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Torabi posted:Last time I checked I couldn't make myself a Zoroastrian character with the king maker dlc thing. The option was grayed out. CK2+ allows you to play pagans. Of course you won't have any options religion-wise, but still...
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Mar 10, 2013 16:01
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Ok gently caress this game. EUIII is impossibly frustrating with it's stupid whack a rebellion. Is there a mod that adds in the crippling status effects that CK2Plus does to each county when under rebellion? Between Westernization, a protracted war with Austria that ramped my war weariness up to 13-15 area and the nonstop spy infiltrations the game becomes unplayable. I won the war merely because I could throw waves after waves of my lovely troops in stacks of 50 onto Austria's 15 man armies. I conclude the defensive war by giving some land back to France who has utterly splintered and find myself in more dire straights after the war than during because of all the loving rebellions. Then there is the totally impossible micromanagment of the pirates and rebellions on stupid islands in the Pacific. There is an outright 60 man "Byzantian Noble" rebellion that burst out of Constantinople during one of the Westernization events. Whoever recommended Westernization is a total crook, gently caress it's taken 100 years and I'm still not completed the job nor do I have Western units.  I own Madagascar and the islands leading East up into the Malaysia and Philippine area. Most of the island nations in the Maylasia area are vassals. France and Britain blew apart in an astonishing fashion which allowed me to start an Alliance with them and Castille is still chugging along. Austria threw down with me for some ungodly long war of easily 10+ years. There are no Protestant or Reformed nations any longer. YouTuber fucked around with this message at 00:30 on Mar 11, 2013 |
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Mar 11, 2013 00:15
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YouTuber posted:There is an outright 60 man "Byzantian Noble" rebellion that burst out of Constantinople during one of the Westernization events. Whoever recommended Westernization is a total crook, gently caress it's taken 100 years and I'm still not completed the job nor do I have Western units. Well, you've taken a lot of wrong religion, wrong culture provinces in middle east/arabia and none of the italian provinces you get missions to take. The 60 man noble rebels I'd guess spawned by not choosing "resist western influences". Westernisation is best done by westernizing, and until you get your stab back and your sliders in order, choose the resist western influences which give you ten years of not being able to modernize the military but also none of the ridiculous events. A single ship in a port will keep pirates from spawning in that port, and I'm not sure but possibly the adjacent port as well.
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Mar 11, 2013 00:39
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Jean Pony posted:Well, you've taken a lot of wrong religion, wrong culture provinces in middle east/arabia and none of the italian provinces you get missions to take. I've been "westernizing" for literally 100 years straight. 95% of my providences are Orthodox and all of modern day Turkey's borders are Greek. Is it a RNG turnover that I'm waiting for? I just get shitloads of events that I've been accepting since I was at peace and had nowhere really to expand to since Italy was controlled by Great Britain when it was at full strength or guaranteed by Castille. It wasn't until after my war with Austria that I've fallen into a quagmire with rebellions. I'm not seeing any progress when it comes to modernizing the military.
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Mar 11, 2013 02:02
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You need to resist Western Influence until you have the required stability to modernise the military. Otherwise lovely events will keep happening to you. Also everybody told you to expand East inland, I don't know why you decided to nab Southeast Asian provinces. It's a complete bitch to ship troops around and squash rebellions. I wouldn't do it regardless of how profitable it was.
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Mar 11, 2013 02:33
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YouTuber posted:
Relive the dream of Alexandros, crush Persia and reach India.
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Mar 11, 2013 02:43
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Torabi posted:Is there any Paradox game that features the Persian Empire? Yo dawg, I heard you like Persia. I totally hooked you up. 
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Mar 11, 2013 03:20
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Crackpipe posted:Yo dawg, I heard you like Persia. I totally hooked you up. *edit* Are there any decent mods for House Divided besides APD? Wolfgang Pauli fucked around with this message at 04:44 on Mar 11, 2013 |
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Mar 11, 2013 04:27
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Wolfgang Pauli posted:What's going on with Joraqatar? New Nations Mod alone is pretty great imho, doesn't bog down the game nearly as much as APD and makes it still pretty fun. Napoleon's Legacy and A Serb Divided are pretty good alt scenarios; ASD is more developed I feel, and it also has the advantage of Europe being more divided (although the Aztec and South American blob still provide for ultrastable super powers in the new world).
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Mar 11, 2013 05:00
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I'm not sure if it's my imagination but it feels like New nations mod increases the likelihood of war. I've seen multiple big wars and loads of minor since I switched from vanilla vic2. Anyway, it makes the game feel more dynamic and fun.
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Mar 11, 2013 08:24
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I manually lowered all the infamy hits to 1/4th of what they were and that seems to be motivation enough for people to go to war. And I am getting all sorts of weird stuff like Austria going for Hedjaz, Holland owns Jerusalem, Portugal has Palestine.... It does seem unbalanced tough, as France I had no problem conquering entire north Africa and parts of Egypt in less than 10 years. I should be able to keep others out of Africa if I can keep this going. Best part of the game so far is the +1 militancy event with the text "what's next, a comet?" I actually laughed out loud when I got that one.
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Mar 11, 2013 09:31
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A Pop Divided and New Nations Mod adds new CBs, which probably tie up with the increased likehood of war. These are featured in A Srb Divided as well, since it was built over NNM.DrProsek posted:New Nations Mod alone is pretty great imho, doesn't bog down the game nearly as much as APD and makes it still pretty fun. Thanks. One of the things I'm working on for the next version is a civil war event chain for Tepehuacu, which means that not every game will have an Aztec superblob ruling in splendid isolation from South America. I've also been playing Napoleon's Legacy, it's rather interesting and makes the USA a fair bit more challenging to play as, so that's been fun. ZearothK fucked around with this message at 11:27 on Mar 11, 2013 |
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Mar 11, 2013 11:22
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Crackpipe posted:Yo dawg, I heard you like Persia. I totally hooked you up. Yo, this is my Vicky2 Persia, inspired by Torabi's post. Was really close to becoming a great power until Russia Sphered me which tanked my industry. Playing with the New Nations mod, by the way. Was planning on invading the Ottomans early on, but somehow they not only did not crumble but actually stayed a great power and became one of the major colonial powers in Africa, along with Portugal and Austria. There's still like 50 years left of the game though, so I should hopefully be able to reach Greece at one point and make them bow to me, like Xerxes did.
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Mar 11, 2013 15:42
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YouTuber posted:I've been "westernizing" for literally 100 years straight. 95% of my providences are Orthodox and all of modern day Turkey's borders are Greek. Is it a RNG turnover that I'm waiting for? I just get shitloads of events that I've been accepting since I was at peace and had nowhere really to expand to since Italy was controlled by Great Britain when it was at full strength or guaranteed by Castille. It wasn't until after my war with Austria that I've fallen into a quagmire with rebellions. I'm not seeing any progress when it comes to modernizing the military. Perhaps I was unclear. Westernization is a two-step process. First you reform the government which brings the tech speed up to par and then you reform the military which gives you western units. Both steps are decisions with some requirements. For military modernization the requirements are: Western tech group Not Western military Stability = 3 Centralization vs. Decentralization -5 or below Have a ruler with administrative skills of 7 or more Nation is not under the effect of Resisting Western Influences After you've reformed the government but before you've reformed the military you will get events like merchants/peasants/nobles resist western influences. Now you get the choice to either ignore them and suffer worse and worse effects or you can listen to them, lose 2 prestige and get a 10 year modifier called resisting western influences. While that modifier is active you cannot reform the military. So get your affairs in order: max stability, max centralization and an adm 7 monarch. Until then: resist western influences!
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Mar 11, 2013 17:21
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Jean Pony posted:Perhaps I was unclear. Westernization is a two-step process. First you reform the government which brings the tech speed up to par and then you reform the military which gives you western units. Both steps are decisions with some requirements. For military modernization the requirements are: This is the most counter-intuitive bullshit EU has thrown at me yet.
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Mar 11, 2013 17:28
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Antinumeric posted:This is the most counter-intuitive bullshit EU has thrown at me yet. Honestly I really hope in EUIV westernization is just paying a huge amount of administrative plus stability 3 and that's it. None of that resisting western influences, maybe not even bordering a western nation. Ryukyu world conquest is hard enough as it is  .E: Speaking of Ryukyu, has there been any word from Paradox on converting your nation between religious groups? Animist Ryukyu is pretty cool, but Sunni Ryukyu is better!
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Mar 11, 2013 18:02
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DrProsek posted:Honestly I really hope in EUIV westernization is just paying a huge amount of administrative plus stability 3 and that's it. None of that resisting western influences, maybe not even bordering a western nation. Ryukyu world conquest is hard enough as it is I hope they don't give non-western nations a double-penalty with a tech penalty and then a penalty in that the units, even for their tech level are dogshit.
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Mar 11, 2013 18:09
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Panzeh posted:I hope they don't give non-western nations a double-penalty with a tech penalty and then a penalty in that the units, even for their tech level are dogshit. 
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Mar 11, 2013 18:16
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Antinumeric posted:This is the most counter-intuitive bullshit EU has thrown at me yet.
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Mar 11, 2013 18:21
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Jean Pony posted:Perhaps I was unclear. Westernization is a two-step process. First you reform the government which brings the tech speed up to par and then you reform the military which gives you western units. Both steps are decisions with some requirements. For military modernization the requirements are: Oh ok, that was the problem. I have Centralization almost maxed and I already have Western Technology. I can't pass some red line I believe. However I'm stuck with a poo poo ruler so more or less it's totally RNG based until a ruler arises that isn't poo poo?  This game has the potential to be so interesting but utterly cripples itself with odd design choices.
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Mar 11, 2013 19:09
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YouTuber posted:I've been "westernizing" for literally 100 years straight. 95% of my providences are Orthodox and all of modern day Turkey's borders are Greek. Is it a RNG turnover that I'm waiting for? I just get shitloads of events that I've been accepting since I was at peace and had nowhere really to expand to since Italy was controlled by Great Britain when it was at full strength or guaranteed by Castille. It wasn't until after my war with Austria that I've fallen into a quagmire with rebellions. I'm not seeing any progress when it comes to modernizing the military. Yeah, as others said, westernizing is about improving your tech group and unit types. Not sure what your province religion and culture has to do with that. It is a pretty bullshit concept for a number of reasons, but you can't really complain that the game is terrible because you're doing it wrong. Here's a good tutorial on westernizing. Also you really shot your self in the foot by expanding so much before westernizing. YouTuber posted:Oh ok, that was the problem. I have Centralization almost maxed and I already have Western Technology. I can't pass some red line I believe. However I'm stuck with a poo poo ruler so more or less it's totally RNG based until a ruler arises that isn't poo poo? You can pass the red line, you just get +1 revolt risk for every step past it. Also if you don't want to deal with RNG bullshit, you can switch your government to a noble republic.
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Mar 11, 2013 19:11
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I really hope they make westernization in EUIV more of an inbuilt 'system', like the V2 uncivilized -> civilized mechanic. Kludging it with unintuitive events is just a mess, and everyone enjoys modernizing their favorite ROTW nation, so it could really use some more love.
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Mar 11, 2013 20:08
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Are they still using techgroups? That mechanic always felt like a kludge, as it's basically an arbitrary thing to sandbag Arab and Asian nations to match historical development.
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Mar 11, 2013 20:18
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What's really funny is that since everyone gets units with a fire phase at Land 18, it means that Europe invents gunpowder before Asia.
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Mar 11, 2013 20:25
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Fister Roboto posted:What's really funny is that since everyone gets units with a fire phase at Land 18, it means that Europe invents gunpowder before Asia. Ottoman's Azab Infantry are pretty badass, though. edit: And Muslim and Indian tech groups gets gunpowder at Land 15. Good luck reaching that before Europe, though. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 20:29 on Mar 11, 2013 |
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Mar 11, 2013 20:27
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I hope they ditch tech groups. Sandbagging non-Europeans just produces a world that isn't very believable in general. Having better reasons for technological stagnation (or, on the flip side, rapid technological growth) would make for a more enjoyable game.
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Mar 11, 2013 20:43
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Dibujante posted:I hope they ditch tech groups. Sandbagging non-Europeans just produces a world that isn't very believable in general. Having better reasons for technological stagnation (or, on the flip side, rapid technological growth) would make for a more enjoyable game. I believe they mentioned tech groups being a thing that modify the cost for technologies in points. Which is a crying shame, the way commerce now works, moving through actual provinces and points that need to be controlled would be ideal for technological development as well, as Europe didn't really achieve an hegemonic position until most of the world's trade was moving through it.
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Mar 11, 2013 21:14
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If my time-traveling level 50,000 Iroquois non-Western troops can't take on some level 30 English pikemen then I will be sorely disappointed.
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Mar 11, 2013 21:30
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It might mean that is easy to just normalize tech rates in a mod and then the commerce handles everything else. I actually like the tech groups for the neighbor bonus feature of them, I just wish they were all had the same tech rate and units were roughly the same at the same tech level.
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Mar 11, 2013 21:31
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Eu3 tech groups work well enough when you play with the slow_limit modifier that was added in one of the various patches. I think it was a HTTT patch, but it could have been DW. The slow_limit setting lets you put a tech level at which the tech percentages actually kick in. By default, it's only set for a few of the tech groups, and it's set to a pretty low level (3-7). I modded it to range from 17-33, and it works drat well. The first two hundred years all the various groups are pretty similar, although the rich HRE OPMs do tend to pull Europe out a tiny bit ahead. Once the other tech groups start hitting their limits however, Europe will end up with a tech lead, but at least the rest of the world isn't entirely useless.
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Mar 11, 2013 21:33
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I wonder if there will be a way to culturally restrict units. That way you could throw every tag into the same tech group and rebalance Europe's resources so that they're producing dirt and sheep and have to trade to make money. Then maybe you'd have a fairer game.
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Mar 11, 2013 21:46
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I really hope they don't go with the "Westernization" thing for EU4, where the more close to Western you are, the better, because it just stinks of Eurocentrism. Like being Western is the greatest thing in the world! Somebody really ought to give the Paradox devs a copy of Guns, Germs and Steel.
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Mar 11, 2013 23:40
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DrSunshine posted:I really hope they don't go with the "Westernization" thing for EU4, where the more close to Western you are, the better, because it just stinks of Eurocentrism. Like being Western is the greatest thing in the world! Somebody really ought to give the Paradox devs a copy of Guns, Germs and Steel. I'm pretty sure many/most of them have read that book. I don't want to say anything else without delving too deep into white knighting them, but I think the Euro-centric part of the game was a deliberate design choice to save resources and concentrate on the part of the game that many of their fans like and identify with.
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Mar 12, 2013 00:02
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Tech groups and westernization works perfectly fine as a simplified gameplay mechanic. It could use some tweaking, sure, but it's not bad or anything. e; and yeah, I'm fairly certain that some people at Paradox have read that book, it's a high profile history book and I'm pretty sure that there are some people at Paradox that are interested in history.
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Mar 12, 2013 00:08
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I think the difficulty for Paradox is that there isn't really a consensus among historians as to why western Europe overtook the middle east and Asia during this period, so how should they model it? I'd like to see something other than inherent bonuses for western Europe but I couldn't suggest a practical alternative that would give roughly historical results.
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Mar 12, 2013 00:08
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Plus, the game's called Europa Universalis, its not like its hiding the fact the game is primarily about Europe.
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Mar 12, 2013 00:09
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SeaTard posted:I'm pretty sure many/most of them have read that book. I don't want to say anything else without delving too deep into white knighting them, but I think the Euro-centric part of the game was a deliberate design choice to save resources and concentrate on the part of the game that many of their fans like and identify with. Besides, they have an easy enough modding system to help with the rest of the world.
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Mar 12, 2013 00:11
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Kainser posted:I'm pretty sure that there are some people at Paradox that are interested in history. I don't know, what are the chances of that?
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Mar 12, 2013 00:20
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ImPureAwesome posted:Plus, the game's called Europa Universalis, its not like its hiding the fact the game is primarily about Europe. Sure, but there's no need to say "you are Chinese, so your best unit tops out at land tech 44 and is really lovely even for that level of land tech." They make up tons of Byzantium poo poo, they can make something up for Napoleonic-era tech for the Chinese.
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Mar 12, 2013 00:23
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Wolfgang Pauli posted:What's going on with Joraqatar? Blowback from a Persian military adventure, I believe. Despite being a staunch ally, I decided after Westernization it was only sensible that I curb Persia's ambitions. I couldn't get involved in a lengthy war that might encourage the Western powers to take advantage of the situation, so I took them prestige hit and flooded them with rebels. Asia was a crazy place to live for a few decades.  I still have no idea why Carpathia defected to me. It was snugly sandwiched between Hungary, Poland and Moldavia when it suddenly went Muslim and turned green. I tried selling it, but I had to give it to Ukraine for nothing, only to lose a ton of prestige and end up having them defect back like a year later. Moldavia succumbed, only for my vassal Wallachia to grab a defecting Polish province.
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Mar 12, 2013 05:02
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