned Colonel Kurtz's.
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Mar 16, 2011 02:02
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IRQ posted:As a native speaker of 'merikan, I've never heard it used that way. Have you ever been involved with a group that utilizes robert's rules of order? That is where I think I picked it up from.
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Mar 16, 2011 02:07
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Is a no fly zone really going to make a significant impact at this point? Even if he can't fly jets anymore, he still has access to helicopters, artillery, and tanks for killing protesters.
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Mar 16, 2011 02:17
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Carnival47 posted:Is a no fly zone really going to make a significant impact at this point? Even if he can't fly jets anymore, he still has access to helicopters, artillery, and tanks for killing protesters. Er, do helicopters not fly? EDIT: VV ah, more of a capability thing than a policy thing. Makes sense! Delta-Wye fucked around with this message at 02:37 on Mar 16, 2011 |
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Mar 16, 2011 02:19
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Delta-Wye posted:Er, do helicopters not fly? It's much easier for low-flying helicopters to escape the notice of a NFZ. In Yugoslavia NATO never managed to adequately interdict them.
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Mar 16, 2011 02:25
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