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rotor posted:its sort of the equivalent of riding lawnmowers slowly over a decade becoming the standard mode of transportation with all this carlike poo poo crudely welded onto the sides and now your actual car can't drive on the tiny little roads and every time someone raves about some great feature of their new mower like "hey did you hear? the new model John Deeres have these lamps that let you safely drive in the dark so you don't have to carry a flashlight with you! they're called 'headlights!!!" you look back on your audi or lexus or whatever and die a little inside which particular things are you complaining about? like what browser plugin do you think should be a standalone app but isn't?
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Apr 28, 2012 05:20
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Inverse Icarus posted:which particular things are you complaining about? like what browser plugin do you think should be a standalone app but isn't? i dont think its about plugins; it's about browsers slowly, slowly, sloooowly gaining desktop app capabilities (why the gently caress are localStorage/indexedDB/file API/all storage solutions still loving TERRIBLE)
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Apr 28, 2012 05:22
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rotor posted:its sort of the equivalent of riding lawnmowers slowly over a decade becoming the standard mode of transportation with all this carlike poo poo crudely welded onto the sides and now your actual car can't drive on the tiny little roads and every time someone raves about some great feature of their new mower like "hey did you hear? the new model John Deeres have these lamps that let you safely drive in the dark so you don't have to carry a flashlight with you! they're called 'headlights!!!" you look back on your audi or lexus or whatever and die a little inside lol you sad old man. its more like how when cars were first invented farmers wanted to make people hide their cars in bushes whenever horses were going by. (you're the farmers)
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Apr 28, 2012 05:24
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Apr 28, 2012 05:25
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Teh boners
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rotor posted:its sort of the equivalent of riding lawnmowers slowly over a decade becoming the standard mode of transportation with all this carlike poo poo crudely welded onto the sides and now your actual car can't drive on the tiny little roads and every time someone raves about some great feature of their new mower like "hey did you hear? the new model John Deeres have these lamps that let you safely drive in the dark so you don't have to carry a flashlight with you! they're called 'headlights!!!" you look back on your audi or lexus or whatever and die a little inside
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Apr 28, 2012 05:25
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Tiny Bug Child posted:lol you sad old man. its more like how when cars were first invented farmers wanted to make people hide their cars in bushes whenever horses were going by. (you're the farmers) now i realize it. tbc is jeff atwood with a mean streak.
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Apr 28, 2012 05:26
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z0ratio fartboner posted:rotor and tbc wrestling cmon cmon
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Apr 28, 2012 05:28
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I guess if you have to do front end stuff the web sucks but that's why you don't do that. Just work on the cool and fun backend things and if someone tries to get you to debug some JS you go separation of concerns, BITCH and then do a 360 and walk off
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Apr 28, 2012 05:29
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Inverse Icarus posted:which particular things are you complaining about? like what browser plugin do you think should be a standalone app but isn't?
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Apr 28, 2012 05:31
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Nomnom Cookie posted:I guess if you have to do front end stuff the web sucks but that's why you don't do that. Just work on the cool and fun backend things and if someone tries to get you to debug some JS you go separation of concerns, BITCH and then do a 360 and walk off front-end dev stuff is fun as hell the most rewarding part of development is making poo poo look good and easy to use. obviously i got mad respect for backend dudes who make the poo poo fundamentally work, but i love doing the top layer because i love working on what users see and what defines their user experience 
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Apr 28, 2012 05:32
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Anal Tributary posted:
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Apr 28, 2012 05:34
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Anal Tributary posted:front-end dev stuff is fun as hell This is def. true. I decided to move away from the front-end because you end up at a pressure point between designers, lazy back-end dev (which I now am), project managers, QA who always blames you first, and customers who think you're in charge of a lot of stuff. It's a lot of pressure from a lot of people with little freedom of movement. Being a back-end dude is letting you a lot of leeway in what you do and nobody gets in your business trying to tell you what to do because they can barely see what's happening except 'does it work or not'. It's good fun.
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Apr 28, 2012 05:35
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Tiny Bug Child posted:like how
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Apr 28, 2012 05:37
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i've actually been doing a bunch of work on a build tool for Ember.js apps and i actually found the most enjoyable part being writing docs, because that's when it goes from "a silly little thing i write code for" to "a tool that other people can use" front-end dev works the same way
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Apr 28, 2012 05:39
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Anal Tributary posted:the most rewarding part of development is making poo poo look good and easy to use. obviously i got mad respect for backend dudes who make the poo poo fundamentally work, but i love doing the top layer because i love working on what users see and what defines their user experience good because i'm not gay and don't like colors
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Apr 28, 2012 05:41
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the login would look FAAAABULOOUS in a mauve
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Apr 28, 2012 14:07
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rotor posted:its sort of the equivalent of riding lawnmowers slowly over a decade becoming the standard mode of transportation with all this carlike poo poo crudely welded onto the sides and now your actual car can't drive on the tiny little roads and every time someone raves about some great feature of their new mower like "hey did you hear? the new model John Deeres have these lamps that let you safely drive in the dark so you don't have to carry a flashlight with you! they're called 'headlights!!!" you look back on your audi or lexus or whatever and die a little inside
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Apr 28, 2012 15:16
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browsers are the de facto application platform because like it or not, yospos. relying on users to install a thing? relying on users to update a thing? relying on users to configure a thing? there is no need to have a compiled apps for 99.999999999% of regular person computer activity. * rides lawnmower off into sunset *
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Apr 28, 2012 15:54
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passionate dongs posted:browsers are the de facto application platform because like it or not, yospos. Developing for HTML, CSS, and js means your poo poo works on every computer and every cell phone and every tablet today
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Apr 28, 2012 16:06
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BonzoESC posted:it's true
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Apr 28, 2012 16:19
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passionate dongs posted:there is no need to have a compiled apps for 99.999999999% of regular person computer activity. regular people only use CRUD applications
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Apr 28, 2012 16:20
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otoh who the heck wants to write shrinkwrap software
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Apr 28, 2012 16:24
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Otto Skorzeny posted:um thats still a lot more than 0
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Apr 28, 2012 16:25
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Anal Tributary posted:i dont think its about plugins; it's about browsers slowly, slowly, sloooowly gaining desktop app capabilities (why the gently caress are localStorage/indexedDB/file API/all storage solutions still loving TERRIBLE) Though to be honest, why even use those at all? All the best web apps have treated web apps as they should be treated: as thin clients that don't do anything more than manage the UI and call the server for everything else
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Apr 28, 2012 17:21
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passionate dongs posted:browsers are the de facto application platform because like it or not, yospos. these were all solved problems and your ignorance of history is sadly predictable. what killed desktop applications was security issues. it departments didn't want to be bothered with all these open ports and all these people installing these filthy applications on it's precious virginal computers.
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Apr 28, 2012 17:32
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rotor posted:these were all solved problems and your ignorance of history is sadly predictable. yeah i love how adobe and java handle updates!
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Apr 28, 2012 17:38
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rotor posted:these were all solved problems and your ignorance of history is sadly predictable. they were "solved" with lovely halfassed solutions. "gosh just <do arcane user-hostile procedure X>" is not really a solution when you can have the same thing by opening yr browser and going to a page
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Apr 28, 2012 17:40
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Inverse Icarus posted:yeah i love how adobe and java handle updates! don't make me angry, switchboy
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Apr 28, 2012 17:41
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Tiny Bug Child posted:they were "solved" with lovely halfassed solutions. "gosh just <do arcane user-hostile procedure X>" is not really a solution when you can have the same thing by opening yr browser and going to a page lol ok tbc sure man, sure
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Apr 28, 2012 17:42
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Tiny Bug Child posted:they were "solved" with lovely halfassed solutions. "gosh just <do arcane user-hostile procedure X>" is not really a solution when you can have the same thing by opening yr browser and going to a page *pats you on the head*
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Apr 28, 2012 17:42
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now run along & play you lil scamp
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Apr 28, 2012 17:43
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Tiny Bug Child posted:arcane user-hostile procedure mods, needful
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Apr 28, 2012 17:44
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Tiny Bug Child posted:they were "solved" with lovely halfassed solutions. "gosh just <do arcane user-hostile procedure X>" is not really a solution when you can have the same thing by opening yr browser and going to a page When was the last time you noticed an update in that
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Apr 28, 2012 17:45
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theres no reason that the language features from desktop apps cant be used in web apps. ex: replace javascript with byecode, replace html/css with xaml. you write whatever you want and it gets compiled to bytecode that gets sent to the client rather than the client downloading the source and compiling it in realtime which limits your language availability. then replace html + css w/ something like xaml and u've got dynamic UIs that are fed to the user over http. all the benefits of desktop apps, none of the shittyness of js/html/css.
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Apr 28, 2012 17:45
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My Linux Rig posted:chrome is a desktop app that has solved all those issues google had the experience from web apps to learn how to do it right!
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Apr 28, 2012 17:46
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Shaggar posted:theres no reason that the language features from desktop apps cant be used in web apps. ex: replace javascript with byecode, replace html/css with xaml. you write whatever you want and it gets compiled to bytecode that gets sent to the client rather than the client downloading the source and compiling it in realtime which limits your language availability. then replace html + css w/ something like xaml and u've got dynamic UIs that are fed to the user over http. all the benefits of desktop apps, none of the shittyness of js/html/css. this is the grossest post. ugh.
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Apr 28, 2012 17:47
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My Linux Rig posted:cause its javascript and everything has to be asynchronous bullshit actually localStorage is very much synchronous but i did some web sql stuff late 2010 when web sql was still a thing and urgh dark days, back then. dark days. it was the first javascript project i'd ever done and i'd never dealt with asynchronous/callback-based code, and it was before i'd discovered jquery, and basically i needed to scrape a shitload of web pages and save them into websql. so there were two layers of callbacks, and me trying to figure out how the gently caress to manage them ("wait you mean i can't just use a for loop? oh NOOOOOOo") quote:Though to be honest, why even use those at all? All the best web apps have treated web apps as they should be treated: as thin clients that don't do anything more than manage the UI and call the server for everything else nah, local storage solutions matter because they're going to bring web apps offline. which i guess pisses some people off, but whatever.
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Apr 28, 2012 17:56
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reminder that in the year 2012 people are literally excited about the following upcoming features of their development platform: * opening a socket * accelerated 3d rendering
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Apr 28, 2012 17:58
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i like many things, web apps included
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Apr 28, 2012 18:00
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i just wish they werent poo poo
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Apr 28, 2012 18:00
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