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I have a question about jumping. When Vecna gets really excited he does that obnoxious GSD thing where he jumps up and latches onto an arm. It's easy to deal with in the house because I can stick him in time out if he doesn't listen when I tell him to knock it off but I obviously can't do that when we're on walks. I tell him "stop!" which means "sit your rear end on the ground and maintain eye contact until I release you" which works about 80% of the time. If he ignores the command I redirect him to a tug and he immediately stops trying to eat my arms but I worry that by giving him a toy, I'm inadvertantly reinforcing lovely behavior. He's been doing this for a couple months now. It used to happen almost every day and now happens maybe a couple times a month but it's super aggrivating, especially when people start screaming that I shouldn't be taking my "aggressive" dog out in public  Is there another way I should be dealing with this?
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Jan 14, 2013 19:40
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Triangulum posted:I have a question about jumping. When Vecna gets really excited he does that obnoxious GSD thing where he jumps up and latches onto an arm. It's easy to deal with in the house because I can stick him in time out if he doesn't listen when I tell him to knock it off but I obviously can't do that when we're on walks. I tell him "stop!" which means "sit your rear end on the ground and maintain eye contact until I release you" which works about 80% of the time. If he ignores the command I redirect him to a tug and he immediately stops trying to eat my arms but I worry that by giving him a toy, I'm inadvertantly reinforcing lovely behavior. He's been doing this for a couple months now. It used to happen almost every day and now happens maybe a couple times a month but it's super aggrivating, especially when people start screaming that I shouldn't be taking my "aggressive" dog out in public Redirection is good, but you have to catch him before he starts. So no more "stop!" when he acts up. When he gets that crazy glint in his eye (which I'm sure you can see) you need to intervene. You can either give a fun but incompatible obedience/trick cue like "spin" then let him tug, or just whip out the tug immediately. Allowing him to freak out then reacting to it means that he's still rehearsing inappropriate behaviour and things that we repeat we get better at. Being more proactive means that he'll not be doing that thing you don't want to do, and he'll get more used to doing something you prefer instead. Industrial posted:She will if I walk her though, it's behavioral not medical. A brief walk isn't the worst thing in the world, but I understand the frustration. If I were absolutely insistent on her pooing in the back yard I'd do as I suggest people with new puppies do. Confine to a crate or xpen where I know she won't soil, and take her out regularly to the spot where I want her to eliminate. If she doesn't, back into the crate. If she does, party! It'll probably take more work and a longer time than if you were dealing with a puppy since the elimination preference is so strongly ingrained already. The Big Whoop posted:Little pom came into work today... he's got some major issues. I ended up recommending them to a positive reinforcement behaviorist however I wanted to see if I could work with him a little bit so he behaves a little more while I'm working with him. There's probably not much that you can do as a groomer. You're seeing the dog for very brief periods of time in a highly stressful environment with lots of scary, exciting things going on. I think working on him in a quiet room is a good idea. If you post your area I'm sure we can try to link you to a few local behaviourists if you'd like. Maybe I'm a pessimist, but my guess is that the owners aren't going to do much (or may not be capable of doing much). I'd go into management with this dog, not training. You can try the CC tactic shown in the JRT video in the OP of this thread where a dog is classically conditioned to love having its face blown on when it previously reacted aggressively.
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Jan 14, 2013 20:05
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Triangulum posted:I have a question about jumping. When Vecna gets really excited he does that obnoxious GSD thing where he jumps up and latches onto an arm. It's easy to deal with in the house because I can stick him in time out if he doesn't listen when I tell him to knock it off but I obviously can't do that when we're on walks. I tell him "stop!" which means "sit your rear end on the ground and maintain eye contact until I release you" which works about 80% of the time. If he ignores the command I redirect him to a tug and he immediately stops trying to eat my arms but I worry that by giving him a toy, I'm inadvertantly reinforcing lovely behavior. He's been doing this for a couple months now. It used to happen almost every day and now happens maybe a couple times a month but it's super aggrivating, especially when people start screaming that I shouldn't be taking my "aggressive" dog out in public This might be way too basic (and I'm not the most experienced person) but do you allow any teeth on skin/ clothing contact? The time outs are a good idea, but also showing Venca that teeth "hurt" by being really dramatic when he does try this at home might help him too, especially if he's very sensitive to your reactions. When you are out, and I don't know if this is too abstract for a dog, jumping up on you and trying to latch on means "Play/ walk time is over, we're going home".
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Jan 14, 2013 20:05
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Engineer Lenk posted:Is he crate-trained? Engineer Lenk posted:Are you doing anything to proactively keep him from lunging? Engineer Lenk posted:Does the cat have his own space to chill? He does, sorta. Right now we're in a temporary living situation that's sort of a studio apartment - meaning one room with sort of a wall divider and then an enclosed bathroom. I'm considering buying a baby gate to keep the animals in each "room", i.e. cat in the living room section and dog in the bedroom section. But for the mean time, when the cat needs alone time, he goes in the bathroom to chill out or goes under the bed or something like that. I wish I had more space to work with right now, but at least there are times when my dog forgets the cat is around (by not being able to see it), and the cat can just chill out. Engineer Lenk posted:If I were approaching this, I would use a very slow cat introduction period to the house as a way to teach cat=AWESOME TREATS. Keep the cat and dog in separate rooms most of the time, and when they are allowed access to the same area make sure you have the dog on a leash and a large quantity of high-value treats. Then if the cat comes around, stuff the dog with treats. If he doesn't take treats, the cat is too close. Eventually, he should see the cat and immediately orient to you to get treats. Keep reinforcing 100% until he can see the cat sprint off and just stares at you for treats. Then you can fade reinforcement gradually - two out of three times he sees the cat, then half the time, then a quarter of the time, then whenever you feel like it. If he ever gets it in his mind to chase the cat again, go back to separate areas and only on-leash time where he sees the cat and work your way back. I'm prepared to put whatever time and effort into this since I'd rather have an alive cat and a fiancee than... well, neither of those. That's really excellent advice, thank you for that. It's been about 2 weeks right now and I hit a point this morning where I broke down and started thinking "oh god, am I going to have to find a new home for my dog?" I think I mostly just hit a wall of frustration. But your post gives me hope, since I really haven't tried the "non-stop machine gun of treats" approach yet.
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Jan 14, 2013 20:12
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wtftastic posted:This might be way too basic (and I'm not the most experienced person) but do you allow any teeth on skin/ clothing contact? The time outs are a good idea, but also showing Venca that teeth "hurt" by being really dramatic when he does try this at home might help him too, especially if he's very sensitive to your reactions. When you are out, and I don't know if this is too abstract for a dog, jumping up on you and trying to latch on means "Play/ walk time is over, we're going home". We do allow teeth on skin provided he's gentle and doesn't put any pressure on. When I first got him and he was loving bite crazy, we tried the "yelp really loudly" thing that's suggested a lot and it sent him into complete overdrive (so would getting up and walking away, even slowly). Walking away or yelping just turned me into a super awesome squeaky toy to chase. Putting him in the bathroom for a couple minutes so that he could calm down was about the only thing that worked. It has helped a lot, I used to look like an abuse victim all the time because of his landsharking and it's been at least a month since I've had so much as a bruise. a life less posted:Redirection is good, but you have to catch him before he starts. So no more "stop!" when he acts up. When he gets that crazy glint in his eye (which I'm sure you can see) you need to intervene. You can either give a fun but incompatible obedience/trick cue like "spin" then let him tug, or just whip out the tug immediately. Allowing him to freak out then reacting to it means that he's still rehearsing inappropriate behaviour and things that we repeat we get better at. Being more proactive means that he'll not be doing that thing you don't want to do, and he'll get more used to doing something you prefer instead. The issue is that almost 100% of the time that he jumps up and bites is when we're in the middle of crossing a huge intersection outside my apartment. As in, when we're in the middle of the street. He knows that when we cross that street we're going to the woods so he gets loving nutty because gently caress YES WOODS AND TREES AND RIVERS AND BIRDS!!!! I can't really safely stop and have him spin or whatever in the middle of the road (I don't use "stop" in this situation obviously(  Should I just, I dunno, shove the tug into his mouth before we cross? Honestly I'm not fast enough to pull the tug out of my snow jacket the second he gets crazy eyes while also crossing a super busy street and juggling a leash and a clicker.Regarding "stop": Our trainer had us teach that command as an emergency interrupter for situations pretty much exactly like this, ie to interrupt something really bad or dangerous that we weren't able to catch in time to  Is that an invalid technique? It's not used like leave it or drop it, I have seperate commands for both of those things.
Triangulum fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Jan 14, 2013 |
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Jan 14, 2013 20:25
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Triangulum posted:
Yeah, I'd jam a toy in his mouth prior to crossing the road, or tug with him all the way across. Or you can practice obedience type heeling with him. He is acting up because he's excited and your attention has lapsed from him to possible oncoming cars (understandable). For you to get your dog's attention you need to give him yours. So try not to disconnect from him while you're crossing. Stay engaged and try to maintain an incompatible behaviour with him, whether it be holding a toy, tugging, heeling, etc. I see no problem with the stop cue. However, you said it yourself - it's an emergency interrupter. It sounds like you're overusing it, and you're using it at times when it has no effect. That's not a very effective emergency cue then, is it? We like these emergency type cues because they get snappy, effective reactions. As handlers we're positively reinforced for using them, so we're more likely to use them again. Overuse reduces their effectiveness. So keep it in mind. It's a good cue, but try not to rely on it for day-to-day life.
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Jan 14, 2013 20:40
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a life less posted:Yeah, I'd jam a toy in his mouth prior to crossing the road, or tug with him all the way across. Or you can practice obedience type heeling with him. He is acting up because he's excited and your attention has lapsed from him to possible oncoming cars (understandable). For you to get your dog's attention you need to give him yours. So try not to disconnect from him while you're crossing. Stay engaged and try to maintain an incompatible behaviour with him, whether it be holding a toy, tugging, heeling, etc.  quote:I see no problem with the stop cue. However, you said it yourself - it's an emergency interrupter. It sounds like you're overusing it, and you're using it at times when it has no effect. That's not a very effective emergency cue then, is it? We like these emergency type cues because they get snappy, effective reactions. As handlers we're positively reinforced for using them, so we're more likely to use them again. Overuse reduces their effectiveness. So keep it in mind. It's a good cue, but try not to rely on it for day-to-day life. I started using "stop" outside of intentionally set up training exercises about a week ago but I realize that my post was probably misleading in that respect. Prior to last week I just tugged with him (if we were moving) and grabbed on to his harness until he calmed down. Our trainer really stressed the importance of training that behavior really, really slowly but yeah, if it's only working 80% of the time it's obviously not reliable enough. I don't use it outside of "holy poo poo this is dangerous" situations because I have other cues for that but honestly I probably need to proof it a lot more. I really appreciate the advice. I've been asking trainers and behaviorists in various online training groups how to deal with this for a while now and all I got was "don't go to that location" and "he's terrified and lashing out" (he's not scared at all )
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Jan 14, 2013 20:58
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Triangulum posted:Ok cool, that makes perfect sense. I hadn't really considered the lapse in attention aspect at all but that does line up with what's going on. Thank you When Lola was younger and I was still teaching her loose leash walking, she would immediately start pulling on roads, because she knew I couldn't really stop and wait for her to return to position. What worked for me was finding a very quiet road, walking onto that, and behaving as if we were still on the street. If he primarily acts up on roads (when your attention is naturally lapsing), you could see if working on his behaviour on quieter roads would help him too?
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Jan 14, 2013 21:24
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Fraction posted:When Lola was younger and I was still teaching her loose leash walking, she would immediately start pulling on roads, because she knew I couldn't really stop and wait for her to return to position. What worked for me was finding a very quiet road, walking onto that, and behaving as if we were still on the street. He doesn't have a problem crossing roads in general, it's just crossing very specific streets. My neighborhood is bordered by two rivers and going to wooded, offleash areas that don't have kids running around requires crossing two specific streets. Vecna unfortunately is smart enough to realize that when we cross two specific streets we're going to a river, even if I cross the street at a completely different intersection 5 or 6 blocks away. He behaves fantastically when we cross any street that doesn't mean OH MY GOD WOODS AND RIVER!!! and he listens really well even if heavily populated areas and intersections that have a lot of pedestrian, bike, car, and tram traffic.
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Jan 14, 2013 22:41
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Cross the specific street just to continue walking around on sidewalks, instead of always going to the river, until he quits being so excited about that street? When he has calmed when you are just walking around the city, then head to the river? Gotta love smart dogs hey? Mine have learned that when Matt and I are both home all day, they get a dogpark outing midday. So they get all whimpery and whiney and leap around when we get up for any reason, on the weekend. gently caress off dogs I am sick and maybe we won't go  They don't do this when its just me, like today 
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Jan 14, 2013 23:23
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Rixatrix posted:Wait, are you saying the problem is she needs a daily walk in order to do her business? Many dogs don't want to go in their own yard for the same reason they don't go inside the house: it's a part of their home. Yes and no. I live in a townhouse so we don't actually own a yard. There is a large grassy area just past our parking lot which is the closest area she will pee in but she is very resistant to pooping there for some reason. Since she happily pees there I don't think that's the issue. She will also happily poop on our porch if there is snow on it. Today she did poop there but only after taking her out 3 other times when she just stared at me like a retard despite frantically whining at the door each time. Unfortunately she pooped when my 38 week pregnant wife took her out so she didn't get her walk, just lots of praise and treats.
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Jan 15, 2013 02:05
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Industrial posted:Yes and no. Triangulum My lazy trainer's solution to Vecna's road crossing issues would be grabbing his collar and calmly walking across the road. If you manage the behavior for a while it will likely disappear. Additionally I'd probably ask for calm attention both before and after the crossing.
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Jan 15, 2013 14:51
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Rixatrix posted:Keep reinforcing for pooping in the large grassy area but try to take her for daily walks. Dogs sometimes learn that pooping = going back inside so they'll hold it in order to get a longer walk. In general this means they should be walked more. Unfortunately these ideas are mutually exclusive. She will always poop on her walk and therefore will never poop in the grassy area, giving me no chance to reinforce that behavior. I'm just trying to get her to understand that pooping in this spot is good as well for those occasional days when a walk isn't going to happen due to illness, severe weather, etc. The only way I can think of accomplishing this is to only give her walks as a reward for pooping until the association is formed....does this plan make sense?
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Jan 15, 2013 23:30
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How many walks a week does this dog get that going on a walk is going to be recognized as a reward and not just the routine?
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Jan 15, 2013 23:40
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Ikantski posted:How many walks a week does this dog get that going on a walk is going to be recognized as a reward and not just the routine? She normally gets 1-2 a day I've been trying this plan for all of 48 hours
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Jan 16, 2013 00:07
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Industrial posted:She normally gets 1-2 a day I've been trying this plan for all of 48 hours I think walking the dog less isn't going to help - walks aren't a fast enough reward to associate that well. Put pooping on cue. Take her for her usual walk, cue when she starts spinning and reward afterwards. Do this for a week, then try cuing in the same spot before she starts to spin. If that works, try cuing closer and closer to the house until you can cue her to go in the near grassy area. Keep walking for a while after she poops unless you're in a weather/illness emergency, so she doesn't get poop=turn around and head back.
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Jan 16, 2013 00:46
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Engineer Lenk posted:I think walking the dog less isn't going to help - walks aren't a fast enough reward to associate that well. We tried this for months I'm pretty sure she formed the association as she goes to the door if we say poop but she won't actually do it when we say.
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Jan 16, 2013 02:31
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I'm looking for a good treat to use for training our toy poodle, I noticed the OP mentioned I could try a lot of things but I'm wondering if anyone else has any recommendations. Also I guess when he said that his dog liked "kibble" he meant a really cheap (but tasty) soft dog food? I'm also guessing that nutrition doesn't matter for a training treat since it just needs to be a tasty and she's already getting good nutrition from her primary dog food. Since the OP mentioned trying several things I'm wondering if rice would be OK? I noticed it's a primary ingredient in a lot of the cheaper foods and she went nuts when I dropped a little bit on the kitchen floor the other day. We make a lot of it for ourselves and it's already small enough for her to eat safely and quickly. Thanks.
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Jan 16, 2013 02:33
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Industrial posted:We tried this for months I'm pretty sure she formed the association as she goes to the door if we say poop but she won't actually do it when we say. Are you using the same word to mean multiple things? Based upon this line alone, it sounds like "poop" = outside. You need to clearly identify behaviors. Remember that dogs don't understand context clues in relation to speech very well unless you absolutely drill them - and some of them are just plain dumb. I use Outside for Outside, and Get Busy for an elimination cue. Orange_Lazarus posted:I'm also guessing that nutrition doesn't matter for a training treat since it just needs to be a tasty and she's already getting good nutrition from her primary dog food. Yes and no. Rice is pretty safe as it's used in a number of foods, as you mentioned (not just cheap ones, either, it tends to be easy to digest). But you shouldn't use just anything for treats, especially if you train a lot. For example a lot of folks, myself included, use hot dogs on and off. However if we used only hot dogs all the time and trained daily, the dog is taking in quite a few phosphates, definitely more than the recommended amounts. I'm not sure what health impacts that would have, but I'd probably be wary of them. Everything in moderation.
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Jan 16, 2013 03:20
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Thanks, we were actually using hotdog before I realized I didn't know what I was doing and soon discovered there was a training thread on Pet Island that I missed. I'll keep in mind to switch whatever treats I decided to use regularly.
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Jan 16, 2013 03:26
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A few posts up on this page someone said their dog love pieces of carrots for training. For my dog who eats anything I use half her dinner for training. So it's just her normal regular food. We also get milkbones which I always carry with me on walks. String cheese she loves. Trader joes has some dog treats which are sticks that are semi soft and I can break little pieces off. I'm talking the size of a pea. She likes a bunch of tiny treats over one big one. So I give her tiny pieces unless she did something amazing.
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Jan 16, 2013 03:31
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Since we're talking about training treats, I'll just throw out that there's an ongoing investigation into a number of treats made in China right now. The FDA has data that consistently linked a number of treat manufacturers to liver failure in dogs across the country and all of them were made in China. They have not been able to find an incriminating substance in the treats thus far, so they can't take any legal action. PetSmart was doing voluntary recalls at my local store of Milo's Kitchen and WagginTrain treats as a result though. Edit: Fixed the agency. MrFurious fucked around with this message at 04:09 on Jan 16, 2013 |
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Jan 16, 2013 03:34
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Since I train a lot I find it is most cost effective to just pick up a small bag of a different kibble than my dog's usual food to use as low/mid value training treats. That way I don't need to worry that I'm treating him too much and his diet isn't going to be unbalanced but it's still a little more exciting than working for his regular meals. Recently I've been using Fromm grain free fish flavored because it's fairly strongly fishy (therefore extra enticing for the beast) and the kibbles are super tiny so I get a lot of rewards out of a handful. Plus you can't beat $12 for 4 lbs of treats. I use scraps of my leftovers, hot dog, string cheese, home made jerkies, and the ultimate reward, liver sausage, for working in highly distracting environments or learning more challenging skills. Here are the treats under investigation by the FDA: 
Instant Jellyfish fucked around with this message at 04:27 on Jan 16, 2013 |
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Jan 16, 2013 03:47
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MrFurious posted:Are you using the same word to mean multiple things? Based upon this line alone, it sounds like "poop" = outside. You need to clearly identify behaviors. Remember that dogs don't understand context clues in relation to speech very well unless you absolutely drill them - and some of them are just plain dumb. I use Outside for Outside, and Get Busy for an elimination cue. I like using cubed Natural Balance rolls or string cheese for high-value training treats, and regular kibble for low value. NB rolls are too wheat and sugar heavy for me to use as a primary food source, but they cube nicely, the dogs go nuts over them, and the lamb flavor doesn't have any poultry - one of my dogs is allergic. We use the same rolls at the shelter for training treats as well.
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Jan 16, 2013 05:42
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Hdip posted:A few posts up on this page someone said their dog love pieces of carrots for training. For my dog who eats anything I use half her dinner for training. So it's just her normal regular food. We also get milkbones which I always carry with me on walks. String cheese she loves. Trader joes has some dog treats which are sticks that are semi soft and I can break little pieces off. I'm talking the size of a pea. She likes a bunch of tiny treats over one big one. So I give her tiny pieces unless she did something amazing. Those Trader Joe treats are great and pretty inexpensive (and if I recall correctly they are made in the states). I've read the ingredients a few times, and they seem like they're both healthy and decent for dogs. I'm also a big fan of Tillman's Treats- they're soft, break up easily, smell really pleasant and they've got a variety of protein sources/ types for itchy dogs.
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Jan 16, 2013 15:04
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Engineer Lenk posted:There's some strong anecdotes out there about little dogs being harder to housebreak. They can be wimps about seasonal changes - but since you're in a mild climate that's probably not much of a factor. They also have smaller bladders and need to process more food and water size-proportionally than larger breeds. Add to that the reduced size of the mess and a surprising number of toy dog owners will just put up with it, whereas they'd train it out of a larger dog (or more likely get rid of a large dog). So if you get a secondhand small dog someone turned in or one from dubious breeding circumstances, they probably have some bad habits baked in. My small dog with no housetraining issues - a former outside dog used for breeding. My special project small dog - two former owners. Okay, so... I have been doing as you instructed. He hasn't had any accidents, per se. And he seems to understand the praise for peeing outside and has (sort of) started to ask to go out. Now, we have some remaining problems. heh. He still can't be trusted in the house. He is crated during the day, and on days I am home we regularly take him out. I'll give you an example of what has been happening this past week. My husband takes him out every morning at 7:30am and he usually pees. I later learned that this time he did not. One morning I returned home at 10:15am to take him outside. He is usually excited to get out of the crate, which I can appreciate, but this time he was extra excited. I took him out, he urinated on command, he went for a walk and pooped a few times. and then I had to leave again, so an hour or so later I put him back in the crate. Except he did not want to go in. I grabbed him and placed him in thinking nothing of it. Later I discovered that he pissed on his blanket and didn't want to sit in it. So I washed everything, replaced his bedding. No harm no foul. He didn't get punished or anything. I figured he might learn from his experience. Fast forward to today, husband took him out at 7:30am as always and he peed. On command, no less! (Snap, point, say "potty!") He's gotten good with that. I got home today around 11:15 and found his bedding with urine on it again. I didn't freak out, I took care of him again. We also fear he may have OCD? He chases his tail massively (it's almost as if he thinks it truly is another being), has obvious pica (barbie shoes, lotions, ice, perfumes, and plants to name a few items he desires), and is a compulsive licker/eater. I am thinking his general bodily function deficiency may be related but I am not sure. I plan to have him evaluated by a vet, but is it possible this is related? If it is, I am hoping treatment will assist.
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Jan 17, 2013 19:54
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LimeMonger posted:Fast forward to today, husband took him out at 7:30am as always and he peed. On command, no less! (Snap, point, say "potty!") He's gotten good with that. I got home today around 11:15 and found his bedding with urine on it again. I didn't freak out, I took care of him again. Is the crate dry at 7:30? I usually let the problem dog out twice in the morning - once when he first wakes up, and once about 30 minutes after he's eaten. I also take the dog out to pee immediately before he goes in a crate and immediately upon exiting the crate - mine is not crated on a regular schedule so this is more insurance on my part. One piece of this may be that he needs to pee after activity/eating/drinking in the morning. Another may be that he works himself into a frantic state while you're gone - if you have a way to record him during the day you can see how he settles.
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Jan 17, 2013 22:40
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Engineer Lenk posted:Is the crate dry at 7:30? I think it was dry. I don't take him out first thing, so I can ask my hubby. But the only reason I knew it was wet was because he was sitting on the lip of the crate bed, as opposed to the bed part of it. We only crate him when we aren't at home, and crate him when we all sleep. When we are home he is restricted to the downstairs/tiled area at least until he's re-potty trained. Before we head up to bed one of us always takes him out, too. I will try recording him, so maybe we can get a vet perspective when we do bring him in. Or bring it to you guys and see. But he is hardly alone for more than 3-4 hours at a time and seemed perfectly fine being alone, previously. I'll check tomorrow morning, myself, and see what he does. ETA: I should also note that sometimes when he is taken out he still doesn't pee, even though we are sure he would have to. Sometimes he seems to wait until the evenings. I try to take him out 4-5 times per day. LimeMonger fucked around with this message at 01:38 on Jan 18, 2013 |
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Jan 18, 2013 01:22
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Quick question: I bought one of those Kong tug toys that are two handles(17 bux!) to play tug with my dog, I figure it's a good way to help work off some energy. But I'm wondering if there's a good way to teach him that tug=awesome? He already enjoys it without me having to do anything, but I'm just curious to see if there's something I can do to reinforce the fact that Tug Is Good? edit: He doesn't seem to get the toy so far, but he grabbed the end a couple of times! I rubbed a blue buffalo bite(the blueberry kind) on it, but it didn't seem to help. Maybe I can rub some cooked chicken on the handle? Deep Thoreau fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Jan 20, 2013 |
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Jan 20, 2013 01:00
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I'm not an expert at tug as Psyche barely gets into it herself and then only with soft, fuzzy toys, but I did find that she is more excited about grabbing toys and holding on after I did a bunch of shaping exercises to get her to pick things up and put them in a box and to play fetch (I had to shape fetch with food). I would probably start rewarding him for grabbing the tug toy with food, but I've read that using food to increase play can be really sensitive to timing, so it's not necessarily the best way. Here's a blog post that talks about it more and gives some tips at the end.
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Jan 20, 2013 01:56
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Kiri koli posted:I'm not an expert at tug as Psyche barely gets into it herself and then only with soft, fuzzy toys, but I did find that she is more excited about grabbing toys and holding on after I did a bunch of shaping exercises to get her to pick things up and put them in a box and to play fetch (I had to shape fetch with food). Thanks! I'll give that a read. He does love kibble/bb bites, so I can try shoving some in his maw when he bites the end of the toy. It'll also be good because he tends to try to grab on to a toy in the middle or near my hand. I can teach him to go for the opposite end of the toy. edit: VVV I like the fact that most of dog training is 'act like a complete idiot' 
Deep Thoreau fucked around with this message at 02:08 on Jan 20, 2013 |
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Jan 20, 2013 01:58
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Bash Ironfist posted:Quick question: I bought one of those Kong tug toys that are two handles(17 bux!) to play tug with my dog, I figure it's a good way to help work off some energy. But I'm wondering if there's a good way to teach him that tug=awesome? He already enjoys it without me having to do anything, but I'm just curious to see if there's something I can do to reinforce the fact that Tug Is Good? How To Create A Motivating Toy I'm about to start doing this with Lola's flirtpole toy
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Jan 20, 2013 02:03
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Engineer Lenk posted:Echoing this. If you give your cue and she doesn't eliminate within 5 seconds, she doesn't know the cue or has starting associating it with something else. Is it possible she understands what I'm asking but is just choosing not to do it?
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Jan 22, 2013 07:29
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Industrial posted:Is it possible she understands what I'm asking but is just choosing not to do it? With an elimination cue it's a matter of simple classical conditioning that happens exactly the same way with humans as well. If you go to the bathroom for whatever reason when you think you don't have to go, the conditioned stimuli (being in the bathroom, seeing the toilet seat etc.) will often make you need to go anyway. What you want to achieve with an elimination cue for a dog is exactly this. It will take a while to condition the cue, but it will happen eventually.
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Jan 22, 2013 08:05
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We adopted Laika just over a week ago. She's a nearly 1 year old Collie/German Shepherd mix. So far, training is going pretty well (she learned sit, shake, leave it, go get it easily). The one problem we've been having is outside in our (fenced) yard. Laika will very suddenly start jumping on me and biting. I'm fairly certain she's trying to play (ears up, tail going), but she won't respond to any commands. Once, I had to make my way across our yard, and she was growling/jumping/biting the whole way. The behavioral person at the rescue told us to disengage her when she starts biting, so my typical tact has been to say No or Stop and turn away. This only seems to amp her up. A couple of days ago, I switched to giving her a command (better to provide her with any opportunity to succeed), but she doesn't respond. I think she's just too excited to listen. The only way I got her to calm down today was by telling her to come. I have no idea why that particular command worked when sit and down didn't. I know she's just playing, but for someone who has never owned a dog it's intimidating behavior that's left my arms and hands bruised. She never does this with my fiance, and I can't associate it with any action outside. It doesn't happen every time we're outside, either, and she doesn't give me a noticeable cue that she's going to start. We're starting training classes at the end of this month, but I want to do whatever I can to discourage the behavior before that. Any suggestions?
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Jan 23, 2013 01:27
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justasmile posted:We adopted Laika just over a week ago. She's a nearly 1 year old Collie/German Shepherd mix. So far, training is going pretty well (she learned sit, shake, leave it, go get it easily). The one problem we've been having is outside in our (fenced) yard. Laika will very suddenly start jumping on me and biting. I'm fairly certain she's trying to play (ears up, tail going), but she won't respond to any commands. Once, I had to make my way across our yard, and she was growling/jumping/biting the whole way. The behavioral person at the rescue told us to disengage her when she starts biting, so my typical tact has been to say No or Stop and turn away. This only seems to amp her up. A couple of days ago, I switched to giving her a command (better to provide her with any opportunity to succeed), but she doesn't respond. I think she's just too excited to listen. The only way I got her to calm down today was by telling her to come. I have no idea why that particular command worked when sit and down didn't. Definitely don't use "come" again, if you're interested in having a reliable recall. You'll just poison it. I would tether her to something strong while you're outside. As soon as she begins being rude, don't say anything, just turn your back and walk calmly inside. Stay there for at least 30 seconds and make sure no one else engages her in any behavior at all. This will take 10-20 repetitions to start to sink in, so you're going to get some exercise, but it will work. Also, this thread is for you: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3471773
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Jan 23, 2013 01:50
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MrFurious posted:Definitely don't use "come" again, if you're interested in having a reliable recall. You'll just poison it. Thanks. I hadn't noticed that thread. I'll have to get a tether and give that a try.
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Jan 23, 2013 03:09
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Well, we just had a really interesting training session and I learned some new things about Psyche's neurological state, I think, and thought I would share while it's all turning around in my brain. As our behavioral modification has progressed, Psyche has learned to deal with things in new ways other than her usual reactive responses. Some of these have been intentional on my part, like teaching her to sit rather than jump, but others have developed naturally. For example, months after we got her and started training, she started wagging her tail when she was nervous/overstimulated. Later, she started whining rather than barking in lower level situations. The whining is also a sign of frustration and her expression of it signals that she is not over threshold, but that she doesn't know what to do to get herself out of the situation. So in that vein, we've had a lot of success with showing her what to do. We recently taught her a head turn calming signal and it has done wonders for her behavior. She now slides into working mode really well and we can do an efficient recovery with the head turn if she's about to get into trouble. This has been so great that last week the trainer was able to feed her directly (with her muzzle on) and she went a whole hour with another dog in sight without freaking out. Our emphasis on working mode, however, has made it a bit of a crutch and she seems to have totally lost any ability to relax while not engaged during our people sessions. This is a fairly recent development too. Things she had long gotten over are stressful again, but in a "mustworkmustwork" way rather than a reactive way. The Be Still and body work I used to do with her to help her relax has now become something she resists. Any time I stop asking her to work and try to get her to relax, she immediately tries to lure me back into playing the head turn game. So this week has been particularly hard on her. She's completely off her prozac, I went back to work last week so she's been alone more, and it's too cold for walks. She is restless in a way that reminds me of why I put her on the prozac to begin with (though still not that bad, so I'm going to see if we can work through it, exercise is definitely a factor). So we went easy on her with her session tonight and just worked on obedience. The trainer barely moved the whole session. But Psyche would not relax and the session culminated in a spectacular display where I asked for a down and, when I didn't treat or ask for something else right away, she started whining and pseudo-hyperventilating for a few minutes (I didn't treat her until she calmed down). She wasn't reactive at all by her usual standards, but she was still so stressed. So it was probably mostly just a bad day, but lately she's following me around more and doing nuisance behaviors to get attention and when I do training sessions with her that are supposed to be fun, she gets frustrated a lot more easily. I've just been working her through the frustration, but I think I need to do more than that. I think I need to require that she work in a relaxed state. Of course, some training will need drive and excitement, but I'm seeing now that there's a difference between being drivey and what she does, which is more panicky. I started the Protocols of Relaxation tonight and I've chosen a bunch of tricks to work on with her, some which require calmness (like balancing a treat on her nose) and others which require activity and energy. I'll alternate between the two as kind of a long-term switching game. If nothing else, it will give her mental exercise, which can only help. Oddly, this all hasn't been a problem I've noticed much in our outdoor dog sessions, and it's worse if she's say, not wearing her muzzle etc. It's like the more distractions, the more she can handle because she's not in her own head (until it's too much and she explodes like a tiny dog volcano). Is there a dog psychologist in the house. 
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Jan 25, 2013 04:01
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I know I've seen her on a mat in your videos before, have you done a lot of mat work? Major gets kind of "lost" when we go to new places and aren't actively working and having a super solid mat behavior has really cut down on his anxiety about exactly what he should be doing. He knows if he sees a mat anywhere that it is his job to go to it, lay down in a settled position (hip kicked out, sometimes head down, looks like this), and watch me for further instructions. If he gets into a loop of pacing around the house after something stressful has happened or he's being a dick and attention seeking by breaking things I can tell him to go to his mat and he will settle and once his body is settled his mind seems to follow. Protocol for Relaxation with staying on his mat instead of sitting helped really solidify what I was asking of him but I started with the matwork laid out in Control Unleashed. Be careful with the protocol and watch Psyche for increased anxiety because my vet behaviorist has seen it make some dogs more anxious. Don't feel like the schedule is set in stone, do it at your own pace. The inability to settle really pushed me towards using psych meds for Major, it can't be fun to be that constantly on edge. Hopefully you and Psyche can work through it with some behavior mod. I know how dedicated you are!
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Jan 25, 2013 04:23
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So, I recently adopted a dog. He's an awesome brindle boxer. He knows your basic sit, down, etc., but needs some work to really reinforce them. Things like when I tell him to sit, he HAS to move next to me before he will. Also, if there is something he deems more interesting, there's an 80% chance he'll ignore me. I've been working on getting him to associate a clicker with GOOD JOB, which seems to be working, slowly. We're going to keep working and we'll get it down. Also, and this is something I actually consider a problem, he licks. Not constantly or in an OCD way, but enough that it's frustrating and impedes progress with his training. He just seems to feel the need to lick your face.
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Jan 25, 2013 04:52
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