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The Locator posted:Wake up, train thread! Vids like that always remind me that 'london fog' used to be a real thing. Look at that black coal smoke, and imagine it multiplied by a million. Unreal.
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Jul 18, 2012 09:04
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That video is sexy as hell. Yeah, shame about the smoke and soot these beautiful machines used to dump into the air. I guess it's just smoke and soot though. Has anyone ever done a serious comparison of the emissions of external and internal combustion locomotives per loaded kilometer or anything like that?
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Jul 18, 2012 18:09
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Pictures of that 5942 dark territory accident. Cant believe no one was seriously injured. http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/Locopicture.aspx?id=60760
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Jul 18, 2012 20:41
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Frag Viper posted:Pictures of that 5942 dark territory accident. Cant believe no one was seriously injured. For those who do not know this crash http://www.outlawperformance.com/movies/cactus-texas-dark_territory-wreck.htm B4Ctom1 fucked around with this message at 20:49 on Jul 18, 2012 |
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Jul 18, 2012 20:46
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B4Ctom1 posted:For those who do not know this crash How the hell did they survive that with only minor injuries?
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Jul 18, 2012 22:27
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 Out of the two train wreck videos I've seen this one's probably the worst. (The other was of a train hitting another one coming in the opposite direction because the driver failed to notice a red signal)
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Jul 18, 2012 22:43
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Zeether posted:
That head on one was nuts, esp seeing the engineer jump out of the cab. This one I think was the scariest looking. Tornado derails the train and you see the a tanker and the rest of it barreling towards you. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WADnriWzJes
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Jul 18, 2012 22:49
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Cygni posted:Vids like that always remind me that 'london fog' used to be a real thing. Look at that black coal smoke, and imagine it multiplied by a million. Unreal. I spent some time earlier this month in and out of a handful of stations (Paddington, King's Cross, and St. Pancras in London, and Waverley in Edinburgh) and it's amazing how beautiful and how wasted the high ceilings are with modern trains.  King's Cross  Newcastle  The Governor's House on the way out of Waverley
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Jul 18, 2012 23:26
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Think about how gross looking up and just seeing... smog in those stations would be. To the poster who posted about emissions - I guarantee that clean burning modern diesels are orders of magnitude better for the environment than steam powered locos. Think about the incredible quantities of mercury and other toxic metals which are released by coal-burning power plants, even with emissions control devices.
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Jul 19, 2012 02:07
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Frag Viper posted:Pictures of that 5942 dark territory accident. Cant believe no one was seriously injured. They rebuilt it? 
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Jul 19, 2012 04:01
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FatCow posted:They rebuilt it? They must have one SERUOUS frame-bender... 
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Jul 19, 2012 04:55
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:To the poster who posted about emissions - I guarantee that clean burning modern diesels are orders of magnitude better for the environment than steam powered locos. Think about the incredible quantities of mercury and other toxic metals which are released by coal-burning power plants, even with emissions control devices. Also considering steam is vented to atmosphere with each cycle of the pistons (which are driven by steam on both the up and down stroke) they're incredibly inefficient - cold water is continuously being added to the boiler to replace what is lost.
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Jul 19, 2012 06:23
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:Think about how gross looking up and just seeing... smog in those stations would be. Yeah, absolutely true. How about the oil burners and diesel burners that were used later on? Oh, and believe me, I know they're not efficient in the slightest.
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Jul 19, 2012 19:52
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Sponge! posted:They must have one SERUOUS frame-bender... Or, a locomotive pulling in the opposite direction. I'd like to see that.
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Jul 19, 2012 20:21
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I'd love to see the frame bender they used.spipedong posted:I literally have an e-waste box full of HT600's an HT1000's - no 2000's though. B4Ctom1 posted:I have seen this before where 3 locomotives were doing it at the same time. Still happens from time to time on a single locomotive but you won't see it as often what causes this? Extremely rich exhaust plus a spark in the wrong place or something?
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Jul 21, 2012 17:49
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kastein posted:what causes this? Extremely rich exhaust plus a spark in the wrong place or something? Shot turbocharger, most likely. The engine is dumping huge amounts of fuel it's not able to burn it all with the available air. Sometimes little pockets of fuel are getting out that can still burn. (I can go into more detail if you're really interested... But it borders on wall of text.) And yes, HT1000's are worth lots of money for ham folk. I used to have one. I couldn't resist selling it due to how much it was worth!
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Jul 22, 2012 01:49
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Nerobro posted:(I can go into more detail if you're really interested... But it borders on wall of text.)
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Jul 22, 2012 08:04
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Wife showed me this link thismorning. It happened near where she grew up http://www.cibolabeacon.com/news/breaking_news/train-derailment-near-thoreau/article_70cd490c-e36e-11e1-b8e9-0019bb2963f4.html
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Aug 11, 2012 15:48
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This happened to me recently. It was on my second locomotive. I was transitioning from braking to power. Something caught my eye in the side view mirror. A great deal of black (unburned fuel) smoke. I also noticed that the access panels were twisted. (this is the view from the mirror without the smoke) So I stopped the train and stepped out the back door to head to the other locomotive to shut it down. I noticed how bad the panel door was twisted and how badly the handrails were bent outward. I went upwind of the smoke, avoiding the walkway for safety, walked all the way around to the front door and hit the fuel cutoff.   Once it was dead I could safely assess the damage. When I shut it down it wasn't even making any "expensive" sounds. Sounded like it was idling normally. The smoke had even begun to clear a little as it idled down when we stopped.   Honestly I think it was just a crankcase vapor ignition. Might have been caused by some sort failure to keep combustion out of the crankcase. Other than the cabinet doors, the only visible damage was the missing sheet metal inspection/access hatch.  I manhandled and tweaked the heavy 100 pound (45Kg) each doors back close enough to snap a few of the hasps closed. Reported it to the mechanical desk, dropped the breakers, and tagged/locked-out the fuel cut with a warning to my fellow Engineers "don't even think about starting this locomotive!"  The mechanical guy I talked to said that as long as the crankcase was open like that, the thing would have continued to smoke badly from all the extra unburned fuel out the stack because it could not make any boost pressure.
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Aug 11, 2012 16:11
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Again, the newer 8000's just suck at life. I wish I shot a photo of the Switch engine that show oil out the stack all over the side of it. Pretty drat bad rear end.
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Aug 11, 2012 20:46
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Slung Blade posted:That video is sexy as hell. I would imagine that the steam locomotives put out a lot more Bad Stuff than the diesels however what you saw in that video was engineers showing off for railfans. Any real steam railroad that let their engineers throw unburnt fuel out the stacks like that wouldn't have stayed in business very long. It still happened when locomotives were working hard up-grade and it was difficult to keep the correct amount of coal evenly distributed on the grates but a steam engine running properly doesn't put out huge black clouds like that.
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Aug 12, 2012 00:36
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When we were in Skagway in May we happened to be next to the yards when the Mikado hooked up to the passenger cars for our trip. Every little bump of the throttle sent a short black cloud into the air - and then it rained bunker fuel for a few seconds.
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Aug 12, 2012 02:21
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BrokenKnucklez posted:Again, the newer 8000's just suck at life. What are you talking about? That is clearly an EMD SD70ACe. A bit of trivia. The reason the doors are so heavy is because the railroads demand flat real estate for their logos on the hatch. The doors could be made lighter if they could have stamped structural shapes. Get ready for that space to become much tighter. EMD will be putting their aftertreatment system on top of the engine hatch for tier 4.  picture from patent
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Aug 13, 2012 16:44
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Giblet Plus! posted:What are you talking about? That is clearly an EMD SD70ACe. Wait...is this basically a big catalytic converter or blue-tec system?
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Aug 13, 2012 17:20
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Giblet Plus! posted:What are you talking about? That is clearly an EMD SD70ACe. Sorry, the UP numbers the newer ACes in the 8000's. And yes, they still suck at life. The cabs rattle worse than most 90's eras GM cars, they don't load very well, they can't hold the rail (meaning traction wise) and for some reason, they have the most obnoxious horn on the face of the planet.
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Aug 13, 2012 17:41
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CommieGIR posted:Wait...is this basically a big catalytic converter or blue-tec system? WO2012/044731A2[/quote posted:FIG. 2C is a system diagram of a control system for a two-stroke diesel having an exhaust aftertreatment system including a NOX reduction system and a filtration system. So, both. Here's one of the patents: http://www.google.com/patents?id=88ALAgAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4#v=onepage&q&f=true You can see they may also be using electric-pumped egr: 
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Aug 13, 2012 17:44
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BrokenKnucklez posted:Sorry, the UP numbers the newer ACes in the 8000's. And yes, they still suck at life. The cabs rattle worse than most 90's eras GM cars, they don't load very well, they can't hold the rail (meaning traction wise) and for some reason, they have the most obnoxious horn on the face of the planet. Sorry, didn't realize you were a foamer. Nobody else cares about locomotive numbers. Your complaint about not "holding the rail well" is incorrect. In CSX tests, similarly setup locomotives from both manufacturers generated the same TE numbers. Your concern about the nathan horn is personal preference only. Their cab isolation system is garbage. The limiters for its travel are removed from the rest of the suspension of the cab, and they do not always line up as they should. Additionally, the links locating the cab over constrain its motion and cause binding if not manually adjusted. Making matters worse, the cab is trimmed with the equivalent quality of a school bus, providing lots of material for BSR (buzz squeaks and rattles). They have a working engine isolation system that removes the need for the cab isolation. It has been tested on an SD60M. Giblet Plus! fucked around with this message at 17:58 on Aug 13, 2012 |
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Aug 13, 2012 17:54
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Giblet Plus! posted:Sorry, didn't realize you were a foamer. Nobody else cares about locomotive numbers. I actually work for the Union Pacific. I don't know where your getting foamer from. I just call them newer 8000's because that's the numbers. Actually all the 8000s are garbage. The lower numbered ones are poo poo as well, same problems, poor loading and the truck hunting is terrible. Plus the horn being louder than all get out is annoying for us smokers that like to have the windows open. All these new EMD products suck.
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Aug 13, 2012 18:01
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BrokenKnucklez posted:I actually work for the Union Pacific. I don't know where your getting foamer from. I just call them newer 8000's because that's the numbers. Actually all the 8000s are garbage. The lower numbered ones are poo poo as well, same problems, poor loading and the truck hunting is terrible. Radial or standard truck? What's the wheel profile look like? Do the shocks get warm after use? It's quite possible something is wrong with the software on the em2000. Their software group is a mess. They often create new problems when fixing existing problems, due to poor testing of their releases. The em2000 is so old that they can't find anyone to build the processor for them anymore.
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Aug 13, 2012 18:09
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I don't know for sure. Next time I go into work, I will take a look, but I have no idea what I am looking for. Though I do like the software that is used for the Distributed Power set up. Feels easier to use and set up a fence or un-fence the consist. The abomination that GE uses just sucks.
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Aug 13, 2012 18:21
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BrokenKnucklez posted:I don't know for sure. Next time I go into work, I will take a look, but I have no idea what I am looking for. This is the HTCR-4 radial truck. It has two additional steering arms, to which the front and rear axles are attached via torque rods. It can generate more TE on curves with less wear on the rail / wheel interface, but is more prone to hunting.  The HTSC-2 is their standard truck. The profile of the wheels, and rail, contributes to truck hunting. The wheelsets negotiate turns by climbing the outer wheel up onto the large part of the profile near the flange, and letting the inner wheel fall to the smaller diameter of the outer wheel. This works like the differential on a car to allow different speeds on the inside and outside rails. When the profiles do not line up as they should, the balance of lateral force between the two wheels becomes unstable, and the truck hunting resonance occurs as the wheelset shifts from side to side, shaking the whole truck about its rotational axis. This phenomena cannot be completely removed from the design, which is where the shocks come in. They provide resistance to the hunting movement, and any other fast motion. As they work, their inner fluid heats up. If they are broken, the fluid will not heat up and they will not be warm after use. 
Giblet Plus! fucked around with this message at 18:53 on Aug 13, 2012 |
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Aug 13, 2012 18:47
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and you're calling him a foamer?
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Aug 13, 2012 19:11
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Das Volk posted:
that would be the joke, yes?
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Aug 13, 2012 19:46
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Well, I was called in.... 27,000 tons, roughly 2.75 miles long, 6 units in 3x1x2. That makes for 26,400 HP, all AC traction motored units. Its going to be a fun night... Blech. I do have a unit that is a notorious truck hunter, so I will take a look and see if its that HTCR 4. But the way the UP maintains their equipment, I wouldn't be shocked if the shocks are completely shot. For a machine that costs around 2.5 million dollars, they would take a little better care of them.
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Aug 13, 2012 20:17
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joat mon posted:Yes, please. Sorry, missed that. Lets talk diesel. But first, lets talk burning. Fire takes place at the interface of fuel, oxygen, and heat, and free radicals. The heat vaporizes more fuel, that fuel mixes with more oxygen.. etc.. I suspect we've all watched a match burn. This is important, as a match, or more directly, a flamethrower, is what you have inside a diesel. In a gasoline engine, your engine ingests fuel and air. A (hopefully) homogeneous mixture, that will burn throughout. If you've ever put a match to a puddle of gasoline or other aromatic hydrocarbon on the ground, you'll remember that "whoosh" as the flame front crosses the puddle. That, is what happens inside a gasoline engine. It's not an explosion, but a whoosh. Due to compression, it happens a lot faster than the puddle of carb cleaner on the ground, but the effect is the same. Usually in a car, they put in just enough fuel so that you get the whoosh, and nothing more. If you're VERY rich on a gas engine, you get black soot out of it too. What happens inside a diesel engine is a little different. The flame in a diesel can only burn what oxygen is near it. Since the flamethrower analogy is more apt, we'll stick with that. If you've ever shot an aerosol can over a lighter, you know the effect. You'll notice that it doesn't all burn "right away." A lot of the fuel gets a few feet down the line, and is still burning. It's still burning a few feet away from you, because it can't find the oxygen to burn immediately. That's also why diesels have a practical limit somewhere less than 5200rpm. (Though Gale Banks is trying to fix that...) The diesel injector works just like that aerosol can. It shoots a spray of fuel into the combustion chamber. If all that fuel reaches oxygen, it all burns. Cleanly, and without smoke. As it turns out, due to spray patterns, and physics means only roughly 1/3 of the air volume in a diesel is available to be burned. Places near the nozzle, squish area, space above the ring lands.. are all space where air is compressed, but you can't get fuel to. That's where superchargers and turbochargers come into play. By packing more air into the engine, you can burn more fuel. That's really how it works. Diesels also get the benefits of higher chamber pressures and compression ratios at low (ish) throttle settings. Getting back to the flames coming out of the locomotive. If the engine lost boost, it's still pumping in fuel for boost conditions. Potentially three times as much fuel as the engine, naturally aspirated, can handle. This means some of fuel is burning, but most of it is just undergoing some nasty chemical changes, producing massive amounts of carbon and other compounds. Many of which are volatile and are still hot. When they reach air, you get flames!
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Aug 13, 2012 20:27
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I went out today and I saw one of Freightliner's new(ish) Class 70s while I was waiting for my train, and oh boy do GE make a gently caress ugly locomotive. Then when I was trying to figure out what the hell the abomination I'd seen, I discovered that when they were unloading them from the ship they're bought here in, they, err, dropped one.   Also another one caught fire, oh well they are only 3 years old.
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Aug 14, 2012 00:45
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They have a lot of potential, due to the GE individual axle AC technology. They should be a lot better for the operators, with much quieter cabs than the JT42CWRM, due to the isolated medium speed diesel, which was a new design. The ugly cab front is due to the design of the energy absorbing, anti climb, structure, which should be a very good thing for operator safety in a crash.
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Aug 14, 2012 01:12
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because the most important thing about a locomotive is how it looks
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Aug 14, 2012 02:06
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Can someone enlighten what a foamer is?
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Aug 14, 2012 11:59
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Cat Terrist posted:Can someone enlighten what a foamer is? One of those guys that stands next to the tracks taking pictures of trains, crying, and foaming at the mouth. It's like a furry but with roundabouts.
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Aug 14, 2012 12:01
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