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RPGs are the direct or indirect descendants of video games trying to capture the experience of playing D&D, the end. Current RPGs may not share this same goal with their predecessors, but are still in the same genre.
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May 10, 2011 00:40
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Wendell posted:Beyond the Beyond is generic poo poo, and let down a generation of PS1 RPG players who were desperate for the system to get its first RPG. It's from the same company that went on to make Golden Sun, and is pretty much exactly like that game. How one is considered "good" while the other isn't is beyond me. Dear lord Beyond the Beyond pissed me off so much. I had to use my own money from working (when I was like 15) to buy the damned thing, which I only did because it was the first rpg for the PSX. gently caress. I kept forcing myself to play it, and eventually I got to a spot where I just couldn't progress any further, because there was a damned random battle every step, the monsters did a ton of damage (some sort of tree guys I think) and I had run out of all my potions. I couldn't get to the town that was maybe 10 squares away. So damned bad.
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May 10, 2011 00:43
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Beyond the beyond is trash, absolute trash. One of the worst games ever made.
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May 10, 2011 00:57
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whydirt posted:RPGs are the direct or indirect descendants of video games trying to capture the experience of playing D&D, the end. Current RPGs may not share this same goal with their predecessors, but are still in the same genre. Here's the question that many are asking, even if they're not quite coming out and saying it: What is the experience of playing D&D? Which parts of that experience did developers try to recreate when making the first RPGs?
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May 10, 2011 01:26
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I've come to the realization recently that although I like RPGs, I really just enjoy having a nice storyline and don't actually care to be challenged by boss fights and such. I hate grinding most of the time, but there's a few games where I can tolerate it. I'm fine grinding for five hours if it means the rest of the game is a cakewalk. Basically, I want an interactive story. Any RPGs that have an excellent plot with fairly non-challenging gameplay? The only system off-limits for me is PS3.
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May 10, 2011 01:32
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Nickoten posted:Here's the question that many are asking, even if they're not quite coming out and saying it: What is the experience of playing D&D? Which parts of that experience did developers try to recreate when making the first RPGs? In D&D, each game's focus changes depending on the whims of the DM. You can have a game that's focused on combat and no story. You can have a game that's all story and social interactions and no combat. The only thing that's common among all D&D games is the core base set of rules that dictate how the game is played, and even still they are more suggestions than hardset rules as each DM can change them as they want. This is basically the same in video game RPGs. The developers are the DMs and they can change the rules how they want to better suit each individual game. They can also focus the game on story telling or combat.
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May 10, 2011 01:34
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Swiss Army Knife posted:I've come to the realization recently that although I like RPGs, I really just enjoy having a nice storyline and don't actually care to be challenged by boss fights and such. I hate grinding most of the time, but there's a few games where I can tolerate it. I'm fine grinding for five hours if it means the rest of the game is a cakewalk. Basically, I want an interactive story. Any RPGs that have an excellent plot with fairly non-challenging gameplay? The only system off-limits for me is PS3. Ice Blue fucked around with this message at 01:40 on May 10, 2011 |
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May 10, 2011 01:36
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Swiss Army Knife posted:I've come to the realization recently that although I like RPGs, I really just enjoy having a nice storyline and don't actually care to be challenged by boss fights and such. I hate grinding most of the time, but there's a few games where I can tolerate it. I'm fine grinding for five hours if it means the rest of the game is a cakewalk. Basically, I want an interactive story. Any RPGs that have an excellent plot with fairly non-challenging gameplay? The only system off-limits for me is PS3. I think you're better off reading a visual novel. Anyways I wanna say the suikoden series because grinding battles in that game isn't that necessary and the way the leveling system scales makes it very unrewarding. It still has some brutal fights in it though but they usually dont last that long in general. Except, s2 spoiler, ( one that takes 3 consecutive groups of 6 man teams and a final 1v1 to actually finish  )They have good stories thats less about some self made deity wanting to destroy the world and more about revolutionary wars against oppressive regimes that really aren't evil and just want to bring order in the way they find most realistic. You still need to grind things in the games but its less about fights and more about getting people in your huge 108 man warband. The fights are random but once you over level the area you can just let go of the mobs. You can equip a rune that stops random encounters all together as well.
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May 10, 2011 01:51
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Ice Blue posted:Controlling characters in a world/story that the DM (game developers) want to convey using a base set of rules that dictate character progression through experience and equipment. Agreed. It's a fairly versatile system "Gameplay"-wise. That's why defining an RPG as nothing more than descendant of games that took after DnD is pretty loose.
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May 10, 2011 01:57
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Wendell posted:Beyond the Beyond is generic poo poo, and let down a generation of PS1 RPG players who were desperate for the system to get its first RPG. It's from the same company that went on to make Golden Sun, and is pretty much exactly like that game. How one is considered "good" while the other isn't is beyond me. Beyond the Beyond was really awful. I played Golden Sun after it and got into it more, having more customization and puzzles helped. Dialogue was still pretty bad, though when it was new I didn't notice as much. Also, the magic effects were nice-looking for the GBA. As far as Kartia, I had a friend who liked it. I haven't played it, so it's now on my list!
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May 10, 2011 02:05
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Cao Ni Ma posted:Except, s2 spoiler, ( one that takes 3 consecutive groups of 6 man teams and a final 1v1 to actually finish Luca Blight is seriously one of the best villains of all time.
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May 10, 2011 02:18
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Swiss Army Knife posted:I've come to the realization recently that although I like RPGs, I really just enjoy having a nice storyline and don't actually care to be challenged by boss fights and such. I hate grinding most of the time, but there's a few games where I can tolerate it. I'm fine grinding for five hours if it means the rest of the game is a cakewalk. Basically, I want an interactive story. Any RPGs that have an excellent plot with fairly non-challenging gameplay? The only system off-limits for me is PS3. I'd recommend Nier. Gets stupid easy, and the characters especially are great. Fallout: New Vegas has pretty easy combat and by the time things ramp up you can start recruiting party members, some of which are crazy OP. It also has really good writing, particularly in the world-building department. Plus if you ever get in a real jam there's the Console to cheat with. More old school than that, Chrono Trigger is another game I'd recommend for being easy, but fun. The writing isn't super dynamic but the set pieces are really enjoyable.
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May 10, 2011 02:24
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JTDistortion posted:Can anyone give me some info about Kartia and Beyond the Beyond? I found them while browsing a local game store and was somewhat amazed by their price. Are they actually any good, or are they just relatively rare? Kartia (summoned) units are basically rock-paper-scissor as I remember it while human units are just all-around good at anything (and can cast spells via kartia). You also kind of need to play through the game twice as the characters' stories run in parallel with different casts. Game was pretty easy from what I remember. All in all it's not a bad game. It was different at the time, may or may not have aged well. Been many years since I touched it. I do remember liking it a lot at the time I played it (disclaimer: I was like in highschool at the time!)
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May 10, 2011 02:43
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TheOriginalEd posted:Luca Blight is seriously one of the best villains of all time. 
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May 10, 2011 03:02
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I'm new to Suikoden, what would be a good one to start with? Or are they all good (except IV apparently)?
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May 10, 2011 03:49
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HondaCivet posted:I'm new to Suikoden, what would be a good one to start with? Or are they all good (except IV apparently)? All of them and start with the first and work your way up. Including IV, because IV is necessary to fully enjoy Tactics which is awesome. Just trudge through it - it's not that long, 20 hours like any other Suikoden.
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May 10, 2011 03:51
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Nevermind.
Jesto fucked around with this message at 06:28 on Sep 12, 2014 |
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May 10, 2011 04:02
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The creator left midway through #3, because Konami wouldn't let him do the final point of view due to time constraints. That POV was supposed to be Sasarai's point of view - instead we got a stupid dog's. This is why the story in 3 seems a little off... we're missing an entire and very important point of view to the story. The fourth one is trash because they hired the character artist from the first game to be the director of the fourth game and she's completely clueless who had no idea what the themes of the Suikoden series were despite working on them. Tactics was made to fix it up, but I still had fun with it. V is pretty damned awesome, but Konami farmed it out so that's probably why. Tierkreis? What's that? Oh right, the MP experiment of Suikoden. Oh god ignore this. Apparently Konami reached out to the original creator of the series to let him come back to work on VI. He rejected it. Probably why there's no VI. loving Japanese, they really should get over their pride in some ways like that. Just rejoin Konami long enough to give us the final chapter of the series already with the final showdown between Pesmerga and Yuber and leave again, sheesh.
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May 10, 2011 04:08
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Rascyc posted:Kartia (summoned) units are basically rock-paper-scissor Uh oh. Judging from how much I have played Fire Emblem, this could be dangerous to my free time. Thanks to everyone for the warnings about Beyond the Beyond. I won't waste my money.
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May 10, 2011 04:19
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To start with Suikoden, I'd say start with three. It's a good RPG in it's own right, but doesn't really hold up to the series (which I'm gonna pretend 4 isn't a part of). It's real easy to get into, and you really don't need to know the story of the universe that much to enjoy it. I personally thought it was mediocre, but some love it, or hate it. I've found that those who started with three like three more then those who started with one or two. From 3, just go in order. Again, pretending 4 doesn't exist, 1, 2 and 5. 2 is probably my favorite of the series, and easily in my top 3 of favorite jrpg's. But going from 2 to 1 is painful. 5 is probably my next favorite of the series. It's got a real long start though, and doesn't really get all that enjoyable until about six hours in. So in short, give 3 a try. If you end up liking it, you'll love the other three because they are better in every way.
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May 10, 2011 04:21
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HondaCivet posted:I'm new to Suikoden, what would be a good one to start with? Or are they all good (except IV apparently)?
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May 10, 2011 04:24
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Cao Ni Ma posted:Except, s2 spoiler, ( one that takes 3 consecutive groups of 6 man teams and a final 1v1 to actually finish It's cool how as soon as I saw the emoticon I didn't need to mouse over the spoiler.  I played all the "normal" Suikodens, and I think all of them are at least a little cool, and none are required. Although I-II-III make a pretty loving spectacular saga, and I can't really say more without spoiling things in the worst way. Unfortunately, those can run you a pretty penny, so you can always just get V. It's plenty good. IV is the lamest of them, yes. Who gives a poo poo whether sequels fall before or after chronologically? Any good story in any time period is going to add fun characters to the "canon." You guys are weird.
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May 10, 2011 04:26
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Exit Fate is an okay game, because it's free and made by one dude, but it is no way better than anything in the Suikoden series apart from IV. Let's not get crazy.
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May 10, 2011 04:34
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So after catching up on this thread recently, I went ahead and picked up Drakensang: The River of Time. There doesn't seem to be any thread on the forums for it (or if there is one, it's archived and I don't have access) and the system it uses is sufficiently different that I basically don't know what the gently caress I'm doing. Would anyone mind outlining some basic stuff that might be useful, like whether magic is over/underpowered, whether ranged weapons are any good, skills to invest in, that sort of stuff?
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May 10, 2011 04:51
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Paperhouse posted:that's pretty much all of the appeal for me, if I wanted to read it on a computer then gamefaqs is just fine. Kind of like how owning a CD or record is way better than just having mp3s, and I'd never buy music if it was download only Actually, just had a nifty masterstroke idea. Why not copy what most CDs and Blurays do these days? Put in a code in your strategy guide that allows you to download a .pdf version of your strategy guide, and you can put it on your droid/kindle/computer device. Have the guide sold unwrapped, but keep the codes near the register. Or you can make it so the code can print out on the receipt. So the perfect dream organization would be have a subscription service with unlimited guide viewing, maybe a lower level subscription that only allows for 2 guides per month, then have your physical guides but sold with a code that allows you to redeem it for a copy that works on kindle/smartphone/computer devices. Said subscription would have a small fee that would allow you to download for your kindle/smartphone/computer device permanently. But alas, I can see we're going to get stuck with guides churned out for the latest generic FPS, with RPG guides being produced a little bit here and there, and quickly go out of print and cost up in the $30+ to acquire a copy yet are the most sought after due to the complexity of the games of the genre.
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May 10, 2011 05:00
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CommissarMega posted:Anywhere where I can buy a digital copy online? So far as I know, only KotOR 1 is available digitally (Steam). For KotOR 2 you must buy a physical copy.
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May 10, 2011 05:08
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Just gonna say it: I am in literal disbelief that people actually buy and use strategy guides.
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May 10, 2011 05:29
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Doc Hawkins posted:Just gonna say it: I am in literal disbelief that people actually buy and use strategy guides. "I'm going to buy a game where the whole point is to create your own image also I will buy this guide that will forgo all free will I could have in creating said image just to minmax the poo poo out of my anime character"
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May 10, 2011 05:37
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What are some of the good flash RPGs out there? I wanna play something this week before diving into Mother 3 again (I tried my old save and it turns out I'm completely under powered to fight the Mecha Drago so instead of grinding at that spot I'm just going to re-start the game).
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May 10, 2011 05:58
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Thanks guys. Looks like 1 is $6 on PSN so I will probably check that one out first. I mean, when PSN goes back up that is. Really wish they'd put Suikoden 2 on PSN or I'd never get to play it . . . so expensive. Seems like they would've done it by now if they were going to do it though. 
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May 10, 2011 06:14
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pandaK posted:"I'm going to buy a game where the whole point is to create your own image also I will buy this guide that will forgo all free will I could have in creating said image just to minmax the poo poo out of my anime character" Some people play RPGs for the stats rather than the storyline, or are happy to experiment with both options in turn. By the same token, some RPGs facilitate this much more. Neverwinter Nights is an RPG but the story is such a collection of fetch quests that I'd much rather check out whether you can viably go through the game as a Fighter/Bard/Red Dragon Disciple/Weapon Master. Either that, or they just want to know where all the sidequests are. (The answer is no because the drat game won't let you take 4 classes so I had to try Bard/RDD/WM and that just sucked in the early levels.) Lone Rogue posted:What are some of the good flash RPGs out there? Monster's Den: Book of Dread is about building a party of adventurers and just delving on down a dungeon looting and killing everything in your path. Strategic-ish turn-based battle system. It's basically the best flash RPG I've ever played. Epic Battle Fantasy 3 is a light-hearted parody of turn-based JRPGs with a very over-the-top graphical style. Probably don't touch it if you don't like the genre. It's pretty and long as gently caress but grindy. Arcuz is an action RPG that kind of straddles the Zelda / Ragnarok Online line. Never had time to play this fully but I've always been impressed with it. Elona Shooter is not technically an RPG, it's a defence shoot-em-up, but it's done by the same guy who did the roguelike of the same name and I'm including it because it's got a lot of skill and item management and because I regularly lose entire days to it.
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May 10, 2011 06:55
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JTDistortion posted:Uh oh. Judging from how much I have played Fire Emblem, this could be dangerous to my free time. There are things like item creation / magic creation / etc as well.
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May 10, 2011 07:07
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Nevermind.
Jesto fucked around with this message at 06:29 on Sep 12, 2014 |
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May 10, 2011 07:09
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Stelas posted:Some people play RPGs for the stats rather than the storyline, or are happy to experiment with both options in turn. By the same token, some RPGs facilitate this much more. Neverwinter Nights is an RPG but the story is such a collection of fetch quests that I'd much rather check out whether you can viably go through the game as a Fighter/Bard/Red Dragon Disciple/Weapon Master. Either that, or they just want to know where all the sidequests are. I do both, first playthrough is always blind with no assistance and later playthroughs are minmax grindouts.
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May 10, 2011 07:09
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Jesto posted:Make sure to play Suikoden 1 in it's entirety to get a save to load into Suikoden, though.  quote::shobon; I had more fun with it than I did in Suikoden 3. Suikoden 3 gets downright tedious at numerous points. That cave dungeon near the capital city with it's winding rooms, constantl trekking back and forth along those narrow mountain paths, the battle turns that took forever to go off from enemies spamming long skills or your characters running slowly across the field. Sure, the end of Suikoden 3 was good but it takes forever to get there. These are all more than fair complaints. I still think it's better than 80% of RPGs in general, though.
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May 10, 2011 07:20
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pandaK posted:I do both, first playthrough is always blind with no assistance and later playthroughs are minmax grindouts. Yeah, I just meant that I can see why people would want to buy a guide if they like experimenting with minmaxing and want the facts at their fingertips, or they just want to make sure they haven't missed anything. Unless Doc meant he can't understand why people buy them when there's a billion wikis online, but that's a whole other kettle of fish. e: vvvv I think Wikia fucks up the formatting everywhere. It's in their design principles or something. Stelas fucked around with this message at 07:28 on May 10, 2011 |
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May 10, 2011 07:22
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Sometimes you just want a pretty book with charts with data instead of having to look every page up online, especially if you don't have a laptop, tablet or smartphone (or a computer near where you play games). Hell, sometimes looking at wikis and guides on iPhone is annoying, especially how wikia fucks over the formatting on mobile. I've not bought a guide in forever but I understand the appeal, especially those Double Jump guides. I remember getting the Nocturne one and it was pretty ridiculous. Way better than those lovely Brady ones from the 90s. Remember when those guides were printed on black and white? Ugh. Anyways using guides with a tablet would be a huge use of an iPad if I were to ever get one. Not that I always rely on them, but sometimes it's nice to look over the part you already did just to make sure you didn't miss anything. Ice Blue fucked around with this message at 07:30 on May 10, 2011 |
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May 10, 2011 07:27
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Nevermind.
Jesto fucked around with this message at 06:30 on Sep 12, 2014 |
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May 10, 2011 07:32
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Swiss Army Knife posted:I've come to the realization recently that although I like RPGs, I really just enjoy having a nice storyline and don't actually care to be challenged by boss fights and such. I hate grinding most of the time, but there's a few games where I can tolerate it. I'm fine grinding for five hours if it means the rest of the game is a cakewalk. Basically, I want an interactive story. Any RPGs that have an excellent plot with fairly non-challenging gameplay? The only system off-limits for me is PS3. Alpha Protocol. It's short, which is great because the genius of that game is only really revealed after multiple playthroughs where seemingly insignificant choices end up revealing new plot points and betrayals and leaving you saying this loving game! But in a good way. Tag pistols, stealth and either Sabotage or Tech for your three tag skills and you'll be fine. I'd play it on the 360 because you need to do some tweaking to get it to run good on the PC. this thread is still going strong a YEAR after release!
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May 10, 2011 07:51
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I don't really enjoy games that gently caress you over with a bad/mediocre ending unless you do very specific things, which put me on a guide addict. I never want to go through a non-108 Suikoden V again. God drat it. And Ogre Battle 64. You saved the world. Get the gently caress out of the country because lol chaos frame never explained.
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May 10, 2011 07:52
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