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Matrim posted:You're right. I meant to say that their one UU is pretty absurd. Warrior strength on a scout is already brokenly good, but choosing your ruins (and upgrading straight to a composite bow) makes it an incredibly long-lasting and versatile unit. I think it's a little too good, given Shoshone's other bonuses. The unit upgrade is okay but being able to guarantee +1 pop and the free tech are an insane jump start. If you can find enough ruins to double dip into those it's the strongest start in the game.
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Aug 1, 2013 05:10
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thehumandignity posted:So what do you think is good about Comanche Riders? They have, what, extra movement? A lower cost? They still have the cities attack penalty so they have a niche use, as far as balance is concerned I didn't think they were worth mentioning. They're a niche unit, but Pathfinders more than make up for it compared to anyone other civs' UU.
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Aug 1, 2013 05:11
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Cirofren posted:The unit upgrade is okay but being able to guarantee +1 pop and the free tech are an insane jump start. If you can find enough ruins to double dip into those it's the strongest start in the game. Yep, culture is also great to grab. Faith as well. The unit upgrade is just the icing on the cake - if you were a warmonger, you could grab a very, very early composite bow that has scout movement and leverage that into a huge early attack. Moreso if you manage to take two upgraded pathfinders.
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Aug 1, 2013 05:13
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Yeah, the Shoshone are incredible but they are also, more importantly, flexible. They're not locked into any single victory path or strategy, and even if you somehow get beaten to a bunch of ancient ruins their ability to grab extra land and fight harder while inside it means that they can't be taken over easily. Poland's nicely flexible too, for different reasons.
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Aug 1, 2013 05:23
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 I saw this one little yellow dot at the end of the continent and thought "Assyria. What are you doing." I sent a boat over to check, and sure enough there's a Citadel exactly two spaces away from Carchemish, which seems really loving petty even in a game where Napoleon's been a douchebag the whole way. Those truffles had to be solidly in French lands, though, so I guess Assyria just really wanted a couple of fish nodes.
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Aug 1, 2013 05:33
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Varjon posted:I'm reasonably certain someone mentioned earlier that it did. I can confirm it does.
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Aug 1, 2013 05:36
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Poland has to easily be the best civ in the game right now. Shoshone are nice, but their window of power fades after the first few eras. Poland keeps on trucking along with big power jumps every era. Ducal Stables are so good that the Huns wish they had that poo poo, and Winged Hussars make Lancers actually desirable. The only possibly bad thing about Poland is that advancing into the Modern Era if you haven't built three Factories yet means that you don't get a free ideological tenet, because the ideology comes a turn or so after you've advanced into Modern - and you can't delay your free policy. So if you want an instant level 2 Tenet once you're into Modern (and are an early adopter) you have to push for coal and factories.
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Aug 1, 2013 05:57
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Yeah, as Poland I don't need to worry about screwing myself for taking too long to finish a tree, or opening multiple policy trees, too. They are to culture what Babylon or Korea are to science. Other civs get extra culture points other ways, but not one whopping whole new policy on top of the ones they're earning the normal way.
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Aug 1, 2013 06:03
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Brannock posted:The only possibly bad thing about Poland is that advancing into the Modern Era if you haven't built three Factories yet means that you don't get a free ideological tenet, because the ideology comes a turn or so after you've advanced into Modern - and you can't delay your free policy. So if you want an instant level 2 Tenet once you're into Modern (and are an early adopter) you have to push for coal and factories. Most players should be pushing for coal and factories anyways, unless its a small game. The bump in free tenets at the start makes it well worth the push.
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Aug 1, 2013 06:17
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Whenever the World's Fair gets proposed, I just drop everything and have all my cities build for it. I just can't take the chance of someone else out-culturing me and I really do want that extra policy. That stuff is worth missing out on a wonder or delaying other projects.
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Aug 1, 2013 06:19
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The nice thing about Poland is the same as Shoshone, really. Their UA isn't better for any one victory type more than the others, it's just great for establishing a firm base to launch into any victory type from. Some people assume culture, but they aren't really any better at that than anything else now that culture victories aren't tied to policies and they don't actually get extra culture, just policies. You can do with that whatever you want.
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Aug 1, 2013 06:29
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Oh gently caress you Hiawatha. I burn your cities and kill your people. Instead of fighting me you just run and build more god drat cities. 
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Aug 1, 2013 06:43
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Thanks ruins for saving two turns on my research, you're a life saver. 
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Aug 1, 2013 06:53
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Well I settled this city with the intention of forcing Napoleon to dow me in a little bit so I can beat him up and take Paris but instead he asked me for a declaration of friendship.   Guess we're buds now.
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Aug 1, 2013 07:16
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A Tartan Tory posted:I can confirm it does.  I know what civ I'm playing as next.
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Aug 1, 2013 07:18
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uPen posted:Well I settled this city with the intention of forcing Napoleon to dow me in a little bit so I can beat him up and take Paris but instead he asked me for a declaration of friendship. That's just Napoleon's way for preparing for war.
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Aug 1, 2013 07:22
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uPen posted:Well I settled this city with the intention of forcing Napoleon to dow me in a little bit so I can beat him up and take Paris but instead he asked me for a declaration of friendship. Indeed. You should probably disband all of your military units and let your guard down.
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Aug 1, 2013 07:23
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Been getting caught up on this thread after picking up the two expansions on a whim... it's been almost two years since I played me some Civ. Does anyone have a good recommendation for a BNW video LP that sort of outlines how to play the game competently? I know Civ is largely a trial and error kind of game but I'd like to at least get the ground rules established so I'm not spending dozens of hours floundering about doing things completely wrong. MadDjinn has a pretty extensive series of videos from the previous expansion but that obviously wouldn't cover the new BNW stuff, and his Venice LP seems tricky to learn from since Venice is kind of a unique civilization. Anyone similar to his style who's done a "normal" LP with the new expansion? Garbo posted:
This is from like 30 pages back but I can't stop laughing, this made my night. Tender Bender fucked around with this message at 10:58 on Aug 1, 2013 |
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Aug 1, 2013 10:56
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Tender Bender posted:Been getting caught up on this thread after picking up the two expansions on a whim... it's been almost two years since I played me some Civ. Does anyone have a good recommendation for a BNW video LP that sort of outlines how to play the game competently? I know Civ is largely a trial and error kind of game but I'd like to at least get the ground rules established so I'm not spending dozens of hours floundering about doing things completely wrong. He can be a little hard to understand sometimes but http://www.youtube.com/user/Marbozir is a good LP'er for this game.
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Aug 1, 2013 11:12
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MadDjinn also just started posting a Poland LP, which should give you a better idea of most civs in the game.
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Aug 1, 2013 11:15
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Jolan posted:MadDjinn also just started posting a Poland LP, which should give you a better idea of most civs in the game. Talking about that, I really laughed at his settlement choice for his Cap.
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Aug 1, 2013 11:17
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If you want to watch an LP with plenty of comedy but absolutely zero strategy, UnitLost have been doing their run-through of BNW and it's hilarious from start to finish (well, it hasn't finished yet) It begins here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sN36vp5-10
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Aug 1, 2013 11:26
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Matrim posted:They're a niche unit, but Pathfinders more than make up for it compared to anyone other civs' UU.  But you said both of their UU's are overpowered. I'm just curious as to what you think is so great about the Comanches.
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Aug 1, 2013 12:04
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How many city states should I be puppeting as Venice, and when? In my current game it's turn ~150 and I haven't puppeted anyone yet. I'm allied with all the city states I've met, have built pretty much every wonder and am comfortably ahead on tech, so it just doesn't really feel like I need to. I know sending Venice food caravans would be pretty neat, but other than that am I missing out on much?
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Aug 1, 2013 12:29
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Jack the Lad posted:How many city states should I be puppeting as Venice, and when? In my current game it's turn ~150 and I haven't puppeted anyone yet. I find the best time to use Merchant of Venices is right at the beginning so you can ship all the food back to Venice, and then right at the end a turn before the world leader vote so you can buy out all of Alexander's CS and screw him over. That feels so good.
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Aug 1, 2013 12:47
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Scorchy posted:I find the best time to use Merchant of Venices is right at the beginning so you can ship all the food back to Venice, and then right at the end a turn before the world leader vote so you can buy out all of Alexander's CS and screw him over. That feels so good. Hm, okay - how many do you normally grab before you start doing trade missions instead? Do you think it's worth me starting to grab them now, or should I leave them as allies? Venice is a pretty decent size already and growing nicely.
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Aug 1, 2013 12:51
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Quick Question: What's the diplo-penalty for taking a City-State? Same as conquering the las city of a Civ?
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Aug 1, 2013 12:54
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So I just started messing with the reseed mod to check some theories a friend and I had about luxuries seeming sparser in variety now. The very first map I generated was this: Look at that goddamn minimap. That is insane, and I really wish I hadn't loaded up as the mongols, because that looks like it'd make for a REALLY interesting game. I rarely see continents spit out 3 landmasses, let alone FIVE. I wish there were a map script that produced that sort of thing more reliably. I love the idea of those kind of maps, but in practice I've never gotten to actually play one. I've been regenning maps for like half an hour straight now, and haven't got anything close to that again. I'm strongly considering loading that turn 0 save and just beelining for astronomy after I get Keshiks.
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Aug 1, 2013 13:01
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Yeah I find the bog-standard continents script creates two boring blobs 90% of the time, and then spits out a lovely gem. That looks amazing though, all the more so because there aren't that many coastal water connections... 
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Aug 1, 2013 13:11
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Scorchy posted:I find the best time to use Merchant of Venices is right at the beginning so you can ship all the food back to Venice, and then right at the end a turn before the world leader vote so you can buy out all of Alexander's CS and screw him over. That feels so good. I got a lot of benefit out of the suggestion earlier to use a couple to puppet city states on other continents as staging areas for wars, and I also used them to consolidate my borders. By the end I had like 80 happiness so it didn't really matter. On a standard sized map I think I took four or five puppets then used the rest as trade missions. That was a bloody game, too. 4 civs died (1 revived), and 7 city states remained free. It'd have been 6 civs dead but I like to leave them with a lovely island city then pass a resolution to embargo them even though it doesn't matter any more.
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Aug 1, 2013 13:16
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wilbur.walsh posted:Quick Question: What's the diplo-penalty for taking a City-State? Same as conquering the las city of a Civ? As Venice, there is no penalty, minus the fact your borders may now rub up against somebody. There also isn't any penalty for Genocide anymore. Jack the Lad posted:How many city states should I be puppeting as Venice, and when? In my current game it's turn ~150 and I haven't puppeted anyone yet. Uhh, as soon as you research optics and can find a coastal city/build a cargo ship. I actually timed it so the turn my cargo ship finished I bought out the city to immediately transfer the ship to start sending food next turn. I'm at turn ~150 and I have three merchant captured CS and one captured city because Shaka backstabbed me and right after forward settling on me. Too bad for him France suddenly decided to declare war on him for some gold. You need to scout out coastal CS immediately as Venice and take them over as quickly as possible. That's why getting your first 2/3 MoV is so critical, because you can ship food and production back to Venice. You also need trade hubs to reach everyone. Venice is just absurd, I'm currently crushing it on Deity with them, once you get a hang for how to play them, they're just inherently more powerful, assuming you aren't landlocked and isolated.
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Aug 1, 2013 13:26
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Tender Bender posted:
All the other Space Jam remixes fall in the category of "haha, that's kind of funny I guess" but this is goddamn amazing. Maybe it's because Baba Yetu is such a good song 
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Aug 1, 2013 13:27
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A Tartan Tory posted:Talking about that, I really laughed at his settlement choice for his Cap. I hadn't started watching it myself when I posted, but holy hell. I really don't get how he keeps on beating Deity. Or better put, I don't get how I can't beat Deity when I make less mistakes than he does.
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Aug 1, 2013 13:28
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Ruder posted:So I just started messing with the reseed mod to check some theories a friend and I had about luxuries seeming sparser in variety now. The very first map I generated was this: This looks rather a lot like the results of the Small Continents script.
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Aug 1, 2013 13:43
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Jolan posted:I hadn't started watching it myself when I posted, but holy hell. I really don't get how he keeps on beating Deity. Or better put, I don't get how I can't beat Deity when I make less mistakes than he does. I'm pretty sure he's just so drat good at it that he can shrug off mistakes that would cost the rest of us the game. Someone said he has really good big picture play which I think nails it.
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Aug 1, 2013 13:51
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He's really good at warfare which is all that matters, really. Does anyone know if Byzantium can choose a reformation belief as their additional policy? I'm too lazy to start a game with them just to find out.
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Aug 1, 2013 14:17
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It was mentioned that Barbarians have a City List. I'd be interested to see what names are there and how long it is. ...If the Barbs are given a Settler via map editing, will they use it? Will a barbarian City work as it 'should'?
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Aug 1, 2013 14:17
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A better question is, can you play as Barbarian? 
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Aug 1, 2013 14:24
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Marketing New Brain posted:He's really good at warfare which is all that matters, really. No, you only get one even as Byzantium.
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Aug 1, 2013 14:26
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How does one intimidate city states? I picked up Gunboat Diplomacy but when I looked at the modifiers for all city states I got something like: -110 base reluctance +100 overwhelming military +20 nearby military -20 a civ has granted pledged to protect total = -10 and so I couldn't demand tribute from any of them. Can you ask the AI to withdraw pledges?
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Aug 1, 2013 14:39
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