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Niwrad posted:I almost always trade with city-states late in the game. Don't want to give the other Civs the extra science or gold. Sometimes I will with a civ that isn't a threat, but never with one that is. I also find that trading with a city-state that is close in proximity is less likely to have issues during a war or from barbarians. Sometimes you can get lucky with quests, otherwise the ones with a ton of allies goes Patronage and Commerce and makes a crapload of money from trade routes to spend on the city states. The downside to trading with only the city states is that you make less money to buy influence with. It also helps to spread your religion to them, which reduces decay. That, combined with Patronage can go a long way. Late game, Freedom and Order have influence affecting tenets that really help a lot. Gunboat Diplomacy and Treaty Organization can keep you allied without spending any money and Arsenal of Democracy lets you replace monetary gifts with units, basically. Some people will go patronage and get the 20 influence resting point bonus and then pledge to protect a lot of city states for an additional influence resting point bonus and be perma-friended with cheap alliances, but that can be risky and bad for your overall world diplomacy if there are aggressive civs on the map. It synergies nicely with Freedom's Treaty Organization though. Niwrad posted:How does the domino effect work? I guess I'm confused at what gives you influence besides the quests and money. Or maybe that's it? It feels like I'll work my butt off helping one and when I get them to ally I look up and another Civ has the other 7 on the continent. I guess I don't understand how they manage to do this. A city state will request resources be hooked up to your trade network. You find another city state that offers that resource, buy them out, and end up getting two CS allies for the price of one. If that city state then offers another resource that another city state wants, the chain continues, but I find those kinds of opportunities rare. To put it simply, the other civs are probably just making a lot more money than you are and have gone Patronage. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 23:11 on Jul 12, 2013 |
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Jul 12, 2013 23:03
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One thing I really would love to see is inter-civ Airport linkages. If you have Open Borders and a Defensive Pact, it makes sense that you'd be able to airlift from your cities to your ally's. I also want shared vision, but that's a more expansive issue.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:09
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I also finished up a game with the Zulus. Almost feel they are overpowered. You can maintain a rather large army without it dinging your gold too much. And the Impi is a great UU. I was able to take over my continent rather early which makes the rest of the game much easier. This isn't BNW necessarily, but what does everyone think of how nukes are done in the game? I feel like they are just too cheap and uranium too easy to come by. If I'm going for a domination victory, I feel like I can look up and see who is close to beating me in another area, and just wipe out their top cities like that. Obviously it mimics how damaging it is in the real world, but I feel like it should be harder to spam them and it should draw bigger ire from the other civs. And perhaps you shouldn't be able to use gold to purchase them, it should be something that has to take turns to build (and maybe can only be built in one city). In my game Brazil was dominating the other continent. Had almost all the city-states aligned and a huge cultural advantage. I was able to wipe out any hope in a handful of turns.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:15
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If the city state has a mine on some coal and they are my allies is there any reason why they aren't giving me the resource? Also there have been 2 wars in my game and I'm paid for both of them to start, so little aggression going on.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:18
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Geokinesis posted:If the city state has a mine on some coal and they are my allies is there any reason why they aren't giving me the resource? Are they connected to you? It took a while for me to get coal since the city state I allied with did not have a Harbor (and was on an island), which was annoying. Almost went to war over it!
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Jul 12, 2013 23:21
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GrandpaPants posted:Are they connected to you? It took a while for me to get coal since the city state I allied with did not have a Harbor (and was on an island), which was annoying. Almost went to war over it! Arghhhhhhh. They are all on separate islands, I have no way of getting coal then.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:23
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Niwrad posted:I also finished up a game with the Zulus. Almost feel they are overpowered. You can maintain a rather large army without it dinging your gold too much. And the Impi is a great UU. I was able to take over my continent rather early which makes the rest of the game much easier. I think it also has to do with the fact that nukes (especially missiles) are so much better than any other way to make use of your Uranium. I dunno how to fix that without massively unbalancing GDRs or Nuke Plants, but that's just my two cents on it.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:26
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GrandpaPants posted:Are they connected to you? It took a while for me to get coal since the city state I allied with did not have a Harbor (and was on an island), which was annoying. Almost went to war over it! Hmm? I don't think this should matter. Don't allied city states give you resources regardless of geography? I thought there was a technological time delay between when you discover the tech to reveal a certain resource and when city states get access to it.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:31
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I am very certain they do, yeah. Are you sure you're their actual ally and someone else isn't beating you?
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Jul 12, 2013 23:33
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eXXon posted:Hmm? I don't think this should matter. Don't allied city states give you resources regardless of geography? I thought there was a technological time delay between when you discover the tech to reveal a certain resource and when city states get access to it. I think the city state has to have the resource revealed (they have their own tech tree progress) and the mine/platform/whatever built.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:37
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Gully Foyle posted:One thing I have been doing in my games is saving up the 3150 gold required to buy three factories as soon as you get Industrialization (and access to coal, of course). This gets you to your Ideology as fast as possible, ensuring you get the maximum number of free tenets (and denying them to the enemy), and getting up the Ideology tree quickly. It also boosts your production quite nicley too. I do this, too. The other industrial era openers have their uses, but Industrialization made a huge leap in the rankings. eXXon posted:The hydro plant too. They're still pretty useful for the early food bonus but not nearly as mandatory as before. Cities on rivers also get a bonus to trade route yields, 25%, I think.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:42
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Most likely that city state does not actually have Industrialization.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:43
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Barbarians start pillaging my nice sea trade routes in a small continents map, so I get upset and build a bunch of triremes to protect my trade routes. Suddenly I'm the biggest military power in the game and my military dwarfs every other civ's militaries combined, and I've got a fleet of frigates ready to strike at a moment's notice. And I'm Venice, just trying to trade and get money to buy favor and get great merchants. I have a terrible tendency to pump out a lot of boats on maps where ocean control is important, and it usually ends up with me waiting forever, sparing the AI, despite the fact that I could kill them all, but I don't because a domination victory is painfully slow. Really wish there was an easier way to get civs to surrender to you if they don't stand a chance.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:44
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Most likely that city state does not actually have Industrialization. Yeah, did you try improving the resource for them? (it's one of the gift options)
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Jul 12, 2013 23:47
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JayMax posted:Yeah, did you try improving the resource for them? (it's one of the gift options) If the city state does not have the required tech access, the option will be red. They can have a mine on the resource but if they can't see it, they can't give it to you.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:49
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Platystemon posted:I do this, too. The other industrial era openers have their uses, but Industrialization made a huge leap in the rankings. I like using Industrialization as my opening Industrial Era tech because in addition to all of its obvious benefits, it has the easiest pre-reqs. My usual strategy is tech Economics and use Oxford University to pop Industrialization for free while I'm backfilling. Fertilizer is the other Industrial opening tech with only one pre-req, but it doesn't have quite the same dividends.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:55
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I managed to rush through Industrial into Modern in like 10 turns my last game using free techs, basically going Scientific Theory -> Electricity -> Radio. It got me to Ideologies really fast without having to build factories (thank goodness for that too, I had no coal) and it was a culture game so rushing radio was pretty good for me. And if you're going culture, you should end up with most of the pre-reqs for Scientific Theory anyways, so this is probably going to be my preferred culture tech route.
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Jul 13, 2013 00:03
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Sometimes you can get lucky with quests, otherwise the ones with a ton of allies goes Patronage and Commerce and makes a crapload of money from trade routes to spend on the city states. The downside to trading with only the city states is that you make less money to buy influence with. It also helps to spread your religion to them, which reduces decay. That, combined with Patronage can go a long way. Late game, Freedom and Order have influence affecting tenets that really help a lot. Gunboat Diplomacy and Treaty Organization can keep you allied without spending any money and Arsenal of Democracy lets you replace monetary gifts with units, basically. Some people will go patronage and get the 20 influence resting point bonus and then pledge to protect a lot of city states for an additional influence resting point bonus and be perma-friended with cheap alliances, but that can be risky and bad for your overall world diplomacy if there are aggressive civs on the map. It synergies nicely with Freedom's Treaty Organization though. Thanks for the tips. Didn't even think about hooking up with a city-state that has a luxury another wants. I'll give Patronage a go next time I play, think I only tried it a couple times in the past. Never got real into religion. One thing I do like about BNW is using great writers to write a treatise and get a huge culture bomb.
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Jul 13, 2013 00:15
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Jesus gently caress Terracotta Army is a gamewinner. Nobunaga just doubled his ten unit army and instantly destroyed me. e: Who thought it was a good idea to change "Decisive victory" from "you win" to "you actually probably don't"? I guess I'm not taking my capital back ever.
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Jul 13, 2013 00:17
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eXXon posted:Hmm? I don't think this should matter. Don't allied city states give you resources regardless of geography? I thought there was a technological time delay between when you discover the tech to reveal a certain resource and when city states get access to it. I'm not sure about this exactly, but I remember getting a message that said that I would get the resources when they get it connected. I assumed it was a new bnw change, but I didn't think about their own tech advancement, or improving the resource for them. I do know something had to be done, though!
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Jul 13, 2013 00:17
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It shouldn't be doubling people's armies. It only gives you one duplicate of each unit type - unless he had 10 distinct unit types?
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Jul 13, 2013 00:31
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Sardonik posted:Does anybody else remember the failure screen in Civ 1 with the archeologists picking over the ruins of your civilization? Civ 1 had a failure screen?  Nah, just kidding. That was pretty heavy when you were 11 and watched your little civ get wiped out. Man, I still remember seeing that original ad in Computer Gaming World that was pretty much the box art with a couple screen shots. I knew I had to have that game instantly, and I must have had some birthday money or something saved, because I got ahold of it right quick. Of course, these were the days before they had video game stores in rural nowheresville, so I had to mail order it over the phone from Chips & Bits with my parents credit card. Mmmmmm.... nostalgia.  
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Jul 13, 2013 00:35
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Geokinesis posted:If the city state has a mine on some coal and they are my allies is there any reason why they aren't giving me the resource? They don't have to be connected by harbor to give you the resource, but they might not have the tech to improve coal yet. You can pay to improve the resource for them - I think it's under the "give a gift" option.
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Jul 13, 2013 00:37
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RBA Starblade posted:Jesus gently caress Terracotta Army is a gamewinner. Nobunaga just doubled his ten unit army and instantly destroyed me. If Nobunaga is on the map I always make it my mission to absolutely obliterate him as soon as possible. Him and Attila are the only civ's I know of where the "build walls, keep composite bowmen in cities" strategy to fending off invasions doesn't work.
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Jul 13, 2013 00:38
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Verviticus posted:It shouldn't be doubling people's armies. It only gives you one duplicate of each unit type - unless he had 10 distinct unit types? He must have had extra then, he attacked with waves of units behind each other, each one the same unit. I did finally beat them back, but god drat it. On a side note I am impressed the AI now knows how to fight. quote:If Nobunaga is on the map I always make it my mission to absolutely obliterate him as soon as possible. The motherfucker spawned next to me. I'm good friends with Montezuma though, who I allied with to take out Theodora's capital. He attacked me as that war wound down. It completely blew my chance at a culture victory I'm assuming, since my capital is now population 1 a couple hundred turns in. I was also forced to annex Constantinople, so that's slowed too.  Maybe I should try the new diplomatic victory. e: Nope I'm hosed, I can't possibly get enough happiness buildings in time to be worth a poo poo. RBA Starblade fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Jul 13, 2013 |
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Jul 13, 2013 00:38
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I can't really grok what France's supposed to be exceptional at. City of Light seems like an extremely limp bonus, considering it ends up being somewhere between +3 to +18 culture (depending on how many wonders you gobble up and how many Great Works you're able to create) that's only available in one city and only available lategame. Chateaus don't seem like anything special as a tile, though I guess it makes playing defense as France easier while still having usable tile yields? I guess Chateaus are better than Moai, at least, and Musketeers don't go obsolete as quickly as Maori Warriors? There's that?
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Jul 13, 2013 00:49
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eXXon posted:The culture bonuses are too small to make an appreciable difference in the late eras. I like farming culture off barbarian encampments but the returns don't keep up past the renaissance. Dunno if you were doing it or not, but leave the guarding barbarian in the encampment and, well, camp the spawn point. The jerks will, supposedly, respawn quicker if you leave a barbarian in the camp.
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Jul 13, 2013 00:59
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If there are any guides to who the new culture aspect works (with details and strats not no noob poo poo) link it here. Praise christ.
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Jul 13, 2013 01:41
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Brannock posted:I can't really grok what France's supposed to be exceptional at. City of Light seems like an extremely limp bonus, considering it ends up being somewhere between +3 to +18 culture (depending on how many wonders you gobble up and how many Great Works you're able to create) that's only available in one city and only available lategame. Chateaus don't seem like anything special as a tile, though I guess it makes playing defense as France easier while still having usable tile yields? With Hotel, Airport and National Visitors Centre each Chateau is worth 3 Gold, 3 Culture and 6 Tourism. That's 9C/18T for every luxury you can fully exploit. For City of Light: I believe Theme bonuses create Tourism as well as Culture, and the ones from Wonders also get multiplied by the buildings. So Paris with all three buildings plus its bonus will get six times the Tourism bonus, eight times if you go Freedom and take the tenet that gives +34% for a Broadcast Tower. I believe a fully loaded Louvre would give 128 Tourism, but even Museums would be worth 32.
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Jul 13, 2013 01:42
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How do you cancel a trade route? I keep clicking on my camel and going to the trade route screen and I can't figure it out.
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Jul 13, 2013 01:46
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counterfeitsaint posted:How do you cancel a trade route? I keep clicking on my camel and going to the trade route screen and I can't figure it out. You can't. You have to wait it out.
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Jul 13, 2013 01:49
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The sane solution would be to let you cancel trade routes at the expense of the caravan, and to let you build caravans when you have all your trade routes completed, but that would be too loving sensible. Instead, don't communicate that they can't be cancelled (but they can be killed so the barbs can do you a favour) and don't let people stockpile an inert civilian unit because ???
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Jul 13, 2013 01:52
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Jedi Knight Luigi posted:You can't. You have to wait it out. Huh? Does a trade route work the same as a deal then, they last a certain number of days? Where can I see how much longer is left?
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Jul 13, 2013 01:55
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Fojar38 posted:If Nobunaga is on the map I always make it my mission to absolutely obliterate him as soon as possible. Him and Attila are the only civ's I know of where the "build walls, keep composite bowmen in cities" strategy to fending off invasions doesn't work. Brannock posted:I guess Chateaus are better than Moai, at least, and Musketeers don't go obsolete as quickly as Maori Warriors? There's that?
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Jul 13, 2013 01:59
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Gah, I really need a decent new walkthrough or guide or something. Can't win at King anymore  It seems to me that playing on normal speed is a lot worse this time around, since there's a lot more stuff to do in each era. On the other hand, I like my games fast and finishable in one/two sessions 
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Jul 13, 2013 02:06
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Brannock posted:I can't really grok what France's supposed to be exceptional at. City of Light seems like an extremely limp bonus, considering it ends up being somewhere between +3 to +18 culture (depending on how many wonders you gobble up and how many Great Works you're able to create) that's only available in one city and only available lategame. Chateaus don't seem like anything special as a tile, though I guess it makes playing defense as France easier while still having usable tile yields? France's UA and the Aesthetics bonus together count as a quadruple theme bonus. That's basically what makes the UA significant.
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Jul 13, 2013 02:09
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I started off a game as Byzantine with my teammate as Venice. I rushed piety to get the reformation belief that allows you to convert barbarians. Then, I setup three barbarian fountains, including a naval one:   Over the course of the 240 turn game on quick, I recruited about 60 hammer-free, gold-free units from these camps. Since I was the dominant religion the whole game, I also picked up just war and holy warriors. After spawning essentially free units all game, I ran them by Mt. Kilimanjaro and gave them to Venice, who had enough gold to pay upkeep and upgrade them. We crushed the other 4 AIs in record time with little opposition on Emperor.
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Jul 13, 2013 02:10
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KoldPT posted:Gah, I really need a decent new walkthrough or guide or something. Can't win at King anymore I hear people say that the game got harder but to me the difficulty feels the exact same. Emperor is still pretty easy, Immortal is still pretty tough and Deity is Deity. Also to y'all who talk about playing and losing a few hours without noticing it, I just finished a 15-hour multiplayer session with my brother and we didn't even finish a game. 
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Jul 13, 2013 02:10
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Goddamn, if anyone hasn't tried out Morocco, you really need to. With the right conditions, you can out-Venice Venice.. Get a decent starting desert with as much incense/gold/silver/sheep/desert hills as possible, get desert folklore and get an amazing early religion while you beeline a traditional tradition start to get a great library -> currency slingshot to get out a petra and a market/mint asap. So, so many 1 faith/4 production/3 food tiles from sheep and 1 food/1faith/4gold/4prod from gold tiles and thats before you even start rocking the kasbah like you REALLY want to poo poo out gold and production. It really does depend on the start, you really do need those gold/sheep (or incense to get out monasteries for a poo poo tonne of culture) but when it starts rolling..it starts rolling! Lots of fun, really recommended. Going to try another version of this start with Holy Warriors, to see if my Islamic hordes can murder everyone before the medieval era.
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Jul 13, 2013 02:14
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Snow Job posted:France's UA and the Aesthetics bonus together count as a quadruple theme bonus. That's basically what makes the UA significant. Same with the... Patronage one, I think, and Venice, meaning you get 4 times the gold from Trade Missions. Made 4000g in one go as a result of that. Still lost on points to Genghis - he'd eaten 2 other Civs, and I was too wishy-washy about whether I was going for culture or diplomatic victory, though I probably could've pulled off culture if I'd managed to win the International Games race, as it stood I had 3 of 5 in the bag and Khan was ready to turn, but Korea was just making GBS threads culture, apparently, and even with +75% and pretty much every Tourism booster I could get, it was only just creeping up on him. Also had a fun time with Pacal just refusing to switch ideologies even after I got him under my culture, and voted mine the World Ideology. He sat for like 100 turns in revolt rather than change, and as a result I lost a Merchant of Venice because his dumb rebels couldn't stick to attacking their own guys. 
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Jul 13, 2013 02:26
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