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On Capitalists: * You get Capitalists by using the Promote Capitalist NF. You can also get them via natural promotion if literacy is higher than 50% and Clerks and Aristocrats are getting their luxury needs fulfilled, but you're almost always going to need Capitalists before then anyway because you'll start seeing Craftsmen promotions as soon as literacy passes 10%. Just keep in mind that if your factories aren't that profitable, then your Capitalists will demote and you might have to NF-promote again to get their numbers up. * I'm one of the people who said before to not use Promote Capitalists too much, that you only want very small numbers of them. This is wrong. It was a hold-out from Victoria 1 and I'm really sorry for having misinformed people. Victoria 2 Capitalists take money from factory earnings as a proportion of their population percentage, so there's no dilution of profits. * Capitalists will also forgo Luxury and Everyday Needs just to build more factories and railroads, so having more of them will result in accumulating funds for projects faster. Also, Capitalists are Liberal, which gives that particular ideology more traction if you ever need it. * Capitalists are also capped at 0.70% of a state's population as of Heart of Darkness, so you can't really have too many of them, and having as much as you can is good (assuming the rest of your requisite pop levels are already met, such as 4.0% Clergymen per state and 1.0% Bureaucrats nationally). * Yes, Capitalists will build railroads and factories everywhere, even if they're only present in a single state, although the industrial bonus they grant will only extend to the one state they reside in. * Since Capitalists draw income from factory profits, your very first factory will probably have to be state-funded, because what otherwise happens is that a pop such as an Artisan makes a bit of money, stores it, promotes to a Capitalist because of the NF, dumps all his savings into a factory ... and then nothing because he has no more money and no source of income. * Once you do have factories though, it's important to note that Capitalists will only build a factory (or expand an existing one) if the state is empty, or if all the factories in the state are at least 70% occupied. The pitfall here is subsidizing factories when your population is still fairly small - the factory isn't full yet and won't be full for a long, long time, so the Capitalists will never build a second one, and the factory isn't really making you a lot of money, but you're keeping it afloat with subsidies anyway. Instead, remove the subsidy and let the
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Jun 14, 2013 00:41
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If you have access to a party with State Capitalism or Planned Economy, it might be a good idea to steer for that at first and build some seed factories before setting your capitalists loose. Make sure they are something that will bring you a profit. Picking a good state is important. A good state will have, probably in order of importance, a high population, some flat terrain for early railroads, and good RGOs. For early factories, liquor will do great in states with grain, glass in states with coal, lumber mills and furniture in states with timber, and fabric in states with cotton. If you have a state with coal and grain, it's a no-brainer to stick a glass factory and a liquor factory both there. The glass would get a bonus for being in a state with its input (coal), and liquor would get a bonus for being in a state with both of its inputs (glass and grain). Even if you don't have control of the RGOs for other goods, it might be a good idea to group factories that produce related goods. Fabric -> Regular Clothes -> Luxury Clothes. Glass->Liquor or Glass->Winery. Lumber Mill->Furniture->Luxury Furniture. Those are all good groupings. Cement, Canned Goods, and Small Arms are all important and everyone needs them, but I swear, they will go bankrupt as soon as you hand them over to capitalists early in the game even if all the conditions are right.
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Jun 14, 2013 01:07
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Thanks for all the information, everyone. This is good stuff.ZearothK posted:You don't really want a Laissez-Faire party without already having an established industry and capitalist class. The game started with a LF controlled government.  Now that socialists are starting to grow as a voting population, I think I might try promoting it and getting communism in place. Bad idea? It seems to allow me a lot of control over my country. (And to do that, I have to let a communist uprising take foot and then let them win when they rebel? Or just do it through voting?) I will keep an eye out for HoD during the summer sale. Thanks for the reminder. 
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Jun 14, 2013 01:29
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ExtraNoise posted:The game started with a LF controlled government. Yeah, a lot of the minor nations in the Americas have predominantly LF parties. It is one of the ways they are rigged not to challenge the USA, as they never manage to industrialize and thus draw immigrants (as job availability is one of the main factors). You can have a communist party in power through elections. It is a good idea because of the control it gives you, and by the time communists become a thing the Oil RGOs in Texas should be popping up, so you will have plenty of money to invest in any project you want. If you decide to let revolutionaries topple the government they will reduce your prestige by 10% (I think that was the value for AHD), reset your diplomatic relations and establish a Proletarian Dictatorship without any social reform, but a free ability to extend social reforms.
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Jun 14, 2013 02:09
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ExtraNoise posted:Thanks for all the information, everyone. This is good stuff. You should be able to elect a socialist party to power, though I think there are some government forms that don't allow that. Communist rebels specifically will change your government form to a Proletarian Dictatorship, put a Communist party in power, and will jumble around your political reforms. If all you want to do is build some factories, I'd suggest looking at the political parties that exist in your country, and hopefully one of them has State Capitalism as an economic policy. Set NFs in all of your most populated provinces to promote that party and use the issue & debate events that pop up during the election to steer your populace towards the same ideologies as that party. Use the same techniques to steer them back to your preferred party again afterwards.
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Jun 14, 2013 02:12
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Even if all you can get is interventionism, it's still better than nothing because as soon as the capitalists START funding a factory you can fund it the rest of the way.
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Jun 14, 2013 02:18
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ExtraNoise posted:Thanks for all the information, everyone. This is good stuff. Since Texas has such a tiny tiny population at game start it is incredibly easy to spam elections to get a reactionary party in power to get your industry rolling. Just keep starting elections until you get the party you want, it shouldn't take more than 3-4.
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Jun 14, 2013 03:13
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In vicky 2, is there a way to remove an arbitrary number of cores from a province? Everything I've seen with the remove_core effect has them listing every possible country you'd like to remove, like here where they have to list every German minor to remove extra cores once Germany forms. Is there no way to remove all cores from a province besides doing that for every tag in the game? Something likecode:
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Jun 14, 2013 03:32
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Speaking of V2, here's a new update for The Imperialist Adventures of Srbja & Friends for Heart of Darkness 3.03.  Download - June 13th 2013 June 13th 2013 -Added cores to Maharashtra; -Added cores to Beroda; -Added cores to Benghal; -Added cores to Nagpur; -Added cores to Travancore; -Added cores to Baluchistan; -Added cores to Arabia; -Added cores to Greater Serbia; -Created specific cultures for each of Tepehuacu's constituent states, rather than the generic North/South Eurohuacu; --Bahian, Roman, Equatorial, Platinean, Hunsriker; -Tweaked Srbja's POPs; -Added events dealing with Croatia's rise to great power and reconquest of its homelands; -Integrated Age of Politics' Issues and Government changes; -Removed the "Form India" decision, as it makes no sense in this setting; -Bengal is now civilized; -Tartastan has been added to BYZ' sphere; -Added a decision to diplomatically annex Not-Croatia for Serbia-Byzantium; -Tartastan and Astrakhan are now civilized; -Increased and re-positioned Rajputana's armies; -Expanded Canada's military; -Added Serbian Clay sources to the Srb Republic and Srbja itself.
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Jun 14, 2013 03:50
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Is Cyprus unsettled in that scenario, or just a dark color?
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Jun 14, 2013 03:56
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Vivian Darkbloom posted:Is Cyprus unsettled in that scenario, or just a dark color? Just a dark color, they are an independent kingdom. Sahara, central Africa, Siberia, Oceania and Amazonia are where colonisation happens in this cenario.
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Jun 14, 2013 03:59
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Cantorsdust posted:In vicky 2, is there a way to remove an arbitrary number of cores from a province? Everything I've seen with the remove_core effect has them listing every possible country you'd like to remove, like here where they have to list every German minor to remove extra cores once Germany forms. Is there no way to remove all cores from a province besides doing that for every tag in the game? Something like Nope. You have to specify the tag of the core you want to remove. remove_core = THIS is a valid command, but it only removes the cores of the country that fires the event or decision.
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Jun 14, 2013 04:49
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Fister Roboto posted:Nope. You have to specify the tag of the core you want to remove. remove_core = THIS is a valid command, but it only removes the cores of the country that fires the event or decision. Ugh. Is there an easy list of all the country tags, maybe?
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Jun 14, 2013 04:54
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Cantorsdust posted:Ugh. Is there an easy list of all the country tags, maybe? victoria2/history/countries Big big list. Province IDs are also in /history, organized by region.
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Jun 14, 2013 05:04
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:victoria2/history/countries If you need the province Id's ingame, you can just use showprovinceid in the console and it shows the id in the tooltip.
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Jun 14, 2013 05:09
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ZearothK posted:-Added Serbian Clay sources to the Srb Republic and Srbja itself.[/i] I'm extremely grateful that you added the most important thing.
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Jun 14, 2013 05:10
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Another issue: installed NNM, checked it in the launcher, game starts up but gives the vanilla checksum, NSPY. To check that I'm using the mod, I make a save, which winds up in the NNM subfolder in my Documents. I feel like I'm going crazy. Why isn't the game loading all the mod files? edit: figured it out, it works fine if I put it in the base install /mod folder, but it didn't work in the Documents/Paradox Interactive/Victoria 2/mod folder. weird. Cantorsdust fucked around with this message at 07:29 on Jun 14, 2013 |
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Jun 14, 2013 07:09
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Whenever I have Interventionist or Laissez Faire economics in place, my capitalists build stupid factories in places that grant no bonuses to them. (EG: Clothes factories in grain states) Given this disadvantage, why would you want to use such economic policies?
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Jun 14, 2013 12:30
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Gort posted:Whenever I have Interventionist or Laissez Faire economics in place, my capitalists build stupid factories in places that grant no bonuses to them. (EG: Clothes factories in grain states) At least with interventionist you can close down and delete the factories and hope they build something more sensible. But yeah, I really don't get why anyone would want Laissez-Faire, since clearly State Capitalism is the best.
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Jun 14, 2013 12:44
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Gort posted:Whenever I have Interventionist or Laissez Faire economics in place, my capitalists build stupid factories in places that grant no bonuses to them. (EG: Clothes factories in grain states) Factory construction and upgrades are cheaper the closer you move towards LF. LF also gives a unique bonus to factory output efficiency that the other economic policies don't give. Less micromanagement if you have a sprawling empire with lots of states. Planned Economy actually gives a unique throughput bonus to factories though, so if you ARE going to micromanage everything optimally, that'd be the best policy. The best thing about State Capitalism is that most countries have a party with it at the beginning of the scenario, so you have something to switch to early on and build the right things. Planned Economy doesn't appear until later. Kersch fucked around with this message at 12:50 on Jun 14, 2013 |
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Jun 14, 2013 12:48
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Until I've actually got at least 3+ factories in all my big states, I avoid LF and interventionism like the plague. And even after that, I'll often stick with state capitalism, just so I can control it somewhat. Every time I've gone LF, I'll end up short either machine parts, canned food or small arms, with 4-5 factories of the type closed down within months of changing over.
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Jun 14, 2013 12:58
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Intervensionism is great in very large countries because the interface for managing your factories is so bad that managing them in huge countries is an absolute nightmare. It's much easier to spam shift+click on the projects screen and rocket to first place through numbers rather than efficiency. If you can crush the AI by just letting capitalists control your economy what's the motivation for managing it yourself?
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Jun 14, 2013 17:07
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edit: I don't read well
Kersch fucked around with this message at 20:38 on Jun 14, 2013 |
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Jun 14, 2013 20:33
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I've gone the later half of my USA game as LF, and my industry score skyrocketed when I had it, though that's doubtlessly more due to incompetence on my part than anything. I can certainly understand the appeal, since when you're economy's big enough it gets the job done and saves you from having to deal with micromanagement bollocks, but if unlike me you have patience and actually know what you're doing State Capitalism will be better pretty much all the time. Is there any reason to ever use Planned Economy? It basically seems like State Capitalism without any of the benefits
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Jun 15, 2013 05:17
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Bishop Rodan posted:I've gone the later half of my USA game as LF, and my industry score skyrocketed when I had it, though that's doubtlessly more due to incompetence on my part than anything. I can certainly understand the appeal, since when you're economy's big enough it gets the job done and saves you from having to deal with micromanagement bollocks, but if unlike me you have patience and actually know what you're doing State Capitalism will be better pretty much all the time. Actually when you have ample resources (specially coal, iron and lumber), like the USA, and a high enough rank to allow you a good position in the market, you can actually get a better score from LF than the other policies, as it increases industrial efficiency. Add in a well-cultivated sphere of influence to guarantee a market for your production and you won't have any reason to go back to the production screen. Planned Economy is good if you're really obsessive about what gets built in your nation, as it completely removes your capitalists' ability to create any projects. It is not very good and I've quit games in vanilla (before the UI improvements allowing for railroads per-state and increasing the size of every factory close to the limit in the country) because I let a communist coup happen and I couldn't be arsed to tinker with every little bit of economy in the game.
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Jun 15, 2013 05:52
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Gort posted:Whenever I have Interventionist or Laissez Faire economics in place, my capitalists build stupid factories in places that grant no bonuses to them. (EG: Clothes factories in grain states) The bonuses really aren't worth sperging out over, since they only affect throughput. That means they don't increase your profitability because you've still got the same ratio of input to output. It just means that each individual craftsman is more productive. This can actually be a bad thing in some cases, such as having a large workforce and not enough input goods. In that case, the throughput bonus will cause you to have an input goods shortage faster, and you'll have a larger percentage of your workforce either unemployed or dependent on your subsidies (because more throughput means you need less employment to consume the goods you have available). So in other words, to answer your question, it's not really a disadvantage in the first place.
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Jun 15, 2013 06:02
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Bishop Rodan posted:I've gone the later half of my USA game as LF, and my industry score skyrocketed when I had it, though that's doubtlessly more due to incompetence on my part than anything. I can certainly understand the appeal, since when you're economy's big enough it gets the job done and saves you from having to deal with micromanagement bollocks, but if unlike me you have patience and actually know what you're doing State Capitalism will be better pretty much all the time.
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Jun 15, 2013 07:12
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Yeah, the advantage of State Capitalism over Planned Economy is that you don't have to engineer a revolution to get SC without being stuck with pacifism, unless you're one of like three countries where reactionaries are also pacifist, like the Papal States. (stupid nonviolent Jesus!  )
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Jun 15, 2013 08:31
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I got Anti Military Planned Economy in my game, which was plenty workable because I'm Germany and therefore can kick everybody's rear end anyway. Finished my first Victoria 2 game with HoD and NNM.  The socialists spent the last thirty years in power because the switch to Full Citizenship gave them the votes of all those angry poor Africans in my colonies that I had made states. By the end, they were hitting absolute majorities with the communists while the anarcho/liberals had about 25, the conservative/reactionaries had about 15 and the fascists 10. I found Planned Economy to be fine, though I was really just pumping more money into the economy that fifty years of LF made and built a handful of more advanced factories myself, while more or less expanding every factory all the time. I tried to industrialize my sphere members too but Hungary was the only one where the factories would stick. I had the highest prestige score, was second in industry to the US and second in military to Japan, who had a pretty crappy industry but a huge navy.  The brave new world. After two Dismantle Nation wars against France and Spain, most of the Old World is a disgusting mess. As you can see from Madagascar and Indochina, the game really divvies up colonies in the ugliest way they can. Spain's was neater because I fought the whole war myself but France's in particular is really scattershot and I have little colonies all over the world. Of major countries, France and Russia ended up fascist. Poland would be fascist if they weren't stuck in Democracy as my puppet, since I own so much of their poo poo that their revanchism must be through the roof. China was fascist for a time, went through the Warlord Era, was taken over by Japan as a puppet, Japan helped them reunite the country, then China became a Great Power and broke the puppetry is now a lovely LF democracy like Japan. For a long time, the UK, Canada, Germany, the Netherlands and the USA made a great socialist alliance that came together to beat the poo poo out of France and Russia a bunch of times. There were two Great Wars, the first between Germany and China versus Russia and Japan, the second between France, Russia and Japan versus Germany, the UK, the Netherlands, the USA and Canada. After the second war though, nothing much happened except for my takedown of communist Spain.  My colonial empire is kind of ugly though I did manage to get colonies on pretty much every continent, including that French island in Canada, the Panama Canal and a smattering of poo poo everywhere else. I ended up releasing a lot of poo poo in Africa to deal with the infamy of gobbling up Austria and stealing colonies from everybody. My three European puppets are Poland, Occitania and the United Baltic Provinces. Poland in particular I really did the screwjob on, I let them get beat to poo poo by France and Russia, communists took over and seized my railroads so I took them over as a puppet then beat up Russia for their poo poo back. It was a fun game. I will probably start a CK2: Old Gods game soon and see if I can get it wrapped up by the time EU4 releases. csm141 fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Jun 15, 2013 |
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Jun 15, 2013 14:09
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Chief Savage Man posted:I got Anti Military Planned Economy in my game, which was plenty workable because I'm Germany and therefore can kick everybody's rear end anyway. That's a pretty interesting-looking world you ended up with there. Do you remember who that bluish-green nation in eastern India is? Congrats on knocking the UK all the way back to third place, too, that must have taken some doing.
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Jun 15, 2013 17:07
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Chief Savage Man posted:Germany
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Jun 15, 2013 18:00
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CK2/EU3 modding question. I'm currently playing a game as a ruler-designed Roman Byzantine Emperor, and intend to remain Roman throughout the remainder of the game. If I were to mod a custom EU3 scenario after wrapping up this CK2(+) game, should the Roman Byzantine state be within the Greek culture group, the Italian culture group or a custom culture group separate from both? I mean, right now the Byzantine Empire's ruled by a Roman emperor and controls only half the territories of the Alexiad starting point (goddamn independence wars! ), but the plan's to focus on (re)conquering Italy rather than reclaiming all those lost Anatolian territories, so by the end there'll be probably as many Italian provinces as Greek.
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Jun 15, 2013 18:11
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Ofaloaf posted:CK2/EU3 modding question. I'm currently playing a game as a ruler-designed Roman Byzantine Emperor, and intend to remain Roman throughout the remainder of the game. If I were to mod a custom EU3 scenario after wrapping up this CK2(+) game, should the Roman Byzantine state be within the Greek culture group, the Italian culture group or a custom culture group separate from both? If you took the Byzantium-> Roman Empire decision in CK2 just stay Greek culture. The entire point of the Roman Empire is the fact it really didn't make a big deal out of ethnicity. Rather they focused on Citizenship through service.
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Jun 15, 2013 18:27
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Ofaloaf posted:CK2/EU3 modding question. I'm currently playing a game as a ruler-designed Roman Byzantine Emperor, and intend to remain Roman throughout the remainder of the game. If I were to mod a custom EU3 scenario after wrapping up this CK2(+) game, should the Roman Byzantine state be within the Greek culture group, the Italian culture group or a custom culture group separate from both?
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Jun 15, 2013 18:31
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Are there any Norse holy orders that can pop up? HRE can pull up 80k levies along with those evil Christian heavy cav holy horders and I'm feeling the difference.
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Jun 15, 2013 18:56
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WeaponGradeSadness posted:That's a pretty interesting-looking world you ended up with there. Do you remember who that bluish-green nation in eastern India is? Congrats on knocking the UK all the way back to third place, too, that must have taken some doing. wukkar posted:You passed on the one of the best states in the game, Bohemia? I did. I had the idea when I started the game that I would go for the historical Germany instead of Greater Germany and get large puppets/sphere members. So instead of gobbling Bohemia and Moravia like I normally would I instead liberated Bohemia-Moravia then got Slovakia out later so they would form Czechoslovakia. Then they released Slovakia as a satellite anyway so I kind of gave up on that idea and just ate Austria whole when I got the event to (at the cost of releasing a bunch of African minors I had just conquered so that Europe wouldn't kill me for having like 30 infamy). Oh well.
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Jun 15, 2013 19:37
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So how about that East vs West Q1 2014 delay?
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Jun 15, 2013 21:37
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Nuclearmonkee posted:Are there any Norse holy orders that can pop up? HRE can pull up 80k levies along with those evil Christian heavy cav holy horders and I'm feeling the difference. Just the Jomsvikings. They're nowhere near as good as the Cavalry orders the Christains get.
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Jun 15, 2013 21:54
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Top Hats Monthly posted:So how about that East vs West Q1 2014 delay? A sign that they're reworking the game to possibly make it not suck? Part of me wants this to work out, while another part wants this whole thing to explode like Magna Mundi and leave the way open for someone to make a Cold War game based off of Victoria.
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Jun 15, 2013 21:58
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Is this how you win Crusader Kings 2?
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Jun 16, 2013 02:01
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