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Install Gentoo posted:He's saying that there's no conceivable way to stem a potential flood of legal weed from Washington State into Oregon along a major commuter and long haul trucking route. The Oregon cops (who are supposed to enforce laws against marijuana) can't do poo poo to all of the hundreds of thousands of people who cross the state line around Portland daily. Basically this. It is one thing when everyone involved is breaking several laws, the government understands that there will always be crime (in the case of prohibition, lots of crime). But when the crime is being enabled by a neighboring state, that's when everyone tends to get all hot and bothered. Its a tradition going as far back as various fugitive slave acts, basically no state is supposed to make life worse for a neighbor, unless its about Guns, then its OK.
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Feb 19, 2013 07:21
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Install Gentoo posted:He's saying that there's no conceivable way to stem a potential flood of legal weed from Washington State into Oregon along a major commuter and long haul trucking route. Yes, and I was saying they have never been able to. Though perhaps I'm mistaken and there is no cannabis available in Oregon. KingEup fucked around with this message at 07:35 on Feb 19, 2013 |
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Feb 19, 2013 07:31
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KingEup posted:Yes, and I was saying they have never been able to. There has never been a period in time when there was this much weed being buyable in Washington for all the folks in Portland to use. It is a massive increase in the good quality weed supply (which is a good thing) and the Oregon cops are probably fuming mad about it and their inability to stop it.
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Feb 19, 2013 07:39
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Install Gentoo posted:He's saying that there's no conceivable way to stem a potential flood of legal weed from Washington State into Oregon along a major commuter and long haul trucking route. The Oregon cops (who are supposed to enforce laws against marijuana) can't do poo poo to all of the hundreds of thousands of people who cross the state line around Portland daily. It isn't legal to bring it from Washington into Oregon anyway, so it's not really "legal weed". There probably will be a bunch of people who drive to Washington to get their own personal stash, but in terms of any trafficking for sale it's going to be pretty much the same in 2013 as it was in 2012 or 1937. I mean there are already people getting "legal weed" from California and it's not a huge issue.
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Feb 19, 2013 08:11
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Install Gentoo posted:He's saying that there's no conceivable way to stem a potential flood of legal weed from Washington State into Oregon along a major commuter and long haul trucking route. The Oregon cops (who are supposed to enforce laws against marijuana) can't do poo poo to all of the hundreds of thousands of people who cross the state line around Portland daily. Yeah, remember that the Oregon/Washington border is one of those zones that people specifically cross every day for economic benefits (there's no sales tax in Oregon, but no income tax in Washington, so people live in the latter and shop in the former).
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Feb 19, 2013 15:25
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Morphix posted:I had a meeting with Mike Reed this weekend, whose one of the bigger lawyers representing people in Seattle in our industry. I think he's going to be setting up my next expansion. And this is why our country is slowly slipping down the toilet day by day.
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Feb 19, 2013 22:02
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Red_Mage posted:I think, at least under the Obama DoJ, they are probably going to go after major growers/distributors that are provably breaking the law by exporting to Oregon/Idaho (some of them will certainly do this). That said since Marijuana is 21+ a fairly easy fix for the Vancouver issue is to require not just an ID, but a Washington State ID to purchase cannabis in border towns. I mean it effectively won't do poo poo because you could just have a friend go purchase it for you, or buy it in not a border town, but it might put minds at ease on the federal level. I think this is how the Netherlands deals with border towns near the German border and the like. They check IDs and everyone is happy other than the German drug 'tourist' (it's not exactly far or a high security border). But like anything else, I'm pretty sure they can just go a little farther into the Netherlands and not get checked, so whatev, its all for show in the end. veedubfreak posted:nd this is why our country is slowly slipping down the toilet day by day.
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Feb 20, 2013 00:14
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Install Gentoo posted:He's saying that there's no conceivable way to stem a potential flood of legal weed from Washington State into Oregon along a major commuter and long haul trucking route. The Oregon cops (who are supposed to enforce laws against marijuana) can't do poo poo to all of the hundreds of thousands of people who cross the state line around Portland daily. The price in other states is already dropping, especially adjacent to legal states, according to people I've spoken with in the industry. If top shelf is going for 240 / oz in Colorado, it's not going to command that much of a premium in other states; maybe a 50% markup (360 / oz). There are some exceptions with states that really detest drug use like Missouri, but generally the price seems to be dropping about 25%. The floor is probably around 2k / lb at wholesale, or about half what it is now. Retail tops should be headed towards about 7 / gram. One of the great things about legalization is that it's significantly reducing the cash flows of cartels. Not to get too excited, but it's surprising to me how much having just two states vote for legalization has affected things. Also, I found this; it has user reported prices for all the states, and enough data points to where it should be reasonably accurate.
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Feb 20, 2013 01:40
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Install Gentoo posted:There has never been a period in time when there was this much weed being buyable in Washington for all the folks in Portland to use. It is a massive increase in the good quality weed supply (which is a good thing) and the Oregon cops are probably fuming mad about it and their inability to stop it. I don't think they would be as mad as you think. It's coming from legal sources instead of funding gangs.
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Feb 20, 2013 02:38
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/19/marijuana-task-force-give_n_2721084.html [quote]DENVER -- Marijuana tourism is on the way to Colorado, under a recommendation made Tuesday by a state task force to regulate the drug made legal by voters last year. But Colorado should erect signs in airports and borders telling visitors they can't take pot home, the task force recommended. Colorado's marijuana task force was assembled to suggest regulations for pot after voters chose to flout federal drug law and allow its use without a doctor's recommendation. Made up of lawmakers, law enforcement authorities and marijuana activists, the task force agreed Tuesday that the constitutional amendment on marijuana simply says that adults over 21 can use the drug, not just Colorado residents. If lawmakers agree with the recommendation, tourists would be free to buy and smoke marijuana. "Imposing a residency requirement would almost certainly create a black market for recreational marijuana in the state," said Rep. Dan Pabon, a Denver Democrat who sits on the task force. Tourists could see purchasing caps though, possibly as low as an eighth of an ounce per transaction. Afraid that marijuana tourism could open the door for traffickers to load up and take it across state borders for illegal sale, task force members agreed that non-residents should be able to buy only limited amounts, though a specific amount wasn't set. "Marijuana purchased in Colorado must stay in Colorado," Pabon warned. "We could attract greater federal scrutiny and displeasure of our neighbors," if marijuana flows across state lines, he said.[quote] I really don't know how this is going to work out. Acknowledging tourism seems like and interstate commerce problem. I'm hoping that this specific agreement doesn't attract the attention of the feds. Keeping pot in your state, however much it's only on paper, at least seems to keep it a states rights issue. Telling people to come on in, while honest, will probably get a federal legal challenge.
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Feb 20, 2013 15:44
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I can't wait to see what kind of signs they come up with for the airport. "Don't take those trees overseas!" I wonder if there will be spots you can drop your excess herb before you get on the plane.
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Feb 20, 2013 16:34
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ChlamydiaJones posted:I really don't know how this is going to work out. Acknowledging tourism seems like and interstate commerce problem. I'm hoping that this specific agreement doesn't attract the attention of the feds. Keeping pot in your state, however much it's only on paper, at least seems to keep it a states rights issue. Telling people to come on in, while honest, will probably get a federal legal challenge. The alternative is to say "only residents can buy pot from the store", which will just open up the black market for native resellers. The government obviously won't get any sort of money from illegal transactions, and people are gonna loving buy marijuana anyway (same as they do in texas or illinois) so it's better to advocate the solution that lets them regulate+tax all sales within the state. They let the cat out of the bag, it's too late to go back now! 
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Feb 20, 2013 17:22
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wilfredmerriweathr posted:I can't wait to see what kind of signs they come up with for the airport. Actually, while it seems really dumb, I hope they do post lots of friendly reminders at airports and border crossings. It would really suck to be pulled over just past the Oregon border and get arrested because you genuinely forgot you left your legal weed in your car. Same with getting searched by the TSA etc... "Entering Oregon, Marijuana illegal in this state"
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Feb 20, 2013 19:05
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wilfredmerriweathr posted:I can't wait to see what kind of signs they come up with for the airport. "You can't take it home so come back soon!"
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Feb 20, 2013 19:22
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Someone's going to make a killing on "pot storage" lockers near the borders.
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Feb 20, 2013 19:51
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ChlamydiaJones posted:I really don't know how this is going to work out. Acknowledging tourism seems like and interstate commerce problem. I don't see how this counts as interstate commerce. Sounds like regular ol' one-state commerce to me. I do wonder if Colorado can legally put weed-related things in tourism ads, though...
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Feb 20, 2013 19:55
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showbiz_liz posted:I don't see how this counts as interstate commerce. Sounds like regular ol' one-state commerce to me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn It's a very broad definition.
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Feb 20, 2013 20:01
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AreWeDrunkYet posted:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn Gonzales v. Raich is much more germane to the situation and holds that the commerce clause pretty much always applies to federally controlled substances.
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Feb 20, 2013 20:30
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Delta-Wye posted:I think this is how the Netherlands deals with border towns near the German border and the like. They check IDs and everyone is happy other than the German drug 'tourist' (it's not exactly far or a high security border). But like anything else, I'm pretty sure they can just go a little farther into the Netherlands and not get checked, so whatev, its all for show in the end. I was referring to the buying and selling of politicians and why the US is in such a lovely state right now.
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Feb 20, 2013 21:53
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Red_Mage posted:Actually, while it seems really dumb, I hope they do post lots of friendly reminders at airports and border crossings. It would really suck to be pulled over just past the Oregon border and get arrested because you genuinely forgot you left your legal weed in your car. Same with getting searched by the TSA etc... In Oregon possessing up to an ounce is at most a $1000 fine. Possessing more than an ounce is illegal in Wa too. There's only jail time if you are within 1000 feet of a school. There are a few places on the highway that are within 1000ft but they are very small sections. All of them are at least a few miles from the border. That's far enough into Portland that there would be no way to tell if you were coming from Wa or not.
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Feb 20, 2013 22:43
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RichieWolk posted:The alternative is to say "only residents can buy pot from the store", which will just open up the black market for native resellers. The government obviously won't get any sort of money from illegal transactions, and people are gonna loving buy marijuana anyway (same as they do in texas or illinois) so it's better to advocate the solution that lets them regulate+tax all sales within the state. I'd think that any pot that could be sold to non residents would have to be bought (and taxed). Of course that doesn't count the plants you can grow but that isn't generating tax income anyway. Anyway their still putting buy limits for non natives so a person from Utah will just go store to store or buy in bulk off the market. I'm just suggesting that saying "tourism" could easily get the feds thinking about the commerce clause when saying "natives only" might do so a little less. We'll see though because that's the approach!
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Feb 20, 2013 23:17
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Some new stuff just out about how pot sales will be regulated. The task force has finalized their proposal and it's off to the state legislature. Seems like Hickenlooper is even more paranoid than the average stoner. Also bolded something hilarious at the end. http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/local-news/marijuana/amendment-64-task-force-approves-recommendations-concerning-pot-sales-and-taxation quote:DENVER - Thursday evening, The Amendment 64 Task Force approved recommendations concerning pot sales in Colorado. The recommendations will next be sent for review by the Colorado legislature. NathanScottPhillips fucked around with this message at 06:47 on Mar 1, 2013 |
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Mar 1, 2013 06:42
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NathanScottPhillips posted:Some new stuff just out about how pot sales will be regulated. The task force has finalized their proposal and it's off to the state legislature. Legal pot will result in more homeless teenagers? What the gently caress? It'll make it easier for them to throw in the towel? This sounds exactly like someone who has never smoked pot, never known anyone who smoked pot, and never looked a single inch past his stupid stereotypes.
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Mar 1, 2013 06:54
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Clean Air Act? Goddamned do they think this is real?
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Mar 1, 2013 07:34
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The Colorado Clean Air Act is about smoking cigarettes and cigars in public places, not industrial-scale air pollution. Its supporters would understandably look to include smoking marijuana in public places as well.
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Mar 1, 2013 09:58
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Denzine posted:The Colorado Clean Air Act is about smoking cigarettes and cigars in public places, not industrial-scale air pollution. This. I-502 bypassed the need for that by applying all the restrictions of cigarettes and most of the restrictions of alcohol to weed. Its pretty fair all things considered, no one should have to breathe in smoke they don't want to. As to the homeless thing, I think he means that the legalization of weed is going to attract more homeless or transient youth to Colorado, not that it will make more youth from Colorado transient or homeless. I assume he has less to worry about than he thinks given that they are all already in Portland and Vancouver is right there.
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Mar 1, 2013 10:29
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Warchicken posted:Legal pot will result in more homeless teenagers? That's just bizarre. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought it was still unlawful for minors to be in possession of cannabis. It was unlawful before and still is!
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Mar 2, 2013 01:53
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New stuff about retail licensing. More restrictive than we were all probably hoping for but that's to be expected with a substance that has been under prohibition for nearly a decade. http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_22689447/tax-legal-issues-tap-at-last-colorado-marijuana quote:What Colorado will look like with legal marijuana became significantly clearer Thursday when the state task force proposing rules for that new world finished its work. Denzine posted:The Colorado Clean Air Act is about smoking cigarettes and cigars in public places, not industrial-scale air pollution.
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Mar 2, 2013 06:42
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/05/dea-marijuana_n_2810347.htmlquote:CHICAGO -- Eight former U.S. drug chiefs warned the federal government Tuesday that time is running out to nullify Colorado and Washington's new laws legalizing recreational marijuana use, and a United Nations agency also urged challenges to the measures it says violate international treaties. Predictable but disheartening.
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Mar 7, 2013 01:26
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quote:But Brian Vicente, co-author of the Colorado pot legalization law, said a handful of North American countries have expressed support for legalization. A "handful" of North American countries? So... Mexico, Canada, and not the US? And the US? There aren't exactly a lot to choose from.
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Mar 7, 2013 01:31
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Delta-Wye posted:A "handful" of North American countries? So... Mexico, Canada, and not the US? And the US? There aren't exactly a lot to choose from. I think you should probably look at a map or something.
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Mar 7, 2013 01:34
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Delta-Wye posted:A "handful" of North American countries? So... Mexico, Canada, and not the US? And the US? There aren't exactly a lot to choose from. You don't actually know where North America starts do you?
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Mar 7, 2013 01:35
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Red_Mage posted:You don't actually know where North America starts do you? Just above South America.
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Mar 7, 2013 01:38
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MacheteZombie posted:Just above South America. That would be Central America.
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Mar 7, 2013 01:40
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Radbot posted:That would be Central America. Which would be North America.
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Mar 7, 2013 01:43
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Radbot posted:That would be Central America.  As you can see, there are 6 continents on the official map. Antarctica isn't listed because no one lives there. You can plainly see that the region you refer to is yellow, and thus in North America.
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Mar 7, 2013 01:54
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Delta-Wye posted:A "handful" of North American countries? So... Mexico, Canada, and not the US? And the US? There aren't exactly a lot to choose from. North America: Wait, there is stuff under Mexico? spengler posted:http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/05/dea-marijuana_n_2810347.html It is pretty obvious that the former DEA heads are going to whine and cry until Obama does something.
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Mar 7, 2013 01:55
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Delta-Wye posted:A "handful" of North American countries? So... Mexico, Canada, and not the US? And the US? There aren't exactly a lot to choose from. For posterity:
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Mar 7, 2013 01:59
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Twiin posted:For posterity: You missed the UK, France, Denmark, and the Netherlands.
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Mar 7, 2013 02:01
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Red_Mage posted:You missed the UK, France, Denmark, and the Netherlands. Being in possession of North America territory doesn't make you a North American country.
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Mar 7, 2013 02:02
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