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paint dry posted:I've only recently gotten into wrestling (well, I was a fan when I was a little kid watching Hulk Hogan and Randy Savage on terrible pirate VHSs - I was the right age to enjoy the Attitude Era but unfortunately by that time wrestling was my little brother's thing and therefore it was by default Lame, Stupid and Totally Gay) and I guess I don't really get how some stuff "works." You still get hurt, usually they work through the minor sustained injuries. Those matches ar a large part of the reason edge retired and why christian is so easily hurt these days.
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Dec 23, 2012 14:49
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Yeah, they do get injured frequently, especially in matches like TLC. There are tricks for minimizing the damage done. Frontal head shots with chairs, for example, watch where they put their arms. They put them up to protect their heads, so the chair just hits their forearms. Still hurts like hell, but a lot better than taking it on the head. Although there are instances where people do just take it straight on the head. If you want to see someone taking DOZENS of unprotected chairshots, look up The Rock vs Mankind I Quit match. Tables are just tables though. When they go through a table, it might be a flimsy table, but they're legit going through it. WYSIWYG. Gyro Zeppeli fucked around with this message at 15:13 on Dec 23, 2012 |
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Dec 23, 2012 15:10
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I think the simplest answer to the question is its an industry filled with people who retire with crippling pain, who harbor drug addictions, and who constantly die young. There's very few secrets of wrestling. The crap you think should do damage usually does.
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Dec 23, 2012 15:15
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SamuraiFoochs posted:Wait what? Cromulent fucked around with this message at 15:28 on Dec 23, 2012 |
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Dec 23, 2012 15:25
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I remember that too, which made it *really* funny that one time Michaels came out in his white Undertaker suit during their feud.
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Dec 23, 2012 16:42
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Cromulent posted:Other such rumors were that Too Cool were going to have a gay wedding, That one is actually true.
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Dec 23, 2012 16:45
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The spot that always gets me is in any ladder match, the inevitable and numerous "ladder falls over with someone at/near the top" spots. That seems like it'd be so unpredictable that there should be a lot more career ending injuries. Re: Vince theoretically writing memoirs, I can totally imagine him as Roger in Mad Men, sitting at his desk and saying random things into a tape recorder.
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Dec 23, 2012 16:55
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And then poor Joey Mercury had his face exploded by a ladder.
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Dec 23, 2012 17:02
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Quick question, which Rotten brother is the bad one? Because I am talking to one Peter B Beautiful, currently 400-something on the low end of the PWI 500, and he's working a tai pei death match with Ian Rotten locally. Is he the one I have in my avatar, or is that the other one? I want to believe he's working with the good Rotten, but that seems a bit of an oxymoron on face, so I'm kinda inclined it's the lovely one. If it's the lovely one, I'm kinda tempted to crash the event screaming about that funeral he crashed. I mean, I talk to Pete regular, and would feel bad for crashing his match, but the funeral crasher is seriously an awful person. E: Also, the idea just occurred to me that I should buy Peter B Beautiful an account. I wish I wasn't broke, I'd so do this so he could host an AMA thread. That would be wonderful. Peter actually ended up on Wrestling Gone Wrong back in the day for a match he worked with Ian Rotten. If he could drop kayfabe for 5 minutes, he'd probably be interesting to talk to. maybe I should talk him into doing it. cucka fucked around with this message at 17:09 on Dec 23, 2012 |
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Dec 23, 2012 17:06
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Ian is the terrible one. I've never heard anything overly bad about Axl.
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Dec 23, 2012 17:11
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cucka posted:Quick question, which Rotten brother is the bad one? Because I am talking to one Peter B Beautiful, currently 400-something on the low end of the PWI 500, and he's working a tai pei death match with Ian Rotten locally. Is he the one I have in my avatar, or is that the other one? I want to believe he's working with the good Rotten, but that seems a bit of an oxymoron on face, so I'm kinda inclined it's the lovely one. e;f,b Maxwell Lord posted:The spot that always gets me is in any ladder match, the inevitable and numerous "ladder falls over with someone at/near the top" spots. That seems like it'd be so unpredictable that there should be a lot more career ending injuries.
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Dec 23, 2012 17:14
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oldskool posted:Ian's the bad one. I figured as much, was just hoping the dude wasn't associating with a scumbag. If only I didn't have to work.
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Dec 23, 2012 17:21
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cucka posted:If it's the lovely one, I'm kinda tempted to crash the event screaming about that funeral he crashed. I mean, I talk to Pete regular, and would feel bad for crashing his match, but the funeral crasher is seriously an awful person. iirc Rotten has Hep C, so cutting the match short would probably be doing Pete a favor.
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Dec 23, 2012 17:22
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It just seems unpredictable to me because you've got an object involved and you also have to make sure it falls where it's supposed to.
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Dec 23, 2012 17:23
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cucka posted:Quick question, which Rotten brother is the bad one? Because I am talking to one Peter B Beautiful, currently 400-something on the low end of the PWI 500, and he's working a tai pei death match with Ian Rotten locally. Is he the one I have in my avatar, or is that the other one? I want to believe he's working with the good Rotten, but that seems a bit of an oxymoron on face, so I'm kinda inclined it's the lovely one. Wait. Why the gently caress is Peter B Beautiful a) Still around and b) working with Ian Rotten again? You'd think he'd want to be as far away from Rotten as possible after what happened last time
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Dec 23, 2012 17:35
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Ziggy Tzardust posted:Wait. Why the gently caress is Peter B Beautiful a) Still around and b) working with Ian Rotten again? You'd think he'd want to be as far away from Rotten as possible after what happened last time And I don't think it's necessary to go out of your way to get Peter B. Beautiful an account here. That's not exactly a huge "get" and I remember him being a mark for himself on other wrestling boards in the past.
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Dec 23, 2012 18:39
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Q: Is there a list of every meaning for CM that Punk has suggested himself? (Chick Magnet, Charles Montgomery, etc.?)
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Dec 23, 2012 18:45
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Probably somewhere if you look hard enough. My personal favourite was Crooked Moonsault.
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Dec 23, 2012 18:48
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VogeGandire posted:Probably somewhere if you look hard enough. "Chicago Made" seems to make the most sense, but the Simpsons reference is probably my favorite.
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Dec 23, 2012 19:26
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According to Scott Stanford it's "Caring Man", and I will not hear of any other idea. 
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Dec 23, 2012 19:28
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When he was doing commentary it was Company Man.
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Dec 23, 2012 21:56
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This might seem like a weird question not 100% suited for this thread, but I'm bored so I'll throw it out there: What do you think is most important in wrestling, the storytelling, the physical performance, the long-term preservation of the industry through the cultivation of big stars, or some combination of the three? The reason I ask this is because I was reading up on various people's retrospectives on 2002, which was my first year as a full-time wrestling fan, and one thing really stuck out for me: all of the critics were so angry about Hulk Hogan becoming Undisputed Champion they wanted to throw their TVs out a window. Now, there are parts of the argument about why this is that make plenty of sense, such as it being bad for the future of the company to have a guy as big as Triple H lose the title strait up after only a month or so to such an old-timer, or that Hogan's matches were of poor quality due to his age and all his competitors were doing a lot to carry him, which shattered the illusion of competition and devalued the championship. And there is plenty of understandable and well-deserved bitterness toward Hogan for his part in the death of WCW, the history of keeping others down for his and his friend's sakes, and his general egomania. But from a storytelling perspective, the return of Hogan as an NWO member (the poor quality of the 2002 NWO not withstanding) the "resurgance of Hulkamania," during his match with Rock, the return to his old colors, and his final test and testament to the fans that had "redeemed," him by making one last run against a worthy foe (eg, another face in high standing with the fans) for the belt was all really good storytelling. Not that complicated or anything, but then again not that different at its building blocks than HBK's capture of the belt that very same year at the first Elimination Chamber. Yet while everyone seems to have unfettered love for the later (me included, the entire HBK vs HHH rivalry was brilliant, and a huge part of what made me fall in love with wrestling), the former seems universally reviled. To me, storytelling was always the best thing about wrestling, with the other two being things that helped facilitate that storytelling but should never be placed over it in importance. But thats just my opinion. I'd love to hear other ones.
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Dec 23, 2012 22:04
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I always thought Hogan got the strap so they could say he was the final WWF World Champion and the first WWE World Champion.
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Dec 23, 2012 22:05
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VogeGandire posted:If you want to see someone taking DOZENS of unprotected chairshots, look up The Rock vs Mankind I Quit match.
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Dec 24, 2012 02:38
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Yeah, he has mentioned a few things that he's either fuzzy on or straight-up can't remember. Like THAT HiaC, he can't remember any of the match, or any of the treatment afterward. But yeah, I really struggle to watch that match all the way through. I mean, it's a good match until the chairshots start...and don't stop. I can see why his wife and kids legit left and didn't watch the ending.
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Dec 24, 2012 02:40
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Maxwell Lord posted:The spot that always gets me is in any ladder match, the inevitable and numerous "ladder falls over with someone at/near the top" spots. That seems like it'd be so unpredictable that there should be a lot more career ending injuries. Sanguinia posted:This might seem like a weird question not 100% suited for this thread, but I'm bored so I'll throw it out there: What do you think is most important in wrestling, the storytelling, the physical performance, the long-term preservation of the industry through the cultivation of big stars, or some combination of the three? If I really had to pick between the two, I'd say that professional wrestling is about people being paid to wrestle. Look at it this way: Have you ever watched an action movie that had great action scenes but a lovely plot? Cool. Now, how often do you watch action movies with an exceptionally good plot (for an action movie), but lovely action scenes? I'm not entirely sure what you group under "storytelling," but I'm against the idea that the matches exist to facilitate promos, rather than the reverse. That's kind of the problem with WWE wrestling today--the wrestlers are cartoon characters who decide to settle their drama with each other in televised spandex battles for unexplained reasons--as opposed to acting like athletes who want to win matches and championships, and matches end up creating feuds which in turn lead to more matches. quote:Now, there are parts of the argument about why this is that make plenty of sense, such as it being bad for the future of the company to have a guy as big as Triple H lose the title strait up after only a month or so to such an old-timer, or that Hogan's matches were of poor quality due to his age and all his competitors were doing a lot to carry him, which shattered the illusion of competition and devalued the championship. All that stuff about his final character arc--those points are well-made. But I'm a guy who likes pro wrestling for the same reasons I like kung fu movies, and when people say "But pro wrestling's fake!" my reply is "Let me blow your loving mind: Matt Damon is not actually a polymath genius assassin, and he probably never hosed Julia Stiles." I will watch a kung fu movie in Cantonese with no subtitles if the fight scenes are good. Likewise, I would rather watch two technicians who know how to tell a story through their wrestling styles have a great midcard match than watch Hogan do anything.
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Dec 24, 2012 03:01
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VogeGandire posted:THAT HiaC, he can't remember any of the match, or any of the treatment afterward. I don't think that's entirely accurate. The way I remember hearing it is that he couldn't remember most of it in the days immediately following the match, but that it all came back to him over time. Obviously that's still pretty awful, but it doesn't really prove anything about the long-term effects of the match (which I'm sure are pretty loving bad anyway).
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Dec 24, 2012 05:49
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fatherdog posted:iirc Rotten has Hep C, so cutting the match short would probably be doing Pete a favor. Quoting this because doing a Tai Pei Death Match with Ian loving Rotten is one of the dumbest ideas ever. I remember seeing a pic of the original between Axl and Ian in an old dirtsheet when I was in middle school and freaking out. They used broken glass and it was real? Holy poo poo! Then I saw the match years later and it sucked a dick. This is not going to be any better in front of like 10 people and he's going to get an incurable disease on top of it so I hope it's worth the extra $50.
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Dec 24, 2012 05:52
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What is the deal with Savage/Warrior finish at Wrestlemania? Seems like there's some miscomunication.
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Dec 24, 2012 10:02
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Halloween Jack posted:Because it's not a competitive sport, the match is a story and tells a story. I don't think you can separate the physical performance from storytelling. I didn't mean to disparage the actual wrestling as a storytelling element at all. I know how important it is. I mean, we all remember the Finger Poke of Doom. There was some justification for it from a storytelling perspective, but we all know what an insult it was to the fans, the locker room, and the industry in general. By comparison, one of my all time favorite matches, the famous Taker vs Matt Hardy ladder match, was entirely self-contained and a brilliant piece of storytelling that needed no special setup to work amazingly. What I was talking about was when the focus on the physical spectacle, of the feats that a given guy is capable of or the chemistry he has with other major performers is so overriding a concern that storytelling both in and out of the ring take a backseat, and the plot becomes an excuse to allow them to fight just because there is some desire to see them fight with no real narrative or meaning to that fight, not even one self-contained within that fight like that ladder match I mentioned. Its not that I was really dismissing the physical element, or saying that matches should only exist to fuel the soap opera stuff (I too hate how much the idea that this is a sport has fallen by the wayside and agree more characters should be motivated more often by their desire to win that sport). Rather, I was saying that all too often storytelling takes a backseat to bloodsport moments where all people care about is seeing a big hit land, and that bums me out. Like you said, you can enjoy the Kung Fu movie for the action alone without knowing any of the story, and I often do myself. But I sure as hell prefer my subtitles on.
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Dec 24, 2012 10:06
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Diabolik900 posted:I don't think that's entirely accurate. The way I remember hearing it is that he couldn't remember most of it in the days immediately following the match, but that it all came back to him over time. Obviously that's still pretty awful, but it doesn't really prove anything about the long-term effects of the match (which I'm sure are pretty loving bad anyway). Nope, he legit can't remember it. He had to watch a video of it to write about it in his autobiography, and wasn't aware Terry Funk was even at the show until they talked a few days later.
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Dec 24, 2012 12:18
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VogeGandire posted:Nope, he legit can't remember it. He had to watch a video of it to write about it in his autobiography, and wasn't aware Terry Funk was even at the show until they talked a few days later. I don't have a copy of Have a Nice Day nearby to check what it says, but this ESPN interview seems to confirm most of my recollection of what he said. He does say there's about 30 seconds that he doesn't remember (which is where Terry Funk got involved) but it's only a short portion of the match. Here's the relevant quote: quote:"I pieced back all of the match in my memory now except for about a 30-second period when I went through the cage and into the ring. There was a point where I saw a pair of sneakers in the ring and I had no idea how they had gotten there. So there were 30 or 40 seconds there that had gone by that I couldn't remember and I'm still not aware of. The day after I had very little recollection of what actually happened." I'm sure the match was absolutely terrible for his long-term health either way, but he only claims to have had no memory of it for a relatively short period of time immediately afterward.
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Dec 24, 2012 13:48
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Chinston Wurchill posted:He had a four-star affair with a cardboard cutout of Rocky Balboa. Don West was amazing as a colour commentator and I will not hear otherwise.
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Dec 24, 2012 15:28
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Sotar posted:Don West was amazing as a colour commentator and I will not hear otherwise. I'll take his bemused ultra enthusiasm over Taz's bemused "I'm too good for this poo poo" bewilderment any day.
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Dec 24, 2012 15:38
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Sanguinia posted:By comparison, one of my all time favorite matches, the famous Taker vs Matt Hardy ladder match, was entirely self-contained and a brilliant piece of storytelling that needed no special setup to work amazingly. Are you talking about the Taker & JEFF Hardy ladder match in 2002, or was there one later done with Matt Hardy that I'm not aware of. I stopped watching WWE completely in 2007, so I genuinely don't know.
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Dec 24, 2012 17:44
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Sanguinia posted:I didn't mean to disparage the actual wrestling as a storytelling element at all. I know how important it is. I mean, we all remember the Finger Poke of Doom. There was some justification for it from a storytelling perspective, but we all know what an insult it was to the fans, the locker room, and the industry in general. By comparison, one of my all time favorite matches, the famous Taker vs Matt Hardy ladder match, was entirely self-contained and a brilliant piece of storytelling that needed no special setup to work amazingly.
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Dec 24, 2012 19:09
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Shiki Dan posted:Are you talking about the Taker & JEFF Hardy ladder match in 2002, or was there one later done with Matt Hardy that I'm not aware of. Yes I am. My bad.
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Dec 24, 2012 19:21
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Here's a question: Is there anything more fun than playing WWE '13 and just beating the poo poo out of Billy Gunn for hours on end?
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Dec 24, 2012 19:58
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Neodoomium posted:Here's a question: Watching created video game characters played by the computer beat the poo poo out of each other for hours on end.
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Dec 24, 2012 20:23
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Critical posted:Watching created video game characters played by the computer beat the poo poo out of each other for hours on end. Especially if it's a Triple Threat match. So many finishers...
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Dec 24, 2012 20:34
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