|
menino posted:My future program has an 84% 3 month employment number (100% response rate, according to USnews) and a median income of 87k with a minimum of 60k. Which I'm getting for 10k plus living expenses (which I'd incur anyway of course). I don't make anything close to 87k now. The only way I can see this MBA not being worth it is if these numbers are cooked, which I have assumed is not the case after checking. If they're severely cooked then I am potentially screwed, but I find it hard to believe that they are to such a large degree so as to make my taking two years off work to get the MBA not worth it. Median salary coming out of my program is 96k or so, I was unemployed for 6 months after graduation and now am making barely more than I did before I got my MBA. Take the numbers with a grain of salt, nobody goes in thinking they will be an outlier.
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 01:38
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 03:05 |
|
|
Tyro posted:Median salary coming out of my program is 96k or so, I was unemployed for 6 months after graduation and now am making barely more than I did before I got my MBA. Take the numbers with a grain of salt, nobody goes in thinking they will be an outlier. I mean, it has to happen to someone, and I'm sorry it happened to you. But it's pretty reasonable for a prospective MBA student to assume that they won't be that outlier. And that's assuming the numbers are accurate in the first place, if not then yes it can be a crap shoot.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 02:35
|
|
|
Pissingintowind posted:For the record, if where you want to go isn't on the top half of the below list, think long and hard about if it's worth it. If it's not on the list at all, think even longer and harder: Where did you get this list? I find it hard to believe that literally every single one of the top 20 are in the US. I've never even heard of Darden, McCombs or Kenan-Flagler.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 02:43
|
|
|
Pissingintowind posted:To be honest, after reading through this thread, I've found it kind of strange that there seems to be some decent encouragement from the goon hive-mind for people seeking a non-top MBA. I've found that goons tend to give decent advice in BFC, but this is one area where I definitely disagree. Not everybody is looking to switch careers or get into Wall Street, consulting, or the like. A lot of people just want to advance their current careers or take advantage of employer reimbursement. Or don't have the GMAT/experience to be competitive at one of those schools but still want to learn what comes with an MBA. There are hundreds of reasons why someone might chose to get an MBA at a non first tier school. Going $100k into debt to get an MBA is a bad idea Letting your employer pay your way while you go part time to State U when you have no desire to go into high power finance? That's a great idea. Thoguh fucked around with this message at 02:56 on Mar 12, 2013 |
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 02:53
|
|
|
China (Mainland and HK) has a lot of joint programs with top 10 MBA schools. Any opinions on whether Tsinghua's IMBA program with MIT Sloan is worth a drat? (Because drat it's cheap...or at least the Tsinghua portion is.) Their salary stats don't look so hot until you consider that their grads are mostly in Beijing, so I'd be fine with it. I just mean in terms of "Oh, nice degree you have there. Thank you, I was out of toilet paper." Yes, Bloodnose, I know you said "Go to HKU," but I don't mind staying in China, and I can easily afford almost any Mainland program, while the Hong Kong schools would be a hardship.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 02:55
|
|
|
menino posted:My future program has an 84% 3 month employment number (100% response rate, according to USnews) and a median income of 87k with a minimum of 60k. Which I'm getting for 10k plus living expenses (which I'd incur anyway of course). I don't make anything close to 87k now. The only way I can see this MBA not being worth it is if these numbers are cooked, which I have assumed is not the case after checking. If they're severely cooked then I am potentially screwed, but I find it hard to believe that they are to such a large degree so as to make my taking two years off work to get the MBA not worth it. He's talking about ROI and opportunity cost. A median income of 87k looks good at first glance but how much were these people making pre-MBA? If you're making 70k pre-MBA and 87k post-MBA you just sacrificed 150k of lost earnings, 100k+ in tuition, and 2 years of work experience to jump 17k up the pay scale. Maybe you could've gotten to that income level by kicking rear end at your current job and getting promoted or lateraling. And don't expect new employers/bosses be all like "oooh this guy has an MBA let us hire/promote him and learn his business wisdom" it will in reality be more like "ok so we just hired some guy who spent the past two years drinking and not gaining any experience but he expects us to hire/promote him because he thinks he has all this business wisdom from taking management 101."
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 06:38
|
|
|
Just wanted to again say that I didn't mean to offend! Just wanted to get some dialogue going.Bloodnose posted:Where did you get this list? I find it hard to believe that literally every single one of the top 20 are in the US. Sorry, US only list. It's from the Poets and Quants website. It's not so much about the exact order, but the general list of schools seems reasonable to me. Not familiar with international schools outside of INSEAD and LBS, so I can't comment there. Thoguh posted:Not everybody is looking to switch careers or get into Wall Street, consulting, or the like. A lot of people just want to advance their current careers or take advantage of employer reimbursement. Or don't have the GMAT/experience to be competitive at one of those schools but still want to learn what comes with an MBA. There are hundreds of reasons why someone might chose to get an MBA at a non first tier school. All I'm saying is that your time isn't free. A part time program will have you attending class in your time off from work, which is arguably more valuable. Oh and if someone offers your a Harvard MBA in exchange for $100K of debt, you'd be an idiot not to do it  edit: So to be clear, I'd consider a part time program as having a similar non-tuition opportunity cost as a full time program (or higher, if you consider your free time to be worth more). The only way an employer can reimburse you for that is if they're actually PAYING you to get that MBA on top of tuition reimbursement. Also one more fun thing to consider: as you earn more, your gross income and net income do not scale linearly. When calculating the break even point, some people forget about this. Pissingintowind fucked around with this message at 08:05 on Mar 12, 2013 |
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 07:41
|
|
|
What's the recommended study plan for the GMAT?
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 11:41
|
|
|
Pissingintowind posted:All I'm saying is that your time isn't free. A part time program will have you attending class in your time off from work, which is arguably more valuable. Oh and if someone offers your a Harvard MBA in exchange for $100K of debt, you'd be an idiot not to do it You're right, I meant going into $100k of debt for a non top tier MBA. Doing it to go to Harvard would certainly be worthwhile. However, I still disagree with your overall point. I think you are looking at this as if an MBA was purely about a certain career path. As if it were the same as getting a degree in engineering, or medicine. But that is only the case for people who want to go into Wall Street or consulting. If that is someone's career goal then I totally agree. For that path then you need to get an MBA from an elite school. But for a lot of people an MBA isn't about that. For everybody else a respected, but not elite, school is totally fine. Especially if you are just going part time. Because for them the tradeoff isn't average MBA vs. elite MBA. The tradeoff is average MBA vs. no MBA. And in that trade average MBA wins every time. quote:edit: So to be clear, I'd consider a part time program as having a similar non-tuition opportunity cost as a full time program (or higher, if you consider your free time to be worth more). The only way an employer can reimburse you for that is if they're actually PAYING you to get that MBA on top of tuition reimbursement. That's only if you consider what you learn from the classes to have no value. Thoguh fucked around with this message at 15:20 on Mar 12, 2013 |
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 15:18
|
|
|
Thoguh posted:That's only if you consider what you learn from the classes to have no value. Wouldn't go as far as no value, but you can probably teach the textbook based stuff just as well to yourself, and you can probably teach any human interaction stuff to yourself better through on-the-job experience. Even at schools like Harvard, the coursework isn't particularly inherently valuable. You have a point for people that don't have a choice (will not be able to qualify for a top MBA), but for anyone that has a chance at a top MBA, I'd definitely consider forgoing getting a lesser one, even if it's "free". Also, you've done a good job on picking up on my inherent bias, so everyone should take what I'm saying with a grain of salt  In the end, it's a decision making exercise that all MBA hopefuls should go through individually.
Pissingintowind fucked around with this message at 15:46 on Mar 12, 2013 |
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 15:42
|
|
|
Swingline posted:He's talking about ROI and opportunity cost. A median income of 87k looks good at first glance but how much were these people making pre-MBA? If you're making 70k pre-MBA and 87k post-MBA you just sacrificed 150k of lost earnings, 100k+ in tuition, and 2 years of work experience to jump 17k up the pay scale. Maybe you could've gotten to that income level by kicking rear end at your current job and getting promoted or lateraling. And don't expect new employers/bosses be all like "oooh this guy has an MBA let us hire/promote him and learn his business wisdom" it will in reality be more like "ok so we just hired some guy who spent the past two years drinking and not gaining any experience but he expects us to hire/promote him because he thinks he has all this business wisdom from taking management 101." That's why it depends on the potential student. 87k might not look that great if you are giving up 70k per year in income and dropping 100k, but it could definitely be worth the opportunity cost in many other situations. Also, most of these schools depend on high employment and median salary #'s, they're obviously familiar with the game and would most likely not be admitting and throwing money at students that aren't going to get decent work afterwards. Granted, not even admission teams are perfectly informed rational actors in that regard, but the numbers seem to point to the 'party boys' getting jobs after graduation.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2013 22:25
|
|
|
What about non monetary considerations? Like maybe an MBA allows you to get a job you prefer but that doesn't necessarily pay enough extra to justify it from a straight dollar perspective. I've been considering this because I'm more of a social person but it seems like I'm stuck as an analyst if I keep on the current path. I don't necessarily think I'd get paid enough extra to justify it from a $ perspective but the type of work might be more enjoyable to me. Or does that fall under career change?
|
|
#
?
Mar 13, 2013 23:16
|
|
|
That's basically why my girlfriend got her MBA. Se went from working 70 hour weeks with a very narrowly defined career progression that she thought she would get burned out in, to making slightly more money, working 40 hours a week in a different field with what she feels are much better promotional and career opportunities.
|
|
#
?
Mar 14, 2013 13:03
|
|
|
Tyro posted:That's basically why my girlfriend got her MBA. Se went from working 70 hour weeks with a very narrowly defined career progression that she thought she would get burned out in, to making slightly more money, working 40 hours a week in a different field with what she feels are much better promotional and career opportunities. Mind if I ask what field she went into?
|
|
#
?
Mar 14, 2013 15:33
|
|
|
Corporate finance, actually.
|
|
#
?
Mar 15, 2013 02:38
|
|
|
Do you need an MBA to get into corporate finance? Or is it really only needed if you're switching gears from something like tax into corporate finance?
|
|
#
?
Mar 15, 2013 17:28
|
|
|
No, you don't need an MBA. Many of her coworkers don't have one. CFAs are pretty popular.
|
|
#
?
Mar 15, 2013 18:37
|
|
|
Has anyone had any experience with a Doctor of Business Administration (DBA) degree? It is being touted as the professional option for a Doctorate degree based off the MBA, rather than the academic focus of a PhD
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2013 12:20
|
|
|
Pissingintowind posted:Just wanted to again say that I didn't mean to offend! Just wanted to get some dialogue going. Again, blanket statements can be tricky... I have over 10 years of experience, and am at the VP/Manager level of a technology organization in big banking. My salary + bonus is (usually) roughly in line with median of top 10 business schools. I'm going to NYU Stern part-time (top 15 on your list, probably higher part-time, but this is pretty meaningless for part-time students) with my employer footing 100% of the bill. So the way I figure it--my opportunity cost of getting a full-time MBA is 2 years salary/bonus (lets say 350-400K at my level) plus about 100-110K in tuition (employer footing the bill). All of that may get me a job in i-banking (hello 100+ hour weeks, goodbye 50-60) or consulting (goodbye wife and kids, I'll never see you again!) at basically the same pay I have now. Of course 5 years down the road I'd probably be making more, but that's if everything goes 100% swimmingly, and if my wife doesn't divorce me (cut that salary in half time). What I can do is get my MBA from a semi-reputable school, and continue to work my way towards senior management in my organization. No, I'm not going to make as much money as a senior investment banker or consultant, but my costs are nil in comparison. Anecdotal, once again, but I'm not alone in this. There are tons of reasons to get an MBA other than your extremely narrow view of only going to a top school as a 26-27 year old with the hopes of maybe grabbing one of the small number of i-banking jobs. Again, anecdotes abound, but I know for a fact that at my office, one of the largest wall street banks, there are Harvard/Stanford MBAs coming in as Operations Associates; the I-Banking associate positions are just fewer and far between these days.
|
|
#
?
Mar 16, 2013 13:05
|
|
|
Omgbees posted:Has anyone had any experience with a Doctor of Business Administration (DBA) degree? What's the point of it? Like, what would a DBA do for you that an MBA doesn't? Wouldn't a real doctorate in a focus area make more sense?
|
|
#
?
Mar 17, 2013 21:04
|
|
|
Anyone here has experience with Hult? Edit: After digging around, too many red flags. rouliroul fucked around with this message at 20:24 on Mar 27, 2013 |
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2013 01:33
|
|
|
Omgbees posted:Has anyone had any experience with a Doctor of Business Administration (DBA) degree? My uncle has a DBA and it hasn't opened any doors his MBA wouldn't have.
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2013 18:34
|
|
|
Julio Cesar Fatass posted:My uncle has a DBA and it hasn't opened any doors his MBA wouldn't have. Of course he could be legitimately interested in doing research on business administration rather than making money. (Probably not!)
|
|
#
?
Mar 27, 2013 21:34
|
|
|
My main thought on that is that an MBA is very much a generalist degree. Its about learning enough about all the parts of running a business that you can succeed at it. Its about being a mile wide and an inch deep. A doctorate is the opposite. Its about being a total expert in one small thing. Its about being an inch wide and a mile deep. I can't even think what somebody getting a DBA would study.
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2013 17:45
|
|
|
Thoguh posted:My main thought on that is that an MBA is very much a generalist degree. Its about learning enough about all the parts of running a business that you can succeed at it. Its about being a mile wide and an inch deep. A doctorate is the opposite. Its about being a total expert in one small thing. Its about being an inch wide and a mile deep. Presumably a DBA would create a new management model. (with the mathematical rigor of one undergraduate calculus course and a hand-wavy statistics for social sciences summer session)
|
|
#
?
Mar 28, 2013 18:55
|
|
|
I'm getting very nervous about the GMAT. I took two practice tests that are included on the GMATPrep software: The first time I took it (Thursday) I got a 500 The second time I took it (today) I got a 730 Too much variation and the fact that I got a 500 is a big concern of mine, even if I saw a dramatic improvement two days later. I take the exam on the 12th of April. Any advice for the final stretch? I thought about downloading the $30 question pack but any other tips or what people did to consistently do well for exam preparation would be appreciated.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2013 00:28
|
|
|
Had you studied at all before the first one? Especially with the math there is lots of simple stuff that you wouldn't get if you haven't done it since high school. But a few hours of studying brings it right back.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2013 00:46
|
|
|
I actually studied quite a bit before the first time and hardly studied at all between the first and second practice exams. Hence the nervousness.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2013 00:55
|
|
|
Could you guys help with me technical question, I missed one of my revenue management classes on my course where we covered this: What is the price elasticity if customers have a log-linear demand?
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2013 23:51
|
|
|
The current university I work for is in no way a top school for MBA programs, but they will cover 90% of my tuition if I enroll in any sort of academic program. Unfortunately I hit a rough patch in undergrad (lots of family/personal disasters) that tanked my GPA so I wouldn't have a chance to get into a decent program anyway right now, but I've got 6 years of management experience in my field and I feel like earning an MBA, especially at such a low cost, would certainly not hurt me. My concentration would be in project management, as most of my job involves coordinating between different departments and creating deadlines/work expectations for various people working with/under me. My current plan is to enroll in the Project Management certification program here, which is 4 classes that will all be be applied directly to an MBA program if I decide that the curriculum is right for me. I'm well aware that the degree won't stand up to people with degrees from top-flight schools, but am I crazy for thinking this is a halfway decent idea?
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2013 18:07
|
|
|
What's your long term goal careerwise? Do you plan on staying in your current area in terms of geography and career path? If you don't get this MBA, do you ever see yourself getting one from a better school sometime in the future?
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2013 18:14
|
|
|
Looks fine to me. If your GPA is 2.5 or whatever, it's not like you have better options unless you are a literal rock star or football player.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2013 18:16
|
|
|
Thoguh posted:What's your long term goal careerwise? Do you plan on staying in your current area in terms of geography and career path? If you don't get this MBA, do you ever see yourself getting one from a better school sometime in the future? I'm currently working in Higher Education and have been since 2006. I just moved to Colorado and don't see myself moving from here anytime soon unless something fantastic opened up, as the location/weather/people/outdoor life are all pretty much perfect for me. As far as my career goes, I don't see myself intentionally branching from higher education, but I'm not married to my industry, if that makes sense. If I were to stay in higher ed., my 5-10 year goal would be to become head Registrar or head of Student Services at a university in the area. The only way I see myself being able to get into a top-tier program would be if I went back to (a different) school for a BS in applied mathematics (something I've been thinking about as I have most of a math degree completed), which would help with the poor GPA problem. GobiasIndustries fucked around with this message at 18:49 on Apr 9, 2013 |
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2013 18:31
|
|
|
menino posted:My future program has an 84% 3 month employment number (100% response rate, according to USnews) and a median income of 87k with a minimum of 60k. Which I'm getting for 10k plus living expenses (which I'd incur anyway of course). I don't make anything close to 87k now. The only way I can see this MBA not being worth it is if these numbers are cooked, which I have assumed is not the case after checking. If they're severely cooked then I am potentially screwed, but I find it hard to believe that they are to such a large degree so as to make my taking two years off work to get the MBA not worth it. A lot of median income numbers are bogus because mid-tier schools just attract "check the box" working professionals who are probably going there paid for by the company and were already earning that money. A better statistic would be median increase in salary.
|
|
#
?
Apr 9, 2013 22:54
|
|
|
Another (easier) solution to low GPA (mine was a 2.6) is to kill the GMAT. I mean, I wasn't getting hits from Wharton, but lower top 50 (decent F500 placement, not iBank/VC feeders) dug it just fine. Though I should point out that employers will care a lot about your undergrad GPA, which can make internships a PITA.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2013 00:23
|
|
|
dumpster17 posted:Another (easier) solution to low GPA (mine was a 2.6) is to kill the GMAT. I mean, I wasn't getting hits from Wharton, but lower top 50 (decent F500 placement, not iBank/VC feeders) dug it just fine. Though I should point out that employers will care a lot about your undergrad GPA, which can make internships a PITA. I'd pick a flagship state school like Colorado-Boulder at 90% off over a lower top 50 school if I were committed to staying in the same state for lifestyle/family reasons. Gobias, if you're 6+ years out of school, going back to do complex analysis and abstract algebra will be...difficult.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2013 00:45
|
|
|
Mandalay posted:Gobias, if you're 6+ years out of school, going back to do complex analysis and abstract algebra will be...difficult. Actually, I just finished up my degree this past May, so I'm not that far removed..I was working full time and doing class part-time to avoid taking out more student loans and for more practical experience. Again the math degree is a pretty small possibility but I'd probably take a calc refresher course at a local CC or something before jumping right in, though calc+ level courses came naturally to me. Anyway, that's neither here nor there, as a good GMAT score is a far more realistic goal to reach for.
|
|
#
?
Apr 10, 2013 02:39
|
|
|
Any wannabe ballers looking for GMAT books? I'm selling my full set of Manhattan GMAT books (3rd edition) and the set of three official GMAT books (11th edition). http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3543789
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2013 15:12
|
|
|
The Experiment posted:I'm getting very nervous about the GMAT. I took two practice tests that are included on the GMATPrep software: Well, I got a 570 with a horrific integrated reasoning score. I was stunned when I saw it. I should have studied harder (I studied for about a week and a half) but it is a part time program where the minimum is a 2.5 GPA and a 500 on the GMAT, and I got some great letters of recommendation so I'm still going to apply anyway.
|
|
#
?
Apr 30, 2013 02:48
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 03:05 |
|
|
I'm working on GMAT prep for the 2014 admissions cycle, and though I can articulate a nice BS "why do you want an MBA" answer I don't have a real one beyond "I'm sick of making 60% of the market rate for my skillset and responsibilities and want a path, any path, to some level of financial security". I do marketing analysis and CRM for a family-owned software company, and I'm wondering if getting an MA in Marketing and shooting for a position with a Fortune 500 firm might be better for me in the long run than pulling the MBA ripcord when my branding is so weak. Any goons who've been in similar situations have insight to offer?
|
|
#
?
May 1, 2013 15:16
|
|