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Dr Snofeld posted:Oh my god that looks amazing. Something to consider when I have money at last, maybe.
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May 25, 2012 08:17
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I work for a sub contractor for NR to design new overhead contact lines for Great Eastern. I find it quite interesting what a mess it can be to work on those tracks/NR as most of my company works on projects in Switzerland. I travel mostly by train here and for all the faults it has I'm glad how it works, especially when I used public transport somewhere else (WTF do you mean DB, my train doesn't have a first class carriage?). As a side note, is it normal for companies in England to lay off most of the staff working on a project and then let them rehire for the same job? Because it's really grating on my nerves that the people I'm in contact with change every 6 months or so.
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May 25, 2012 09:45
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Bozza - have you done any work on/studied much on level crossings? It came up briefly in the UK
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May 25, 2012 15:17
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notaspy posted:I would love to take a bullet train from London to Beijing via India. How long would that take using modern trains? A week? Shame it'll never happen. I looked into what this might actually look like if there were bullet train lines capable of doing this route. The fastest bullet trains in Japan right now go about 199 mph, and with a reasonable route from London, passing through India, and on to Beijing, it would take about 47 hours 30 minutes nonstop at that top speed. A more direct route that doesn't pass through India would be 34 hours 30 minutes nonstop at that speed. Note to do this, would pretty much require thousands of miles of brand new or heavily upgraded routes to handle the speeds. You'd also not maintain the top speed all the way through, due to stops for major stations and possibly for border control purposes.
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May 25, 2012 15:34
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Install Gentoo posted:I looked into what this might actually look like if there were bullet train lines capable of doing this route. The fastest bullet trains in Japan right now go about 199 mph, and with a reasonable route from London, passing through India, and on to Beijing, it would take about 47 hours 30 minutes nonstop at that top speed. A more direct route that doesn't pass through India would be 34 hours 30 minutes nonstop at that speed. When the revolution happens this will be it's crowning achievement! So in super-duper future time a week return trip, almost like a land cruise.
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May 25, 2012 15:44
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Kerbtree posted:Bozza - have you done any work on/studied much on level crossings? It came up briefly in the UK Could do mini effortpost on Level Crossings if you like, there's lots of sorts that the average person doesn't really notice.
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May 25, 2012 15:52
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Bozza posted:Could do mini effortpost on Level Crossings if you like, there's lots of sorts that the average person doesn't really notice. Please use the one in Barnes as a case study, it's a nightmare getting stuck there for 15 minutes.
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May 25, 2012 16:02
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Install Gentoo posted:On this blog, the author describes her trip around the world, which includes traveling from Shanghai to Croatia by train, as well as Rome to London by train after an interval of travel by watercraft. I like the entry on London-Southampton which highlights that the ticket costs more than a first class ticket from Shanghai to Beijing 
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May 25, 2012 16:11
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Bozza posted:Could do mini effortpost on Level Crossings if you like, there's lots of sorts that the average person doesn't really notice. I would love to read every word that you have to say on the subject of level crossings.
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May 25, 2012 16:59
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Additionally, whats your take on this development: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/may/25/anarchists-claim-railway-signalling-bristol
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May 25, 2012 17:02
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Char posted:I would love to read every word that you have to say on the subject of level crossings. I literally have an entire book devoted to the history of level crossings. It's amazing, if a bit depressing since the "rulebook written in blood" maxim applies in a particularly strong and grizzly way for level crossings.
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May 25, 2012 17:31
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Bozza posted:Could do mini effortpost on Level Crossings if you like, there's lots of sorts that the average person doesn't really notice. That'd be fantastic.
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May 25, 2012 18:48
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Zero Gravitas posted:Additionally, whats your take on this development: The infrastructure is fail safe so this literally does nothing except delay trains. But it could so easily not be, and I don't think that this anarchist group really knows what they are doing. I spent 3 hours in the pissing rain once trying to reroute signalling circuits through spare cable cores because it is complicated poo poo and if you do it wrong you get Clapham Junction.
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May 25, 2012 20:38
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Bozza posted:I spent 3 hours in the pissing rain once trying to reroute signalling circuits through spare cable cores because it is complicated poo poo and if you do it wrong you get Clapham Junction. Sup rewiring Really Dangerous poo poo using semi-adequate existing infrastructure buddy! Turns out upgrading 50 year old process control systems is a right pain in the arse, who knew? My day job frequently involves pissing around with scruffy as hell prints from microfilm trying to work out if core 5 is 'pump start' or 'pump stop'. Annoyingly bad things would happen if that one went awry...
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May 25, 2012 20:43
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What do you do, Vando?
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May 25, 2012 20:58
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Nah, best thing about safety critical work is using the mega to give your mate an electric shock  I'm all for anarchist distruption, do whatever the gently caress you want, just cut the cable cleanly not burn the bastard cos you could get shorts. Hacksaw chaps, no fires required (and it's harder to find).
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May 25, 2012 20:59
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V. Illych L. posted:What do you do, Vando? I can't strictly say  Process control systems, safety interlocks, environment monitoring, that sort of thing.
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May 25, 2012 21:02
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^^ You should've left that post at the first sentence, combined with the avatar.
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May 25, 2012 21:22
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Orange Devil posted:^^ Historically I find this just makes people ask more questions 
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May 25, 2012 21:29
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I'm overly excited about this up-coming level-crossing effort-post.
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May 25, 2012 22:47
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Bozza, I have a question I've been wanting answered for about 15 years. In about 1994 or 95 I started noticing that station platforms had little white squares with what looked like a red slider in them just above the ballast. The best picture I can find of them is this: It's the thing down and to the left of the big yellow thing in the middle.  What are they?
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May 25, 2012 23:14
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Iohannes posted:Bozza, I have a question I've been wanting answered for about 15 years. In about 1994 or 95 I started noticing that station platforms had little white squares with what looked like a red slider in them just above the ballast. The best picture I can find of them is this: I only found this out recently myself - as far as I know, they record the track's vital statistics like cant and twist along with what should be the measurement from the red slidery thing to the track itself so that someone can come along and check it from time to time. Keeping these measurements strict is obviously rather important near platforms where slight errors can (and do) result in nasty scrapes.
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May 26, 2012 00:27
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Holy poo poo thanks for that, always wondered.
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May 26, 2012 00:34
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Jonnty posted:I only found this out recently myself - as far as I know, they record the track's vital statistics like cant and twist along with what should be the measurement from the red slidery thing to the track itself so that someone can come along and check it from time to time. Keeping these measurements strict is obviously rather important near platforms where slight errors can (and do) result in nasty scrapes. Cool. Thanks Jonnty
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May 26, 2012 01:46
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Jonnty posted:I only found this out recently myself - as far as I know, they record the track's vital statistics like cant and twist along with what should be the measurement from the red slidery thing to the track itself so that someone can come along and check it from time to time. Keeping these measurements strict is obviously rather important near platforms where slight errors can (and do) result in nasty scrapes.  Spot on. It's called a datum plate. (text shamelessly stolen from some website I had written in some lecture notes) A datum plate identified as chainage point number (C.P.N°) 58. The letters "DN" (on a red background) denote that the information on the plate relates to the Down line. "Offset" is the horizontal distance from the plate to the running edge ("R.E.") of the nearest rail of the relevant track, in this case 2915 mm. The track is canted at 35 mm. The top of the movable slider block is normally set at the level of the nearest rail. If it is necessary to fix the datum plate at a higher level than the track, the number above the slider block indicates the difference in height between the rail head and the slider block (300 mm in the example illustrated). A red slider block means that the data on the plate refers to the actual position of the track at the time when the datum plate was installed. A green block denotes a track design position, to which the track should be returned in the event of it moving out of alignment.
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May 26, 2012 09:31
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As an interesting aside. I got leafleted by the RMT as part of an TUC/Rail Union day of action. May just have to go to the meeting on Thursday! http://www.rmt.org.uk/Templates/Internal.asp?NodeID=159286&int1stParentNodeID=89731&int2ndParentNodeID=89763
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May 28, 2012 09:52
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Bozza posted:Nah, but Maidenhead Station is my baby, been working on the layout on and off since I started in design (so about 4 years) from concept to approval in principle/ready for detailed design phase. "layout" meaning everything but the basic architecture, right? Interested because I work in Maidenhead twice a week, and have a bunch of questions about the station architecture where things don't make sense to me. Also, I thought stations were owned / controlled by the franchisee (First in this case) rather than Network Rail itself. Also, this goes all the way back to the first page, but people who talk up the "amazing" train service in Japan have never used it during rush hour / used one of the "private" lines (because JR was privatised a while back now, and the Tokyo Metro more recently.) - on the Odakyu line, the "wrong" sort of rain, delaying trains by easily 10 or 15 minutes in any sort of rain, and on the Tokaido line, the main fast link from the south, through Yokohama, into Tokyo, I regularly saw trains an hour or two late. When JR trains are late they stop displaying the time they should have been in, which I suppose makes them seem less bad. ookiimarukochan fucked around with this message at 11:08 on May 28, 2012 |
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May 28, 2012 10:57
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ookiimarukochan posted:"layout" meaning everything but the basic architecture, right? The "Major Stations" (things like Manc Piccadilly, Leeds, London terminals, Edinburgh, etc) are NR controlled, everything else is franchisee controlled.
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May 28, 2012 11:15
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ookiimarukochan posted:Also, this goes all the way back to the first page, but people who talk up the "amazing" train service in Japan have never used it during rush hour / used one of the "private" lines (because JR was privatised a while back now, and the Tokyo Metro more recently.) - on the Odakyu line, the "wrong" sort of rain, delaying trains by easily 10 or 15 minutes in any sort of rain, and on the Tokaido line, the main fast link from the south, through Yokohama, into Tokyo, I regularly saw trains an hour or two late. When JR trains are late they stop displaying the time they should have been in, which I suppose makes them seem less bad. When I lived over in Japan I had no problems whatsoever with the privately owned Tobu line granted this was a few years ago but the private lines still seem subject to some severe requirements. But like many things, "your mileage may vary"
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May 28, 2012 13:31
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Venmoch posted:As an interesting aside. I got leafleted by the RMT as part of an TUC/Rail Union day of action. May just have to go to the meeting on Thursday! What city are you in? Only say that because I was doing some of the leafleting in Birmingham alongside the RMT guys.
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May 28, 2012 14:31
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Antinumeric posted:What advantages to broader gauges actually have? Was Brunel's thing about a smoother ride actually a thing?
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May 28, 2012 14:54
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Larger carriages (ie an increase in loading gauge) doesn't necessarily require an increase in track gauge (compare a deep level tube train which will be less than 2.7m wide, to an american passenger train of width 3.2m). Broader gauge obviously increases the theoretical upper limit and trains will generally be larger -Russian trains which have widths of 3.6m -but the largest loading gauges of the world are actually standard gauge, such as the Channel Tunnel (4.1m). The main problem with crowding on British trains is the height anyway, making it so we will never have double-decker trains outside of High Speed. Brunel mainly advocated his ludicriously large gauge of 7ft for the stability and speed benefits. In the early days of rail this was a much easier method of achieving relatively high levels of comfort and speed than the design of the trains and carriages themselves. The disadvantages are mainly the initial costs of the building a railway that much wider, since over long distances that adds up to alot more earthwork, and an inability to turn tight corners. Also when Brunel introduced his gauge there was already a significant amount of standard gauge track everywhere else. No matter how advantgeous broad guage may be, a standard gauge throughout the country is better overall, even if it is narrower. Broad gauge makes stability and high speed easier, but that really isn't a barrier of standard gauge these days. In Spain/Portgual where there is the Iberian gauge for their normal speed lines, their new high-speed network is the smaller standard gauge for reasons of international connections. nozz fucked around with this message at 16:16 on May 28, 2012 |
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May 28, 2012 16:00
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Thundercloud posted:What city are you in? Charming and wonderful Southend-On-Sea! (No sniggering at the back! The combined cost of rent and travel is cheaper than living in East London. My flat is larger than its London equivalent and I get to live ten minutes from the sea. Plus the c2c is one of the best run lines in the UK at the moment.)
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May 28, 2012 16:25
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Gat posted:Larger carriages (ie an increase in loading gauge) doesn't necessarily require an increase in track gauge (compare a deep level tube train which will be less than 2.7m wide, to an american passenger train of width 3.2m). Broader gauge obviously increases the theoretical upper limit and trains will generally be larger -Russian trains which have widths of 3.6m -but the largest loading gauges of the world are actually standard gauge, such as the Channel Tunnel (4.1m). The main problem with crowding on British trains is the height anyway, making it so we will never have double-decker trains outside of High Speed. What are the height limits like anyway (outside of the obviously low deep level tubes)? Over here in the NYC area, they've been able to squeeze doubledecker train cars into only 14 foot 6 inches high to fit the century old river tunnels.
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May 28, 2012 18:48
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Wikipedia is only slightly unhelpful http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loading_gauge#Great_Britain writing about the size of things that can be carried but not the total dimensions.
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May 28, 2012 19:35
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Install Gentoo posted:What are the height limits like anyway (outside of the obviously low deep level tubes)? Over here in the NYC area, they've been able to squeeze doubledecker train cars into only 14 foot 6 inches high to fit the century old river tunnels. I think most lines in the UK have a limit of well under 4m, though core freight routes are being heightened a bit so containers can use them. The loading gauge for the sub-surface underground is actually slightly larger than the standard british loading gauge. Generally we are talking around closer to 13 feet than 14 feet though. This site has some info: http://www.btinternet.com/~joyce.whitchurch/gauges/text.htm We did try to do double deck once: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SR_Class_4DD 
nozz fucked around with this message at 19:58 on May 28, 2012 |
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May 28, 2012 19:53
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W6/W8 gauge are pretty much the standard in the UK which is 3 and a bit metres to 2 and a bit metres (think it's 3.5 x 2.5 but not really my thing). I know they just spent a ton of money on making the route from Southampton W10 gauge for shipping containers. I believe I saw a figure quoted somewhere that the average cost of increasing loading gauge is ~£3k per mm per metre... edit: it may have been £3k per mm per km but I can't find the reference right now
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May 28, 2012 20:34
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The trains on the Glasgow Subway are loving tiny. Wiki tells me the tunnels are only 11 foot in diameter so presumably by the time you take an arc off that for the rails to sit on and include the height of the rail themself youre only left with like 7 foot of headroom for the whole train to the middle of the carriage. The Glasgow subway is generally in desperate need of a complete overhall, half the stations are essentially abandoned now, particularly on the south side where the factories have closed and it doesn service the east end or the majority of argyll street at all. They are currently doing quite a bit of work to the stations as there is only disabled access to like 3 of the stations and quite a few dont even have escalators. Still though for £1.20 to any station its pretty cheap and just about does a job.
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May 29, 2012 00:44
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Bozza posted:I believe I saw a figure quoted somewhere that the average cost of increasing loading gauge is ~£3k per mm per metre... I can see you hold no financial responsibility at your job...
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May 29, 2012 01:00
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Ras Het posted:I can see you hold no financial responsibility at your job... Or, more likely, that gauge clearance isn't what he happens to work on?
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May 29, 2012 04:10
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