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drat, I was hoping Slippery Pete would be in there somehow.
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Nov 21, 2012 05:39
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IronSaber posted:Micro-update! I don't think so, really. More that that's just a really rude thing to say and it would be quite strange not to be offended.
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Nov 21, 2012 06:00
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It's particularly bad when it's from a voice in your head. No wonder she's depressed so often.
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Nov 21, 2012 06:38
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I am now a Fan Of Prequel. Because it is cool. 
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Nov 28, 2012 03:53
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Why would anybody not be a fan of Prequel?
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Nov 28, 2012 11:43
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The folks translating Etrian Odyssey are also fans of Prequel! (along with Cucumber Quest, Gunnerkrigg Court, a couple of more) Check out the names of the party in this trailer. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iV9GugnThJY&t=48s
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Nov 28, 2012 15:34
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Mad Fnorder posted:The folks translating Etrian Odyssey are also fans of Prequel! (along with Cucumber Quest, Gunnerkrigg Court, a couple of more) Check out the names of the party in this trailer. I guess we know what the staff alt+tabs to in between translations...
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Nov 29, 2012 06:42
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oh yes oh god yes form the head FORM THE HEAD unghhhh...
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Mad Fnorder posted:The folks translating Etrian Odyssey are also fans of Prequel! (along with Cucumber Quest, Gunnerkrigg Court, a couple of more) Check out the names of the party in this trailer. That rules. I know that one of the earlier Etrian Odyssey trailers had a bunch of Homestuck names in it, glad to see those guys must still be around.
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Nov 29, 2012 08:04
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Kaz, who did you piss off to get your avatar changed like that? 
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Dec 6, 2012 22:28
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Probably because of some stuff he posted in the webcomic thread.
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Dec 6, 2012 23:11
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That's actually a new one that's been put in place since IronSaber's post. Looks like Kazerad is managing to get on the bad side of several groups of people???
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Dec 7, 2012 01:23
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Regy Rusty posted:That's actually a new one that's been put in place since IronSaber's post. Looks like Kazerad is managing to get on the bad side of several groups of people??? It's a pretty fun and interesting exchange if you keep up with it, particularly the parts between Tubgirl Cosplay and idonotlikepeas. Link, uh, under my avatar I guess.
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Dec 7, 2012 01:47
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Kazerad posted:It's a pretty fun and interesting exchange if you keep up with it, particularly the parts between Tubgirl Cosplay and idonotlikepeas. Link, uh, under my avatar I guess. I suddely have a hankering for baby-back ribs...
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Dec 7, 2012 03:00
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Kazerad posted:It's a pretty fun and interesting exchange if you keep up with it, particularly the parts between Tubgirl Cosplay and idonotlikepeas. Link, uh, under my avatar I guess. Well, you should have shut up and I wouldnt have learned what an exploitative rear end in a top hat you were. Goddammit. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 7, 2012 06:46
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SynthOrange posted:Well, you should have shut up and I wouldnt have learned what an exploitative rear end in a top hat you were. Goddammit. Whoa whoa whoa, take it easy. I was under the impression that Kaz was making an example out of the economic variances between artists. There's no need for hostility. 
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Dec 7, 2012 07:01
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Not exactly stunned. Didn't we talk about how prequel was an experiment in manipulation or whatever? Eyeballing that thread for one second, in conjunction with some of his posts I skimmed, has led me to believe that Kazerad is literally Boethiah, Prince of Plots, IRL.
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Dec 7, 2012 07:25
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Kazerad posted:It's a pretty fun and interesting exchange if you keep up with it, particularly the parts between Tubgirl Cosplay and idonotlikepeas. Link, uh, under my avatar I guess. That other thread's argument was similarly baffling, but instead because I have trouble even relating to their complaint since I've never supported myself with freelance art and I guess a bunch of them do/have tried to. It was a little shocking just how personally it appeared to hit home with them, so I have to imagine that they've seen or personally experienced all sorts of lovely situations with getting paid for art. I completely understand their point about pricing being totally hosed, but since I've always been on the structured side of working (as in 9 to 5 type stuff) I'm having trouble relating. I guess the main problem is that most of the art they're talking about can be done at home at any hour, so the doors are busted wide open for any bozo with a tablet and free time, which totally screws with the market. Whereas I can't really be expected to take a bunch of frozen pee home with me so I can catalog it at my leisure. So it's hard for me to say "yeah, that guy shouldn't be allowed to sell his art for less than it's worth (assuming you can even determine a discrete value for an art) because it's loving up the market." I would have posted something like this in the other thread, but emotions are running hot over there and I'm a little scared.
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Dec 7, 2012 08:10
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Yeah I awno, goons get mad at dumb poo poo sometimes.
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Dec 7, 2012 08:14
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Zenzirouj posted:That other thread's argument was similarly baffling, but instead because I have trouble even relating to their complaint since I've never supported myself with freelance art and I guess a bunch of them do/have tried to. It was a little shocking just how personally it appeared to hit home with them, so I have to imagine that they've seen or personally experienced all sorts of lovely situations with getting paid for art. I completely understand their point about pricing being totally hosed, but since I've always been on the structured side of working (as in 9 to 5 type stuff) I'm having trouble relating. I guess the main problem is that most of the art they're talking about can be done at home at any hour, so the doors are busted wide open for any bozo with a tablet and free time, which totally screws with the market. Whereas I can't really be expected to take a bunch of frozen pee home with me so I can catalog it at my leisure. So it's hard for me to say "yeah, that guy shouldn't be allowed to sell his art for less than it's worth (assuming you can even determine a discrete value for an art) because it's loving up the market." Yeah, the thread got pretty heated. I think it hit a nerve with them because my words gave the impression I was a Big Exploitin' Man who goes around direly underpaying artists to do all my work for me, completely missing the parts where I said the low prices would drive artists to hire other artists and collaborate. That's really where my position is in this: I'm an artist and I sometimes hire other artists who are within my low budget to create something better than we could have done alone. I'm not going to wait around until I can pay them ten times their asking price. gently caress, sometimes when I contact these people they are struggling to get money for food. If it's wrong to pay their asking price then and there then I'm not terribly interested in what is right. I think the business behind art and the different setups that can evolve from it are extremely interesting, but it's filled with a lot of people grouching about how the field is full of problems and how artists need to band together to make people appreciate their occupation. I feel like a lot of those problems are misunderstood benefits, but I think I'd rather explore them myself and see how it works out. If it backfires horribly you all, knowing what I am doing, can learn from my disasters! The people who kept bringing up how my advice didn't count because I was doing Oblivion/Homestuck stuff were pretty baffling since I made it clear I was talking about projects done before that. I fanficed so hard that it altered time and turned all my past experience into fanfiction too. e: vvvv not looking for accolades; just restating my feelings on it. I continued some stuff in that thread via PMs, you're welcome to join in if you are interested. Kazerad fucked around with this message at 09:07 on Dec 7, 2012 |
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Dec 7, 2012 08:52
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Yeah, I disliked the hyperbole over the comic too. Mainly because you can use that as an easy out to show they're unreasonable instead of the people making actual points about the things you actually said. Why make up a absurd strawman of people disagreeing with you when they'll gladly volunteer to be absurd. Just because this thread has your fans in it doesn't mean you can take it here and get accolades. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 7, 2012 09:02
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I've been reading the comic here and there from the start, and just got through the awesomely javascripted part, and wanted to mention that Prequel is really cool and I got to this thread just in time, it seems.
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Dec 7, 2012 09:06
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Guys, we all stopped talking about it in the other thread because it was getting lovely. Let's avoid reopening the can of worms in this thread, because this thread is also one of the least lovely threads I've seen for a comic with this many people that hate it and it would be great if we could keep it that way. I think the safest thing to say is that we've got a bunch of different people here with different ideas about what the morally correct way of hiring independent artists is. I genuinely do not believe anyone is trying to be an rear end in a top hat, and I think that lots of people feel very strongly about this issue, so let's just let it go and maybe come back to it once there's a bit more distance from this argument.
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Dec 7, 2012 09:08
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Oh sure, there's no problem with the fact that artists are used to getting paid less than minimum wage and exploiting and perpetuating that myth because artists are SO loving GRATEFUL TO GET WORK and AMAZED at your generosity in paying more than they could imagine, yet still far less than what their work would be worth is nothing to get angry about. gently caress that. gently caress THIS poo poo. You were addressing a whole bunch of artists who have been there and are calling out exploitative bullshit and the reason we were so pissed off is that we've all heard your loving excuses a thousand times before. 'It'll get you great exposure.' 'It'll be great for your portfolio' 'Be grateful for work'. gently caress that. It only leads to artists continuing to get screwed over because they're trapped in that lovely mentality and grubbing for any work when there's far more options out there. You're part of the problem, not a solution. You say the system is not fair on one hand then you squeeze everything out of it on the other. Synthbuttrange fucked around with this message at 10:59 on Dec 7, 2012 |
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Dec 7, 2012 10:46
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Can we just not go there? Please?
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Dec 7, 2012 12:20
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Zenzirouj posted:Maybe I'd be angrier if I ever read Homestuck?
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Dec 7, 2012 13:54
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Boy, I sure do like hearing about the personal life of the artist in a webcomic about a promiscuous alcoholic catgirl.
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Dec 7, 2012 14:08
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And here I thought the comic had updated from the amount of replies I saw in this thread. 
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Dec 7, 2012 14:21
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When I said shut up about it in the General Webcomic thread I didn't mean poo poo up this or any other thread.
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Dec 7, 2012 14:43
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Ok, so how misogynist is it for a male to write for a self-loathing self-destructive female character? It seems like there is a lot of sympathy in the writing, but is it being let down by a lack of explicit sociological critique?
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Dec 7, 2012 22:47
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I like it when the cat makes fire.
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Dec 7, 2012 23:13
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DEAD MAN'S SHOE posted:Ok, so how misogynist is it for a male to write for a self-loathing self-destructive female character? That's a valid point. That said, he's reaching the untapped audience of people who are trapped by emotions and circumstance. People who are in that position might have trouble intellectually analyzing someone they identify with so strongly. Katia struggles with constant sense of self-loathing and self-doubt. She recognizes that a lot of her thoughts are wrong but still takes the validity of the negative thinking. She was able to escape from a lifetime of being in an overbearing family and destructive coping mechanisms in order to form a new identity from scratch. That's something a lot of us have trouble with. Somehow the little victories and a vague sense of "things can be different" keep her going. That's a very meaningful and very powerful message.
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Dec 7, 2012 23:48
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DEAD MAN'S SHOE posted:Ok, so how misogynist is it for a male to write for a self-loathing self-destructive female character?
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Dec 7, 2012 23:48
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It's striking how much gender equality runs throughout the Elder Scrolls game world yet the main character hates herself for having sex. Nothing is psychologically impossible but the writer has to be able to address the contradiction or it will just look like they are playing with dolls. It might be OK for an audience that will massively self-identify and then generously provide their own backstory and rationale but to let that happen is a huge cop out and gives nobody any new perspective.
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Dec 8, 2012 02:17
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She doesn't hate herself for having sex, she hates herself to having anonymous sex with random assholes while blackout drunk. I know it's a subtle difference, but it's pretty important!
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Dec 8, 2012 02:53
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There seems to be no other kind with which to compare and that's something that needs better explanation, particularly if we are supposed to enjoy a pole-dancing minigame at the same time.
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Dec 8, 2012 03:37
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Dec 8, 2012 03:53
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DEAD MAN'S SHOE posted:There seems to be no other kind with which to compare and that's something that needs better explanation, particularly if we are supposed to enjoy a pole-dancing minigame at the same time. I've never been there, but I'm sure ADTRW can help you fulfill your quota of catgirl sex.
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Dec 8, 2012 04:44
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Kalos posted:I've never been there, but I'm sure ADTRW can help you fulfill your quota of catgirl sex. yes, well you see I was having a fun time  with that pole dancing minigame but it occurred to me that the character would regret it and I was so conflicted
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Dec 8, 2012 04:57
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DEAD MAN'S SHOE posted:yes, well you see I was having a fun time Yeah, can't say I'm a huge fan of the constant ALCOHOLIC SLUT!!! thing coming up pretty much semi-constantly. Even knowing women out there who feel that way, the flippant take on it really is abrasive, and feels more like soapboxing than a character moment. I won't blanket-statement it as 'misogynistic,' but it's really uncomfortable. Keeping in mind that if a woman was writing it, I'd be feeling more or less the same way in my reactions. I'll admit, I wish it'd drop out entirely; I like the series, I'm just not into that gimmick. It's getting to the point of preachy when it comes up, and really stands out on a glaring level.  Saying this as someone who literally started and finished it in a couple evenings. It might be different if I was reading it in staggered installments, but I can't say that for certain because... yeah, wow, that poo poo stands out. e: grammar fail Old Boot fucked around with this message at 10:48 on Dec 8, 2012 |
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Dec 8, 2012 10:44
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An Old Boot posted:Yeah, can't say I'm a huge fan of the constant ALCOHOLIC SLUT!!! thing coming up pretty much semi-constantly. Even knowing women out there who feel that way, the flippant take on it really is abrasive, and feels more like soapboxing than a character moment. I won't blanket-statement it as 'misogynistic,' but it's really uncomfortable. Keeping in mind that if a woman was writing it, I'd be feeling more or less the same way in my reactions.
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Dec 8, 2012 10:46
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