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MassRanTer posted:Here are some stats just to show how completely insane Bischoff was for thinking everything was lost in 98. I already said they made their biggest profits, but how much did business grow? I wonder how much of this insanity was due to burnout from dealing with the shark tank that was the WCW Main Event and how much was Eric just being a loving idiot as always. Like 30/70?
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May 8, 2013 13:54
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MassRanTer posted:They were winning every demographic in the ratings except for children (where they lost big enough to lose the ratings week in and week out, but still.) When you say this, do you mean that there was a huge influx of children watching Raw? Or that wrestling in general wasn't popular with kids at the time. I remember hearing that WCW's kid friendly image ironically ended up sending all the young viewers to WWF, just didn't actually see numbers.
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May 8, 2013 15:06
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Quotes from the March 4, 1996 Observer:quote:WCW is making the cardinal mistake of relying too much on the old-timers rather than use the old-timers for their name value and use the underneath time to get over the young stars and groom them for headline positions. It's a broken record and you all know the story of how the old guys are basically blocking anyone except their friends from advancing to the top. But you also have to look at it from a company standpoint. They are in a weekly ratings war and the old guys have the name value to draw the ratings and the good workers don't have the name value even though they have better matches. Except for Luger's reactions and the opening match it was a very poor show. The total crowd (not paid crowd) and gate in Knoxville was larger than anything SMW ever did in that building. WCW wouldn't allow any signs in the building for this show because they were afraid Jim Cornette would have a friend get something on the air, not realizing Cornette is living in Connecticut and is basically incommunicado with most of the civilized and uncivilized world. quote:Eric Bischoff was back to talking about WWF on the show, giving away the Raw results (so quickly it didn't have the desired effect) and calling it the World Whining Federation. His other reference, was in the new storyline where they talk about Bootie Man formerly being Zodiac but that he was a spy all along in the Taskmaster's camp and McMichael brought up having a spy in the enemies camp is great strategy and Bischoff came back with something like he's subscribes to that theory as well. quote:Based on the television, it appears the Tupelo line-up on top will revert to its original deal with Loch Ness in the main event and Luger teaming with Sting against Warriors. At least that's what the weekend TV leads you to believe. WCW, particularly the guys running the ship, are so into working everyone that it seems more important to "fool people" than to do things that lead to building interest in the issues and thus make money. Somehow the mentality has degenerated into fooling people equals making money when in most cases in wrestling, building up things that hit a nerve with the fans and make sense over the long haul makes the most money. quote:Ed Leslie in an On-line interview said he gave up his lawsuit against McMahon to get the rights to use the name Brutus Beefcake about two months ago because the legal fees were more than he could afford. This issue also talks about Hall and Nash leaving for WCW, we're getting closer to the nWo!
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May 8, 2013 15:32
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triplexpac posted:When you say this, do you mean that there was a huge influx of children watching Raw? Or that wrestling in general wasn't popular with kids at the time. The WWF just had more kid viewers, wrestling was super popular with kids during the Monday Night Wars and WWF always dominated that demo.
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May 8, 2013 17:34
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It's so funny seeing all these complaints about WCW in 1996 that could fit in modern day wrestling, even. I love "the guys running the ship are so into working everyone that it seems more important to "fool people" than to do things that lead to building interest in the issues and thus make money"
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May 8, 2013 17:59
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I know it's small potatoes compared to most of the other stuff they did, but every time I'm reminded that Bischoff used to read Raw results on-air I'm dumbstruck all over again by how petulant and shortsighted it is.
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May 8, 2013 19:57
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MassRanTer posted:Here are some stats just to show how completely insane Bischoff was for thinking everything was lost in 98. I already said they made their biggest profits, but how much did business grow? You would think 18-30 was at least as valuable as the younger demo, if not more so.
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May 9, 2013 00:04
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CarlCX posted:I know it's small potatoes compared to most of the other stuff they did, but every time I'm reminded that Bischoff used to read Raw results on-air I'm dumbstruck all over again by how petulant and shortsighted it is. In his takedown of Bischoff's book Meltzer pointed out that Bischoff consulted others about giving out results. He would only do it when there was a consensus that Nitro had a more compelling show. However, on January 4th 1999 the usual suspects were not consulted. They all told Dave they would have told Bischoff not to do it. The funny thing is Raw had live commentary for the taped show tonight so when they heard the results go out they promised viewers their main event wouldn't start at 11 pm and be mostly talking like most Nitro main events. Giving away results wasn't short sighted, but doing it the night of the finger poke was insanely stupid.
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May 9, 2013 00:07
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MassRanTer posted:In his takedown of Bischoff's book Meltzer pointed out that Bischoff consulted others about giving out results. He would only do it when there was a consensus that Nitro had a more compelling show. However, on January 4th 1999 the usual suspects were not consulted. They all told Dave they would have told Bischoff not to do it. The funny thing is Raw had live commentary for the taped show tonight so when they heard the results go out they promised viewers their main event wouldn't start at 11 pm and be mostly talking like most Nitro main events. Giving away results wasn't short sighted, but doing it the night of the finger poke was insanely stupid. The fingerpoke was insanely stupid, so one good turn deserved another.
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May 9, 2013 00:11
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It was pretty gracious of McMahon to give Bischoff a job after all the poo poo he pulled.
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May 9, 2013 00:24
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Don't forget that Bischoff's got so rattled by the comments on the Raw commentary, and was so annoyed he lost his cool and started handing Tony notes to make the anti foley comments, as he was sitting next to him at the time.
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May 9, 2013 00:26
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Animal-Mother posted:It was pretty gracious of McMahon to give Bischoff a job after all the poo poo he pulled. I would say it was more of an ego massage for Vince, in that he likely took more than a tiny bit of satisfaction from putting Bischoff--the guy who once came very close to bankrupting WWE--on the WWE payroll.
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May 9, 2013 00:32
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And don't forget that Bischoff's WWE career literally ended with Vince tossing him into a garbage truck.
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May 9, 2013 14:11
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Zack_Gochuck posted:And don't forget that Bischoff's WWE career literally ended with Vince tossing him into a garbage truck. I still maintain that Bischoff as the Raw GM was the best one they ever had. When he's an on-air character with no storyline power, he's terrific. He's very good at being a smarmy heel, or a heel who doesn't give a poo poo about faces or heels.
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May 9, 2013 14:40
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Writer Cath posted:I still maintain that Bischoff as the Raw GM was the best one they ever had. When he's an on-air character with no storyline power, he's terrific. He's very good at being a smarmy heel, or a heel who doesn't give a poo poo about faces or heels. Yeah, he was honestly pretty hateable on account of that poo poo-eating grin and he was rarely anyone's ally, even heels. Basically he was an evil lickspittle.
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May 10, 2013 09:40
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Writer Cath posted:I still maintain that Bischoff as the Raw GM was the best one they ever had. When he's an on-air character with no storyline power, he's terrific. He's very good at being a smarmy heel, or a heel who doesn't give a poo poo about faces or heels. Kevin Nash for Raw GM!
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May 10, 2013 14:05
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Corzaa posted:Kevin Nash for Raw GM! Only if he gets fired and thrown in some manner of mass-waste receptacle.
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May 10, 2013 14:22
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Corzaa posted:Kevin Nash for Raw GM!
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May 10, 2013 18:18
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Thanks to MrBling we will be able to watch Uncensored 96 and the legendary Finlay/Regal brawl on Tuesday!
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May 12, 2013 21:12
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Oh wow, that'll be great. Those two REALLY kick the poo poo out of each other.
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May 12, 2013 21:27
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This show won TWO Observer Awards. That doesn't happen every year. This is an event you need to see. Just to hype up this mega event even more, here's the card: Eddie Guerrero vs. Konnan Lord Steven Regal vs. The Belfast Bruiser Col. Robert Parker vs. Madusa Diamond Dallas Page vs. The Booty Man in a Retirement Match The Giant vs. Loch Ness The Road Warriors vs. Booker T & Sting in a Chicago Street Fight Hulk Hogan & Randy Savage vs. Ric Flair, Arn Anderson, Lex Luger, Kevin Sullivan, The Barbarian, Meng, Z-Gangsta, & The Ultimate Solution (THE ALLIANCE TO END HULKAMANIA) in a Doomsday Cage Match Just look at that card. Look at it. All you need to do is tune in Tuesday at 8 and you will see not one of those matches, not most of them, BUT ALL OF THEM.
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May 13, 2013 07:29
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I still can't loving believe WCW initially called the Ultimate Solution "The Final Solution".
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May 13, 2013 12:41
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Strenuous Manflurry posted:I still can't loving believe WCW initially called the Ultimate Solution "The Final Solution". This was the same WCW that floated the idea of having Col. Parker bring Harlem Heat out in chains for their debut appearance, so I can't really say I'm all that surprised.
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May 13, 2013 13:03
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MassRanTer posted:This show won TWO Observer Awards. That doesn't happen every year. This is an event you need to see. The best thing about the cage match other then the match itself is that Hogan wanted Pillman in it so he could "help" him get over. However, Pillman knew better so during that time it was time to get surgery.
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May 13, 2013 13:14
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Sydney Bottocks posted:This was the same WCW that floated the idea of having Col. Parker bring Harlem Heat out in chains for their debut appearance, so I can't really say I'm all that surprised. At least that one got cut (or did they do it live, but then not show it on TV?).
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May 13, 2013 13:17
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Strenuous Manflurry posted:At least that one got cut (or did they do it live, but then not show it on TV?). I think it was one of those things that had been kicked around by WCW's booking team before it was finally (mercifully) nixed... ...but with that said, I also wouldn't be the least bit shocked if it turns out that there were actual segments filmed, in front of a live crowd, where a stereotypical white Southerner brought out two black men in chains. Because WCW.
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May 13, 2013 13:21
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I'm pretty sure they done it at one or two house shows and the crowd absolutely ripped it to shreds. Which is funny in it's own dimension, because it makes it look like WCW were actually surprised that a racist slavery gimmick was shat on.
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May 13, 2013 13:24
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VogeGandire posted:I'm pretty sure they done it at one or two house shows and the crowd absolutely ripped it to shreds. To say nothing of how puzzled I'm sure they were at the crowd reaction to the whole "rappers vs. cowboys" feud a few years later. 
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May 13, 2013 13:30
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Why is a fairly new to wrestling DDP taking on The Bootyman who debuted three weeks ago in a retirement match? Did I miss the blood feud that set up that match???
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May 13, 2013 14:40
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oatgan posted:Why is a fairly new to wrestling DDP taking on The Bootyman who debuted three weeks ago in a retirement match? If memory serves it was a feud over Kimberly Page aka The Booty Babe.
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May 13, 2013 18:09
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oatgan posted:Why is a fairly new to wrestling DDP taking on The Bootyman who debuted three weeks ago in a retirement match? It was supposed to have Johnny B Badd in the Bootyman role but he had already jumped ship to the WWF.
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May 13, 2013 18:10
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Was there a reason why Ed Leslie never feuded against the nWo after the beatdown? I mean we should be thankful that this never happened but it's still weird.
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May 13, 2013 21:02
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It was mostly because he had become a part of the One Warrior Nation and then Warrior left WCW. That pretty much took any remaining wind of the sails of the Brutus Beefcake push. Such as it was. A less nice way of phrasing it would be "because he's a literal nobody that was only employed because of his friendship with Hulk Hogan and even Hogan knew that feuding with him would lose the company money and fans".
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May 13, 2013 21:09
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MrBling posted:It was mostly because he had become a part of the One Warrior Nation and then Warrior left WCW. That pretty much took any remaining wind of the sails of the Brutus Beefcake push. Such as it was. That did not stop them from main eventing Starrcade 94!
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May 13, 2013 21:12
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bobkatt013 posted:That did not stop them from main eventing Starrcade 94! As dumb as you might think WCW was in the late 90s, it was nothing compared to 1994.
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May 13, 2013 21:17
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MrBling posted:As dumb as you might think WCW was in the late 90s, it was nothing compared to 1994. It went from Flair/Steamboat to that
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May 13, 2013 21:19
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MrBling posted:It was mostly because he had become a part of the One Warrior Nation and then Warrior left WCW. That pretty much took any remaining wind of the sails of the Brutus Beefcake push. Such as it was. I think he meant when he was beaten down by the nWo in 96, but that was just a way to write him out of the company.
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May 13, 2013 21:19
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Heh, I recently watched the Timeline 1989 with Brutus and he used this exact sentence to describe himself pre-Barber gimmick: "Brutus Beefcake, the hottest heel in the business, a household name, the greatest thing since sliced bread."
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May 13, 2013 21:21
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MassRanTer posted:I think he meant when he was beaten down by the nWo in 96, but that was just a way to write him out of the company. Oh right. Well yeah, that was just him leaving the company to do more drugs or whatever it was he did.
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May 13, 2013 21:22
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MrBling posted:Oh right. Well yeah, that was just him leaving the company to do more drugs or whatever it was he did. and I must admit, he looked far more impressive as The Disciple (though he still sucked in the ring).
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May 13, 2013 21:40
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