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Squinty Applebottom
Jan 1, 2013

Doc Block posted:

said a terrible programmer.


"how do i maek iphone apps, post tutorials plz."

both of these apply to me

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DONT THREAD ON ME
Oct 1, 2002

by Nyc_Tattoo
Floss Finder
oh yeah, have fun trying to learn anything from apples site. here are some helpful links that will help you get used to apples documention:

https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/#space/qasd91

http://developer.apple.com/library/mac/#qa/qa1712/_index.html%23//apple_ref/doc/uid/DTS40013349

http://developer.apple.com/library/mac/#qa/qa1032/_index.html%23//apple_ref/doc/uid/DTS4000749

http://developer.apple.com/library/mac/#qa/a_really_helpful_link/_index.html%23//apple_ref/doc/uid/DTS4000749

X-BUM-RAIDER-X
May 7, 2008
c++ owns you rear end burgers and if you disagree you need to get the gently caress out forever. jk this is the terrible programmer safe zone, you're welcome to post here.

PleasingFungus
Oct 10, 2012
idiot asshole bitch who should fuck off

OBAMA BIN LinkedIn posted:

c++ owns you rear end burgers and if you disagree you need to get the gently caress out forever. jk this is the terrible programmer safe zone, you're welcome to post here.

some sick burns itt

X-BUM-RAIDER-X
May 7, 2008
also if you program c++ and haven't read effective c++ then you know literally nothing about c++. c++ is such a goddamn amazing language. Jesus

uG
Apr 23, 2003

by Ralp
plz rename this thread to C++ safe zone/hideout tia

Stringent
Dec 22, 2004


image text goes here

uG posted:

plz rename this thread to C++ safe zone/hideout tia

it's already named that

Squinty Applebottom
Jan 1, 2013

uG posted:

plz rename this thread to C++ safe zone/hideout tia

it already is named that

MeruFM
Jul 27, 2010
Hiveburns

Bloody
Mar 3, 2013

Doc Block posted:

msvc is poo poo. ms going out of their way to purposefully not implement c99 is bullshit. making their own c99-esque safe string functions that take the exact same arguments and produce the same results but have different names is bullshit.

clang/LLVM supremacy.

why not gcc/g++?

X-BUM-RAIDER-X
May 7, 2008
wow it's almost as if Microsoft is an awful company that produces awful proprietary software designed to keep their awful users/devs locked into the platform. goddamn can we get a mod in here???

weird
Jun 4, 2012

by zen death robot
C++ Primer was a really good book

weird
Jun 4, 2012

by zen death robot
It taught me enough C++ for my needs but I still prefer C

Doc Block
Apr 15, 2003
Fun Shoe

Bloody posted:

why not gcc/g++?

because it's poo poo. it's slower, its c++11 implementation isn't as complete as clang's, and it produces really awful error messages.

clang is fast. clang has a (nearly) complete c++11 implementation, and, thanks to its developers trying to make it understand your code really well, it produces error messages that are so helpful it can actually suggest fixes. that same code understanding also gives clang a really good static analyzer and makes things like Objective-C's ARC possible.

additionally, clang/LLVM are architecturally superior to GCC. GCC is basically a big monolithic thing that its devs are only now trying to modularize in any meaningful way. LLVM is constructed as a bunch of independent libraries, and these libraries can be used by other, non-LLVM code. you can use this to build LLVM right into an IDE like Xcode does, or use it to build your own code analysis tools, or use it to more easily create your own domain-specific language. you can even write your own optimization steps.

Posting Principle
Dec 10, 2011

by Ralp
gcc is c++11 complete. libstdc++ is a seperate project, and is not

Cocoa Crispies
Jul 20, 2001

Vehicular Manslaughter!

Pillbug

Bloody posted:

why not gcc/g++?

code:
  $ cat t.cc
  struct a {
    virtual int bar();
  };
  
  struct foo : public virtual a {
  };
  
  void test(foo *P) {
    return P->bar() + *P;
  }

  $ gcc-4.2 t.cc
  t.cc: In function 'void test(foo*)':
  t.cc:9: error: no match for 'operator+' in '(((a*)P) + (*(long int*)(P->foo::<anonymous>.a::_vptr$a + -0x00000000000000020)))->a::bar() + * P'
  t.cc:9: error: return-statement with a value, in function returning 'void'

  $ clang t.cc
  t.cc:9:18: error: invalid operands to binary expression ('int' and 'foo')
    return P->bar() + *P;
           ~~~~~~~~ ^ ~~

Posting Principle
Dec 10, 2011

by Ralp
before someone gets mad about using a 5 year old version of gcc, 4.7 produces just as obtuse an error

uG
Apr 23, 2003

by Ralp
if you need to be coddled through your mistakes then sure thats p cool

Socracheese
Oct 20, 2008

in my short career i have thrown a django thing at basically every problem and it has worked. but in the past when I encountered a bug I would be like "$feature sucks because the web is a lovely platform" and now I realize that it just seems that way because of what a scrub i am

i guess i should look into ruby i just have this huge feeling of ughhhhhhh about it for some reason. i think its the japanese spergitude

Socracheese fucked around with this message at 05:18 on Jun 22, 2013

DONT THREAD ON ME
Oct 1, 2002

by Nyc_Tattoo
Floss Finder
the web was a terrible platform because people were putting all of their scripts in a bin and then apache would run those scripts on request and this was "web development"

or at least, that's how i imagine it worked. i know about as much about how the web worked back then as i do about how fires were started in the neolithic era



ruby and python are basically the same thing but with really different syntax

DONT THREAD ON ME fucked around with this message at 05:23 on Jun 22, 2013

Doc Block
Apr 15, 2003
Fun Shoe

uG posted:

if you need to be coddled through your mistakes then sure thats p cool

what's cool is that clang/LLVM is better than GCC at analyzing your code. on the surface this manifests as more helpful error messages, it also leads to more optimization opportunities and better code analysis tools.

also, final decisions re: clang/LLVM don't rest with a bunch of freetards.

Cocoa Crispies
Jul 20, 2001

Vehicular Manslaughter!

Pillbug

Socracheese posted:

in my short career i have thrown a django thing at basically every problem and it has worked. but in the past when I encountered a bug I would be like "$feature sucks because the web is a lovely platform" and now I realize that it just seems that way because of what a scrub i am

i guess i should look into ruby i just have this huge feeling of ughhhhhhh about it for some reason. i think its the japanese spergitude

ruby and python are basically the same

Stringent
Dec 22, 2004


image text goes here

Cocoa Crispies posted:

ruby and python are basically the same

django and rails however

double sulk
Jul 2, 2010

ruby is poo poo

--is poo poo

Nomnom Cookie
Aug 30, 2009



Socracheese posted:

in my short career i have thrown a django thing at basically every problem and it has worked. but in the past when I encountered a bug I would be like "$feature sucks because the web is a lovely platform" and now I realize that it just seems that way because of what a scrub i am

i guess i should look into ruby i just have this huge feeling of ughhhhhhh about it for some reason. i think its the japanese spergitude

dont learn ruby, learn c

Ericadia
Oct 31, 2007

Not A Unicorn
Ruby is fine. The thing with constants not being constant confused me for a few seconds but now I think it doesn't matter. But I am terrible.

Posting Principle
Dec 10, 2011

by Ralp
http://stackoverflow.com/a/612196/1015660

if only there were some way to enforce constraints like this before runtime. oh well guess we'll just all have to pinky swear to name our methods right

MeruFM
Jul 27, 2010
does ruby have applications outside of web?

coaxmetal
Oct 21, 2010

I flamed me own dad

Cocoa Crispies posted:

ruby and python are basically the same

this offends my sensibilities.



Anyway, although they have superficially similiar syntax and are often applied for similar tasks, as languages they are quite different. For instance, python can be parsed!

X-BUM-RAIDER-X
May 7, 2008
if ur work allows you to use c++11 then u my friend have a good job

X-BUM-RAIDER-X
May 7, 2008
we have 2 platforms that our c++ code has to compile on before it gets into production, one of which uses an ancient gcc extension that still complains if u don't specify a compile time const value when u initialise arrays.

Bloody
Mar 3, 2013

Doc Block posted:

because it's poo poo. it's slower, its c++11 implementation isn't as complete as clang's, and it produces really awful error messages.

clang is fast. clang has a (nearly) complete c++11 implementation, and, thanks to its developers trying to make it understand your code really well, it produces error messages that are so helpful it can actually suggest fixes. that same code understanding also gives clang a really good static analyzer and makes things like Objective-C's ARC possible.

additionally, clang/LLVM are architecturally superior to GCC. GCC is basically a big monolithic thing that its devs are only now trying to modularize in any meaningful way. LLVM is constructed as a bunch of independent libraries, and these libraries can be used by other, non-LLVM code. you can use this to build LLVM right into an IDE like Xcode does, or use it to build your own code analysis tools, or use it to more easily create your own domain-specific language. you can even write your own optimization steps.

does it take any effort at all to convert a project from using g++ to using llvm because if it does then i don't care because after this project i strongly hope to never use the c++ again

double sulk
Jul 2, 2010

MeruFM posted:

does ruby have applications outside of web?

homebrew is probably the only useful non-web thing written with it. it's still a horrible language with an even worse community though

Cocoa Crispies
Jul 20, 2001

Vehicular Manslaughter!

Pillbug

Jerry SanDisky posted:

http://stackoverflow.com/a/612196/1015660

if only there were some way to enforce constraints like this before runtime. oh well guess we'll just all have to pinky swear to name our methods right

it's not a constraint, it's a convention that means it's "exciting" in some fashion

with builtins like strings and arrays, it's a sign that it modifies in place (although both of those have non-bang methods that modify in place)

in other places (activerecord) it means it raises errors on failure instead of returning false

it's okay to also make it mean "this verb includes a commit to the database"

sorry your spergers is flaring up and mkaing you want enforced rules instead of loose guidelines

uG
Apr 23, 2003

by Ralp

OBAMA BIN LinkedIn posted:

we have 2 platforms that our c++ code has to compile on before it gets into production, one of which uses an ancient gcc extension that still complains if u don't specify a compile time const value when u initialise arrays.

sounds like gods own c89 maybe you should just become a better programmer?

Posting Principle
Dec 10, 2011

by Ralp

OBAMA BIN LinkedIn posted:

we have 2 platforms that our c++ code has to compile on before it gets into production, one of which uses an ancient gcc extension that still complains if u don't specify a compile time const value when u initialise arrays.

use a vector and then just pass around the underlying array to whatever c bits you have. since you probably don't have c++11 on that platform, you can do a fake version of data() by passing around &front()

Posting Principle
Dec 10, 2011

by Ralp

OBAMA BIN LinkedIn posted:

if ur work allows you to use c++11 then u my friend have a good job

for reals c++11 is the best part of my job

Posting Principle
Dec 10, 2011

by Ralp

Cocoa Crispies posted:

sorry your spergers is flaring up and mkaing you want enforced rules instead of loose guidelines

i also want const_cast to be a compile error unless you add a -imafuckingshithead flag but no one has accepted my gcc patch

NOTinuyasha
Oct 17, 2006

 
The Great Twist

polpotpi posted:

theres no good tutorials or books for objective c

big nerd ranch makes a good objective-c book

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X-BUM-RAIDER-X
May 7, 2008

Jerry SanDisky posted:

use a vector and then just pass around the underlying array to whatever c bits you have. since you probably don't have c++11 on that platform, you can do a fake version of data() by passing around &front()

boost::scoped_array m8

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