Terrible Editorials, Opinion Pieces and Letters to the Editor

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«‹›106 »

Ned: May 23, 2002; by Hand Knit

Unreal_One posted:

Hell, they could have their own plane by 1912!

The Titanic, which would have crossed the Atlantic in a week, was an example of 1912 mobility. It's more of a comparison of a middle class person and someone from 2 centuries ago, and even then, the 1812 baron had a better life than their 1912 one.

It bothers me when people have no idea that poverty isn't a static concept. A color TV was a luxury in the 70's but a flat screen TV today is hardly a luxury - it is the only thing on the market. Same thing with smart phones. Just because an old person who doesn't like technology is happy with their land-line doesn't mean poor people should have smart phones. They are pretty much the most useful thing a person can own these days.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 03:51

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# ? May 28, 2024 17:27

VideoTapir: Oct 18, 2005; He'll tire eventually.

Adam Smith posted:

�A linen shirt � is, strictly speaking, not a necessary of life. The Greeks and Romans lived, I suppose, very comfortably though they had no linen. But in the present times, through the greater part of Europe, a creditable day-labourer would be ashamed to appear in public without a linen shirt, the want of which would be supposed to denote that disgraceful degree of poverty which, it is presumed, nobody can well fall into without extreme bad conduct.�

# ? Apr 30, 2013 05:29

Armyman25: Sep 6, 2005

VideoTapir posted:

Dear loving god this response. Every point missed. No understanding of what everything costs.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2718392/replies?c=27

I like that this guy thinks that every state has a deposit on their cans.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 05:43

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

I'll never not love people so far up their own rear end they don't understand that 'just don't be poor, DUH' isn't an answer.

And by 'love' I mean 'want to throw out a window'.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 07:40

Kegluneq: Feb 18, 2011; Mr President, the physical reality of Prime Minister Corbyn is beyond your range of apprehension. If you'll just put on these PINKOVISION glasses...

VideoTapir posted:

Adam Smith posted:
�A linen shirt � is, strictly speaking, not a necessary of life. The Greeks and Romans lived, I suppose, very comfortably though they had no linen. But in the present times, through the greater part of Europe, a creditable day-labourer would be ashamed to appear in public without a linen shirt, the want of which would be supposed to denote that disgraceful degree of poverty which, it is presumed, nobody can well fall into without extreme bad conduct.�

Adam Smith was full of poo poo, linen has been in use since the Neolithic in Europe. :eng101:

The worst response I saw was this one (cross posting from the Freeper thread). Guess poor people aren't really poor. :smug:

# ? Apr 30, 2013 07:56

little munchkin: Aug 15, 2010

Boxman posted:

I don't know a ton about the issue.but I like to learn- what is that criticism?

Despite being an activist opponent of white privilege in society, he's benefited from it a whole lot. There's plenty of minority anti-racism activists, but he's the one that sells all the books and gets all the media attention and speaking gigs. It's something he admits to; he's no more knowledgeable or competent than his minority colleagues, and many of them were making the same arguments long before he was, but not many people were listening until a white man came along.

It helps spread awareness because he's able to reach audiences that would have no interest in listening to an actual black person talking about how his race is being held back by society, but it has downsides. He prevents minority scholars and activists from getting attention that they deserve just as much as he does, and keeps POCs from being the spokespeople for their own movement.

I think that's what watt par was referring to. I hope I did an ok job at explaining it. Like he said though, that college republican misses the mark, because he's not using the criticism he honestly wants to raise the status of minorities, he just wants to be able to say that everyone in this scenario is being racist except him, the privileged white kid writing articles about how white privilege is nonexistent.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 15:20

Grand Theft Autobot: Feb 28, 2008; I'm something of a fucking idiot myself

I had that 1912 Rich vs 2012 Poor thing come up in a bar argument before the election, and my drunken brain was still able to come up with the only response necessary to shut that whole thing down, "So who would you rather be? Andrew Carnegie, or the Obamaphone Lady?"

You cannot answer that question in good faith without completely undoing your argument.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 15:25

PeterWeller: Apr 21, 2003; I told you that story so I could tell you this one.

quote:

...teach your kids stealing meat from the store is wrong and unacceptable under all conditions.

I find this one to be the absolute worst. You can just hear the smug self-satisfaction dripping off this bit of petty moralizing.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 16:26

Boxman: Sep 27, 2004; Big fan of

Thanks for the Tim Rice stuff, thread.

Also, The Onion pretty much perfectly summed up that "To not be poor" thing way back in 1997.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 16:46

Gynocentric Regime: Jun 9, 2010; by Cyrano4747

watt par posted:

Here's a pretty good and often self-critical piece by Ewuare Osayande on not just Wise, but white anti-racist activism in general. To be fair, Wise is pretty good about acknowledging the problems himself, which are in part beyond his control.

I saw Tim Wise speak at a UAA, and the first five minutes of his talk was taking the administration to task for choosing him to talk to AHAINA (the University's minority group) rather than a person of color. Very unexpected but awesome.

Gynocentric Regime fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Apr 30, 2013

# ? Apr 30, 2013 19:36

Amused to Death: Aug 10, 2009; google "The Night Witches", and prepare for

30 Reasons to hate Barack Obama

http://townhall.com/columnists/johnhawkins/2013/04/30/30-reasons-to-dislike-barack-obama-n1582397/page/full

I'm much impressed with 12 and 13
12) He looks like a pansy when he rides his little bike in mom jeans.

13) He throws like a six year old girl.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 22:40

AstroWhale: Mar 28, 2009

I know it's low hanging fruit, but still.
http://www.redstate.com/2013/04/24/this-is-why-we-need-to-pass-cispa/

quote:

We�re at war online. Iran, North Korea, and Russia are the sources of sustained attacks on our government and our economy. They steal from us, they disrupt our operations, and they�re no better than the pirates of old. On the sea, such attacks would eventually mean war, but on the Internet they get a pass.

Individuals do tend to get nabbed after the fact, as they build massive botnets for credit card fraud and Bitcoin mining, but it�s not enough to sit back passively and wait to get attacked before doing anything.

We need to be proactive, and that means putting together all the information we can about attacks past, present, and future. We need to be able to deal with attacks before the spin up fully. We need to pass along warnings before it�s too late. And that means we need legislation to prevent trial lawyers from making a mess of all of this. So that�s why it�s time to pass CISPA.

Inaction isn�t going to fly as an answer here. If we do not find a way to use government in a legitimate role as national security provider, then the Democrats will try again. The last few times they�ve tried, they went with a high-regulatory approach, giving the President �emergency� dictatorial powers over private property and internet infrastructure. These bills have gone as far as the Internet Kill Switch plans, letting the President order that American Internet connections to the rest of the world be shut down, and be given power over the private employees who have the ability to do that.

It is important that we can improve this situation, and get us moving in the right direction, with a light touch. A clearing house for voluntary information sharing, aggregating data in industry-standard ways, is about the lightest possible touch we�re going to have here.

Amendments are possible. There are surely ways we can tweak the language of the law to find just the right balance between private �privacy� agreements, and need to address the pressing national security threat. Address those in the Senate.

But nebulous privacy concerns are not an argument in themselves. Improving this bill is something that must be done in a constructive way. In particular, we must dismiss entirely the left-libertarian radicals who keep screaming that this bill has anything to do with copyright or SOPA. The anarchists, freeloaders, Pirate Party types, Anontards, and associated scum want to sink this bill because they oppose greater cybersecurity. The online bomb throwers don�t want us to be better protected.

Let the normal legislative process move forward, amend CISPA into the best practical bill we can make it, and make it into law.

Freeloaders :argh:

# ? Apr 30, 2013 23:05

Guilty Spork: Feb 26, 2011; Thunder rolled. It rolled a six.

Amused to Death posted:

30 Reasons to hate Barack Obama

http://townhall.com/columnists/johnhawkins/2013/04/30/30-reasons-to-dislike-barack-obama-n1582397/page/full

I'm much impressed with 12 and 13
12) He looks like a pansy when he rides his little bike in mom jeans.

13) He throws like a six year old girl.

This piece totally sounds like a parody in some places, and in others just fails to back up its assertions. I also like how drone strikes against civilians and renewing the Patriot Act apparently don't make the Top 30 at all.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 23:12

Radbot: Aug 12, 2009; Can't post for 3 years!

If Tim Wise is bad because people pay attention to him because he's white, can a white person ever be an anti-racist ally in any meaningful sense? Can a man ever not be part of the patriarchy? I thought the whole idea was to use your privilege to bring down that privilege, it sounds like that's not good enough.

# ? Apr 30, 2013 23:51

Fulchrum: Apr 16, 2013; by R. Guyovich

Amused to Death posted:

30 Reasons to hate Barack Obama

http://townhall.com/columnists/johnhawkins/2013/04/30/30-reasons-to-dislike-barack-obama-n1582397/page/full

I'm much impressed with 12 and 13
12) He looks like a pansy when he rides his little bike in mom jeans.

13) He throws like a six year old girl.

From th comments, but still paraphrasing most of what was being said.

quote:

My primary two reasons for disliking the President are his left wing politics, and also his ego combined with his haughty looking down his nose at his servants.

Translation - "that uppity friend of the family thinks he's better than us white folks."

# ? May 1, 2013 03:11

Alec Bald Snatch: Sep 12, 2012; by exmarx

Amused to Death posted:

30 Reasons to hate Barack Obama

http://townhall.com/columnists/johnhawkins/2013/04/30/30-reasons-to-dislike-barack-obama-n1582397/page/full

I'm much impressed with 12 and 13
12) He looks like a pansy when he rides his little bike in mom jeans.

13) He throws like a six year old girl.

Coulda just combined the two into

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WcRXJ4piHg

# ? May 1, 2013 06:27

Amarkov: Jun 21, 2010

Radbot posted:

If Tim Wise is bad because people pay attention to him because he's white, can a white person ever be an anti-racist ally in any meaningful sense? Can a man ever not be part of the patriarchy? I thought the whole idea was to use your privilege to bring down that privilege, it sounds like that's not good enough.

The best intentions and the best actions don't somehow get rid of white privilege. It's wonderful that Tim Wise is a voice of anti-racist activism, but that doesn't make it less horrible that white people are the most celebrated voices of anti-racist activism.

# ? May 1, 2013 07:34

Fulchrum: Apr 16, 2013; by R. Guyovich

Amarkov posted:

The best intentions and the best actions don't somehow get rid of white privilege. It's wonderful that Tim Wise is a voice of anti-racist activism, but that doesn't make it less horrible that white people are the most celebrated voices of anti-racist activism.

I'd be curious to know by what measure Tim Wise is the most celebrated anti-racist activist, and not just another well known anti-racist activist.

# ? May 1, 2013 08:04

Alec Bald Snatch: Sep 12, 2012; by exmarx

Fulchrum posted:

I'd be curious to know by what measure Tim Wise is the most celebrated anti-racist activist, and not just another well known anti-racist activist.

Name another anti-racist activist without looking any up.

# ? May 1, 2013 09:00

Pope Guilty: Nov 6, 2006; The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

watt par posted:

Name another anti-racist activist without looking any up.

Ta-Nehisi Coates?

# ? May 1, 2013 10:36

Name Change: Oct 9, 2005

watt par posted:

Name another anti-racist activist without looking any up.

Al Sharpton? Also I could probably think of five dead black activists off the top of my head who are more famous than Wise will ever be. This argument is stupid anyway.

# ? May 1, 2013 10:49

Borneo Jimmy: Feb 27, 2007; by Smythe

Here's a pure injection of crazy straight from the Huffington Post.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/rakhi-kumar/michelle-obama-beyonce_b_3120434.html?utm_hp_ref=tw

quote:

Dear Michelle Obama,

I'm addressing this to you because I admire you. Because you're smart and a mum to two young girls. And you're the First Lady of the USA. And because you were recently quoted as saying that Beyonce is a great 'role model' to your two daughters, and because you recently tweeted, after the Superbowl, that you were 'so proud' of her. I'm writing because everything you do is admired and emulated by so many; but when you endorse a recording artist like Beyonce, I see the most misogynistic aspects of the music industry (that prefers girls to be no more complex than dolls) interpret your comments as a seal of approval for the thoughtless cultural currency that they flood the youth market with. I'm writing because I think it's time to stop suggesting to very young girls that ultimate feminine success - in the music industry or anywhere else - comes with the need, or the expectation for them to undress.

When Beyonce kicked off her Mrs. Carter Show World Tour two nights ago, wearing her sheer bodysuit with nipples showing, to me she performed the final degradation of her talent; a retrogressive transformation that has taken someone stellar and otherworldly, and made them into something dreadfully familiar and sad.

Variations of Beyonce's body suit can be found in brothels, strip clubs and red light districts across the world - where sex is for sale and it happens to be dispensed through a woman's body. That she is a human being with feelings and dreams, perhaps a sister, a mother, a leader, a teacher, a student - ALWAYS - a daughter - all of this can be forgotten. In those surroundings a suit like Beyonce's would look far from glamorous. Maybe just downright heartbreaking as a woman somewhere becomes an object, available for the gratification of a desire - at a price dictated by her 'managers'.

Next time you're presented with a shortlist of people in popular culture who you should spend time with or commend, think about how many young girls want to be just like Beyonce: Beyonce who sings 'Bow Down Bitch' and wears sheer bodysuits and high heels, singing about making money and being independent.

Remember that in the USA, the average age of a girl when she is trafficked for sex for the first time is 13.

Remember that she's often brought into the 'life' by drug dealers who promise her a celebrity lifestyle, clothes like the ones Beyonce wears, and situations where she can live like Queen Bey: looking hot, being desired by alpha males, wielding power over others with her body and sexuality.

Understand that in an obscene act of manipulation by the young men who will pimp them, for a very short amount of time - maybe only for a half an hour in one of their early encounters - young girls who are trafficked do actually get to taste the experience that they have identified as ultimate feminine success: they get given hot pants or body suits like the one Beyonce's dancing in, they dance for men who find them alluring, and for a very short time, these very young girls are convinced that they've made it - only to be assaulted, abused and sometimes murdered in the years ahead, by the men who they thought wanted them.

Beyonce, performing in sheer body suits, nipples displayed, mouth open, high heels and sheer tights, shaking her butt on stage, can no longer be held by world leaders as an icon of female success.

Because for as long as she is, we are feeding a demonic myth that women must make themselves sexually available to enjoy ultimate success. And it is demonic because the impact this myth has on those most vulnerable young girls who fall pray to, is unimaginably horrible.

It can take years of a young girl's life away from her when she tries to escape a life of abuse at home by believing promises of money and glamor, sexual allure and power - a life just like the most successful women in the world; only to be sold for sex, beaten, and made addicted to drugs. It can take a chance of an educated, secure future away from her; and sometimes, if she can't find an exit - it can take her very life away from her.

Beyonce is a singer and a songwriter. She doesn't need to wear see through clothes or body suits to sing. We know that because we've seen her singing accapella in a hospital in a pair of jeans and a T-shirt and - and she sounded like a celestial being from a different dimension.

She doesn't have to do this. She's choosing to. And she's not the first or only one woman to do it. And like the many women who have played this game the way they have, her reasons may be economic, artistic, personal or even misunderstood.
But whatever her reasons, her influence cannot be underestimated or misunderstood.

And it's time that young girls were sent a different message. A more refined, intelligent message. A message that engaged them at the level of their intellect and potential because implicit in our message to them should be the acknowledgement that they are naturally brilliant and that we believe that they are capable of everything -without ever having to undress to achieve their success.

The work here is to re etch the self image and self worth of young girls who think that sexualizing themselves is necessary to be powerful or successful.

So please - let it be known that Beyonce is not a role model.
She may have a lot of money, and she may have enormous influence.
But she can no longer be called a role model.

(Unless you think it would be really cool for Sasha or Malia to follow her example and sing songs for people on a stage whilst wearing sheer gold glitter bodysuits detailing the contours of their body, under the management of their daddy and/or their husband).

Instead, call out those who deliberately allow their sexual identity to eclipse the genius of their spirit and sacredness of their soul. Tell young girls that they are more than that. Engage with artists who sing, dance, write, design, perform - but whose presentation centers on showcasing the brilliance of their brain, not their body.

If I had daughters I'd tell them to pass on the Beyonce show because when you're wearing a sheer see through body suit with nipples on display, no matter how much gold thread in it - I don't see any light coming out of it. I just see a glowing ball of soullessness.

I'd say to my girls - all that's gold doesn't glitter. Let's find something genuinely luminous...and take them to a Lorna Simpson exhibition, or a C.C White concert, or hand them a Zadie Smith book.

tl;dr Beyonce's clothing will enfluence young teenage girls to become prostitutes.

# ? May 3, 2013 17:30

Zeroisanumber: Oct 23, 2010; Nap Ghost

Borneo Jimmy posted:

Here's a pure injection of crazy straight from the Huffington Post.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/rakhi-kumar/michelle-obama-beyonce_b_3120434.html?utm_hp_ref=tw

tl;dr Beyonce's clothing will enfluence young teenage girls to become prostitutes.

If Beyonce influences young girls to do anything it will be to replace their puny human forms with a being made of raw ambition, and I'm not certain that that's a bad thing.

# ? May 3, 2013 18:12

Acrophyte: Sep 5, 2012; Respect me like Pesci
and if rap was hockey
I be Gretzky

Zeroisanumber posted:

If Beyonce influences young girls to do anything it will be to replace their puny human forms with a being made of raw ambition, and I'm not certain that that's a bad thing.

Lemme put it this way, what was the last word you got added to the dictionary? :smug:

I'm ready for the jelly. :quagmire:

# ? May 3, 2013 18:56

Mr. Funny Pants: Apr 9, 2001

Zeroisanumber posted:

If Beyonce influences young girls to do anything it will be to replace their puny human forms with a being made of raw ambition, and I'm not certain that that's a bad thing.

I think Beyonce is nuts, but if she can also influence girls and women to understand that their thighs, hips, and rear end don't have to be the size of a 9 year old's, that would be great too.

# ? May 3, 2013 22:52

Radbot: Aug 12, 2009; Can't post for 3 years!

Amarkov posted:

The best intentions and the best actions don't somehow get rid of white privilege. It's wonderful that Tim Wise is a voice of anti-racist activism, but that doesn't make it less horrible that white people are the most celebrated voices of anti-racist activism.

What is he supposed to do about that? Your post implies the world would be better off without anti-racist activists who are white.

Couldn't the same thing be said about celebrated straight/cis LGBT allies? It sucks that racism and homophobia exist, but the more people on the right side of history, the better.

# ? May 4, 2013 03:56

Fulchrum: Apr 16, 2013; by R. Guyovich

Besides which, you're making a judgement of his capacity to fulfill a role based on the color of his skin. A person doesn't have to have firsthand experience with a matter to be a valid and learned speaker on the matter.

Just pointing that out.

# ? May 4, 2013 09:12

Mecca-Benghazi: Mar 31, 2012

I didn't read that as an attack on Wise but a condemnation that people are only taking into account his ideas about race because he's white.

# ? May 4, 2013 09:24

Fulchrum: Apr 16, 2013; by R. Guyovich

Can it not just be because he's good at what he does, and his race doesn't factor into it?

# ? May 4, 2013 09:28

A Fancy 400 lbs: Jul 24, 2008

Fulchrum posted:

Can it not just be because he's good at what he does, and his race doesn't factor into it?

Even he admits that he just basically restates what activists of color have been saying for decades. Is it really that much of a stretch to say that racists that hate black people will probably listen to a white person instead of a black person?

# ? May 4, 2013 10:05

Amarkov: Jun 21, 2010

Autumncomet posted:

I didn't read that as an attack on Wise but a condemnation that people are only taking into account his ideas about race because he's white.

Yeah, this is exactly the point. The only obligation Wise has is to recognize that this is lovely, and he does. (I mean, ideally he'd refuse to take money from those people, but capitalism corrupts everything etc.)

# ? May 4, 2013 10:29

The Warszawa: Jun 6, 2005; Look at me. Look at me.

I am the captain now.

Fulchrum posted:

Can it not just be because he's good at what he does, and his race doesn't factor into it?

No, thanks to institutional and interpersonal racism. In a racist society, race is pretty much always a factor.

# ? May 4, 2013 11:14

Fulchrum: Apr 16, 2013; by R. Guyovich

A Fancy 400 lbs posted:

Even he admits that he just basically restates what activists of color have been saying for decades. Is it really that much of a stretch to say that racists that hate black people will probably listen to a white person instead of a black person?

About racial equality? Yes.

# ? May 4, 2013 11:32

Mecca-Benghazi: Mar 31, 2012

It's an institutional thing. There's a very real phenomenon where people of color that talk about racism aren't viewed as "objective" in their concerns whereas the white guy will be. It's dumb and lovely but if Wise is helping out, can't really condemn him for it.

# ? May 4, 2013 17:59

Amarkov: Jun 21, 2010

Autumncomet posted:

It's an institutional thing. There's a very real phenomenon where people of color that talk about racism aren't viewed as "objective" in their concerns whereas the white guy will be. It's dumb and lovely but if Wise is helping out, can't really condemn him for it.

I remember that one of the appeals judges for California Prop 8 was gay, and everyone was worried about how he could possibly render an objective decision about gay marriage.

# ? May 4, 2013 18:04

The Warszawa: Jun 6, 2005; Look at me. Look at me.

I am the captain now.

Amarkov posted:

I remember that one of the appeals judges for California Prop 8 was gay, and everyone was worried about how he could possibly render an objective decision about gay marriage.

The district judge, Vaughn Walker. Largely conservative, law & econ judge, Bush I appointee. Literally the least controversial profile possible in the district courts.

# ? May 4, 2013 18:09

Fulchrum: Apr 16, 2013; by R. Guyovich

Autumncomet posted:

It's an institutional thing. There's a very real phenomenon where people of color that talk about racism aren't viewed as "objective" in their concerns whereas the white guy will be. It's dumb and lovely but if Wise is helping out, can't really condemn him for it.

I really do have to scream bullshit at this. Unless you can find me someone out and out saying this, I think this is some people reading racism into what should logically be a post racial topic.

# ? May 4, 2013 21:46

Radbot: Aug 12, 2009; Can't post for 3 years!

Some people view people that have a vested interest in the topic at hand as not able to be completely impartial about it. It's extremely dumb in this circumstance, but it does happen. People that hate on white anti-racist advocates or straight/cis LGBT allies are the people who make the SJ movement look loving dumb and alienating to outsiders.

# ? May 4, 2013 22:09

Fulchrum: Apr 16, 2013; by R. Guyovich

Yes, Racists will say that, in an attempt to shut down any talks of racial equality. Its just a troll argument so that they can discredit some racial theorists who say things that upset them - there is no way in hell those people would actually find the arguments palatable from a white man.

Is this something people have said about Tim Wise, or are you just assuming the worst of his supporters?

# ? May 4, 2013 22:13

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# ? May 28, 2024 17:27

Radbot: Aug 12, 2009; Can't post for 3 years!

Try frequenting any SJ board/tumblr and you'll frequently see claims that allies/activists that advocate for a minority that they are not specifically a part of cannot ever be legitimate fighters for that cause.

# ? May 4, 2013 22:18

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Terrible Editorials, Opinion Pieces and Letters to the Editor

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