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QPZIL posted:Also just a confirmation that M4/3 lens mounts are the same across Olympus/Panasonic/etc.
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Jan 3, 2013 01:23
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QPZIL posted:Also just a confirmation that M4/3 lens mounts are the same across Olympus/Panasonic/etc. Yep, though some Pana lenses have image stabilization that's redundant on Olympus bodies, but you can turn off the IBIS.
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Jan 3, 2013 04:35
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Out of curiosity, what happens if you leave both on? Do they stack or does it get worse?
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Jan 3, 2013 08:51
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spankmeister posted:Out of curiosity, what happens if you leave both on? Do they stack or does it get worse? It doesn't stack. At best you get a normal image, at worst the image will be blur as both IS systems try to compensate for each other.
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Jan 3, 2013 11:21
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Can report that the Olympus 40-150 was on sale here recently (1290 SEK for the "portrait kit" including the lens, bag and 8 gig SDHC card; about half of normal price) so picked one up. Feels pretty "cheap" but seems well enough built and the optics are quite good (check the PZ review which was not bad at all). Should make for an excellent travel setup together with the 12-50 and a fast prime like the 20/1.7. They recently revamped the 40-150 cosmetically so it looks a little more like the 12-50, but the optics should be identical to the older version.
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Jan 3, 2013 19:29
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Clayton Bigsby posted:Can report that the Olympus 40-150 was on sale here recently (1290 SEK for the "portrait kit" including the lens, bag and 8 gig SDHC card; about half of normal price) so picked one up. Feels pretty "cheap" but seems well enough built and the optics are quite good (check the PZ review which was not bad at all). Should make for an excellent travel setup together with the 12-50 and a fast prime like the 20/1.7. They recently revamped the 40-150 cosmetically so it looks a little more like the 12-50, but the optics should be identical to the older version. I kind of regret selling mine last year. True, the build quality was very cheap but it was super light and the AF was pretty damned quick for a kit zoom. I still have the classic 40-150 f/3.5-4.5 but the AF is a little too sloppy for wildlife stuff on a u4/3 body. Bouillon Rube fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Jan 3, 2013 |
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Jan 3, 2013 19:57
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So after using my xpro1 over the holidays-- I really don't like it as much as I thought I would. I might sell the 35 1.4 and try the 18/2 for a bit to see if the FOV is more to my liking and a saving grace for the camera-- but the AF still isn't all that great, raws have problems in Lightroom, and I'd rather not take too large of a $ hit for a camera I'm not in love with. I liked the X100 way more-- so I'm not sure if I'm willing to keep a larger and more expensive camera to do act relatively the same (xpro + 18/2). Might even sell it this week before Fuji announces their X100s/x200 next week-- but either way, this isn't the camera I was hoping it would be.
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Jan 3, 2013 20:18
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Shmoogy posted:So after using my xpro1 over the holidays-- I really don't like it as much as I thought I would. I might sell the 35 1.4 and try the 18/2 for a bit to see if the FOV is more to my liking and a saving grace for the camera-- but the AF still isn't all that great, raws have problems in Lightroom, and I'd rather not take too large of a $ hit for a camera I'm not in love with. Are you sure you're current on all your lens/body firmware updates? I know those make a pretty significant difference. The AF will never be DSLR fast on the X series cameras/lenses, but I am hoping their new AF motors they are using on all the new lenses will make a bigger difference, along with maybe another firmware push to get things a little better still. I got rid of my Xpro1 and totally regret it, I'm looking at the xe1 right now and thinking I may have to make room in my heart to be a 2 system kind of guy. There are things I got from my xpro1 that I am unable to get from my OM-D, and vice versa - having both would be almost the perfection of desire.
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Jan 3, 2013 21:09
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Yeah everything is current. It's a nice camera- but everything sort of adds up and results in a slight disappointment for me- it's not an improvement over the X100 at all, the EVF still isn't very good, the autoISO leaves a lot of room for improvement. I'm tempted to try the OM-D to see if the compromises it makes are closer to what I'm looking for- but I think the 2012 mirrorless cameras just aren't for me. I might try the Sony nex6 and see if that handles things more towards what I'm looking for. e: I think the RX1 would honestly be the best, but I'm not buying it at anywhere near the current price. $1500-1800 is probably the highest I'd really consider for the time being.
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Jan 3, 2013 21:27
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The EX-1 has the better EVF if that was a big deal.
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Jan 3, 2013 22:03
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Shmoogy posted:Yeah everything is current. It's a nice camera- but everything sort of adds up and results in a slight disappointment for me- it's not an improvement over the X100 at all, the EVF still isn't very good, the autoISO leaves a lot of room for improvement. I'm tempted to try the OM-D to see if the compromises it makes are closer to what I'm looking for- but I think the 2012 mirrorless cameras just aren't for me. That sounds like my own terrible spiral over the last 6 months of 2012. I have a genuine love of Mirrorless cameras, in terms of form factor and the quality of image you get from them, but I have yet to find the "perfect" camera, and it's cost me in terms of wasted money and time, as well as made most of the local camera store owners think I must be retarded. The reality of the situation is that I am at least slightly OCD and coupled with a decent, slightly disposable income, it enables me to make tremendously BAD decisions on the fly, which I typically regret fully and yet somehow manage to never really learn any proper sort of lesson from. Here's my 2012 camera history, just for shits and giggles: January 2012: I enter the year owning a Fujifilm X100, NEX 5n, and a Ricoh GXR with the M-Mount module - I love the X100 but feel cramped by the 35mm focal length, whereas the GXR is great but would have made more sense if I had a plethora of M-Mount glass at my disposal, which I did not have. The NEX5n was dead sexy and more or less rendered the GXR redundant, so you can see what I was starting to think... gently caress it, why not trade it all in and get a regular boy DSLR - Enter the Canon EOS 60d. March-April-ish 2012: the 60d has reminded my why I really dislike full size DSLR's, so it goes back to camera store. all the big bulky Canon gear gets turned into a tiny, svelte Panasonic Lumix GX1 and the dreamy 25/1.4 lens. Great lens, not so great camera, maybe just a little too tiny for my taste. May 2012: I go into the camera store with the Lumix and I leave with a NEX 7 and the LA-EA2 Adapter. I almost fall in love with this combination, but by turning the NEX7 into basically an awkward DSLR, I am already subverting the whole point of having a small, mirrorless camera. Also, the IQ of the NEX 7 turns out to be not as nice as the 5n, IMHO. Late May, it all goes in and out comes a Nikon D7000. June 2012: I've had the D7000 for a couple of weeks, so I must be getting sick of it by now, right? Actually, a smash and grab on my car solves my D7000 problems before I get a chance to even develop them. gently caress, this must be karma. Late June hits, and I scrape together the money to replace my pilfered D7000 - Hello OM-D #1 July-August 2012: I still love my OM-D, have I finally found my dream camera? September 2012: Obviously not. The OM-D goes bye-bye in a moment of poor judgment and OCD mania. September is a weird, bad month - first comes and just as quickly goes a used NEX 5n, and by now even I am understanding just how crazy this is. Then I tinker with a Sony RX-100 for a whole 48 hours. I return the RX-100 with the plan of making a deposit on a D600, figuring that full-frame is the cure to what ails me, only I somehow end up leaving the store with a Fuji XPro1. gently caress I AM CRAZY. October 2012: I have become frustrated with the AF accuracy of the XPro 1, culminating with me returning from my friend's wedding with absolutely ZERO salvageable photos. I love what the camera is capable of under controlled circumstances, but as my sole-camera, I am not finding it a good fit for my impatient and fickle brain. I trade it in, knowing I will regret it, and attempt to right the wrong originally created when I got rid of OM-D #1 by bringing home OM-D #2. THIS IS WHERE I SHOULD HAVE STOPPED, as I had a truly malevolent setup with both the lusty 25/1.4 and the 45/1.8 lenses, and all was right with the universe. Everything that had been bugging me about the OM-D previously was gone, and I just appreciated it for what it was and it rewarded me with some truly excellent images. November 2012: oh hello NEX 6 - are you what I've been waiting for my entire life? December 2012: NO. Hello OM-D #3. For my sins, I am now having to rebuild my lens collection, so no 25 or 45 for me yet. Again, I am reminded how retarded I am and how foolish it was to ever get rid of the OM-D (twice!) to begin with. It's 2013, and my outlook is NO MORE SUBTRACTION. I have asked the local camera shop folks to no longer let me trade stuff in (those were fun, slightly humiliating conversations) and now my plan is to only add to my equipment, instead of constantly cannibilizing my gear to get new, shinier gear. I have a couple of lenses for the OM-D that are on my short list, and I may branch into a second system with the XE-1 to heal the heartache I still feel over getting rid of the XPro1, but not at the expense of having to get rid of the OM-D. Have I learned something? Am I growing and processing the data from previous mistakes? gently caress if I know, probably not. I'm a fickle dude with too much time on my hands, I should be out taking pictures with what I have instead of reading about things I don't have on the internet. The glass is always shinier in the next camera shop, or whatnot. I'm entering this year with intent to do the right thing, despite what my fickle brain wants me to do. I have a great camera, and that should be enough, right? Now to go make some photos. The moral of this sad tale? DON'T BE ME.
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Jan 3, 2013 23:16
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That's hilarious and you're a little bit worse than me with regards to gear acquisition syndrome. I kept and have been moderately happy with my 5d2 and 1d2 for well over a year now- but as they're large and heavy, I wanted smaller cameras to take for travel, outings, restaurants etc. I basically want something that can give me the AF speed/accuracy of the OM-D (I'd prefer 1d2+ quality focus ability but being realistic with regards to mirrorless cameras), a 1.4-1.8-2~ pancake lens with good sharpness, good ISO3200+ would be nice, and a built in flash for emergency use when I can't setup flashes but want to get a shot. Pocketability would be nice, but I always have a bag with me, so it's not a dealbreaker. The next things are just general wants so that I could be perfectly happy with just a 1Ds2, and not lust over a 1d3/5d3/1d4/et.al: Ability to mount ef-s lens, ability to use off camera lighting, focus peaking, good quality LCD screen -- I plan to do more food photography so if I could get all this in my mirrorless, I would probably get rid of my 5d2 without any problems. My Sony Nex5n covers almost everything well enough, except the stupid nonstandard hotshoe- so I was tempted to pick up a nex6 as a stop-gap.
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Jan 3, 2013 23:33
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For everyone feeling cramped by the X100 - what are your thoughts on composite images or the wide angle conversion?
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Jan 3, 2013 23:48
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Shmoogy posted:e: I think the RX1 would honestly be the best, but I'm not buying it at anywhere near the current price. $1500-1800 is probably the highest I'd really consider for the time being. If you're looking for AF, then the RX-1 probably isn't your thing. My friend who has a X-E1 tried out the RX-1 said that the AF was even slower than his X-E1.
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Jan 4, 2013 00:12
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alkanphel posted:If you're looking for AF, then the RX-1 probably isn't your thing. My friend who has a X-E1 tried out the RX-1 said that the AF was even slower than his X-E1. That was my takeaway after groping one @ Glazers Camera here in Seattle as well. It felt good in hand, but the manual focus by wire was no real performance improvement over the XE-1, nor was the AF ability. Photos from it look drat fine, but I already know it's not for me. My guess is that what Sony follows this up with will be one hell of a camera, assuming they incorporate all the feedback this one generates.
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Jan 4, 2013 00:47
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krackmonkey posted:That was my takeaway after groping one @ Glazers Camera here in Seattle as well. It felt good in hand, but the manual focus by wire was no real performance improvement over the XE-1, nor was the AF ability. Photos from it look drat fine, but I already know it's not for me. My guess is that what Sony follows this up with will be one hell of a camera, assuming they incorporate all the feedback this one generates. Yeah I suspect the RX-1 is Sony's way of testing the market for a FF MILC, much like what Fuji did with the X100.
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Jan 4, 2013 02:22
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I wonder what would happen if Sony went "gently caress it" and made a pro NEX with full weather sealing, dual processors for fast operation, dual card slots and all that?
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Jan 4, 2013 04:49
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What would happen is I would buy the gently caress out of it.
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Jan 4, 2013 05:19
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HPL posted:I wonder what would happen if Sony went "gently caress it" and made a pro NEX with full weather sealing, dual processors for fast operation, dual card slots and all that? Everyone would simultaneously groan since it would mean a new line of FF glass would need to be developed, when their APS-C line only has like 5 first-party lenses after a few years.
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Jan 4, 2013 05:46
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bobfather posted:Everyone would simultaneously groan since it would mean a new line of FF glass would need to be developed, when their APS-C line only has like 5 first-party lenses after a few years. It wouldn't have to be FF. Sony would have a chance to really shake things up if they could make a crop body that could perform to a high standard. It would be like when journalists went from Speed Graphics to Rolleis or Rolleis to 35mm cameras. There was a technical decrease in quality each time but it was worth the trade-off because of the advantages.
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Jan 4, 2013 06:20
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alkanphel posted:Yeah I suspect the RX-1 is Sony's way of testing the market for a FF MILC, much like what Fuji did with the X100. All I want is sony to release rx2 or whatever with the same lens and everything but add a hybrid viewfinder in there. 
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Jan 4, 2013 07:24
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keyframe posted:All I want is sony to release rx2 or whatever with the same lens and everything but add a hybrid viewfinder in there. I suspect the body size must grow for that, probably to X-Pro 1 size? As it is I think the RX-1 is almost the same size as the X-E1.
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Jan 4, 2013 07:36
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Hello, Sometime in April or May I will be going to Peru on vacation and I'm looking for a camera. We will be on a guided tour through the jungle and mountain areas, and of course Machu Picchu. So there is going to be a wide variety of things to shoot, from plants and animals to old ruins, and vistas. I currently own a Canon 50D with stock lens. I barely use it because of the bulk, so I'm selling it and looking at mirror-less options. Also, another reason for selling, is I just want something a bit more simple. I don't need all of the options the 50D provided for setting up a shot, but at the same time I'd like a little more control than a typical P&S if / when I want it. The mirror-less cameras are new to me as I haven't shopped for a camera in at least 5 years. What I've been looking at so far are the NEX-5n and the E-PL5. The OM-D is also very enticing but I'm not sure I can justify the price tag. I think I'd rather get something <$700 and buy another lens. The other thing that would be helpful is to narrow down some lenses that would cover the most shots for the trip with as few lenses as possible. Preferably only 2 total. Thanks for your help.
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Jan 4, 2013 09:41
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xgalaxy posted:Hello, You really can't go wrong with either of your candidates. The NEX5n or the newer NEX5r are both very affordable and the only downsides are limited lens options and the prices Sony charges for the better lenses. The E-PL5 is nice because you get the same sensor as the OM-D with only slightly worse in-body image stabilization (so every lens you use becomes a stabilized lens, instead of paying more for stabilized glass) and you have a plethora of lens options with similar gripes about some of the pricing for the truly premium lenses. Both deliver exceptional, best-in-class image quality and fit your bill in terms of price as well as size. Really, if you dislike the bulk of your DSLR, using either one is going to be a huge godsend and will make a huge difference in how much fun you have taking photos again. There are people who will insist you should go with the NEX because of the bigger sensor size, and there are folks who will insist that the dynamic range and autofocus capabilities of the Olympus are superior, but the reality is that both have great strengths and very minor weaknesses. Having had cameras from each system, and knowing what I know about what I like/dislike about each now, I would get the e-pl5 were I in your shoes today. I think Olympus does the whole touchscreen thing much better than Sony does and I REALLY love some of the m43 glass that is available. I'm not wild about either of the kit lens options you get, no matter which way you go - in fact I really recommend just getting a body only then investing in a good pancake for pocket-ability (something like either the Panasonic 14 or 20mm or the Olympus 17mm, keeping in mind the 2x crop factor for m43) and either the Panasonic 45-200 or the Olympus 45-200 would be the ideal travel combination and cover a whole lot of focal length with a lot of gusto. That's just my 2 cents, and I'm sure there will be wildly dissimilar suggestions that follow this one. I think you're heading the right direction, no matter what. Hope this helps, and that you enjoy whatever you end up getting!
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Jan 4, 2013 13:00
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Against the better judgement of the thread, I went ahead and got an X-E1. The OM-D was just too small for me. After using it for some urban stuff for a couple of days, I can say: 1. EVF I need to do more experimenting to see what circumstances the EVF lags under. Right now, lag is very evident when zooming, but I need to try it with OIS turned off, etc.. The camera can display LV / menu in 3 modes: EVF, LCD, and eye sensor (dynamic switching). The full menu is available through the EVF, and it's very cool to be able to change settings like this. I need to poke around to see if the EVF can give a live preview of exposure, because right now it doesn't seem to be doing so. 2. Built-in LCD is mediocre This is really a shame. In the year 2012, on a $1400 camera, we get a screen like this. What the gently caress Fuji. 3. Kit lens is really good I haven't sperged over brick wall shots, but the lens is pretty good for a kit lens. Not as nice as my 24-70 Nikkor. Probably on par, or better than, my 24-85 f/2.8-4 AF-D Nikkor. The interesting thing (to me) is that Fuji has placed a fair amount of camera control in the lens itself. The OIS and APERTURE MODE toggle are both on the lens itself. This is really divergent from other systems I've used and not intuitive at first. The control rings (focus, zoom, aperture) are all nice to use. Focus and zoom are well damped so you can get fine control over either. The aperture ring is stepped, but rotates infinitely, as does the focus ring. I wish Fuji had designed the lens with a more identifiable gap between the focus and zoom rings. 4. Build quality is excellent Everything seems to be made of metal, and that's a good thing. I got the black, because the silver has a somewhat "cheaper" appearance, and I don't know how well that finish would stand over time. I wish fuji had gone the distance to make this body weather-sealed. 5. Focus The mode selector is a half-assed 3-point dial on the front of the body. Using it with gloves on is poo poo. All I have to compare AF to is an old-rear end G10 and my D800, so the X-E1's AF is between those two  For manual focus, the crop-peeking is loving great: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nKq_M8KKgA. Overall, I would say that if you need to shoot things that are moving (catte), or just rely on AF all the time, this camera isn't for you. The few times I used AF, it hunted. A lot. Catte action shot was impossible. 6. Software Where to begin? Fuji went and made a kickass sensor that didn't use a Bayer filter pattern. Problem is, everything else uses a Bayer filter pattern. While LR4 "supports" the X-series RAW files, the quality isn't great. Fuji seems to acknowledge this through shipping some esoteric shitware, based on Silkypix, with the camera. Observe the differences: Silkypix:  LR4:  In short: Fuji and Adobe should fix this poo poo. Yesterday. Other stupid poo poo: -The tripod mount isn't center line with the lens, so any mount you put on there, arca, etc, will partially cover the battery/SD slot. gently caress you Fuji. Overall: Camera is an oddball with wacky quirks. RAW IQ is great, if you have software that can read it properly. I'll probably keep it.
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Jan 4, 2013 13:47
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krooj posted:Catte action shot was impossible. Throw it in the garbage. 
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Jan 4, 2013 15:20
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edit: ignore what I said... I thought the X100 didn't use a bayer pattern sensor for some reason.
luchadornado fucked around with this message at 20:49 on Jan 4, 2013 |
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Jan 4, 2013 15:52
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krooj posted:1. EVF Also, the Gariz case has clearance for battery and card access and moves the tripod socket to the proper position, worth the investment if you are sure you're keeping it. krackmonkey fucked around with this message at 16:53 on Jan 4, 2013 |
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Jan 4, 2013 16:51
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X100 is regular Bayer.
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Jan 4, 2013 20:21
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HPL posted:It wouldn't have to be FF. Sony would have a chance to really shake things up if they could make a crop body that could perform to a high standard. You mean a 5N?
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Jan 4, 2013 22:09
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Anyone have the Panasonic 20mm f/1.7? How do you like it?
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Jan 5, 2013 01:18
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I have one on an OM-D and I love it. It's the best walk-around lens I've ever used. The combination is so good I might as well superglue it in place.
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Jan 5, 2013 01:44
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Speaking personally, I've loved working with the XE-1. It has some idiosyncrasies, to be sure, but the files are really quite lovely and it's just so much drat fun to use. I've been leaving it in manual focus mode, since that just converts the rear AE-L/AF-L button to a focus button and automatically assigns the 3x/10x magnification to a press of the rear wheel. The autofocus is finicky but workable, but manual focus is actually pretty spectacularly easy with the aids they provide. While I thought that no real RAW support would bug me (although I guess Capture One is about to end that), the JPEG output is so strong that I just haven't cared all that much. Honestly, the ability to compose in B/W with the EVF has been a real revelation to me. A few shots I've taken with it, if anyone cares:   
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Jan 5, 2013 01:53
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http://photorumors.com/2013/01/04/more-fuji-x100s-and-x20-details-and-specs/#more-36938 Apparently the new X100 will be called the X100s. Improved AF with hybrid contrast/phase detection, with improved EVF among other improvements; should also have an Xtrans sensor like the X-Pro 1 and X-E1. Official announcement should be coming this Monday (the 7th) though.
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Jan 5, 2013 02:11
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I didn't know there were still issues with raw processing through LR and PS. If Fuji is going to keep this sensor format AND put it in new cameras, they need to get this taken care of. It would be cool if the x100s had a crop mode like the Sony RX-1, too. TheAngryDrunk fucked around with this message at 02:31 on Jan 5, 2013 |
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Jan 5, 2013 02:27
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ttam posted:I have one on an OM-D and I love it. It's the best walk-around lens I've ever used. Sweet, I remember loving my old E-410 and 25mm f/2.8 combo for the regular 4/3 as a walkaound.
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Jan 5, 2013 03:33
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Decided to pass on a DSLR and go for a mirrorless, the NEX-5N to be specific. I have some concern about the lack of lenses for this line, but the truth is that while I want a camera that takes high quality photos I don't really plan on amassing a huge selection of lenses. And anyway, even if I wanted to I have to assume that more E-mount lenses are going to be produced given the success of this line, right?
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Jan 5, 2013 07:39
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AndrewP posted:Decided to pass on a DSLR and go for a mirrorless, the NEX-5N to be specific. I have some concern about the lack of lenses for this line, but the truth is that while I want a camera that takes high quality photos I don't really plan on amassing a huge selection of lenses. And anyway, even if I wanted to I have to assume that more E-mount lenses are going to be produced given the success of this line, right? The current lineup should cover the basic needs. The 16mm, 35mm and 50mm should do for most purposes. Even the kit lens isn't bad combined with the image stabilization and the 5N's great high ISO capability to make up for the slower maximum aperture.
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Jan 5, 2013 07:52
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DJExile posted:Anyone have the Panasonic 20mm f/1.7? How do you like it? I have it and have used it on GF-1 and E-M5. It is a very sharp lens, with a good field of view (in my opinion) for "general purpose" shooting. Very compact and fairly affordable. Downside is that autofocus is noisy and on the slower side compared to e.g. the 45/1.8. But it is hard for me to recommend a better "do it all" prime for m43. The 25/1.4 is much larger, more expensive, and a little too "tight" IMO.
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Jan 5, 2013 15:35
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DJExile posted:Anyone have the Panasonic 20mm f/1.7? How do you like it? I've got it and really enjoy using it. It does produce a little bit of banding in the shadows on the OM-D, and it doesn't focus quite as quick or reliably as the Olympus lenses do, but it's sharp and produces some great DOF for an m4/3 lens. That being said, I'm probably retiring it in favor of the new Olympus 17/1.8, as soon as I can get my hands on one because it's a dead sexy lens and focuses like a ninja. I shot a few test frames with one at an Olympus day event at a local shop here, and it really charmed me.
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Jan 5, 2013 18:43
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