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Dr Christmas posted:I guess I'm just freaking out that the message of the largest protest in recent memory was "God hates Fags." I thought we were moving past this We are but that doesn't mean small-minded people won't kick and scream and drag their feet the entire way.
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Aug 3, 2012 12:04
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I think we still are. I'd like to think that we're witnessing the last, thrashing paroxysms of a dying beast.
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Aug 3, 2012 13:32
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It's bizarre that people are able to say in the same paragraph that Cathy has the right of free speech to donate tons of money to anti-gay organizations but Joe Schmoe is being mean and unreasonable by not buying fast food based on that. Also didn't Chick-Fil-A do crazy business last Wednesday making the whole "we're being persecuted for our beliefs" stuff kinda off?
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Aug 3, 2012 14:03
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Radish posted:It's bizarre that people are able to say in the same paragraph that Cathy has the right of free speech to donate tons of money to anti-gay organizations but Joe Schmoe is being mean and unreasonable by not buying fast food based on that. They're simultaneously surrounded and surrounding, duh
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Aug 3, 2012 14:45
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Iceberg-Slim posted:I think it's meant as a rebuttal, to post to people who mindlessly forward these types of things. It's also the hilarious reductio ad absurdum result of trying to compare sovereign debt to Tina's AMEX. Right, I was going for two things in it. (By the way, thanks Dr. Christmas for the idea). 1) Its a response to conservatives who claim Bush's fiscal policy was bad, but that the Republicans' current plan championed by Romney is a good idea. They want to have everyone make huge sacrifices, while also increasing military spending significantly and making huge cuts to the Government's income. And we're supposed to just trust them that its going to work this time. Its the same drat thing they supposedly didn't like about Bush! 2) Also, the sacrifices being made were supposed to start out almost being reasonable, and get increasingly absurd until eventually you have a husband who knows his family is in financial trouble asking for a pay cut, and going on a spending binge to buy another armored vehicle, a bunch of guns, and a boat; all while wanting to spend more on their home security system that is already at down right absurd levels. Families don't operate at all like this; but the Government does have to choose between buying more tanks or paying for Grandma's medicine. The analogy of family budget = government budget is stupid because in order for a family's budget to even resemble the government's they'd have to be spending money in a way that is completely unrealistic for a family. Kugyou no Tenshi posted:4. The boycott is not just about what Dan Cathy said, it's also about the millions of dollars that have been funneled through WinShape into anti-SSM and anti-gay groups like Exodus International, the Family Research Council, and the Marriage & Family Foundation. Exactly. If you're getting into arguments with people over the Chick-Fil-A boycott, the key point to make is that it has nothing to do with Cathy's right to free speech. He can believe whatever he wants, and talk about it all he wants, and I'll still eat there. I can't stop buying stuff from every company that is run by someone who I don't agree with 100%, if I did, I couldn't ever buy anything ever again. But the issue wasn't Dan Cathy saying in an interview, "I disagree with gay marriage, but Chick-Fil-A has no policies regarding it." He came out and said that it was Chick-Fil-A's policy to only support "traditional marriage". He even made the point that Chick-Fil-A's are only owned by "traditional families", except for a couple that are owned by single parents. If you're in a same-sex relationship and want to start a business, Chick-Fil-A does not want you. That's the company policy, not Cathy's speech. What's more, Chick-Fil-A the company, not Dan Cathy the individual, has donated over $3M in the past few years to groups that actively fight to restrict the rights of LBGT individuals. The issue isn't Dan Cathy's Free Speech, it's Chick-Fil-A's policies. I really think that point is the most important. But the idea that my free speech (boycott) is in no way limiting Cathy's is a good one, too. And also that cities and towns routinely decide what kinds of businesses they allow within their limits. Pornography is protected free speech, but I can't open an adult bookstore anywhere I want to. Both are excellent points, but the most important is to clarify the difference between Cathy's free speech and Chick-Fil-A's company policies. If you don't do this, it's just going to be "you want to stifle free speech", no matter what other reasonable points you make. andrew smash posted:We are but that doesn't mean small-minded people won't kick and scream and drag their feet the entire way. Yep. They may have gotten huge support, but they really are on the wrong side of history. Things will inevitably continue to move towards equal rights, and in 50 years we'll look back on this the same way we currently view people turning out to support segregation in 1962. Sarion fucked around with this message at 14:52 on Aug 3, 2012 |
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Aug 3, 2012 14:48
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I was listening to the radio this morning, and somebody wrote in "Isn't this America? What happened to free speech?!" I really would just love for somebody with that viewpoint to explain exactly how Dan's right to free speech was taken away from him by the government.
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Aug 3, 2012 15:10
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This one just popped up on my feed. My eyes, trained as they are to this kind of crap, immediately began to roll, but then I read the whole thing and was kind of pleasantly surprised. Oddly enough it came from a borderline insane libertarian nut who can often be seen complaining about the "poors" and welfare, then a few posts later will be complaining about how the US military doesn't pay her husband enough money  (She might have to, gasp, get a job!)
Craftics fucked around with this message at 15:22 on Aug 3, 2012 |
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Aug 3, 2012 15:17
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I just don't understand how anybody would think that being gay is a choice. First) their brains are different and second) I don't think anybody would loving choose a life of being picked on, socially ostracized, beaten, and constantly yelled at by the crazy religious people that their entire lives are wrong because an ancient book said so.
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Aug 3, 2012 15:23
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andrew smash posted:We are but that doesn't mean small-minded people won't kick and scream and drag their feet the entire way. I think the fact that people had to couch their utter enthusiasm for sticking it to the gays as "protecting CFA's freedom of speech" highlights that actual progress is being made. They know they can't say what they really think, they know they have terrible opinions and people will berate them for them, so they have to hide behind more acceptable terminology to make themselves feel better about their bigotry. 
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Aug 3, 2012 15:24
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zeroprime posted:I think the fact that people had to couch their utter enthusiasm for sticking it to the gays as "protecting CFA's freedom of speech" highlights that actual progress is being made. They know they can't say what they really think, they know they have terrible opinions and people will berate them for them, so they have to hide behind more acceptable terminology to make themselves feel better about their bigotry. I was going to post this. That they are having to actually utilize "politically correct" speech like this to rail against political correctness is just the cherry on top. They can't even come out and say that gays are going to hell like they want to say - they have to say Chic Fil A "stands up for Christian values". They are losing the culture war, and losing is the one thing conservatives fear more than anything. There's a reason why a map of all the Chic Fil A locations in the US looks exactly like the map of the last states to allow interracial marriages, allow slavery, cling to segregation, and prohibit women from voting. Unzip and Attack fucked around with this message at 16:37 on Aug 3, 2012 |
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Aug 3, 2012 16:34
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Craftics posted:This one just popped up on my feed. My eyes, trained as they are to this kind of crap, immediately began to roll, but then I read the whole thing and was kind of pleasantly surprised. Treaty of Tripoli was under Adams' presidency (the quote is an accurate excerpt however.) I personally have no doubts that all those quotes are real, but if this is going to convince anyone it would be nice to have sources.
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Aug 3, 2012 16:43
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Unzip and Attack posted:There's a reason why a map of all the Chic Fil A locations in the US looks exactly like the map of the last states to allow interracial marriages, allow slavery, cling to segregation, and prohibit women from voting.
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Aug 3, 2012 18:00
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DarkHorse posted:I would love to see this graphic.  edited for unity edit2: fixed Michigan Augster fucked around with this message at 18:40 on Aug 3, 2012 |
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Aug 3, 2012 18:09
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Make that into one nice easily postable image.
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Aug 3, 2012 18:11
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DarkHorse posted:I would love to see this graphic. I was about to post something, but Augster seriously out did me. zeroprime posted:I think the fact that people had to couch their utter enthusiasm for sticking it to the gays as "protecting CFA's freedom of speech" highlights that actual progress is being made. They know they can't say what they really think, they know they have terrible opinions and people will berate them for them, so they have to hide behind more acceptable terminology to make themselves feel better about their bigotry. This was a great read by the way, thanks for sharing this.
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Aug 3, 2012 18:14
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Augster posted:graphs After living in rural Michigan for so long it's nice to see that the state as a whole has a history of progressive attitudes.
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Aug 3, 2012 18:23
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Just realized Michigan in the last map was two colors. Investigation reveals that it should be all green.
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Aug 3, 2012 18:40
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Per Wikipedia: Michigan was also the first English speaking government to abolish the death penalty in 1846 (excluding treason, which was then eliminated in the 60s, and nobody was ever executed for it). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_Michigan
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Aug 3, 2012 18:48
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Sprecherscrow posted:Treaty of Tripoli was under Adams' presidency (the quote is an accurate excerpt however.) I personally have no doubts that all those quotes are real, but if this is going to convince anyone it would be nice to have sources. From what I can find, it WAS signed during Washington's presidency, but became effective during Adams'.
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Aug 3, 2012 19:05
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Craftics posted:Oddly enough it came from a borderline insane libertarian nut who can often be seen complaining about the "poors" and welfare, then a few posts later will be complaining about how the US military doesn't pay her husband enough money Most Libertarians I've met are atheists. They tend to be socially...well not liberal but not as socially conservative as your freeper or anything, they at least tend to tolerate homosexuality on the level of "if it isn't hurting anyone who cares?" It's anything involving social programs and economics they're horrible about.
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Aug 3, 2012 19:06
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Augster posted:
Might wanna add this one too   What kinda coke you want? I WANT A loving COKE, WHAT THE HELL 
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Aug 3, 2012 19:06
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Loving Life Partner posted:What kinda coke you want? Cherry, always. Obviously. 
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Aug 3, 2012 19:08
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Craftics posted:This one just popped up on my feed. My eyes, trained as they are to this kind of crap, immediately began to roll, but then I read the whole thing and was kind of pleasantly surprised. I'll bet that quote from Ben Franklin is pretty out of context. He was an excellent skeptic, but I'm fairly sure he was also a devout Christian. He was, at the very least, a Christian deist.
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Aug 3, 2012 19:10
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Loving Life Partner posted:Might wanna add this one too I demand other.
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Aug 3, 2012 19:11
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Tomahawk posted:From what I can find, it WAS signed during Washington's presidency, but became effective during Adams'. Yeah, it was written up during Washington's Presidency, but the Senate didn't ratify it until Adams was President. Either way its a pretty amazing piece of evidence that shows the founders really didn't view the US as being founded on Christianity, regardless of their personal beliefs. Its almost as if they saw the government as having no religious belief, but rather as an entity that protected the rights of all individuals to believe whatever they wanted. Too bad there is no word for a government that picks no sides when it comes to religion...
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Aug 3, 2012 19:17
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Parachute posted:I demand other. I had no idea what the hell "other" would be, but in my search I found this: quote:In Afrikaans (my mother tongue) we call it "blikkies koeldrank", which translates to tinned cooldrink. Therefore I fall the the "other" category. So I guess I know what I'm calling pop from now on.
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Aug 3, 2012 19:18
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Loving Life Partner posted:Might wanna add this one too People round these parts literally say that. 
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Aug 3, 2012 19:18
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Daktar posted:I'll bet that quote from Ben Franklin is pretty out of context. He was an excellent skeptic, but I'm fairly sure he was also a devout Christian. He was, at the very least, a Christian deist. Was Franklin? I know Jefferson was a deist, hence the Jefferson Bible. But like Sarion said, their religious affiliation doesn't really matter, they were all English or English subjects, one expects them to be some form of Christian or another. The point was the writing of The Constitution pretty clearly states they didn't want their personal beliefs to affect the government.
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Aug 3, 2012 19:19
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Daktar posted:I'll bet that quote from Ben Franklin is pretty out of context. He was an excellent skeptic, but I'm fairly sure he was also a devout Christian. He was, at the very least, a Christian deist. Hard to say, I can't find a single source for the quote, though it exists all over the internet. Was it from a letter, a diary, an essay? No one seems to know. But even if it is real, the longer version of the quote seems to suggest his beef was with The Church, not Christianity. In fact, most quotes from the founding fathers seem to focus on The Church or The Bible rather than the belief itself. Which is probably what you would expect from deists.
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Aug 3, 2012 19:30
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Daktar posted:I'll bet that quote from Ben Franklin is pretty out of context. He was an excellent skeptic, but I'm fairly sure he was also a devout Christian. He was, at the very least, a Christian deist. As near as I can tell after a decent search, including his papers, that quote has no source at all beyond an uncited reference in "Toward the Mystery" by William Edelen.
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Aug 3, 2012 19:44
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Made a thing
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Aug 3, 2012 20:01
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DarkHorse posted:Made a thing I hope you don't mind if I borrowed that.
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Aug 3, 2012 21:16
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Like n' Share! I did neither.
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Aug 3, 2012 21:35
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CitizenKain posted:I hope you don't mind if I borrowed that. (you're welcome to it)
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Aug 3, 2012 21:38
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I'm a little concerned that that image is too " Heh, southerners" and doesn't really get to the heart of the matter. On the other hand, Heh, southerners.
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Aug 3, 2012 21:46
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Today a friend highly recommended that I look up an old high school classmate on facebook! "Jesus is a false prophet because the letter J had not yet been conceived." 
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Aug 3, 2012 21:56
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DarkHorse posted:Made a thing Haha that's great. When I conjured it in my mind it wasn't quite this devastating and obvious. Man these pics absolutely do not lie.
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Aug 3, 2012 21:57
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Daktar posted:I'll bet that quote from Ben Franklin is pretty out of context. He was an excellent skeptic, but I'm fairly sure he was also a devout Christian. He was, at the very least, a Christian deist. As far as I can tell from what I've read about his life, Franklin, like Jefferson, was extremely skeptical of most of the dogma that pretty much make Christianity what it is, i.e. the Trinity, Christ's miracles, Christ's death and resurrection, etc. The extent of any Christian belief on his part was only to the degree that his deist God may have had some Christian flavor (e.g. maybe some Christian metaphysics and existentialism). Personally, I don't like quoting the Founders as authorities on anything other than what their actual beliefs were, because most of them were raging racists, slave-owners, and various other kinds of assholes (like Patrick Henry, who was infamous for beating his slaves and abusing his wife). http://www.dialoginternational.com/dialog_international/2008/02/ben-franklin-on.html Ben Franklin on "Stupid, Swarthy Germans" posted:Immigrants to America have always been feared and hated. Germans represent the largest group of immigrants to America, outnumbering the English and Irish by a wide margin. Nearly 20% of Americans can trace their ancestors back to Germany. But they were not universally welcomed to our shores. Louis Rumbaut (via Matt Yglesias) reminds us that one of our iconic founding fathers - Benjamin Franklin - warned about German immigrants overrunning America - in language that sounds very much like that of Mitt Romney and Roland Koch. Franklin warned that Germans were too stupid to learn English, and therefore represented a political threat to America: Ben Franklin was the Lou Dobbs of his era. Craftics posted:This one just popped up on my feed. My eyes, trained as they are to this kind of crap, immediately began to roll, but then I read the whole thing and was kind of pleasantly surprised. There are plenty of libertarians who hate religion in general and more specifically hate government benefits for religion, e.g. tax-exempts statuses, grants for charitable work, the entire "Office for Faith-based Initiatives," etc. It's a very Randian sentiment towards religion being for dupes and morons. Gourd of Taste posted:They're simultaneously surrounded and surrounding, duh That's it. I'm starting Umberto Eco's Pancake House, home of the Fifth Column Giant Stack.
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Aug 4, 2012 00:04
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Not a facebook thing going around, but a funny article with facebook comments from JoePals and Fandusky's. I'm trying to start as much poo poo as I can with them, it's great http://onwardstate.com/2012/08/03/p...5897#f287ef7618
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Aug 4, 2012 00:14
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Someone posted a picture of a huge line outside Chick-Fil-A that's making rounds with the caption:quote:August 2nd – Sure, most polls over-sample Dems. But even so you wonder, “How can O still be in the mid-forties?” Could make you depressed. Then something like yesterday happens. Americans saying they’ve had enough! Not with mindless chants or drum circles but with their wallets. They’ve had enough of insecure blowhards dictating what their values should be. There’s no record of discrimination at Chick-fil-A. Yet the anger from the left yesterday was brutal. No way to show quotes, way too vile. But the basic sentiment was this: “Hope these fat, Bible-thumpers all die of heart attacks!” Peace & love to you too, oh tolerant & open-minded ones. As for the believers in free speech? A great day to be an American! P To which someone replied, quote:How groovy. Let's get a crowd of Christians, of people who claim to be, to show up in force to work at soup kitchens and homeless shelters. Oh, and get Chick-Fil-A to take Pork Sausage and Bacon off their their Breakfast menu, because Leviticus forbids it, also. :-) To which someone else rebutted: quote:It's about FREE SPEECH Joe... If you and your liberal friends try and stop free speech at the soup kitchens and homeless shelters, we'll be there to show our support as well... Meanwhile, we're already there taking care of those in need... Nice try making this a "Christian" issue... You need to try and think for yourself rather than just following MSNBC's talking points.
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Aug 4, 2012 01:04
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