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Gabriel Pope posted:Over/under on it just being a frontend for whatever sim Cyanide BB uses for AI vs. AI matches? 0.5 I guess? Assuming 1 = yes and 0 = no
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Mar 7, 2013 06:28
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Leperflesh posted:I suggest that, first, you shouldn't play a team whose primary method of winning games is fouling the poo poo out of the opposing team until they're so crippled you can actually manage to score plus stealing all their rerolls (which is especially crippling to a newbie player); and, second, as a much more experienced player, you should consider handicapping yourself significantly. You assume he takes the chef and fouls a lot. Regardless, people who play Blood Bowl need to have thick skin. if losing a new saurus and skink player made the guy quit, I can only imagine what he'll do if he ever loses his star Block/Guard/Mightyblow/Break Tackle Saurus later in the league, maybe it's better for him to just stop playing the game right now... League I'm currently in, first game with my Necro team, one Warewolf gets a broken neck (-1 agi) and the other WW got a Niggling injury and my only golem (I only start with 1 on my necro teams generally, need the extra reroll) died. Now THAT is how you start a Blood Bowl season! I managed to tie a DElf team the following week thanks to a freebooted Warewolf and Bloodweiser Babes and then beat a Chaos Dwarf team week 3 so I'm coming back nicely! Mr. 2 agility Warewolf is just definitely going to be a killer since he won't be able to be a ball carrier or a retreival man (too easy to tie up.)
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Mar 7, 2013 07:15
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If he isn't fouling and using the halfling chef, and is somehow still on the top spot in the league, then his opponents are unfathomably bad at the game. If that is the case, then he should run them through a newbie boot camp of sorts and try to better instill in them the basics of the game so they can better understand and enjoy it.
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Mar 7, 2013 14:05
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Vamps, underworld, goblins would all be better gimmick teams for a veteran player vs newbie friends. Halflings are terrible against other good players, but not so vs new players (at all)
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Mar 7, 2013 15:10
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I bought Chaos Edition in an attempt to put in the effort to finally learn this game having been an old-school GW fan (not that I aren't any more, I just don't have the finances for Warhammer/40k :P), plus it will kill time until someone blesses my life with an awesomely made Gorkamorka game, which for some reason didn't get as much love as Necromunda. ANYWAY! I'm all about flavour when it comes to things like team selection, but in the name of accepting I am a novice, would I be far better off in the long-run going for one of the more jack-of-all-trades teams (Humans/Chaos/Orcs) or is there merit to learning through consistent failure with the more play-style centered teams? Coming into the game, it seems that strength is a desired attribute for new teams, since not being able to take a punch seemingly restricts being able to practice general play if half your team are on the ground holding their faces together. With all this taken into account, Lizardmen seem like a neat fit for me, they have some flavour, a nice mix of players and should lead to some fun games. I caught the first game of Agent's LP yesterday, though will no doubt re-watch it to take things slightly better and I shall attempt to get myself on IRC later.
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Mar 7, 2013 16:01
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gredgie posted:I caught the first game of Agent's LP yesterday, though will no doubt re-watch it to take things slightly better and I shall attempt to get myself on IRC later. Orks are pretty much the accepted new guy team since they are so bashy and easy to use. Lizards take a bit more learning I find than others, given that they are so specialized in their players, even if lizards are great. For new players though cknoor's been doing some guide dealies on youtube that'll help with basics and stuff. Really choosing your team is all a matter of your playstyle and how you happen to be feeling that day. You don't have to stick with one.
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Mar 7, 2013 16:11
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I'd say one of the undead teams (not Khemri) would be better, each positional is fairly brainless to use with the added advantage of regeneration.
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Mar 7, 2013 16:19
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gredgie posted:I bought Chaos Edition in an attempt to put in the effort to finally learn this game having been an old-school GW fan (not that I aren't any more, I just don't have the finances for Warhammer/40k :P), plus it will kill time until someone blesses my life with an awesomely made Gorkamorka game, which for some reason didn't get as much love as Necromunda. I would recommend against starting with lizards. Strength is nice to have, but the AG1 on the Saurs and Kroxigor is a huge drawback, and not starting with any block doesn't help matters, either. If you don't have strategy and positioning down as lizards, all the strength in the world won't help you. I'd suggest you stick with orcs for a few games to pick up the fundamentals, then branch out to try teams with different playstyles that appeal to you. If you go against a team that you want to try as orcs, so much the better. Observe how they play, so when you give it a shot you have a better idea as to what you should be doing.
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Mar 7, 2013 16:25
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Lizards are defiantly not for beginners. My advice would be orcs or undead for a beginner. That should teach you the basic cage running game and the 2-1 grind, which are the fundamentals of this game.
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Mar 7, 2013 16:25
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Seconding Undead/Necromantic. Regeneration will work wonders as far as insulating you from the ~fun~ of horribly crippled players early on, and they'll allow you to pull off some running plays with werewolves/ghouls, whereas Orcs are much more restricted to their cage.
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Mar 7, 2013 16:30
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Forums Terrorist posted:I'd say one of the undead teams (not Khemri) would be better, each positional is fairly brainless to use with the added advantage of regeneration.  But yeah, don't fall into the pit of choosing humans as your beginner team, their lack of any particular strength is a huge weakness when starting out.
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Mar 7, 2013 16:33
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Humans are actually pretty great starting out, the real problem is lack of advancement. You start with enough block to play bashy and enough ball handling skills to play elfy, but once other teams get skills to match you you're hosed. If you don't mind starting over I'd definitely recommend starting with humans and tossing them in favor of something else after you get a few games under your belt. Lizards are probably not a good idea to start with though. They break a lot of fundamental assumptions about the game and almost operate as a gimmick team except their gimmick is actually amazing. They can be effective as a newbie team, if only because they're as tricky to play against as they are to play, but they're not the best introduction to a lot of key skills. the holy poopacy fucked around with this message at 17:13 on Mar 7, 2013 |
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Mar 7, 2013 16:40
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I always recommend undead as a beginner team, nothing beats having 2 mummies who can punch almost every turn and your positionals all have well defined roles. I think necro are a better team but need more development, have a weaker starting roster and are a bit harder to play for a novice thanks to frenzy.
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Mar 7, 2013 17:09
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I gave Undead a whirl against the A.I. and found them to be rather fun. I believe my starting selection was: 2x Mummy 2x Wight 4x Ghoul 3x Zombie Having no idea on their best uses, I used the Mummies and Zombies as players to attempt to hinder advances and break through defenses whilst I mainly attempted to have a Wight carry the ball with Ghouls in support if it was likely the opponent would be able to block me. Otherwise Ghouls made for a snatch and run tactic. Didn't make it on IRC yet, but I shall endeavour to do so tomorrow evening.
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Mar 8, 2013 04:25
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gredgie posted:2x Mummy Tie up and punch mans. 5 strength with no nega trait means the mummies are awesome, if slow. Zombies are poo poo and are only there to get in the way of the opponents guys and fouling. gredgie posted:2x Wight Blitzers. Move them around and use them as ball protection. They get strength access so giving them guard is awesome. gredgie posted:4x Ghoul Ball handlers. Dodge lets you move them around with a bit less worry, but they are av7 with no regen so don't let them get punched. Also ag 3 means they aren't that great at bullshit plays.
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Mar 8, 2013 04:34
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Wait for a Wight to get a double and then take Pass and then Strong Arm for the best undead team strat.
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Mar 8, 2013 04:53
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Brainamp posted:
It actually means that your opponent gets even madder than normal when it works
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Mar 8, 2013 04:58
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Something I've always wondered, is there ever a reason not to stand a player up who's been knocked to the ground? Since the option to pick him up is free I'm surprised it's not automatically handled by the game. All I can figure is it's left to be done manually as a sort of "player awareness" thing, where if a player forgets to pick a player up then they've gibbed themselves for the next turn.
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Mar 8, 2013 12:08
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It can be used to block movement, or more importantly if he's on the sidelines getting him up will get him surfed.
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Mar 8, 2013 12:10
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For the most part, yeah you want to stand your guys up first, avoid rolling dice when you can do safe moves. The main reasons are pretty much that you don't want to get surfed, or if you have plans for that player. For example, an elf laying on the pitch could just chill out until you spring the ball free, then he could get up, dodge away, and scoop up the ball. If you're playing a bashier team then for the most part you'll want to stand your guys up asap, but there are the occasional times where you need the guy on the ground for a later point in your turn
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Mar 8, 2013 12:15
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Yeah, sometimes it's better to keep a player pinned to the sidelines down, especially if they're AG3 or less. It's better they stay laying down for an extra turn or two than get surfed. Also, sometimes the order matters. If you want to blitz with a downed player, you're obviously going to want to wait until the time is right for that. Sometimes you want to move downed player and have to clear a way for them before their turn. Otherwise it's usually better to stand them up. If it's a weak AV7 player, getting punched again can be dangerous but getting fouled is even more dangerous. Consider the risks of either event. It's rare that I leave a guy who isn't stuck on the sideline down, but there may be an instance or two in which I'd do so if I determine that they'd be safer down or if their body can block movement.
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Mar 8, 2013 12:27
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It's worth noting the risk is fouling is only there if you're playing against a team with cheap players of some kind. Or studmandudebro, but then you were boned anyway.
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Mar 8, 2013 12:31
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Forums Terrorist posted:It's worth noting the risk is fouling is only there if you're playing against a team with cheap players of some kind. Or studmandudebro, but then you were boned anyway. Most teams have a cheap player of some kind, and even ones that don't I might foul someone out of spite 
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Mar 8, 2013 12:32
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Apart from the reasons already mentioned, being on the ground is the safest place to be. Regarding undead team build, 4 ghouls is way too many, 2 are enough in mm and unless it’s a really long league 3 is enough. Ghouls die so hard to everything that it’s really limited what they can do on the field.
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Mar 8, 2013 12:50
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I like to start my UD teams with 1 ghoul and an extra zombie so you can foul a bit and keep your man advantage. Ghouls' life expectancy goes up massively once they get a level so I try to never have more than a single unskilled one at a time.
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Mar 8, 2013 13:36
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It's this sort of thing that unsettles me as a newcomer. What with all the "that's a bad choice fella" potential :P. But I guess the idea of being new with anything is to make these bad choices so I realize why they were bad and therefore learn.
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Mar 8, 2013 18:39
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gredgie posted:It's this sort of thing that unsettles me as a newcomer. What with all the "that's a bad choice fella" potential :P. Play to have fun, not to win. Bam, problem solved.
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Mar 8, 2013 18:50
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gredgie posted:It's this sort of thing that unsettles me as a newcomer. What with all the "that's a bad choice fella" potential :P. As with all games there are two main types of players. The funhavers who play ogres and gobbos, and the others who play murder chaos. Some skills are downright stupid to pick on various players, but unless you honestly care about crushing everything before you just choose what you want.
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Mar 8, 2013 18:57
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Then there is a third type, that farms chorfs so you have six +AG VLL leaping midgets.
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Mar 8, 2013 19:04
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gredgie posted:It's this sort of thing that unsettles me as a newcomer. What with all the "that's a bad choice fella" potential :P. Having 4 ghouls isn't terrible or anything, it's just not the ~optimal~ build. Really you've got the right attitude, just remember to give in to the inevitable rage.
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Mar 8, 2013 20:28
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ZigZag posted:Apart from the reasons already mentioned, being on the ground is the safest place to be. Ghouls are made to die and having less than three on the pitch at one time is just hurting your team. And they don't die any harder than any other AV7 guy. Less so since they start with dodge. e: 4 Ghouls on the pitch just means you like having fun But it's also a situational thing and I only really do it against teams with a ton of movement and not a lot of bash.
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Mar 8, 2013 20:32
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Ghouls are terrible. Kill all Ghouls.
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Mar 8, 2013 20:40
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Muscle Tracer posted:Play to have fun, not to win. Bam, problem solved. Exactly. It might be a game on the PC, but it's still a board game at heart.
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Mar 8, 2013 21:02
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IcePhoenix posted:Ghouls are made to die and having less than three on the pitch at one time is just hurting your team. And they don't die any harder than any other AV7 guy. Less so since they start with dodge. They do die more than typical AV7 guys, because typical AV7 guys are on teams with access to an apothecary. Whereas ghouls are on teams with only a necromancer, and they don't have regen. So unless you induced an igor, your ghouls' chances of dying are higher than usual. That said, they move well and have dodge to start. They're useful positionals! The key with ghouls is to get them one levelup (block) and then not any more. They won't bloat your TV too much that way, and with blodge they're harder to get an armor roll against in the first place. This is for a team starting out, say 1000 to maybe 1300 or 1400 TV. After that, you might well drop down to just a couple ghouls and focus on scoring with other players. Personally I quite like ghouls so I ignore the above advice and run them up the SPP charts anyway, but that's not optimal play.
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Mar 8, 2013 21:06
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Ghoul bloat is the greatest thing but also the worst when you go up against high TV bash teams. And like I said, it's a lot more fun when your ghouls have a bunch of skills and just run around causing havoc. Their high movement makes them easy to level when one does die.
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Mar 8, 2013 21:19
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Ghouls are cool and you should get some, I'd run with 3 if it wouldn't ruin my symmetrical defensive formations. You're going to need a few unless you're planning on using a Wight as a ball carrier.
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Mar 9, 2013 03:16
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cKnoor posted:Ghouls are cool and you should get some, I'd run with 3 if it wouldn't ruin my symmetrical defensive formations. You're going to need a few unless you're planning on using a Wight as a ball carrier. Hmm.. here are the 2 most common undead defensive setups both are symmetrical (only matters for the ocd) 1 for mm 2 for league: 1 ------zzz------ --------------- ----m-z-z-m---- -----wg-gw----- 2 ------zzz------ --------------- ----m--z--m---- -----wg-gw----- -------g-------
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Mar 9, 2013 03:54
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Internet Kraken posted:Is this a joke or has cyanide actually said they are going to do poo poo like this for BB2? It's a joke but I don't trust Cyanide to not poo poo it up in a similar manner.
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Mar 9, 2013 04:17
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ZigZag posted:Hmm.. here are the 2 most common undead defensive setups both are symmetrical (only matters for the ocd) 1 for mm 2 for league: Neither of those are the cKnoor Special defensive formation that he's famous for, though??
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Mar 9, 2013 04:21
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NutShellBill posted:a) How do you keep people interested in what can be a very unforgiving game? Playing Halflings correctly against new players is like playing Dark Elves or Cybork Bikers against noobs in the other games. Don't do it! You're being mean. deathbagel posted:if losing a new saurus and skink player made the guy quit, I can only imagine what he'll do if he ever loses his star Block/Guard/Mightyblow/Break Tackle Saurus later in the league, maybe it's better for him to just stop playing the game right now... This is a terrible attitude for bringing new players into the game.  "Yeah maybe you better just quit if you can't handle losing, it's your fourth game you baby." Is there a horrible neckbearded smug emote?
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Mar 9, 2013 04:29
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