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PrBacterio posted:EDIT: What I'm trying to say here is for a starship to get past Jupiter in only a minute or so with only the impulse drive in Star Trek doesn't make any sense whatsoever, even in Star Trek terms. They could always use the warp drive beyond warp 10, but you know what happens when they do that 
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Apr 2, 2013 21:11
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bobkatt013 posted:They could always use the warp drive beyond warp 10, but you know what happens when they do that 
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Apr 2, 2013 21:16
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PrBacterio posted:Just to be, in the spirit of the thread, a pedantic bore for a minute here, but Jupiter is some 600 million kilometres outwards from here. To cross that distance in "a minute or so" you'd have to travel at some 10 million kilometres/second, which is to say, some 30 times the speed of light. The impulse drive doesn't go faster than light so the only way for that to be possible is if there's some serious time dilation going on and the one minute of travel time is taken to be only the subjective travel time from the frame of reference of the crew aboard the starship. In which case there's still a lower limit of about an hour or so that would pass in the same time span for an outside observer at rest respective to the remaining solar system. That actually always bothered me.
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Apr 2, 2013 22:34
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When Geordi and Jellico talk about their days as junior officers piloting shuttles inside the solar system, Jellico brings up the 'Titan turn', where they'd would bank hard into the gravity well of the moon and slingshot themselves up to 0.7c. So they did remember the no-warp thing from time to time. The Dark One fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Apr 2, 2013 |
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Apr 2, 2013 22:56
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Well, at least the producers did think about it though! This chart uses velocities that were given for each value of warp in the Star Trek TNG Technical Manual.
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Apr 3, 2013 02:07
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OrganizedEntropy posted:Well, at least the producers did think about it though! This chart uses velocities that were given for each value of warp in the Star Trek TNG Technical Manual. I don't quite get the "Across Federation" part. The Federation is about 50-60 years across? How does anyone ever go outside Federation space?
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Apr 3, 2013 04:11
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Lobok posted:I don't quite get the "Across Federation" part. The Federation is about 50-60 years across? How does anyone ever go outside Federation space? That column is broken. A ten thousand light-year gap, crossed at the speed of light, somehow takes one hundred thousand years?
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Apr 3, 2013 04:16
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The Dark One posted:That column is broken. A ten thousand light-year gap, crossed at the speed of light, somehow takes one hundred thousand years? You have to account for all of the crazy poo poo that's out there, obviously. I mean, it's pretty much a given that in that expanse, you'd come across a few temporal anomalies.
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Apr 3, 2013 04:28
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The MSJ posted:I'm hearing the Doctor Who theme here.
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Apr 3, 2013 04:33
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That warp chart cracks me up when I think of episodes where like, Geordi takes a shuttle for 3 hours at warp 2 to an engineer convention or whatever, instead of the Enterprise just warping him there in 18 seconds.
The Fuzzy Hulk fucked around with this message at 04:52 on Apr 3, 2013 |
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Apr 3, 2013 04:36
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The Fuzzy Hulk posted:That warp chart cracks me up when I think of episodes where like, Geordi takes a shuttle for 3 hours at warp 2 to an engineer convention or whatever, instead of the Enterprise just warping him there in 18 seconds. Gotta create opportunities for drama somehow!
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Apr 3, 2013 06:02
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OrganizedEntropy posted:Well, at least the producers did think about it though! This chart uses velocities that were given for each value of warp in the Star Trek TNG Technical Manual. So ummm what about that TNG episode where the future Enterprise D can go to warp 13?
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Apr 3, 2013 06:12
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Pops Mgee posted:So ummm what about that TNG episode where the future Enterprise D can go to warp 13? The warp scale was adjusted sometime between TOS and TNG, stands to reason that it could happen again.
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Apr 3, 2013 06:50
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Pops Mgee posted:So ummm what about that TNG episode where the future Enterprise D can go to warp 13? Limits are set so that it's even more exciting when they are broken!
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Apr 3, 2013 07:04
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OrganizedEntropy posted:Well, at least the producers did think about it though! This chart uses velocities that were given for each value of warp in the Star Trek TNG Technical Manual. This image is peak fandom, saying absolutely nothing at all with a poo poo ton of words.
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Apr 3, 2013 07:29
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There's a DS9 episode where Cassidy Yates mentions a family member who has a baseball team on the other side of the Federation, and it would take several weeks/months to get there. So yeah that pic.
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Apr 3, 2013 09:49
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Pops Mgee posted:So ummm what about that TNG episode where the future Enterprise D can go to warp 13? Wasn't that a Q episode? In which case it could just be Q messing with Picard.
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Apr 3, 2013 10:17
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jivjov posted:The warp scale was adjusted sometime between TOS and TNG, stands to reason that it could happen again. I've seen all of TOS, TNG and DS9 and not only is nothing like this ever claimed, it would be meaningless if it were because 'warp speed' are totally arbitrary units anyway ('wow, now 10x = 6y! What a stunningly useful piece of information!').
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Apr 3, 2013 11:41
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Kieselguhr Kid posted:I've seen all of TOS, TNG and DS9 and not only is nothing like this ever claimed... But it always struck me as weak that it was never referenced where it counts...in the shows. Heck, they had a perfect opportunity in expository-happy Encounter at Farpoint for Data and Bones to discuss it in a line or two.
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Apr 3, 2013 13:46
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OrganizedEntropy posted:Well, at least the producers did think about it though! This chart uses velocities that were given for each value of warp in the Star Trek TNG Technical Manual. Wow, I haven't seen an STinSV watermark in years.
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Apr 3, 2013 13:47
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Cheesus posted:It definitely was described in early Starlog articles and magazines when TNG came out. It was mentioned in the behind the scenes stuff because the original Enterprise went faster than warp 10. They set a limit on the warp speed to make it more realistic, though quickly bent that rule before the first season was even up. The warp 13 used during the last episode hinted towards a redrawn warp curve, but is also just shorthand to show in the future, things are faster and it's no big deal.
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Apr 3, 2013 15:50
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I'm not sure where something like transwarp even fits, since it was never very well explained, but used often on Voyager since the Borg use transwarp to travel around. Then there's also the quantum slipstream thing, which was mentioned in a couple of episodes, and seems to be the fastest method of travel.
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Apr 3, 2013 17:39
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It makes a lot of sense to change the scale as warp drives get better - once ships can all get near warp 10, describing the speeds as 9.994 and 9.995 or whatever would get a bit silly. Remember that there are big differences in speed between tiny numerical increments once you get that high up the scale. If the refit D cruises at 9.98 and can go all out at 9.99, I can understand wanting to call them 12 and 13 instead.
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Apr 3, 2013 18:05
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Wowbagger2004 posted:It makes a lot of sense to change the scale as warp drives get better - once ships can all get near warp 10, describing the speeds as 9.994 and 9.995 or whatever would get a bit silly. Remember that there are big differences in speed between tiny numerical increments once you get that high up the scale. There was a time (pre-TNG) when the cube of the warp factor described multiples of the speed of light. Warp 4 was 64c, Warp 5 was 125c, and so on. The reason they went to the log scale was that the numbers were just getting silly in all the books and such, with authors one-upping each other.
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Apr 3, 2013 18:29
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You guys are sure spending a lot of time writing about a fake travel system that the writers don't even portray consistently. All you need to know is that warp speed is as fast or as slow as the plot demands.
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Apr 3, 2013 19:44
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Yes, I'm actually a little irritated that people ran with the first part of my post 'they never mentioned it in the show' -- telling me all the various places where this useless piece of information was mentioned -- and not the part about why it was useless anyway. What, are you going to cross-reference episodes and 'canon' (never mentioned in the show) data relating how warp speed to multiples of c so you can figure out how far it is from Vulcan to Romulus or whatever? I seriously do not understand the problem with warp ~1 = crawl, warp ~5 = walk and warp ~9 = HAULIN ARSE.
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Apr 4, 2013 03:19
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Kieselguhr Kid posted:Yes, I'm actually a little irritated that people ran with the first part of my post 'they never mentioned it in the show' -- telling me all the various places where this useless piece of information was mentioned -- and not the part about why it was useless anyway. I believe Threshold in Voyager is the only episode to outright say that Warp 10 is infinite speed. If you take that and the fact that speeds higher than warp 10 were used all through TOS (and once in the first season on TNG, once in the alternate future timeline in the finally, but never any other time), it's not hard to reconcile that there were different warp scales for different time periods. But also given how inconsistent warp speeds are shown to be on screen in all of the shows, its easier to assume that the ship moves as fast as the plot requires it too.
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Apr 4, 2013 13:38
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If you think think about this stuff for longer than five seconds, you're probably thinking about it longer than the writers did.
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Apr 4, 2013 14:44
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BrandonGK posted:If you think think about this stuff for longer than five seconds, you're probably thinking about it longer than the writers did.
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Apr 4, 2013 14:53
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Hey AAtrek, the blu-rays for the original ST movie(s) bundle is on sale, are these all the good versions of the movies? (I really care about the extended Motion Picture more than anything really)
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Apr 4, 2013 15:33
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Comfortador posted:Hey AAtrek, the blu-rays for the original ST movie(s) bundle is on sale, are these all the good versions of the movies? (I really care about the extended Motion Picture more than anything really) The Motion Picture is the theatrical cut, and it doesn't have the redone effects from the special edition DVDs. It still looks amazing on Blu Ray, however, so you should get them anyway.
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Apr 4, 2013 16:40
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Yeah but if there is an official release coming down the pipe, I think I'd rather wait for that. I already have WoK on blu-ray.
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Apr 4, 2013 16:47
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It's worth having for the artifacts of the original release, like the opening credits which were clearly done at the last minute and are just sort of plopped on like in a Woody Allen movie.
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Apr 4, 2013 19:05
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Comfortador posted:Hey AAtrek, the blu-rays for the original ST movie(s) bundle is on sale, are these all the good versions of the movies? (I really care about the extended Motion Picture more than anything really) The 2001 "Director's Edition" of The Motion Picture will not be available on Blu-ray until Paramount decides to pay for a recreation of all the CGI developed for that version of the film. The effects generated for the DVD were all built and rendered in 480p (standard definition), so until that is completely rebuilt and re-rendered for a high-definition release, we won't see it. It's the only version of the film available on Blu-ray, so I say go for it - that is a pretty good price for the six-film set, even though the transfers could really use a "real" remastering.
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Apr 4, 2013 19:36
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Aatrek posted:The 2001 "Director's Edition" of The Motion Picture will not be available on Blu-ray until Paramount decides to pay for a recreation of all the CGI developed for that version of the film. The effects generated for the DVD were all built and rendered in 480p (standard definition), so until that is completely rebuilt and re-rendered for a high-definition release, we won't see it. What effects are only on the DVD? I never knew they did that.
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Apr 4, 2013 20:10
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penismightier posted:What effects are only on the DVD? I never knew they did that. THOMAS VINCIGUERRA in the New York Times posted:
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Apr 4, 2013 21:40
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Shots like this aren't in the Blu-ray theatrical edition: Also, when Enterprise visited Vulcan in the 4th season, they designed the landscape to be similar to the director's cut version of the planet. Aatrek fucked around with this message at 22:16 on Apr 4, 2013 |
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Apr 4, 2013 22:13
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Whoa, I always thought I'd seen the director's cut but I definitely have not.
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Apr 4, 2013 22:18
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It's worth noting, though, that while the Director's Edition is generally pretty good, there are some inexcusable edits, notably the removal of Kirk's second "viewer off" and the butchering / general warming up of the sound mix. They dubbed over the awesome computer voice, for gently caress's sake.
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Apr 5, 2013 00:02
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Timby posted:They dubbed over the awesome computer voice, for gently caress's sake.
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Apr 5, 2013 11:12
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