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CommieGIR posted:I hear rumors Russia is moving their only carrier to the waters near Syria to discourage Western support Probably scarier for the Russian sailors than it is for the Sixth Fleet, but it is an indication that Putin is at least semi-serious about trying to save Assad.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:32
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What is the plan, though? Russia won't back down now, when it looks like their boy has a chance of winning again. Sending arms and money in will just prolong the conflict indefinitely.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:32
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TheBalor posted:What is the plan, though? Russia won't back down now, when it looks like their boy has a chance of winning again. Sending arms and money in will just prolong the conflict indefinitely. Convince them to back down. The White House has already presented its case to Russia with regards to Syrian chemical weapons so the ball is in their court right now.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:35
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TheBalor posted:What is the plan, though? Russia won't back down now, when it looks like their boy has a chance of winning again. Sending arms and money in will just prolong the conflict indefinitely. I don't think they have a coherent plan other to get the US openly committed to the conflict.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:35
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I've just put together a post on a mystery munition that might be a DIY rocket used by the Syrian government forces http://brown-moses.blogspot.co.uk/2013/06/a-mystery-munition-syrian-army-diy.html
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Jun 13, 2013 22:36
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Even without the Russian grandstanding, I think the window of opportunity for direct intervention has passed. The rebels' reputation is in tatters at this point, especially in Europe. If the US intervene, it will most likely be unilateral (or perhaps with the backing of France, interestingly enough).
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Jun 13, 2013 22:38
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Phlegmish posted:Even without the Russian grandstanding, I think the window of opportunity for direct intervention has passed. The rebels' reputation is in tatters at this point, especially in Europe. If the US intervene, it will most likely be unilateral (or perhaps with the backing of France, interestingly enough). The UK will get involved if the US wants them too. But it will just be the UK, France and the US. No other European nations will come along. Turkey might have gotten involved a few months back, but with the unrest there I am far less certain of that.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:40
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Joementum posted:the White House is going to build a case about the use of chemical weapons to present to the UN to urge action I literally laughed out loud when I read this.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:41
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McDowell posted:Probably because the global economic outlook is just too bleak/insoluble as a narrative. Secular Leftism failed, particularly in the Mideast. Religion and promises of 'give me power and it will be better' are a fall back for easy political power. Granted, with the bleakness of the outlook you would think it would be easier to form a narrative. Ultimately, economics would rear its head at some point, and since neither side had a real solution to it as an issue, it is easy to see how religious division would fill in the void. It is going to even more dire at this point because Syria's economy really doesn't exist in a realistic sense.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:44
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New Division posted:The UK will get involved if the US wants them too. But it will just be the UK, France and the US. No other European nations will come along. Eh, we'll see. Germany has been really pro-active about it, and the entire EU recognizes the rebels as the legitimate representative of the Syrian people. France is almost guaranteed to go along.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:44
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New Division posted:The UK will get involved if the US wants them too. But it will just be the UK, France and the US. No other European nations will come along. I think the UK government has pretty much said it'll be up for a vote. They probably are aware it's a poo poo decision either way, so they might as well share the blame.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:45
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The White House is confirming that it has not made any decisions on a no-fly-zone or arming rebel groups. John McCain will be appearing shortly on CNN to discuss what he knows about the situation, which appears to be not a whole lot.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:46
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Volkerball posted:Eh, we'll see. Germany has been really pro-active about it, and the entire EU recognizes the rebels as the legitimate representative of the Syrian people. France is almost guaranteed to go along. Germany won't do anything except maybe write a check or two. They're not going to meaningfully participate in any operations in Syria.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:47
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Joementum posted:John McCain will be appearing shortly on CNN to discuss what he knows about the situation, which appears to be not a whole lot. That won't stop him from taking a very strong pro-interventionist stand. The guy is just addicted to trying to throw the US military into another tar pit.
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Jun 13, 2013 22:49
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New Division posted:Germany won't do anything except maybe write a check or two. They're not going to meaningfully participate in any operations in Syria. They gave Patriot missiles to Turkey over this. Maybe all they do is write a check or two, but the memo might say "gunz."
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Jun 13, 2013 22:49
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Well, it could lead down a path that would get McCain what he really wants (bomb bomb bomb bomb bomb Iran)
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Jun 13, 2013 22:50
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New Division posted:Well, it could lead down a path that would get McCain what he really wants (bomb bomb bomb bomb bomb Iran) Does the 5th war come free if we're involved in 4 at once?
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Jun 13, 2013 22:55
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Where are the Aircraft Carriers?
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Jun 13, 2013 22:57
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Saint Celestine posted:Does the 5th war come free if we're involved in 4 at once? How do you think Rome financed its wars? Bargain basement deals!
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Jun 13, 2013 22:58
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Speaking of Turkey, has there been any news on the talks tonight?
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Jun 13, 2013 23:02
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Volkerball posted:They gave Patriot missiles to Turkey over this. Maybe all they do is write a check or two, but the memo might say "gunz." I don't know, it's possible. I just get the impression that in most of Europe public opinion has become much less positive about the rebels since the beginning of the conflict (to the extent that people even know and care about it). Especially since there has been a trickle of young muslims leaving Europe to 'fight for Islam'. The rebels have started to become associated with Islamic fundamentalism, and I don't think there would be a lot of enthusiasm for intervention.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:03
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Baloogan posted:Where are the Aircraft Carriers? Roughly here If any three of those pips are in one place outside of US waters, a country within 600 miles is probably about to be bombed.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:05
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CommieGIR posted:I hear rumors Russia is moving their only carrier to the waters near Syria to discourage Western support Russia has a working carrier? Didn't they sell them to China and India?
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Jun 13, 2013 23:06
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Cyprus is also nearby if the US, UK and France end up doing to do a bombing campaign. Now that I've had to time to digest this though I think all that happens for now is more weapons poring into Syria. Escalation only comes after that fails, I'm guessing.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:10
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-Troika- posted:Russia has a working carrier? Didn't they sell them to China and India? That was Varyag, the unfinished sister ship of Admiral Kuznetsov which has been in service since 1990. Well, actually Varyag is no longer unfinished either.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:10
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John McCain is pro World War 3. The Russians don't want us to arm the rebels against Assad, they seem willing to go to war over this. You can read more on RT and Infowars. It is unclear how they feel about Israel and Saudi Arabia. McCain wants to take this to full Cuban Missile Crisis. Except this time we open the gates of Ragnarok and the Maverick goes to Valhalla. Nenonen posted:That was Varyag, the unfinished sister ship of Admiral Kuznetsov which has been in service since 1990. Also the uncommissioned Burans and Ekranoplans lying around 
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Jun 13, 2013 23:12
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Zeroisanumber posted:That won't stop him from taking a very strong pro-interventionist stand. The guy is just addicted to trying to throw the US military into another tar pit. John McCain is to interventions as most republicans are to tax cuts.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:12
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McDowell posted:John McCain is pro World War 3. I don't think the Russians would react too much to the arms flow into Syria from the west picking up. What they don't want to see is an open Western military intervention.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:15
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Best Friends posted:John McCain is to interventions as most republicans are to tax cuts. Keep in mind that the person charged with presenting the administration's case to the UN for action in Syria will almost certainly be Samantha Power.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:22
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McDowell posted:You can read more on RT and Infowars. I'd rather not!
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Jun 13, 2013 23:23
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AJE is reporting that the US has decided to provide military aid to the rebels.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:23
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New Division posted:I don't think the Russians would react too much to the arms flow into Syria from the west picking up. What they don't want to see is an open Western military intervention. In the end I don't think Russia is going to do anything meaningful if it comes to that. They were very much opposed to NATO bombings of Serbia and Libya. Syria would be just another "ally" ending in -a that Russia has left to its own devises.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:24
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Joementum posted:Keep in mind that the person charged with presenting the administration's case to the UN for action in Syria will almost certainly be Samantha Power. I have no idea who that is, but that's a pretty cool name. Reminds me of that Simpsons episode.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:24
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Jerry SanDisky posted:AJE is reporting that the US has decided to provide military aid to the rebels. Eh, that's not going to end the war.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:25
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We're really going to bungle into this, aren't we? Jesus loving Christ.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:25
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McDowell posted:The Russians don't want us to arm the rebels against Assad, they seem willing to go to war over this. You can read more on RT and Infowars. Russia is not going to war over this, they'd just ship Assad unimaginable amounts of weapons and funds.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:26
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Jerry SanDisky posted:AJE is reporting that the US has decided to provide military aid to the rebels. Well, all bets are off 
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Jun 13, 2013 23:28
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New Division posted:Germany won't do anything except maybe write a check or two. They're not going to meaningfully participate in any operations in Syria. At least the rebels have the support of our TV stars! 
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Jun 13, 2013 23:29
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Nothing like a full bore proxy war I guess, I wonder how the US plans on getting weapons to the "right guys."
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Jun 13, 2013 23:30
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Brown Moses, do you have any thoughts as to any possible implications of this sudden appearance of wire guided missiles? Such as where they might be coming from, etc. Also, don't wire guided missiles require some kind of training to use? Sorry if this is all wrong and naive, but I know literally nothing about military weapons and your blog has been the first time for me hearing about many things.
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Jun 13, 2013 23:31
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