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"I will repeat some fw:fw:fw: with Jefferson's name slapped on again."
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Jan 12, 2013 10:43
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thathonkey posted:Implied the constitution might be outdated in a 2nd amendment argument on FB, got called a communist and nazi... "The exact same things are happening as in GERMANY!!!" Ok, where is the communist paramilitary force and how do I sign up, because that sounds awesome as hell.
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Jan 12, 2013 12:08
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what is it with these people and "god given rights" What did god give before the constitution? what about countries without our consitution? are they dictatorships?
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Jan 12, 2013 13:05
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Branis posted:what is it with these people and "god given rights" What did god give before the constitution? what about countries without our consitution? are they dictatorships? Yes. I live in Canada, a border town specifically. I've been told by Americans that Canada isn't a "real" democracy because we haven't adopted "the" constitution. In some people's minds it's actually a universal document, and America is the only place in the world free enough to have adopted it.
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Jan 12, 2013 13:58
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Gen. Ripper posted:"The exact same things are happening as in GERMANY!!!" They were in Kiel, Wilhelmshaven, Hamburg, Hanover, Brunswick, Frankfurt am Main, Berlin, the Ruhr area and parts of Bavaria including Munich. Unfortunately they got killed by fascists with social-democrat support. Orange Devil fucked around with this message at 14:18 on Jan 12, 2013 |
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Jan 12, 2013 14:13
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generatrix posted:In some people's minds it's actually a universal document, and America is the only place in the world free enough to have adopted it. It is this. I think the U.S. education system might be partially to blame but I'm not sure.
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Jan 12, 2013 15:26
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thathonkey posted:Implied the constitution might be outdated in a 2nd amendment argument on FB, got called a communist and nazi... So you are ready to take on the American military when the revolution comes? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TZOxlTwAvA 
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Jan 12, 2013 15:35
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ultimateforce posted:So you are ready to take on the American military when the revolution comes? 
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Jan 12, 2013 17:39
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The Rokstar posted:Well they won't have to because the military will all side with them, duh. That was basically the response I got. Then I asked "well if the military is going to side with the revolution then wouldn't that trump any arms the civilian population has?" and that got ignored. Also in a scenario where the U.S. military has defected that kind of precludes the U.S. government from being a viable tyranny anyway...
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Jan 12, 2013 17:43
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Fandyien posted:So this "Stalin, Mao, and Hitler enacted gun control!" thing seems to be a really popular talking point right now. I know that Hitler restricted guns for Jews and loosened more restrictive Weimar-era laws for Germans, but what about Stalin and Mao? My instinct is that there weren't a ton of privately owned guns in the hands of Chinese peasants in 1950, but it seems like WWII might have inundated the USSR with weapons. Did either Stalin or Mao actually enact any kind of meaningful gun control like the right seems to be fantasizing about Obama implementing? From the last page, but about Mao: I've got no idea whether he did anything gun-controlly, but it's a non-issue because even if the people were armed to the teeth they wouldn't have touched him because he was so insanely popular. So much so that when the Communist Party sidelined him after the failure of the Great Leap Forward (the death toll of which, incidentally, is also why people call him a mass-murderer), he used the power of the people to launch a second revolution (the Cultural Revolution) against the CCP old guard and firmly place himself in the centre again. Again, with Stalin, I've no idea what he did with gun control, but IIRC he was popular with the masses too, who thought that he was a good man who wanted the best for all Russians, but was being deceived and mis-served by those working below him..
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Jan 12, 2013 18:21
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thathonkey posted:Implied the constitution might be outdated in a 2nd amendment argument on FB, got called a communist and nazi... "I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and Constitutions. But laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors." - Thomas Jefferson And I still get a kick out of people thinking they can fend off the government with a rifle in the age of cruise missiles, gunships and drones.
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Jan 12, 2013 18:30
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I've been shaming friends on my FB by pointing out how fast they went from "Oh no those poor kids!" To "By gawd they're gonn take our guns!" It's honestly sickening to see someone go from supportive to nut job gun wacko in less than a week. In a debate on Germany and the whole guns thing, I got called a Wikipedia History Teacher because the guy thought that it was impossible for a college-educated person like me to know a lot about history itself. It was only my major, rear end in a top hat!
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Jan 12, 2013 18:58
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Teddles posted:Stalin, I've no idea what he did with gun control, but IIRC he was popular with the masses too, who thought that he was a good man who wanted the best for all Russians, but was being deceived and mis-served by those working below him.. Stalin pre WW2 may have been feared by the masses more than anything. Post WW2 there was probably more love since mother Russia and papa Stalin had defeated Hitler. e: quote:And I still get a kick out of people thinking they can fend off the government with a rifle in the age of cruise missiles, gunships and drones. To add to this, I still get a kick out of the fact people think the second amendment is about overthrowing the government. Yeah, sure, that makes sense, every government puts provisions for violent overthrow into their constitutions. It can't possibly be something that was meant to actually protect the government in absence of a standing army.
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Jan 12, 2013 19:05
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Ringo Star Get posted:In a debate on Germany and the whole guns thing, I got called a Wikipedia History Teacher because the guy thought that it was impossible for a college-educated person like me to know a lot about history itself. It was only my major, rear end in a top hat! Oh yeah, from what college? Unless you went to Liberty University, it doesn't count, you brainwashed liberal.
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Jan 12, 2013 19:05
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Amused to Death posted:Stalin pre WW2 may have been feared by the masses more than anything. Post WW2 there was probably more love since mother Russia and papa Stalin had defeated Hitler. There was a very common belief among political prisoners - who often were loyal CPSU members - held in the gulags that Stalin somehow wasn't aware of what his corrupt underlings were doing, and if only he found out he'd correct the mistakes. This is reflected in the many appeal letters that inmates sent to him.
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Jan 12, 2013 19:18
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Here is what Jefferson REALLY said: http://www.monticello.org/site/jefferson/when-governments-fear-people-there-libertyquotationMonticello website posted:One source attributes this quotation to Thomas Jefferson in The Federalist. The Federalist, however, was the work of Alexander Hamilton, John Jay, and James Madison; it also does not contain the text of this quotation. This quotation is vaguely similar to Jefferson's comment in an 1825 letter to William Short: "Some are whigs, liberals, democrats, call them what you please. Others are tories, serviles, aristocrats, &c. The latter fear the people, and wish to transfer all power to the higher classes of society; the former consider the people as the safest depository of power in the last resort; they cherish them therefore, and wish to leave in them all the powers to the exercise of which they are competent." To date however, the most likely source of this quotation appears to be a series of debates on socialism published in 1914, in which John Basil Barnhill said, "Where the people fear the government you have tyranny. Where the government fears the people you have liberty." That hardly sounds like OMG GUNS to me. If anything, it sounds like Jefferson was making a point about how the ruling classes try to manipulate the mob. Hmmmm. HMMMMMMMM.
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Jan 12, 2013 19:25
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Sporadic posted:I still get a kick out of people thinking they can fend off the government with a rifle in the age of cruise missiles, gunships and drones. I think it's funny how they can flip around the abilities of our government so drastically. The US Gov't is amazing at stopping poorly trained people with rifles using the methods mentioned above. However, what people claim the revolution would be in response to is something that the government is nearly powerless to do. Scrambling military hardware is a piece of cake compared to the prospect of trying to disarm over 100 million people with almost 300 million guns. The logistics required for such an operation are mind-boggling and we can barely manage our basic operations like FEMA and the Post Office. edit: but you probably shouldn't be arguing with anyone who views any gun control as "our guns are going to get taken away." If you do want to get through to them, it's probably going to take a bit of backing up. Ror fucked around with this message at 19:47 on Jan 12, 2013 |
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Jan 12, 2013 19:45
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Amused to Death posted:To add to this, I still get a kick out of the fact people think the second amendment is about overthrowing the government. Yeah, sure, that makes sense, every government puts provisions for violent overthrow into their constitutions. It can't possibly be something that was meant to actually protect the government in absence of a standing army. I posted this earlier in the thread, but honestly, that is part of why it was put into the Constitution. Idran posted:Actually, that's (sort of) exactly why they included it. It was drawn from a similar right in the English Bill of Rights 1689, which guaranteed that the Crown could not legally disarm the Protestant population of England. That right itself was included because of James II's general policy of disarming Protestants in the years leading up to the Glorious Revolution as part of a policy of weakening the Protestant population to help prevent exactly such a revolution. It failed, he was overthrown by William III and Mary II, and William III had the Bill of Rights 1689 drafted to ensure that future monarchs couldn't repeat that or other such actions that James II had taken. It wasn't foresight, though, so much as them remembering a time in then-recent history when the government literally did try to steal the arms of its people in order to stave off a rebellion. You are probably right that it was in part an alternative to a standing army as well, but not entirely so, no. Idran fucked around with this message at 21:13 on Jan 12, 2013 |
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Jan 12, 2013 21:11
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To it a good extent I think it actually was though. A lot of people at the time including the founding fathers were very wary of standing armies. Militia units during the revolution were notoriously unreliable, however, ones that had had regular training often did perform well. A well regulated militia, especially given our relative isolation, was probably seen as a good defense force. The standing army was always kept quit small, right up to WW2. I think at the deceleration of war in 1812 the standing army was less than 10,000 men. Even right before the civil war it was still less than 20,000.
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Jan 12, 2013 22:55
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This has probably been posted already, but it deserves a repeat just for being so crazy. It pretty much has everything: Obama the tyrant, Obama's third term, Obama never working a  REAL JOB, secret undiscovered oil reserves in Texas, etc. etc. It's great stuff.http://pro.stansberryresearch.com/1210THIRDLIA/LPSINBDC/
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Jan 12, 2013 23:15
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 Just had this nonsense pop up on my Facebook. 
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Jan 12, 2013 23:43
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Here's a great  one on my fb wall. I love the pixelated photoshop scare-tactics too:quote:
While I agree drug companies have questionable ethics it's still loving hilarious. A nurse got the first comment on this fb post and called it BS.
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Jan 12, 2013 23:44
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Agents are GO! posted:
For this to not be racist, it implies that anyone holding a gun is a potential criminal and they just happened to use black people for the pic.
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Jan 12, 2013 23:47
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Agents are GO! posted:
Somebody should exchange the picture with this one and repost it. I wonder if anybody would catch on. 
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Jan 13, 2013 00:09
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Agents are GO! posted:
Hang on, let me start by saying before you look at this image I want you to know that it is not racist. Okay? We good? Okay look at the picture... ...I TOLD YOU IT'S NOT RACIST! The wording is weird too. "Lol no it's not racist but its drat hilarious." So racist things are inherently hilarious but not racist things need to be explained as funny?
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Jan 13, 2013 00:15
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Also how warped does your definition of racism need to be to think that is not racist?
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Jan 13, 2013 00:21
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thathonkey posted:Also how warped does your definition of racism need to be to think that is not racist? There aren't any racial slurs in it, and that is the de facto definition these days.
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Jan 13, 2013 00:35
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The NYPD Q1 report on stop-and-frisks in 2011 actually found illegal weapons on 3.8% of white people searched, as opposed to 1.8% of Blacks and Latinos. It wasn't for lack of trying either: over 50% of those stopped were black, over 30% Latino, and less than 10% white. Blacks and Lantinos were obviously frisked more often after being stopped as well.
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Jan 13, 2013 00:42
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Internet Webguy posted:There aren't any racial slurs in it, and that is the de facto definition these days. No, the de facto definition of racism is 1) hating black people because of their skin and 2) being a black person who defends another black person or harbors with the slightest negative feeling towards a white person. You get Newt Gingrich and O'Reilly giving speeches about how people of a race want free stuff, but they didn't say the skin color itself was bad, so they aren't racist. Racial slurs don't make you racist, see the fallout from Chris Rock's infamous "Black people vs. N__s routine." Consider Laura Ingrahm shouting the N-word to a black housewife, who threatened by her husbands white friends, because she wanted to intimidate her and put her "in her place." But the caller was the "real racist" because some black guy somewhere said honky.
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Jan 13, 2013 00:51
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seiferguy posted:Here's a great I got a flu shot and I haven't gotten a flu despite everyone in my house (who did not get flu shots) having it. I also hate these things a lot as they always say "Don't take prescription meds! They are killing you!". I'm pretty sure my insulin is keeping me alive, seeing as when I go even a day without it I get kind of sick.
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Jan 13, 2013 00:52
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KillerJunglist posted:I got a flu shot and I haven't gotten a flu despite everyone in my house (who did not get flu shots) having it. I also hate these things a lot as they always say "Don't take prescription meds! They are killing you!". I'm pretty sure my insulin is keeping me alive, seeing as when I go even a day without it I get kind of sick. The anti-vaccination movement is just terrible. There are actually people who believe Jenny McCarthy and her spouting that vaccines cause autism based on a debunked report. That same report which caused Andrew Wakefield to lose his medical license for authoring it. Ugh.
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Jan 13, 2013 01:03
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KillerJunglist posted:I got a flu shot and I haven't gotten a flu despite everyone in my house (who did not get flu shots) having it. I also hate these things a lot as they always say "Don't take prescription meds! They are killing you!". I'm pretty sure my insulin is keeping me alive, seeing as when I go even a day without it I get kind of sick. The point of the flu shot is to make your immune system more ready to fight it off, not magically ward off getting the flu. People forget that flu used to kill one out of three people who caught it, it was a very deadly illness. Thanks to the flu shot, people don't die from it anymore, they just get miserable and plot conspiracy theories about vaccines. seiferguy posted:The anti-vaccination movement is just terrible. There are actually people who believe Jenny McCarthy and her spouting that vaccines cause autism based on a debunked report. That same report which caused Andrew Wakefield to lose his medical license for authoring it. Ugh. I hate her so much, my wife is part of a group she joined when we had our first child, and of course our child receives every vaccine offered, we had some parents berate us for not being more skeptical of the vaccines. I also have an autistic brother, whom my parents suspected was autistic before he ever received vaccines. It is just all kind of waked out pseudoscience based on fraud. CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 01:35 on Jan 13, 2013 |
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Jan 13, 2013 01:33
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Ror posted:The NYPD Q1 report on stop-and-frisks in 2011 actually found illegal weapons on 3.8% of white people searched, as opposed to 1.8% of Blacks and Latinos. It wasn't for lack of trying either: over 50% of those stopped were black, over 30% Latino, and less than 10% white. Blacks and Lantinos were obviously frisked more often after being stopped as well. Actually, funnily enough the overrepresentation of black people being stopped and frisked will probably have brought down the proportion of those caught with illegal weapons, since if you're stopping five times as many black people as white people you're most likely stopping only suspicious looking white people but basically anyone who's black. Find guns on suspicious white people AND suspicious black people, don't find guns on non-suspicious black people, don't stop non-suspicious white people therefore they're not included in the stats.
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Jan 13, 2013 01:40
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vyelkin posted:Actually, funnily enough the overrepresentation of black people being stopped and frisked will probably have brought down the proportion of those caught with illegal weapons, since if you're stopping five times as many black people as white people you're most likely stopping only suspicious looking white people but basically anyone who's black. Find guns on suspicious white people AND suspicious black people, don't find guns on non-suspicious black people, don't stop non-suspicious white people therefore they're not included in the stats. NYPD doesn't know what a "non-suspicious black person" is.
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Jan 13, 2013 01:53
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Agents are GO! posted:
No that's pretty racist.
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Jan 13, 2013 02:03
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:No that's pretty racist. You said it's racist. Therefor it is YOU who are the real racist!
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Jan 13, 2013 02:08
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CommieGIR posted:The point of the flu shot is to make your immune system more ready to fight it off, not magically ward off getting the flu. People forget that flu used to kill one out of three people who caught it, it was a very deadly illness. I think someone else mentioned it earlier too, there's different strains of the flu as well and medical experts aren't psychic. If they're wrong about the strain that they think is going to be most prominent that season, then the flu shots will be less effective against the actual problem strain. At any rate I think this really is just a bad year for the flu, I never get vaccinated just because I practically never get sick, haven't gotten a cold/flu in years but I got hit by it hard this year for some reason.
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Jan 13, 2013 02:33
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ratbert90 posted:You said it's racist. Therefor it is YOU who are the real racist! Like some sort of reverse racist?! 
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Jan 13, 2013 03:34
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Twelve by Pies posted:I think someone else mentioned it earlier too, there's different strains of the flu as well and medical experts aren't psychic. If they're wrong about the strain that they think is going to be most prominent that season, then the flu shots will be less effective against the actual problem strain. More specifically, the "Flu" that most people say they are getting, which is causing gastroenteritis and weakness, is actually GII.4 (Sydney 2012), and not even part of the influenza family.
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Jan 13, 2013 04:10
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:Like some sort of reverse racist?! No you see he said it was not racist! 0bummer said we live in a post-racial society, therefore whatever I say is not racist!  Looked up H.R. 347, basically allows Secret Service jurisdiction beyond their normal scope in order to suppress protests and make arrests in cases of trespass on restricted locations and intentional disruption of government functions. The commie-loving bastards at the ACLU have a better write-up on the bill.  I can guarantee that this guy does not give two shits about the plight of women in the Arab world, but thinks that Sharia Law is right around the corner in the US.  This guy was in the military, but seems to not remember that your average soldier is equipped with semi-automatic rifles of the same model as civilians. Difference being there's a three-round burst option whos use is highly discouraged.  poo poo like this pisses me off. Is feminism always about abortion? As far as I've seen, reproductive rights were a recent addition thanks to advances in medicine and obstetrics over the last century.
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Jan 13, 2013 06:05
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