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I don't really see either group as having a superior morality historically. This has been pretty well covered already and is getting a little trite E: my username illustrates this point pretty well too
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Apr 17, 2013 08:41
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Sorry, but if you build a pit of snakes and start throwing in underlings who have failed you once, you're the bad guys. Also coerce converting someone just so you can break a promise to a Christian instead of a Pagan is worth some serious Bond Villain points too.
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Apr 17, 2013 09:37
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I'm glad you either can't read or are willfully ignorant of what I said. Or just ignorant about history. Go look up some of the poo poo the "good guys" were doing and tell me if you still think its remotely black and white.
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Apr 17, 2013 09:41
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Perhaps my usage of the technical term commonly used in the Social Sciences, "Bond Villain", was what made my post seem as if it was an earnest treatise on the moral and ethical failings of the Anglo-Saxons in their dealings with the Vikings. I apologize.
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Apr 17, 2013 10:05
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Conquistador posted:I'm glad you either can't read or are willfully ignorant of what I said. Or just ignorant about history. Go look up some of the poo poo the "good guys" were doing and tell me if you still think its remotely black and white. Try reading his post again before starting to froth at the mouth like a fat Saxon king.
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Apr 17, 2013 15:08
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Flippycunt posted:Try reading his post again before starting to froth at the mouth like a fat Saxon king. Yeah, he referred to them as the bad guys, the point I was making that its all relative and that theyre relatively the same. Did you have any thoughts on the subject to add or?
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Apr 17, 2013 15:13
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Conquistador posted:Yeah, he referred to them as the bad guys, the point I was making that its all relative and that theyre relatively the same. Did you have any thoughts on the subject to add or? He referred to the Saxons in the show as coming across a bad guys, which doing poo poo like building snake pits, double crossing, and being douchey tends to do. I dont think we was putting down the Saxons historically as bad people dude, relax.
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Apr 17, 2013 15:14
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Oh. I mean, i was trying to say that theyre basically the same and that neither of them were fantastic. Who knows, i havent slept much since the vikings and or saxons bombed my city
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Apr 17, 2013 15:18
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TemetNosceXVIcubus posted:This is one of those "lies" that the people in the British isles keep telling themselves. There is very definitive genetic proof that the Welsh, Irish, English and Scots are not of Celtic origin. They're wannabe celts, they share the same culture, but they share none of the ancestry. Don't get me wrong, they were badass, just neolithical british isles Badasses, not celts. Um, what? 'Celtic', 'Germanic', 'Roman' etc are cultural groups, I said nothing about genetics. Britons spoke a Celtic language, worshipped Celtic gods, made Celtic art, etc. Some of the tribes that Caesar encountered in Britain were branches of the same tribes as on the continent, e.g. the Belgae.
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Apr 17, 2013 16:45
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He was probably referring to this claim from several years ago: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/07/0719_050719_britishgene.html and parts of these ideas: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celtic_settlement_of_Great_Britain_and_Ireland#Celtic_settlement
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Apr 17, 2013 17:19
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I just hope they get a quality antagonist soon. Ragnar's triumph's are less interesting when everyone opposed to him follows the same play book. *sneer* *frontal assault* *sneer* *half-rear end trickery* *frontal assault*
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Apr 17, 2013 17:42
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I don't care if the rest of the season is just them knitting a sweater. It's never boring to me. The pacing is great, it looks and sounds great, and I'm fine with not having clearly defined good guys and bad guys. Keeps things unpredictable even though it's all ancient history. I love this show  Seriously, I can't remember the last time I was this pumped for a new episode to be broadcast.
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Apr 17, 2013 18:20
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The good guys are clearly Ragnar because without Ragnar we'd probably call Thursday something stupid. Jovisday or something I bet.
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Apr 17, 2013 19:15
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hypersleep posted:I'm a little surprised to see the Saxons portrayed in such a negative light, them being Christians, on a mainstream TV show. They've been shown to be ineffective weaklings too busy praying to God to mount a competent offense or defense. And after the Vikings decimate their forces, they end up just giving them the gold to make them go away, while their king sputters with impotent rage. Just because they're Christian doesn't mean they can't be shown as dumbasses. I mean hell, Kingdom of Heaven showed them as a bunch of uneducated, dirty, smelly, moronic fucksticks compared to Muslims. None the less it's a good movie.
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Apr 17, 2013 19:44
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Sash! posted:The good guys are clearly Ragnar because without Ragnar we'd probably call Thursday something stupid. Jovisday or something I bet. The Anglo-Saxons had already borrowed this weekday naming scheme from Latin before being Christianized. They used their corresponding pagan deities (Tiw, Woden, Thunor, Frige) instead of the Latin versions, and kept the names after Christianization. This was before Ragnar's time and likely in parallel with the naming scheme's adoption into Old Norse. Edit: Saturday was the odd-day-out possibly because there wasn't a good corresponding pagan version of Saturn. Scandinavians called it "bathday" or something. Pioneer42 fucked around with this message at 20:07 on Apr 17, 2013 |
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Apr 17, 2013 20:01
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I may be reading too much in to this, but it seemed like Floki was not referring to the Rollo's conversion when he said something like "And NOW how will you get Odin to forgive you?" He emphasized the "now" in a way that made me think Rollo has been trying to get forgiveness for some time, and for some other reason.
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Apr 17, 2013 21:20
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Blue Star posted:The Christian Anglo-Saxons still had a lot of the same traditions as their pagan ancestors and Viking contemporaries. They still drank mead and ale and feasted in mead halls. I thought it was cool that they showed that in this episode, because a lot of people think that those things (mead, mead halls, etc.) are just Viking stuff. Well, the feasting, anyway. I've yet to see them drinking mead. From what I've been reading it seems like the most common drink was ale made from barley. Grapes didn't grow there but some wine was imported. It was rare and expensive so only the most important people got to drink it. Bee-keeping back then used skeps, woven basket-style hives, that had to be destroyed to harvest the honey, killing the bees in the process. So honey wasn't as cheaply and readily available as it is now. The page says that many bills were paid in honey, at least in England, so the wealthy and important types would have more, better honey for making mead. It also references other material indicating mead was only for special occasions and ceremonies.
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Apr 18, 2013 00:33
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SocketWrench posted:Just because they're Christian doesn't mean they can't be shown as dumbasses. I mean hell, Kingdom of Heaven showed them as a bunch of uneducated, dirty, smelly, moronic fucksticks compared to Muslims. None the less it's a good movie. Plus the Vikings did cause so much trouble with their raids that the victim kingdoms handed over protection money or even gave lands away in the case of Normandy to keep the dragon ships away.
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Apr 18, 2013 00:53
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The show still doesn't have enough Katheryn Winnick kicking the poo poo out of things. Feast well, Torstig and I laughed at King Greasy Hair's RAGNAR HOOOUUUSSSEEE!!!  I really like the fight choreography as well - everyone gets interesting and plausible things to do and the vikings always seem to make an effort to make sure the person they are fighting is proper dead.
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Apr 18, 2013 01:19
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Well, she was pretty darn pregnant for this episode. That shouldn't be a problem next time :/
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Apr 18, 2013 01:24
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hypersleep posted:I'm a little surprised to see the Saxons portrayed in such a negative light, them being Christians, on a mainstream TV show. They've been shown to be ineffective weaklings too busy praying to God to mount a competent offense or defense. And after the Vikings decimate their forces, they end up just giving them the gold to make them go away, while their king sputters with impotent rage. Except that's kind of what happened. There's even a word for it, 'Danegeld', which in modern English pretty easily translates to Dane's gold. Which was a tax levied to pay off Vikings to keep them from raiding. It's not uncommon for modern day war hawks to point to the Danegeld as a reason to avoid appeasement, because the Vikings just come back next year looking for more money. thrakkorzog fucked around with this message at 10:20 on Apr 19, 2013 |
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Apr 18, 2013 02:05
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I was a little disappointed that Tostig's arc ended so quickly. I mean, it was pretty obvious where it was eventually going to end, but I hoped Ragnar would be playfully kissing his bald head for at least a few more episodes. Which, by the way, was the most awesome moment in the episode.
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Apr 18, 2013 02:18
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That Rough Beast posted:I was a little disappointed that Tostig's arc ended so quickly. I mean, it was pretty obvious where it was eventually going to end, but I hoped Ragnar would be playfully kissing his bald head for at least a few more episodes. Which, by the way, was the most awesome moment in the episode. Now Archer is the only TV series with a surviving hobbit.
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Apr 18, 2013 03:02
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etalian posted:Now Archer is the only TV series with a surviving hobbit. Mallory killed the Hobbit near the beginning of the latest season.
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Apr 18, 2013 03:06
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thrakkorzog posted:Mallory killed the Hobbit near the beginning of the latest season. So hobbits only survive in the Lord of the Rings movies. Also the Danegeld pulled in some pretty impressive amounts of precious for example the ransom for one year to keep the Flokis away was 26,000 pounds of silver and many kingdoms under the threat of Viking invasions so it as just another standard cost of running the kingdom
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Apr 18, 2013 03:49
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DS at Night posted:I don't care if the rest of the season is just them knitting a sweater. It's never boring to me. The pacing is great, it looks and sounds great, and I'm fine with not having clearly defined good guys and bad guys. Keeps things unpredictable even though it's all ancient history. I love this show I would definitely watch this show if all they did was sit around drinking and knitting cool viking sweaters.  I hope that knitting sweaters while watching Vikings becomes a thing. There's already a companion book: 
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Apr 18, 2013 05:53
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The  knitting patterns ever. ^Anyway, I agree this show is so interesting because it follows a band of complete assholes , especially when you find out that a lot of the stuff thats happened in the show actually happened in real life... and that the whole gangrape/murder funeral was a big thing for their culture. 
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Apr 18, 2013 07:26
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Sash! posted:The good guys are clearly Ragnar because without Ragnar we'd probably call Thursday something stupid. Jovisday or something I bet. Also, protagonist not hero. Plus I'm kind of worried about what's gonna happen next episode.  Noni posted:I would definitely watch this show if all they did was sit around drinking and knitting cool viking sweaters. If there's anything I learned from TV it's that they love their knitted sweaters an inappropriate amount up north (example: Forbrydelsen).
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Apr 18, 2013 07:45
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There was something about that scene just as Ragnar's camp was preparing for the incoming army they saw coming that was just so...sexy. Poor Lagertha  ...was...was that her baby in the bowl the slave lady put outside?
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Apr 18, 2013 09:09
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Probably afterbirth. She seemed pretty far along so I don't think her baby would've fit on a plate that size. Pretty gruesome either way. I wonder if it will be blamed on Siggy bringing bad luck. The next episode preview seems to point the finger at Athelstan, though.
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Apr 18, 2013 12:21
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I don't think the preview was pointing any fingers, just Ragnar and crew trying to find the best sacrifice to make the gods happy. Although, given Floki's annoyance with Rollo over the whole baptism thing, I could see him doing his best to get things turned so Siggy or her daughter get sacrificed. And of course doing a little dance and playing with some fire.
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Apr 18, 2013 15:42
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^Wouldn't be surprising. Floki is probably the most terrifying character on the show during those few moments he gets serious about something. When he called out the Earl for being a shameful viking at the initial rejection of Ragnar's duel offer or during Rollo's conversion he straightened up and got this creepy, fixed look in his eyes. It's pretty subtle but more intimidating than Ragnar's smirk or Rollo's scowl. Props to the actor for making that happen.
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Apr 19, 2013 04:17
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I prefer the smirk 
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Apr 19, 2013 05:34
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Gyges posted:I don't think the preview was pointing any fingers, just Ragnar and crew trying to find the best sacrifice to make the gods happy. Although, given Floki's annoyance with Rollo over the whole baptism thing, I could see him doing his best to get things turned so Siggy or her daughter get sacrificed. And of course doing a little dance and playing with some fire. Sacrifice Athelstan! Or is Athelstan going a bit native?  I lost it at the part where Rangar said to the king "I too have a man of god!" Like some kind of Christian pokemons.
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Apr 19, 2013 06:56
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lt_kennedy posted:Sacrifice Athelstan! quote:I lost it at the part where Rangar said to the king "I too have a man of god!" Like some kind of Christian pokemons. That and the plate smashing cracked me up so much. I loved last episode a whole lot.
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Apr 19, 2013 08:03
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lt_kennedy posted:I lost it at the part where Rangar said to the king "I too have a man of god!" Like some kind of Christian pokemons. He does look like he's about to evolve into his next form.
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Apr 19, 2013 08:27
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Gustaf Skarsgård could play the Joker if by some retcon magic if he's alive in the inevitable Batman reboot. He would crush it
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Apr 19, 2013 08:49
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Rocksicles posted:Gustaf Skarsgård could play the Joker if by some retcon magic if he's alive in the inevitable Batman reboot. He would crush it He would also make for a great Loki over in the Marvel Films.
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Apr 19, 2013 09:47
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actually thinking about the way he moves and how lanky he is, he'd be a great Riddler
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Apr 19, 2013 10:36
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Rocksicles posted:actually thinking about the way he moves and how lanky he is, he'd be a great Riddler Ugly him up a bit, and he would make a for a decent Deadpool.
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Apr 19, 2013 11:58
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