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Baron Bifford posted:I haven't read the book but the Wikia entry on this guy says that he was basically duped by the agents of Chaos. Please tell us more oh mighty wiki reader.
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Jul 12, 2013 07:23
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Cream_Filling posted:The cool thing with the Emperor is that no two people can even agree on what he looks like, and each person tends to see either what the emperor wants them to see or else what they themselves want to see in his face. In Deliverence Lost, doesn't Corax see him as a normal sized, plain looking man and the Emperor is surprised by this? MariusLecter posted:What always stuck with me is that scene in LEGION with John Grammaticus. He doesn't say what he physically saw but that the Emperor and him having a little 'immortal psychics' bro moment makes me think he has a better view of what is behind the psychic mask the Emperor puts up. "Bloodthirsty" was the impression he came away with, wasn't it? This is also mentioned at in the Last Church. The priest initially thinks the Emperor is the face of god that he saw as a young man in the unification wars, but when the church is burning and he takes a second look he sees the bloodthirsty, naked ambition and focus it takes to conquer a galaxy
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Jul 12, 2013 08:41
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Mechafunkzilla posted:No, he really is that goddamn stupid and spergy. Check his post history and rap sheet. Cream_Filling posted:You should preface all your posts with this, as a warning to new posters.
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Jul 12, 2013 09:18
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Baron Bifford posted:If I have such a bad rap sheet, then I cannot be the ideal goon. The high odds of you racking up another ban in the near future are the only reason you aren't rolling around with angry red avatar text.
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Jul 12, 2013 10:23
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Halfway through Angel Exterminatus trip report: 1. Nice to see Fulgrim and Perturabo's backgrounds and childhoods. 2. "Gothic. Do you speak it ?" ADB rules the Black Library. 3. Every book he appears in makes Fabius Bile more of a primary target. He needs to get got. mllaneza fucked around with this message at 11:18 on Jul 12, 2013 |
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Jul 12, 2013 11:15
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Aside from Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer, Xenology, and The 13th Black Crusade, what other graphic novelizations (Do they even count as such?) are there?
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Jul 12, 2013 11:39
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Baron Bifford posted:If I have such a bad rap sheet, then I cannot be the ideal goon. get the gently caress out, you contribute nothing to the thread and everyone hates you Lead Psychiatry posted:Aside from Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer, Xenology, and The 13th Black Crusade, what other graphic novelizations (Do they even count as such?) are there? You should check out the Imperial Munitorum Manual. Very similar in concept to the Uplifting Primer. Also, I believe there's a Sabbat Worlds book out. Also Liber Chaotica is the coolest goddamn thing ever, but is 90% Warhammer Fantasy. Mechafunkzilla fucked around with this message at 12:43 on Jul 12, 2013 |
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Jul 12, 2013 12:37
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Dog_Meat posted:In Deliverence Lost, doesn't Corax see him as a normal sized, plain looking man and the Emperor is surprised by this? I can see the Emperor being a pretty average sized guy who uses psyker abilities to appear as a 14 foot walking death machine and to emulate the abilities of a physical god of that stature. I would suggest that the primarchs are actually 12 feet tall, being engineered demigods. And for those saying we don't know much about the Emperor, ADB's 'The Master of Mankind' should hopefully clear some of this up!
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Jul 12, 2013 13:42
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Neurosis posted:I can see the Emperor being a pretty average sized guy who uses psyker abilities to appear as a 14 foot walking death machine and to emulate the abilities of a physical god of that stature. I would suggest that the primarchs are actually 12 feet tall, being engineered demigods. If I remember right, in A Thousand Sons the battle between Russ and Magnus has them growing to all kinds of crazy sizs and perspectives. Partially because they're literally fighting in a warp maelstrom, but the clash of psychic energy from the conflict plays havoc with perception and they're literally titans fighting Which is hillarious to think that they could actually be a couple of 5'5 little guys having a slap fight
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Jul 12, 2013 14:41
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Neurosis posted:I can see the Emperor being a pretty average sized guy who uses psyker abilities to appear as a 14 foot walking death machine and to emulate the abilities of a physical god of that stature. I would suggest that the primarchs are actually 12 feet tall, being engineered demigods. Well, they were the forerunners of the astartes, so I can see them being huge, but 12 feet is so big they'd have trouble fitting through doors! Same with the astartes, honestly. If you're developing weapons to fight in cities and boarding actions, you want something that can fit through a standard doorway in full armor. So the old 7 foot and change marines are fine, but the 8 foot ones are kind of pushing it, even assuming the doorways are chunky and oversized like everything else STC.
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Jul 12, 2013 15:51
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Cream_Filling posted:Well, they were the forerunners of the astartes, so I can see them being huge, but 12 feet is so big they'd have trouble fitting through doors! If primarchs are supposed to be to space marines what space marines are to men, that would put them at 3 meters, or about 9' 10". Baseline humans average 1.75 meters (5'7"), and space marines are at ~2.3 meters (7'6")
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Jul 12, 2013 16:37
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Lead Psychiatry posted:Aside from Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer, Xenology, and The 13th Black Crusade, what other graphic novelizations (Do they even count as such?) are there? Aside from what Mechafunkzilla mentioned regarding Munitorium manual there is also the Sabbat Worlds Crusade lore book that ends where His Last Command starts, it's frankly amazingly written by Dan Abnett and I wish he'd write a second one for the rest of the series. Then there is Tactica Imperialis which is just a compendium of various campaigns and wars, including one in the Sabbat system. And lastly there the Battle for Armageddon, which is about Armageddon. Even if it's not that great as it never really goes anywhere regarding the various wars but is a nice fluff book regardless.
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Jul 12, 2013 16:41
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The Lion is referred to as 3m tall out of his armour in Descent of Angels when the astartes come. Then you have Mortarion swinging a sythe the size of a space marine, Dorn holding a gladius which is the size of a man, Ferrus/Perturabo swinging a hammer the size of a tank and other insane scales. If a marine is 9 feet tall in his armour a Primarch is going to be a walking tank. Although the primarchs are always shifting in size. They're always described as "seeming to fill the room with their presence". In Outcast Dead Dorn is causing problems by being in the psyker chamber because his presence is a glowing beacon that interferes with their abilities. And of course, in the First Heretic a blind woman can see Lorgar Makes you wonder how exactly terminator marines operate in cramped space hulks. It's enough to drive a sperg lord crazy...
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Jul 12, 2013 16:48
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Dog_Meat posted:
They used to be smaller
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Jul 12, 2013 16:57
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Isn't/wasn't the chainfist's description that it was used to carve bulkheads in ships during boarding actions/exploring space hulks?
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Jul 12, 2013 17:00
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Dog_Meat posted:Makes you wonder how exactly terminator marines operate in cramped space hulks.
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Jul 12, 2013 17:23
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Mechafunkzilla posted:Also Liber Chaotica is the coolest goddamn thing ever, but is 90% Warhammer Fantasy. Fried Chicken posted:If primarchs are supposed to be to space marines what space marines are to men, that would put them at 3 meters, or about 9' 10". Baseline humans average 1.75 meters (5'7"), and space marines are at ~2.3 meters (7'6") bunnyofdoom posted:Isn't/wasn't the chainfist's description that it was used to carve bulkheads in ships during boarding actions/exploring space hulks? Also bear in mind that "Tactical Dreadnought" armour was originally for doing repair work on plasma reactors while they were running, not for combat.
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Jul 12, 2013 19:08
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Lincoln`s Wax posted:You can find it for sale on amazon usually. Not cheap though. Still pretty happy I got the hardcover complete liber chaotica when I did. Much, much cheaper to get it from BL's print on demand service. If it's still on there, I'm not looking because gently caress the BL website. It always gives me inaccurate search results. In French. For things I wasn't searching for.
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Jul 12, 2013 20:17
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Thanks! Gonna try and find these all except for the Munitorum Manual. That's been merged with Uplifting Primer so already read.
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Jul 12, 2013 20:35
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mllaneza posted:3. Every book he appears in makes Fabius Bile more of a primary target. He needs to get got. Erebus or Bile: Who do you hate more at this point? I go with Erebus, every time.
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Jul 12, 2013 21:54
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VanSandman posted:Erebus or Bile: Who do you hate more at this point? I go with Erebus, every time. Even Lorgar doesn't like Erebus. Mechafunkzilla fucked around with this message at 22:34 on Jul 12, 2013 |
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Jul 12, 2013 21:57
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Arquinsiel posted:Liber Chaotica is entirely written from the perspective of some dude in the Empire in Fantasy, but the author snuck in some 40K stuff as an homage to the old fluff. Clearly an Imperial meter is smaller than a 20th century Earth meter. Or else the popularity of basketball ended up doing some weird things to the human gene pool in the future. This also helps explain the measurements for 4 meter wide MBTs. I prefer the "primarchs aren't 10 feet tall" explanation because a man the height of a literal elephant starts to become more comical or monstrous than it is impressive or regal. Versus them being about the size of a Space Marine (basically out of armor the height of a contemporary basketball star except built like a football player) and just nobody ever notices or can accurately judge their actual height because magic. Arquinsiel posted:Also bear in mind that "Tactical Dreadnought" armour was originally for doing repair work on plasma reactors while they were running, not for combat. I thought they were derived from plasma reactor suits, but are a unique design specifically meant for intense boarding actions and the like. Also, heroic scale means that the actual proportions and sizes might not be as ridiculous as they're modeled. Unless the growing rate of psyker mutations means that Cadians really do have heads the size of wastebaskets.
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Jul 12, 2013 22:18
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Lead Psychiatry posted:Thanks! Gonna try and find these all except for the Munitorum Manual. That's been merged with Uplifting Primer so already read. To be really honest, good luck with that. You might find some of them but they won't be cheap since they went out of print years ago. It should be noted these weren't normally sized books but printed in larger than usual format.  Also I got reminded of another one simply called The Inquisition which was pretty much an A to Z book about various characters and things related to the Inquisition and had stuff related to both Eisenhorn and Ravenor and such. On the fantasy side there is the Life of Sigmar book as well as the Witch Hunters handbook for those interested in that. Not to mention the WH40k Quiz book.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:00
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Cream_Filling posted:I prefer the "primarchs aren't 10 feet tall" explanation because a man the height of a literal elephant starts to become more comical or monstrous than it is impressive or regal. Versus them being about the size of a Space Marine (basically out of armor the height of a contemporary basketball star except built like a football player) and just nobody ever notices or can accurately judge their actual height because magic. I like the monstrous proportions because it makes the primarchs less like humans and more like something out of a Lovecraft novella. The Imperium is already pretty alien, but having the paragons being inhuman adds a bit more. I'd still like the Emperor to be a normal sized human, though, mostly because it would fit with his origin as against the primarchs'.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:31
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I prefer the notion that for a sufficiently powerful psyker/psykic entity the question "What do you look like?" simply stops having an absolute answer.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:44
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Arquinsiel posted:Also bear in mind that "Tactical Dreadnought" armour was originally for doing repair work on plasma reactors while they were running, not for combat. This has always been funny to me simply because in game-mechanical terms terminator armor can't withstand plasma. Maybe the people wearing it to work on reactors just hoped to get really lucky with their constant 5++ saves. 
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Jul 12, 2013 23:48
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I agree that the emperor should be normal man size and I think the space marines should of also been normal size(out of armour) but insanely muscly.
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Jul 13, 2013 00:03
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Neurosis posted:I like the monstrous proportions because it makes the primarchs less like humans and more like something out of a Lovecraft novella. The Imperium is already pretty alien, but having the paragons being inhuman adds a bit more. I'd still like the Emperor to be a normal sized human, though, mostly because it would fit with his origin as against the primarchs'. They're still plenty inhuman considering that even the least psychic of them is basically spiritually radioactive to the point where he throws off interstellar communications if he gets too close to the astropaths. And that nobody can even quite remember or agree on what they look like because the details of their appearance seem to shift and play weird tricks on human perception and memory. Lovecraft's whole thing was where the scary inhuman stuff in his novels is so outside the realm of human experience that human senses and minds literally can't deal with them and basically just glitch out and end up insane and unreliable, not that his creatures are physically huge and imposing. OXBALLS DOT COM fucked around with this message at 01:38 on Jul 13, 2013 |
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Jul 13, 2013 01:34
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I don't know, I think part of the "appeal" of Space Marines is that they are basically these almost inhuman genetically engineered monstrosities. There's a good moment related to this in the very first Horus Heresy book, where they kill the "emperor" and he basically tells Loken that of course they're fighting against the space marines the space marines are all gigantic inhuman monsters, so they can't be the "real" human empire. Also in terms of the primarchs, I think they really are that big and scary and monstrous, it's just in most cases their sheer presence is already so overwhelming that most people don't notice. In A Thousand Sons one of the remembrancers freaks out the first time he sees Magnus because he sees him for a moment as some gigantic awful creature and then snaps back into the 'normal' image of Magnus, who's to say all the primarchs don't have some affect like this (especially on normal humans, they wouldn't be as bad to space marines because of the similarities).
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Jul 13, 2013 03:42
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The primarchs are such an awesome presence of charisma, splendor and psychic might that most humans simply break down and begin weeping in their company. I don't think them being a foot taller than a space marine is even that notable.
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Jul 13, 2013 03:49
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hopterque posted:I don't know, I think part of the "appeal" of Space Marines is that they are basically these almost inhuman genetically engineered monstrosities. I get that, but I'm in disagreement on how much "big" matters to "big and scary and monstrous" because a guy the size of a house who can't even ride around in a normal car or spaceship but has to be carried around like cargo isn't a more scary super-intelligent demigod, he's clifford the big red dog. I just think it makes the whole setup sillier instead of scarier or cooler. Also Magnus may be a bit of an exception since he's one of the most mutated and least human of the primarchs, up there with maybe Sanguinius in terms of massive visible deviations from normal humanity. I also like the idea that the Space Marines really are relatively close imitations of their primarchs in physical form, but they lack the sorcerous and spiritual component of the primarch's creation and nature. OXBALLS DOT COM fucked around with this message at 03:55 on Jul 13, 2013 |
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Jul 13, 2013 03:53
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Cream_Filling posted:I get that, but I'm in disagreement on how much "big" matters to "big and scary and monstrous" because a guy the size of a house who can't even ride around in a normal car or spaceship but has to be carried around like cargo isn't a more scary super-intelligent demigod, he's clifford the big red dog. I just think it makes the whole setup sillier instead of scarier or cooler. Magnus is the same as any other primarch, he just lost one of his eyes to a warp beast, when they call him the cyclops it's not like his one eye is in the middle of his head or anything.
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Jul 13, 2013 04:30
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You say that but it's made pretty clear that he's not like any other primarch, and there's a few times where his face changes from the normal one eyed and an empty scarred socket, to just one eye and the other seeming never to have existed, and to one giant cyclops style eye. Also he didn't "lose" his eye he sacrificed it to what was most almost certainly tzeentch in return for an end to the gene seed instability of the thousand sons
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Jul 13, 2013 04:43
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There's also the bit when Horus is poisoned by the Anathame and the apothecary says he tried opening him up but he can't make sense of his organs or whatever is in there. So he recommends putting Horus into stasis and beelining for Earth so the Emperor can fix him.
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Jul 13, 2013 05:01
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Not to mention the torture/foreplay of Fulgrum where Fabulous Bile and the other children were fascinated by this chance to see what makes a Primarch and how much they can endure. And then came the butt plugs...
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Jul 13, 2013 05:41
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EyeRChris posted:Not to mention the torture/foreplay of Fulgrum where Fabulous Bile and the other children were fascinated by this chance to see what makes a Primarch and how much they can endure. And then came the butt plugs... Fabulous Bile really is a better name.
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Jul 13, 2013 07:53
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EyeRChris posted:Not to mention the torture/foreplay of Fulgrum where Fabulous Bile and the other children were fascinated by this chance to see what makes a Primarch and how much they can endure. And then came the butt plugs...  What book was that in?
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Jul 13, 2013 08:06
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UberJumper posted:
I can't recall the title of the book but it was one of the short story collection Horus Heresy books. I want to say The Primarchs.
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Jul 13, 2013 11:02
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EyeRChris posted:I can't recall the title of the book but it was one of the short story collection Horus Heresy books. I want to say The Primarchs. Yeah, it was from The Primarchs, which is an absolute garbage collection.
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Jul 13, 2013 14:20
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Mechafunkzilla posted:The primarchs are such an awesome presence of charisma, splendor and psychic might that most humans simply break down and begin weeping in their company. I don't think them being a foot taller than a space marine is even that notable.
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Jul 13, 2013 14:25
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