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The GIG posted:I honestly couldn't stand P3FES after playing P4 first. I honestly felt like the Main Character was just "There" and never did much to really affect anything, story, social links or otherwise. It didn't help that I was one of those guys who ended up drawing the worst moves of the AI partners. And this is why I'm so excited about P4. It sounds like a much better P3P. The story was engaging and the characters are more likable. And I love the Velvet Room (reminds me of Twin Peaks).
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Aug 22, 2012 13:05
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Pierce posted:And I love the Velvet Room (reminds me of Twin Peaks). The Velvet Room is always awesome. All of them are very classy places.
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Aug 22, 2012 13:09
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The GIG posted:Though I will say that P3P is far and away the better version of P3. Spruced up a lot of stuff and feels less like a chore to go through. I put it just under P4. It's my favourite just because it's portable. I can't imagine having enough time to sit in front of my tv for the time it takes to play these games, plus that's my proper free time and there's almost always something else I'd rather be doing. But spending 2 hours a day commuting on the tube? P3P was amazing for that. I quit playing P4 at the part when you get Rise but will seriously be buying a Vita just for the portable version.
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Aug 22, 2012 13:24
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The GIG posted:The Velvet Room is always awesome. All of them are very classy places. After playing P2 I really wish they had kept the painter. I loved making new demons and watching him flip out on his canvas.
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Aug 22, 2012 13:27
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I found The Answer's story to be OK, it's really no better or worse than The Journey (though for me that's not saying much because I don't really care for P3's story). Except for Yukari, who became insufferable. However, it's the gameplay that kills it. I hate it when developers attempt to accomplish the goal of "increase the difficulty" with "let's take out really basic gameplay elements to intentionally make it more cumbersome".
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Aug 22, 2012 13:49
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My main problem with The Answer gameplay is that they gave a lot of enemies who have a weakness an Evade skill to that weakness. Basically you roll the dice and if you miss it was worse than just smacking them.
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Aug 22, 2012 13:57
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The GIG posted:Though I will say that P3P is far and away the better version of P3. Spruced up a lot of stuff and feels less like a chore to go through. I put it just under P4. Maybe I'm alone in this (Or I'm turning into the new Technique  ) but I tried playing P3P after clearing FES once and was completely turned off by the limitations of the PSP engine. Something about not being able to move my own character and other minor changes made me feel like I was playing a visual novel, which I guess is just not my type of genre. I couldn't get more than two hours into the (interesting, from what I could tell) feMC story.
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Aug 22, 2012 15:01
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The GIG posted:I honestly couldn't stand P3FES after playing P4 first. I honestly felt like the Main Character was just "There" and never did much to really affect anything, story, social links or otherwise. It didn't help that I was one of those guys who ended up drawing the worst moves of the AI partners. It's been a while since I played either game but doesn't the MC just sit around and be "there" in P4 as well?
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Aug 22, 2012 15:17
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Ibram Gaunt posted:It's been a while since I played either game but doesn't the MC just sit around and be "there" in P4 as well? In P4 it felt more like the MC was in charge of things, and wasn't just witnessing the social links and story happen, but participated in it. P3 felt like "The Adventures of SEES guest staring that blue haired guy" , while P4 was more like "Persona 4 staring Yu Narukami and His Merry Band of Morons".
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Aug 22, 2012 15:23
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Ibram Gaunt posted:It's been a while since I played either game but doesn't the MC just sit around and be "there" in P4 as well? Arguably, no. The MC feels a lot less like a passive enabler in P4's Social Links. There is a lot less of "you passively listened to X rambling until they reach a life changing crisis by themselves".
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Aug 22, 2012 15:24
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The P4 protagonist and to a lesser extent the P3 female protagonist are both written to be a bit more proactive. Their dialogue choices and where they occur tends to allow them to do more than sit there and nod like the male P3 protagonist does. It's relatively minor but does make a notable difference.
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Aug 22, 2012 15:25
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I think there should be more SMT protagonists like the DeSu2 dude. MCs are gonna be boring anyway, might as well just let you call people perverts and smell people's hands.
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Aug 22, 2012 15:40
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THE AWESOME GHOST posted:There should be a disclaimer next to all your posts that you liked P1 better than P4 because that's not normal The fact that he likes Persona 1 at all is pretty damning.
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Aug 22, 2012 15:45
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Persona 1 doesn't deserve nearly the amount of hate some people have for it, especially after the PSP version.
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Aug 22, 2012 15:47
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I'm not too hot on P1 (I don't think it aged well at all and the XP system is dumb) but I think most of the hate comes from people expecting the remake to change the fundamentals of the game, rather than just give it a make over. And I can't speak for anyone in this thread but I'm sure at least some of the hate online comes from people blindly buying it cuz they liked P3 or P4 without realizing it's nothing like those.
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Aug 22, 2012 15:49
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Persona 1 was my very first MegaTen game and I went in with zero expectations and found it to be one of the few JRPGs that I would call unredeemable. I mean I've played some bad JRPGs, but none of them invoked the gut reaction that P1 did. Which is amazing because the story at its core is actually pretty decent, and I've enjoyed plenty of JRPGs for their story and placing the gameplay second. The gameplay is just that bad. And then I followed it up with P2 IS & EP, which collectively was one of my favorite JRPG experiences.
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Aug 22, 2012 16:04
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Nate RFB posted:Persona 1 was my very first MegaTen game and I went in with zero expectations and found it to be one of the few JRPGs that I would call unredeemable. I mean I've played some bad JRPGs, but none of them invoked the gut reaction that P1 did. Which is amazing because the story at its core is actually pretty decent, and I've enjoyed plenty of JRPGs for their story and placing the gameplay second. The gameplay is just that bad. Just out of curiosity, after an experience that bad, why on earth did you come back for Persona 2?
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Aug 22, 2012 17:10
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Nate RFB posted:I found The Answer's story to be OK, it's really no better or worse than The Journey (though for me that's not saying much because I don't really care for P3's story). Except for Yukari, who became insufferable. Honestly the fact that Yukari was pretty insufferable made me appreciate her more, because it was honestly pretty realistic. gently caress if I would want to deal with more of that poo poo after the ending of the Journey.
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Aug 22, 2012 17:21
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Radish posted:Persona 1 doesn't deserve nearly the amount of hate some people have for it, especially after the PSP version. But you can't even date anyone in it! How can you play a Persona where you can't even seduce a 10 old boy? That's like playing a FPS without jumping.
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Aug 22, 2012 17:24
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King of Solomon posted:Just out of curiosity, after an experience that bad, why on earth did you come back for Persona 2?
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Aug 22, 2012 17:27
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I agree with the p1 hate, everything about that game felt like the least satisfying experience I've ever had in an rpg game. Even just the core mechanics of the combat system, just positioning people and worrying about what squares they can attack in regards to their position, all felt like a chore to me instead of strategy. It was work to play. I didn't find the story engaging either. Still haven't played p2, I know it got rid of that awful grid system, and I should probably try the psp remake sometime.
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Aug 22, 2012 19:05
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I've only played the PSP version (and only the main route), but I had a lot of fun with Persona 1. I never really had to reposition anyone during battle, and I used a guide for negotiation, so the whole thing went pretty smoothly for me. I also enjoyed The Answer in P3.
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Aug 22, 2012 19:47
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ImpAtom posted:The P4 protagonist and to a lesser extent the P3 female protagonist are both written to be a bit more proactive. Their dialogue choices and where they occur tends to allow them to do more than sit there and nod like the male P3 protagonist does. It's relatively minor but does make a notable difference. Also  compared to 
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Aug 22, 2012 19:49
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The P4 MC is seriously one of my favorite MegaTen characters. He's just so goofy.
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Aug 22, 2012 19:57
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Once you get the hang of where you have to put people so their weapons hit where you want it's really trivial. Spells mostly hit anywhere as well. In the original PSX version the menu system was clunky as hell and it was a real chore to move them around especially since if you were back attacked it would set everyone backwards even after the fight was over but the PSP version fixed a lot of those problems. The negotiation was easier than P2 and you didn't really need to do a lot with it. It was also pretty exploitable so unless you were doing the SQQ or something it wasn't hard. The combat was really standard for the time other than the position aspect anyway. The plot was also weird which was more interesting to me than P3's really generic "person remaking the world by destroying it" story that has been done a million times. Of course I've bought P3 four times so it's not like I don't like that one either.
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Aug 22, 2012 20:04
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Radish posted:"person remaking the world by destroying it" I can't remember who was trying to do it. Certainly not Strega. Ikutski? or Kirijo? Several people were trying to do the latter half of that statement, but I can't recall any plans outside of the "destroy it" part.
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Aug 22, 2012 20:22
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This thread is weird sometimes. Days without more than a handful of posts between them, followed by fifty posts of "hey let's argue about which Persona is better some more." Clearly they need to release games quicker to keep us entertained. (also Yu is my favorite protagonist and I like Inaba as a setting since I grew up in a small podunk town mysel but I like the "vibe" of P3 more including Tartarus)
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Aug 22, 2012 20:26
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Nate RFB posted:The P4 MC is seriously one of my favorite MegaTen characters. He's just so goofy. Yea I love P4 because of the cast, game's just so wacky and upbeat and you can make the MC a complete idiot sometimes, whereas P3 had almost nobody that was likeable, they didn't even feel like friends half the time.
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Aug 22, 2012 20:39
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I don't think most of the P3 cast was unlikeable, but yeah they didn't really feel like friends. Junpei, Yukari, Fuuka and Shinjiro are all pretty cool though, I love those characters and their stories.Spiffo posted:I can't remember who was trying to do it. Certainly not Strega. Ikutski? or Kirijo? Literally no one in P3 had an actual plan besides Ikutsuki and even his just flies out of nowhere as he's never really built up as a villain at all. Strega are a bunch of schmucks who show up solely to annoy you and Kirijo is a mixed bag of crazy that no one has any idea of what went on.
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Aug 22, 2012 20:49
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So I'm going to be separated from my family w/low bandwidth internet for the next 4 months. Normally I only play handhelds but I'm packing my PS2. I've not played any SMT for this console. Where to start?
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Aug 22, 2012 20:50
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Depends, do you want an easy game or to dive off the deep end?  Persona 3 and 4 are probably the best for simpleness. 4 more so, largely because of improvements and refinements to the system, but 3 is still good. Or you can go off the deep end and play Nocturne and watch the world end in 20 minutes. 
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Aug 22, 2012 20:55
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Well, you played P3P right? And plan on playing P4G down the road I assume. If we can set those aside as a result, then it comes down to Nocturne and DDS1. Both of these games are pretty good, Nocturne in particular. I haven't played DDS2 yet but there are ~reasons~ that it isn't as good as DDS1. After that, I think the only other PS2 MegaTen game worth playing would be Devil Summoner 2, another game I haven't played but generally speaking doesn't seem to be in the same tier as Nocturne or DDS1.
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Aug 22, 2012 20:58
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THE AWESOME GHOST posted:There should be a disclaimer next to all your posts that you liked P1 better than P4 because that's not normal The problem is, Technique is pretty much right. Persona after Eternal Punishment is fairly terrible. Persona 1 wasn't great by any means, and yet it's better than what we're getting now. That is unfortunate. Saying P1 is better than Eternal Punishment is really questionable, though. Katsuya alone carries the whole game (and to be honest it would have been better if Tatsuya stayed sidelined).
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Aug 22, 2012 21:00
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Tallgeese posted:The problem is, Technique is pretty much right. Persona after Eternal Punishment is fairly terrible. Your definition of "terrible" includes two of the best rpgs made. Ones that are absurdly successful and pretty much shot Atlus up a few notches in the industry. (They used to be even more niche then they are now)
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Aug 22, 2012 21:02
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I wouldn't go so far as to call P3 and P4 two of the best RPGs ever made. They're great games, but certainly not two of the best RPGs ever made, that's getting into hyperbole.
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Aug 22, 2012 21:04
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Nate RFB posted:Well, you played P3P right? And plan on playing P4G down the road I assume. If we can set those aside as a result, then it comes down to Nocturne and DDS1. Both of these games are pretty good, Nocturne in particular. I haven't played DDS2 yet but there are ~reasons~ that it isn't as good as DDS1. After that, I think the only other PS2 MegaTen game worth playing would be Devil Summoner 2, another game I haven't played but generally speaking doesn't seem to be in the same tier as Nocturne or DDS1. Yep, played P3P 2x and P4G is preordered. I'll grab DDS 1 and Nocturne. Dr Pepper posted:Depends, do you want an easy game or to dive off the deep end? I am pumped about Nocturne. I've heard SJ was somewhat similar and looking forward to a challenge.
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Aug 22, 2012 21:10
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Sex_Ferguson posted:I wouldn't go so far as to call P3 and P4 two of the best RPGs ever made. They're great games, but certainly not two of the best RPGs ever made, that's getting into hyperbole. Well somebody has to be near the top spot. 
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Aug 22, 2012 21:10
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Dr Pepper posted:Your definition of "terrible" includes two of the best rpgs made. Ones that are absurdly successful and pretty much shot Atlus up a few notches in the industry. (They used to be even more niche then they are now) That sounds like you are equating success with quality though, which is highly questionable. P3 and 4 are just complete slogs to play through, and their settings are just not as interesting as P1 and P2's. P1's dungeons were bad, but frankly I cannot call 3 and 4's dungeons much better.
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Aug 22, 2012 21:12
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Tallgeese posted:That sounds like you are equating success with quality though, which is highly questionable. P3 and 4 are just complete slogs to play through, and their settings are just not as interesting as P1 and P2's. No I'm saying they're great and that they were successful there's a difference.
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Aug 22, 2012 21:16
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I can agree on the latter, but I dare say their success has nothing to do with their (lack of) quality. I can say the same for Innocent Sin's cult status; it is completely undeserved. Eternal Punishment is the better game.
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Aug 22, 2012 21:18
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