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1stGear posted:They aren't avoiding security, as I understand it. But if you build your ship right, you can kill your target before the security kills you. Since Goonswarm is already wealthy and has been planning for this event for a while, they can just eat the monetary loss. Ahhh, okay, so that is what the article is referring to with "spent time building up to this". Sounds like Goonswarm when quit for a while, built up a ton of ships that they could loose one after another, and then went to town on Juta.
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Apr 30, 2012 15:39
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^^^^ They just got done wiping another Alliance off the map, actually. EVIR Gibson posted:I want to know how they are killing in Jita without triggering the security force. They're usually using the wardec sytem on the people they gank, which afaik is basically paying a fee to have Concord ignore you when you attack an alliance in highsec. The great thing is that some of the allianes trying to fight them aren't doing the same thing, so when they try to fight the Goon hitsquads they just get slaughtered. They're getting close to $25k worth of losses and 10k dead ships in Jita alone. If EVE wasn't a terrible game I'd play it just to scam pubbies. I love being a dick in hands off sandboxes.
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Apr 30, 2012 15:56
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In WoW there is (or used to have) an area called Tol Barad where it is a skinning heaven where one can skin hundreds of dead crocs for leather thanks to the sheer amount of player traffic there. Naturally skinners flock there collecting leather from any dead croc they can find FFA style, except for a few idiots who think there's a code of honor this sort of thing and just stand there hurl insults at other players like me because the latter got to a dead croc first, instead of spending time to collect more leather. Thus I realized I don't even have to do anything to grief people; they actually spend effort to grief themselves, seriously.
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Apr 30, 2012 16:32
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BexGu posted:Okay, we need some one in Goonswarm here to explain it, because apparently Goonswarm is now trying to burn the largest trade hub to the ground in Eve Online. Oh man, this makes me wish I still played EVE. No way I'm resubbing during my thesis just to help burn Jita, though. EVIR Gibson posted:I want to know how they are killing in Jita without triggering the security force. I'm not sure that distracting CONCORD works any more, but even if it doesn't you pretty much have two options: - wardec the targets. This is tedious and expensive but lets you attack them with impunity. - charge in and start blasting. It takes a few seconds for CONCORD to hyper in, web/scram/neut you, and kill you; if your opening salvo is heavy enough you can destroy the target before CONCORD gets you. If the ships you're attacking with are cheap enough, the latter approach may even be cheaper in the long run; a lot of the ships in Jita are transports not really fitted for combat, and it doesn't take that much ISK to build a destroyer with a lot of big guns and no defences whatsoever.
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Apr 30, 2012 17:42
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freeforumuser posted:In WoW there is (or used to have) an area called Tol Barad where it is a skinning heaven where one can skin hundreds of dead crocs for leather thanks to the sheer amount of player traffic there. That being said, it's even easier to grief people who skin your crocs by just not looting them, or leaving loot on the bodies. I had someone following me one day skinning mobs that I was grinding on for a rare drop. He would afk for a bit a little ways away from me, I'd kill a few, then he'd go and skin all of them. When I decided to stop looting the mobs completely, he actually sent me a tell saying "can you loot those mobs? I want to skin them" as if I was his personal monster-killer. When I told him to gently caress off he, freaked out and called me a loser 
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Apr 30, 2012 17:52
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EVIR Gibson posted:I want to know how they are killing in Jita without triggering the security force. Goonswarm's philosophy has always included noob ships ganging up on big scary expensive ones. Ten noob ships outfitted with decent gear, all attacking as one, can usually take down something worth three or four times the combined amount of the cheap ships. If it fails, they can just grab a new ship (provided by the swarm), and if they succeed, they still get reimbursed, plus sweet pubbie tears.
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Apr 30, 2012 20:59
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PokeWarVeteran posted:Goonswarm's philosophy has always included noob ships ganging up on big scary expensive ones.
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Apr 30, 2012 21:16
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From the Aion thread: The white chat text is said by the NPC. Devs trolling their players~
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Apr 30, 2012 21:31
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GreenAcidRage posted:And there I spend my days happily getting xbox live messages calling me a human being. I remember playing WoW a couple of years ago and having lots of fun PvPing with a really overpowered hunter character. Hunters in WoW have pets and also are most powerful at ranged attacks, with the ability to do things like freezing an opponent or Damaging them Over Time. Basically playing in easy mode. Anyway, I was able at level 19 (the maximum level in the 10-19 level pvp instances) to have a level 60 friend help me get a gun rated for a level 35-40ish character as a reward for a level 40ish quest in an area with way too-dangerous-to-me critters. I basically grouped with her and followed her around cleaning up animals that could one-shot me. So I get this gun and max-level ammo, and can generally two-shot most magic using characters. Cue the opposite faction enemies getting on their alliance characters (no cross faction talk was allowed then) and cussing me out because if I couldn't kill them at one shot, my pet could. If they could last long enough for my pet to get too them at all. Lots of being called a cheater, a human being, a dirty twink, and other sundry names. It's no Fansy the Famous Bard, but it was fun griefing people within the "rules," even if I bent them pretty heavily in my favor.
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Apr 30, 2012 21:53
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Giggily posted:If EVE wasn't a terrible game I'd play it just to scam pubbies. I love being a dick in hands off sandboxes. I remember when I played EVE for awhile years ago, the Goon newbie guide actually recommended scamming pubbies as the fastest and most consistent way for a new player to make money. 
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Apr 30, 2012 23:02
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Here's the damage report for Burn Jita http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3447025&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=375#post403164152 The cost to just Goonswarm (because the guild actually reimbursed suicide ships for this event) was about 140 billion isk, assuming everyone who loses a ship bothers to apply for reimbursement. A PLEX is 500m isk, and is worth something like 15 or 20 real dollars. But we're incredibly space-rich from moon mining or something, so really just a drop in the bucket, and we're apparently one of the few nullsec guilds that doesn't RMT our space-gold or otherwise have ridiculous embezzlement from the leadership, so a lot of that money goes back into the guild for events and reimbursements and helping newbies. There used to be finance spreadsheets.  I don't know if i still have access to them since I haven't played in over a year, but the numbers were ridiculous.
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Apr 30, 2012 23:07
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 Part of me really, really wants to get into Eve and Goonswarm now. That poo poo is inspiring.
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Apr 30, 2012 23:39
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ToxicFrog posted:
It cannot possibly be the second option because the video shows the ships sitting around locking target after target for a good few minutes which would call the sec force twenty million times over. So to me it looks like it has to be option one and that is amazingly expensive! Tens of thousands of thrashers is one thing, wardecs on a a bunch of alliances is even crazier. Experience Level: I blew up mining ships for great Allah, praise him.
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May 1, 2012 00:06
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Malachite_Dragon posted:
It sounds cool when you read about it, but once you join you realise that you actually have to play EVE Online.
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May 1, 2012 00:07
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EVIR Gibson posted:It cannot possibly be the second option because the video shows the ships sitting around locking target after target for a good few minutes which would call the sec force twenty million times over. Considering that Goonswarm is building Titans on a weekly basis now I think wardecs and swarms of Thrashers aren't really a speck on their finances.
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May 1, 2012 00:09
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You really won't get to do much in Goonswarm from what I hear, more often than not you just end up on the bottom end of what is ultimately a Griefing Pyramid Scheme where everyone above you gets to have the most fun while you're stuck mining asteroids or suiciding with the cheapest ships they can provide for you.
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May 1, 2012 00:09
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FrancisYorkPatty posted:You really won't get to do much in Goonswarm from what I hear, more often than not you just end up on the bottom end of what is ultimately a Griefing Pyramid Scheme where everyone above you gets to have the most fun while you're stuck mining asteroids or suiciding with the cheapest ships they can provide for you. I don't know about now, but when I played everything you said was untrue. Goons using newbies to tackle was a strategy shift during the day. No one suspected that a days old character could actually shift the battle. After newbie tacklers came to be, PvP became less of a gentleman's battle where people just float in two blobs and lobbing shots back and forth and more "that newbie died but he died tackling a ship that was worth thousands of times more" Plus hoovering rat loot and salvaging was a great way to get money without mining.
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May 1, 2012 00:18
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TheRagamuffin posted:I seriously can't wait for this game to be out on PC, GFWL or no.
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May 1, 2012 02:03
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Shumagorath posted:It is going to have worse hacks than Diablo 1, mark my words. I have nothing but fond memories of hacking in Diablo, so that's entirely fine with me.
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May 1, 2012 02:24
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PokeWarVeteran posted:Goonswarm's philosophy has always included noob ships ganging up on big scary expensive ones. It should be noted that this person registered specifically to join goonfleet. They will never join goonfleet. Good grief.
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May 1, 2012 02:33
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EVIR Gibson posted:It cannot possibly be the second option because the video shows the ships sitting around locking target after target for a good few minutes which would call the sec force twenty million times over. Both things happened. There were a number of groups paying for wardecs to shoot at goons and friends. On the other hand most, if not all, of the freighter and jumpfreighter ganks were suicide missions. When the wardec mechanic changes it will be prohibitively expensive to wardec a large alliance like Goonswarm or TEST so the general population will be even more powerless to stop an attack like this.
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May 1, 2012 03:16
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FrancisYorkPatty posted:You really won't get to do much in Goonswarm from what I hear, more often than not you just end up on the bottom end of what is ultimately a Griefing Pyramid Scheme where everyone above you gets to have the most fun while you're stuck mining asteroids or suiciding with the cheapest ships they can provide for you. I joined and immediately started scamming, ultimately making over 4.5 billion isk using my silver tongue. I then bought a character and destroyed a corp from the inside out with it. I had been playing for three weeks.
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May 1, 2012 03:48
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GreenAcidRage posted:I joined and immediately started scamming, ultimately making over 4.5 billion isk using my silver tongue. I then bought a character and destroyed a corp from the inside out with it. I had been playing for three weeks. Yeah, newbie advice is generally to scam your way into a lot of isk and buy a better character, but if you can't do that, you can always hoover space junk or shoot things way bigger than you with ships you'll be given for free. When I first joined, I didn't even know what half the ships I was stealing off people were, I just said they were okay for part of a security deposit.
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May 1, 2012 03:52
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Reverence posted:I have nothing but fond memories of hacking in Diablo, so that's entirely fine with me. I never played the original, so please regale us with tales . Diablo 2 ones too if you got em! I understand Diablo-speak to an extent, far better than Dota or EVE.
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May 1, 2012 06:34
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Manuel Calavera posted:I never played the original, so please regale us with tales Oh god, Diablo 2 hacking. Back when I was a wee lad of 10 or so, I started playing online with a buddy (we'd play at his place, switching off, mostly. I was the only one who had a copy of the game). All the rage on open battle.net at the time was white/black items. For those of you who don't recognize this, these items were made in a hex editor, with their colors set to either pure white or pure black (which looked really cool), and with completely ludicrous stats on them. If you got a full set, you could attack 200 times per second, hitting for 300x as much damage as the final boss had life, while casting any of a number of spells on each swing, while being nigh-impossible to hit, and with so much health it'd cause a stack overflow. Now, as kids with no idea what a hex editor was, let alone how to use one, we wanted these items. We wanted them bad. So, we'd scour the list of game names for such gems as "free whites here!!!!!!" or "hacks inside," and pop in, begging for some of these stupidly broken items. Most of the time we didn't get any, occasionally we did, but a few times we got more than we'd bargained for. The hexed items could do way more than give you super buffs: you might change models, have your stats reduced, etc. One time in particular, we ran into a griefer, who, I can only assume, had gotten tired of these annoying as poo poo beggars. So, he made a game, and started handing out free hacked items. The items looked awesome, great stats, all of that, we couldn't believe our luck. I immediately equipped the item and admired how badass the character looked, then went off to kill poo poo with no challenge whatsoever. Or, at least, I tried to, but my character refused to move. No matter where I clicked, he just stood there. Then I saw my health globe, completely empty, sitting at 1 out of some ridiculously large number. I realized that the item must have been the cause, and tried to unequip it, but no dice, it was stuck harder than a cursed Amulet of Strangulation in Nethack. I started begging the guy in chat, pleading with him to tell me how to fix this, but he just laughed. Finally, he said "Just restart the game, the item will be gone." Relieved, I exited the game and restarted it, then went to load up my character. "Can't load save: general bad file" The item had corrupted my character's save file, making it impossible for me to use the character ever again (well, I could have fixed it with a hex editor, but again, I had no idea what that was). Bastard.
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May 1, 2012 06:58
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Manuel Calavera posted:I never played the original, so please regale us with tales The original Diablo was so buggy that some of the hacks weren't so much hacks as they were macroed glitches so you could do them faster than normal. Diablo 1 had a dupe that worked in multiplayer built right in that was a glitch. All I recall about it was that you had to drop two items, click one so your character started walking towards it then right before he picked it up, you grabbed the other one and tried to put it in one of your belt slots. Then you had one in your inventory and one on your cursor. The hacks were pretty much exclusively for griefing, and the only one I distinctly recall was the resurrection hack. There was a spell that let you resurrect dead players, and when you died (in general) you'd drop some of your gold and I think your items. So someone could hack the resurrection spell client-side so it would res you, THEN DAMAGE YOU, so you immediately died again. So they'd just chain res you 50 times in a second, murdering you each time you respawned so you could never abandon your body and they'd get all your gold and loot (which was usually incidental because they'd just use hacked or duped loot). Diablo 2 griefs varied greatly depending on when you played. Early on there was a spot in the wall of one of the buildings in Act 2 where if you dropped an item someone could grab the item through the wall, but it only worked one way. So someone would ask you to hold their super valuable awesome item but first they needed to do a trust test, where you'd go to A2 and you'd both drop items on the other side of the wall so you couldn't rip each other off. And it was in town, so you they couldn't PvP you. You'd both drop your items and then they'd just jank your poo poo through the wall, pick their item back up (or use auto-pickup on a bot) and leave. There were also glitches that would let you PvP without retribution in town, glitches that would let you lag out a game so bad you would crash it, or using specific ones only disconnect the players within a certain radius of you. That one was abusable with other "trust tests" to have someone drop their gear while you were seemingly far away from them, then lag them so bad they d/c and you can casually walk over and steal everything.
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May 1, 2012 07:42
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A long time ago in WoW my friend and I used to grief in Gadgetzan on our rogues. If you attack another player in town, you would get attacked by the guards, but since we were rogues, we could just vanish and the guards would stop attacking us and turn their attention on whoever we were fighting. It was also possible to chain sap people and gently caress with them for a while before diminishing returns & the guard aggro was fixed. It was so much fun. We'd gank people for hours and there was pretty much nothing anyone could do about it.
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May 1, 2012 08:36
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In pre 1.10 D2, after a well-geared character dies, spam cracked sashes and useless stuff all over the corpse, hoping the player picks up one of them. After which when they click their corpse it would mean juicy equipment spilling over the ground ripe for the taking. Fun if the player wasn't smart enough to simply save and exit when they saw the potential grief coming from a mile away.
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May 1, 2012 09:00
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Bloody Antlers posted:A long time ago in WoW my friend and I used to grief in Gadgetzan on our rogues. If you attack another player in town, you would get attacked by the guards, but since we were rogues, we could just vanish and the guards would stop attacking us and turn their attention on whoever we were fighting. Hunters could grief in Gadgetzan if they specced for extra range prior to BC. You could hide on the rooftops and shoot people (usually two shooting them with Aimed Shot + Arcane Shot) and the guards couldn't touch you because you were out of range. Later on, they increased the guard range and gave them an attack that forced knockback. This made it harder for hunters to grief people there but if you kept your back towards the nearest city wall you could get knocked over the exterior wall relatively reliably, at which point the guards would have to run all the way around to a gate then all the way back around to you and you could usually get out of range before they caught up to you again.
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May 1, 2012 09:11
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EVIR Gibson posted:It cannot possibly be the second option because the video shows the ships sitting around locking target after target for a good few minutes which would call the sec force twenty million times over. You can lock people and scan them with impunity.
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May 1, 2012 21:48
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I want to add in that the Burn Jita even the Goons did in EVE caused so much  amongst the normal boring people in the game. Just endless anger and cursing and gnashing of teeth. The sad groups of "pro PVPers" tried to form fleets of proud defenders to stop us bad bad peoploe but just ended up getting massacred. It was cute watching them work themselves up into a righteous fury only to have twice as many of us come up and make them  Another fun thing I didn't see mentioned is CCP (the devs) not only made no effort to stop us, they thought it was awesome. They were even nice enough to put the system on their 4.5Ghz Xeon* superserver to keep the lag down for us  (*EVE's code is still single threaded, though they're fixing this)
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May 1, 2012 23:43
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LethalGeek posted:I want to add in that the Burn Jita even the Goons did in EVE caused so much EVE bored me to tears, but I do love reading poo poo like this, and CCP is loving awesome for encouraging this kind of stuff.
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May 2, 2012 05:38
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One of my favorite griefs in WoW was to turn on PVP in the Sunwell Isle quest zone back in late BC and stand on top of one of the quest givers. I played a tauren, the biggest race in the game, so I pretty much covered the entire quest giver and kept spinning in circles so the opposing faction members could never get a good spot to click on him from under me. It was great, whenever one of them tried to click him they'd attack me which would piss off these super powerful guards that would proceed to paste them in 1 shot. So many angry tells those days .
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May 2, 2012 15:01
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So what are the long term consequences of this eve thing? Some people are making it sound like they're just killing some whiners. Others are talking like its going to crash the entire virtual economy.
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May 2, 2012 16:22
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Dr_Amazing posted:So what are the long term consequences of this eve thing? Some people are making it sound like they're just killing some whiners. Others are talking like its going to crash the entire virtual economy. Right now Goonswarm and their allies control something like 90% of the game's supply of some resource needed to build mining ships. They also have a campaign going that's led to the destruction of around 1500~ish of these ships in the last two days. So either they can starve everyone else of a supply of these resources, sell them for inflated prices, or laugh as they pay 120% market value to get them anyways. I believe their resource is also vital to the construction of almost any advanced item in the game. So yeah, the economy probably won't collapse, but they're certainly doing a great job in loving with it.
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May 2, 2012 16:30
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FrancisYorkPatty posted:You really won't get to do much in Goonswarm from what I hear, more often than not you just end up on the bottom end of what is ultimately a Griefing Pyramid Scheme where everyone above you gets to have the most fun while you're stuck mining asteroids or suiciding with the cheapest ships they can provide for you. From what I hear you don't know what the gently caress you're talking about. Burn Jita was amazing and open to all members who received reimbursements for everything they lost. I'm some dumb old vet who barely plays but I still get up to scamming all the goddamn time because it makes me a ton of cash for little to no effort.
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May 2, 2012 16:52
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Someone should compile a list of forum posts of people crying about Goonswarm. It'd probably be long, but I really get a kick out of people posting about how goons are ruining the game/the devs aren't doing enough to stop goons from ruining the game
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May 2, 2012 16:56
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RichterIX posted:Someone should compile a list of forum posts of people crying about Goonswarm. It'd probably be long, but I really get a kick out of people posting about how goons are ruining the game/the devs aren't doing enough to stop goons from ruining the game This already exists, it's called the official EVE forums.
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May 2, 2012 18:17
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RavenKrows posted:From what I hear you don't know what the gently caress you're talking about. poo poo, The Mittani even writes like a Machiavelli Prince on his reasons for guiding GoonSwarm in its actions: http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve/spymaster/78 quote:Why did we do it? The usual reasons were trotted out: revenge, celebration, petty griefing, market manipulations, conspiracy with CCP, real-life sociopathy, class warfare. The truth is that we did it because we could: we wanted to see what would happen to Jita if we hit it with all the organizational might of a nullsec bloc. How is a game this boring so fun to read about?
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May 2, 2012 18:20
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Yeah for real, every time EVE stuff gets posted I wish I could retire early and just spend the rest of my days being a space-dick and ruining people's virtual lives even though I know in practice it probably may not actually be that fun
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May 2, 2012 18:26
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