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PoptartsNinja posted:And the Davions are just going to let the players walk onboard? Why not, we apparently let them drop off an entire assault force unopposed. [EDIT] Less snark-ily, it would be less people they have to fight, and they're here to take the planet, so yes? They'd be fine with "beating" the Clans with less of a fight. Zaodai fucked around with this message at 02:09 on Nov 17, 2012 |
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Nov 17, 2012 02:06
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I was mostly just referring to the "defend the dropships while they power up" objective, although really that could just as well be "defend the dropships while they finish x" so I probably shouldn't have said anything.
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Nov 17, 2012 02:12
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Oh this is gonna be good.  So, I take it the Bondsmen count as DC's for the purposes of the contest? Since the Commandos won them after all. Also will it be fine if we all use one doc for the sake of simplicity? While two docs would be interesting in a co-op competition sense, it would also be needlessly complicated. And we all know what needless complications will do.
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Nov 17, 2012 02:34
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Zaodai posted:Why not, we apparently let them drop off an entire assault force unopposed. Right, 'cause those Thrush fighters in orbit performed really well in my behind-the-scenes rolling. The Capellan Confederation isn't exactly known for its air superiority, and it's hard to stop a regiment equipped with jump jets from disembarking. The Thrush is crap, Sian! Stop building so many of them!  Ease up for a bit, please. The players are already hitting the starport within 3 minutes of the Davions touching down; which is pretty impressive given that the trip really should take a half-dozen container ships and a few months. The plan is still 'blow them up while they land.' You'll just have to do it with guns rather than explosives because one of those two things is actually entertaining to watch. Because I'm sure people are curious: the Thrush fighters all got themselves shot down by tanks. It was an embarrassing enough performance that I haven't found a way to fit it into the story updates between missions. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 04:17 on Nov 17, 2012 |
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Nov 17, 2012 02:42
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PoptartsNinja posted:“Neg,” Wilberforce’s laughter. This part doesn't sound right, but I'm not making any suggestions since it could be changed in several ways. I LOVE the mission objectives for the next fight. The competitive aspect reminds me a bit of the Solaris tournament, which apparently was a lot less fun to play than it was for me to watch.
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Nov 17, 2012 02:50
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If by some miracle Wilberforce makes it through this, I hope he survives the Lady Coordinator's madness long enough to get a position of real power. From what we've seen of him, he's actually an interesting character. Looking forward to the new scenario, at any rate.
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Nov 17, 2012 02:58
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Tran posted:If by some miracle Wilberforce makes it through this, I hope he survives the Lady Coordinator's madness long enough to get a position of real power. From what we've seen of him, he's actually an interesting character. Seriously, one can only hope that he doesn't fall victim to her rampant paranoia when (actually, if) he gets back. Canon BattleTech doesn't have any Clanners that are nearly as three-dimensional as him. Well, technically it doesn't have ANY characters that are, but that's a more general kind of problem. My beef with Clanners is that they are sort of handled like the alien races in Star Trek, where humans could have nuanced and interesting personalities, but the others were just slight variations on their respective dominating single cultural attribute. Klingons = Warriors, Ferengi = Greedy, etc.
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Nov 17, 2012 03:08
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PoptartsNinja posted:Because I'm sure people are curious: the Thrush fighters all got themselves shot down by tanks. It was an embarrassing enough performance that I haven't found a way to fit it into the story updates between missions.  Tran posted:If by some miracle Wilberforce makes it through this, I hope he survives the Lady Coordinator's madness long enough to get a position of real power. The Lady Chancellor Romano is more crazy like a fox in this timeline, which honestly makes her a lot more dangerous. For the rest of the Inner Sphere anyway. I wouldn't be surprised if she skewed a little closer to a proto-Sun Tzu Liao than her canon character. Also Wilber's not participating because he took two pilot hits last go and that means he's benched.
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Nov 17, 2012 03:12
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PoptartsNinja posted:Because I'm sure people are curious: the Thrush fighters all got themselves shot down by tanks. It was an embarrassing enough performance that I haven't found a way to fit it into the story updates between missions. Wow, Thrushes? I would have imagined the Death Commando's would have brought along some of the CC's good fighters, like Lightnings or maybe the Transit. Justin Xiang must have been really cutting corners on this suicide mission!
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Nov 17, 2012 03:18
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If Emil Voronov were a different kind of man, he might let Wilburforce go when all is said and done rather than subject him to the tender mercies of Justin Xiang and the Lady Chancellor. But Voronov is a Death Commando, and that isn't in his nature.
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Nov 17, 2012 03:18
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Andrevian posted:If they're not intimidated by anything we're throwing at them, then they are fools. "Anything" in the context of what Gooncompany and the Clanners have left to throw at the Grenadiers right now. They simply aren't the type to get intimidated by a force they outnumber, outgun and nearly match in pilot quality and they're quite willing to take losses to get the job done.
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Nov 17, 2012 03:47
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Magni posted:"Anything" in the context of what Gooncompany and the Clanners have left to throw at the Grenadiers right now. They simply aren't the type to get intimidated by a force they outnumber, outgun and nearly match in pilot quality and they're quite willing to take losses to get the job done. Then they're still fools. And foolish fools at that. Our goal for this mission is clear, then: Make them afraid.
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Nov 17, 2012 05:01
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Andrevian posted:Then they're still fools. And foolish fools at that. The 4 clan lpl on the rifleman should do that.
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Nov 17, 2012 05:38
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Welp, this is going to be one interesting end to this Campaign... The 18 mechs of GoonStarCompany fighting through 40 fresh Kestrel Grenadier mechs to their Dropships, all while competing to see who can kill more of them? This will be good. Wilberforce has really too cool to kill now that we've kinda gotten to know him. I just hope that when he goes with the Death Commandos back to the Cappellan Confederation, he doesn't fall victim to the intrigues of the court, especially with Romano Liao and Justin Xiang running the show. Too bad the Bloodnamed light Star Commander and his mech got taken out the turn the last mission ended, as he and his Stormcrow probably would have been pretty helpful here. Oh well, there's still 3 more Bloodnamed Clanners around, including the Star Captain. Then again, there's also Talyn Hell Horse and her Seagull around to draw fire from the enemy mechs or whatever. Wonder how many and which of the Clanners left will survive to become Bondsmen and go to the Confederation if and when the Death Commandos wind up winning this contest. Because really, even if the Clanners win, there's really no way that a single Star of Clan mechs, minus whatever casualties they take here, will be able to take out whatever assets of the Kestrel Grenadiers are left after this mission, assuming that they win this contest here. Sure, Amirault might just be going for the glory here in attempting to fight off an entire battalion of fresh, seasoned troops, and there will definitely be a lot of glory to go around if they manage to pull it off.
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Nov 17, 2012 05:39
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GhostStalker posted:Wonder how many and which of the Clanners left will survive to become Bondsmen and go to the Confederation if and when the Death Commandos wind up winning this contest. Because really, even if the Clanners win, there's really no way that a single Star of Clan mechs, minus whatever casualties they take here, will be able to take out whatever assets of the Kestrel Grenadiers are left after this mission, assuming that they win this contest here. Sure, Amirault might just be going for the glory here in attempting to fight off an entire battalion of fresh, seasoned troops, and there will definitely be a lot of glory to go around if they manage to pull it off. It doesn't look like anyone is getting out of here without being on a Capellan dropship, so unless their plan is to declare victory and immediately turn around to die in a blaze of glory (which wouldn't be out of the question, I suppose), they presumably have it on the Commando's honor that they'll be free to return to their mission if they win the trial. Hope the weather's nice on Sian this time of year. Voyager I fucked around with this message at 06:43 on Nov 17, 2012 |
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Nov 17, 2012 06:36
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GhostStalker posted:Wilberforce has really too cool to kill now that we've kinda gotten to know him. I just hope that when he goes with the Death Commandos back to the Cappellan Confederation, he doesn't fall victim to the intrigues of the court, especially with Romano Liao and Justin Xiang running the show. Wilberforce is too awesome to fall prey to the court intrigue. Wilberforce will infiltrate the Capellans and reshape them from the inside. He will be the Negative Caesar Steiner. Then one day Caesar and Wilberforce will meet on the field of battle and no goon will be happy because we won't know who to cheer for. Also they will be fighting to decide the fate of Korean Robert, Rosinski Ami, and the Brave Little Office Chair.
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Nov 17, 2012 06:59
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DivineCoffeeBinge posted:Wilberforce is too awesome to fall prey to the court intrigue. Wilberforce will infiltrate the Capellans and reshape them from the inside. He will be the Negative Caesar Steiner. I don't want to be the goon acting as one of them in that fight, that's for sure. Talk about pressure! ...I'm guessing that by posting this I've all but guaranteed it shall be so.
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Nov 17, 2012 07:18
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DivineCoffeeBinge posted:Then one day Caesar and Wilberforce will meet on the field of battle and no goon will be happy because we won't know who to cheer for. Oh man, the final mission. When the Office Dude and His Girlfriend get crushed by 80 tons of falling battlemech. Man, 2015 is going to be a great year.
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Nov 17, 2012 07:21
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Wait... back up It's 3014... and there are clanners in the Sphere? DA HELL!? I know the Dragoons were a scout party, but... I suppose this is explained somewhere in the past 800 pages?
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Nov 17, 2012 07:53
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Surely the Overlord pilots would never consider using their weapons exclusively for sniping Hell's Horses' kills. That would be downright dezgra.
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Nov 17, 2012 08:11
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Scurrilous posted:Surely the Overlord pilots would never consider using their weapons exclusively for sniping Hell's Horses' kills. That would be downright dezgra. Or just maneuver yourself around so the clanners take most of the damage and then shoot them down afterwards.
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Nov 17, 2012 08:36
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Mezzanon posted:Or just maneuver yourself around so the clanners take most of the damage and then shoot them down afterwards. Well, ideally having them basically be slaves to the Confederation would work to more of a long term advantage if possible compared to just shooting them like dogs. [EDIT] Ahaha, someone is mad again. 
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Nov 17, 2012 08:57
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Calax posted:Wait... back up It's later than that right now, but yes this isn't the canon timeline. quote:We’re not playing in that universe. Instead, we’ll be rewriting it. Slycne fucked around with this message at 09:07 on Nov 17, 2012 |
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Nov 17, 2012 09:04
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Calax posted:Wait... back up Check out the OP, it's filled with helpful information! Like context for the campaign and pictures of Caesar Steiner by way of Animal House.
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Nov 17, 2012 09:14
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T.G. Xarbala posted:Check out the OP, it's filled with helpful information! Like context for the campaign and pictures of Caesar Steiner by way of Animal House. If he doesn't have time to read the OP, the thread title also offers several hints, such as "and rewrite Inner Sphere history".
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Nov 17, 2012 09:22
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TildeATH posted:Oh man, the final mission. When the Office Dude and His Girlfriend get crushed by 80 tons of falling battlemech. You bite your tongue, mister! Korean Robert ain't going out like a chump! 
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Nov 17, 2012 10:58
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Hell's Horses better win, if only because talking horses with lasers attached to them ought to dominate the battlefield of tomorrow. Edit: Speaking of Thrushes, I know we've discussed this earlier, but what are some of the more awful designs of mechs and vehicles, and what did the writers give as a reason for them existing? Edit 2: And on another note, I really like the new designs that came out before people figured out how to make SL-tech stuff, trying to emulate those older, more advanced designs. Which is what I would be expecting the IS to try and throw at the Clans before they got their hands on and managed to distribute anything good. I haven't looked into it yet, but are there also some early designs that were just awful because they were trying to implement new tech really quickly without much fieldtesting or just because of design flaws that slipped in when no one was looking? evilmiera fucked around with this message at 15:17 on Nov 17, 2012 |
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Nov 17, 2012 14:49
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evilmiera posted:Hell's Horses better win, if only because talking horses with lasers attached to them ought to dominate the battlefield of tomorrow. Out of universe designing nothing but perfectly min-maxed units is not fun and kind of limited as once you have the handful of perfectly optimised mechs what else do you do? Also the writers need to keep selling TROs and so new mech designs are a must. Which is why with the odd exception (I am looking at you Hellstar) you will not see all that many perfectly optimised designs. In universe mech designers are people. They don't design perfect mechs because there is plenty of debate on what the perfect mech for a role is. Also things that make sense for a brief 5 minute combat do not make sense when you are fighting a weeks long campaign or vice versa. I.E 5 tons of gauss rifle ammo on the War Dog are dumb as hell in terms of one battle but when you are fighting an extended campaign without resupply that extra ammo is mighty tempting. Another reason is politics the reason this mech mounts MGs even though it does not need one is because the company that makes them is owned by the friend/cousin or political ally of the guy who decides what gets built you want your mech to be bought right? better stick a couple of MGs on there.
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Nov 17, 2012 21:09
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Politics is also the reason why all `Mech machine guns are SperryBrowning .50s I'm not entirely serious, but at least one of the manufacturer names implies that their machineguns are actually automatic shotguns. They're also mounted solely on Vedette tanks, which are terrible. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 21:22 on Nov 17, 2012 |
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Nov 17, 2012 21:19
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Well for an ICE engine'd 50 tonner they're not THAT bad; 5/8 is pretty quick for a vee of that weight, and it has enough armor to take a an AC/20 hit and keep going. AC/5 as the main weapon sucks, but en mass they can do damage. Also, they can headcap and Ostsol after it's been hit in the head by an SRM round and a Medium Laser shot. I mean, could you get a better mech if you had a Fusion engine? Yes. It would also cost somewhere between 2-3 times as much. ICE engine'd vees are CHEAP. They aren't generally meant to win in one on one fights; they're meant to swarm you and drat the 
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Nov 17, 2012 21:44
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Ferrosol posted:Out of universe designing nothing but perfectly min-maxed units is not fun and kind of limited as once you have the handful of perfectly optimised mechs what else do you do? Also the writers need to keep selling TROs and so new mech designs are a must. Which is why with the odd exception (I am looking at you Hellstar) you will not see all that many perfectly optimised designs. I meant more in terms of specific examples, like in your case, what particular noble got that greenlit and things of that nature. And especially when the writers put in stuff like "These mechs have gyros that were badly calibrated at release" or "Entirely lacks energy weapons because of a lack of good heatsinks on the world this was made" or in the actual case of the Thrush "...the Thrush can enter an uncontrolled spin on entry to a planetary atmosphere."
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Nov 17, 2012 22:09
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evilmiera posted:"...the Thrush can enter an uncontrolled spin on entry to a planetary atmosphere." Looking like a remote control duct-taped to a frisbee with spoilers will do that.
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Nov 17, 2012 22:24
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evilmiera posted:or in the actual case of the Thrush "...the Thrush can enter an uncontrolled spin on entry to a planetary atmosphere." The Thrush costs 1.6 million C-Bills, which is cheap as hell. Its closest competitor is the more expensive Davion Sparrowhawk (AKA: the only Unseen aerofighter!) and the Marik Cheetah (which has a worse armament and less fuel). The Thrush is actually pretty reasonable, and it's one of my favorite aerofighters just because it's got an iffy performance history (also, it's cute). Also, House Kurita's Thrush knockoff the Sholagar has similarly hilarious performance issues. Edit: And everything benefits from not being the Seydlitz (AKA: the flying Commando)
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Nov 17, 2012 22:27
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PoptartsNinja posted:The Thrush costs 1.6 million C-Bills, which is cheap as hell. Its closest competitor is the more expensive Davion Sparrowhawk (AKA: the only Unseen aerofighter!) and the Marik Cheetah (which has a worse armament and less fuel). The Thrush is actually pretty reasonable, and it's one of my favorite aerofighters just because it's got an iffy performance history (also, it's cute). The idea behind it isn't half bad. Sort of. Having a single Large Laser makes it mostly ineffectual and expensive (well, it costs less than a Thrush, but relatively inexpensive when armaments are compared), but trying to outrange stuff while moving at high speeds should be a deadly combination. Except it blows up if you sneeze at it. And maybe I'm not used to reading these things for vehicles, but is that engine a bit weak for something that needs speed to stay alive? Anyway, thanks PTN for providing a few fun examples.
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Nov 17, 2012 23:57
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The Seydlitz follows the same design principles as the primitive-tech Commando (Armaments: one large laser, mobility. Armor: mobility, prayer). Except Aerospace Fighters don't work the way `Mechs do. A Commando can still fire its large laser directly behind it while running away, whereas the Seydlitz has to be making head-on passes which means slower targets can simply stay out of range until the Seydlitz itself is close enough for them to make a head-on pass against. The only Aerospace fighters this wouldn't work for are the hundred-ton monsters that the Seydlitz couldn't scratch and wouldn't have a range advantage against anyway. So, I guess what I'm saying is: the Seydlitz would've been a better fighter if the laser fired into the rear arc.
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Nov 18, 2012 00:05
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Isn't mobility and forward mounted weaponry a great combination for dogfighting? Less so for Close Air Support, but as a pure interceptor...
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Nov 18, 2012 00:28
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DatonKallandor posted:Isn't mobility and forward mounted weaponry a great combination for dogfighting? Less so for Close Air Support, but as a pure interceptor... Absolutely, but Aerotech has never simulated dogfighting effectively. Very few games have managed that.
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Nov 18, 2012 00:54
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^^^ Crimson Skies did pretty well, and that's basically Battletech with airplanes.DatonKallandor posted:Isn't mobility and forward mounted weaponry a great combination for dogfighting? Less so for Close Air Support, but as a pure interceptor... Head-on passes with long-range weaponry kinda negate the advantage of mounting long-range weaponry when the Seydlitz could mount 2 (and really, probably four) medium lasers for greater overall damage, or a better engine for more mobility. Other fighters are generally going to be mobile enough to keep the Seydlitz from taking advantage of its range, and the ones that aren't? It can't scratch.
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Nov 18, 2012 01:03
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Well, it also depends radically on the environment and sensor quality. The classic example of maneuverability over heft is still the Zero, but that was atmospheric combat (clouds, altitude, and the sun all being factors) with eyeballs as the primary form of detection. Engagement ranges were often close, and most sci-fi/fantasy space combat (since Star Wars) is based on that era because of the glamour typically attached. Battletech is no exception in theme, but the games don't reflect the advantages of agility well at all with the way initiative and the turn based system works. Though it's entirely correct that mounting long range weapons on what should be a knife-fighter is pretty dumb. Corbeau fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Nov 18, 2012 |
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Nov 18, 2012 01:08
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If we're going to have a competition then you should consider tweaking the starting order of mechs somehow. Clan players have an advantage going last!
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