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Both growth buildings and production buildings will have a snowball effect on your ability to make other buildings. Start a +production and a +food trade route (preferably ocean rather than land) from two of your other cities to give it an initial boost until it can run pretty effectively on its own.
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Aug 1, 2013 18:18
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Ok, had to post this. Everyone wonders about the dream start, Where you have food and production and can get early wonders? Well, what about when the AI does it to you? The AI usually ignores the Oracle wonder, but I've never seen any Classical wonder go this early, it is absurd. I checked and sure enough, Askia got the Greater Library on turn 20 something.
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Aug 1, 2013 18:19
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Haha, I bribed a couple of civs with some gold per turn in order to have them elect my religion as the world religion. But after the world congress convened it turned out that some of them didn't support the proposal with even a single vote and one of them even voted against it. I wish I was in a position to declare war, instead I'm apparently forced to hold up my end of the deal with these shitlords.
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Aug 1, 2013 18:25
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Vil posted:Both growth buildings and production buildings will have a snowball effect on your ability to make other buildings. Start a +production and a +food trade route (preferably ocean rather than land) from two of your other cities to give it an initial boost until it can run pretty effectively on its own. Just want to say that inter trading between your cities is amazing if you have enough gold income from other source. I used two trade routes exclusively to feed my capital during my entire game last night and that fucker got so huge. My other trade routes went to helping my outer cities grow and I was still making bank because I setup a city in the center of the continent which acted as a massive trade hub for all the other civilizations on the continent.
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Aug 1, 2013 18:26
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The achievements in BNW unlock so screwy. I got two today, "Greed is Good" and "Enemy Blade No More". The latter is to take an enemy capital with as Indonesia with a kris swordsman having the Enemy Blade promotion (one of the negative ones). I got it when re-capturing Jakarta, which I'd lost a few turns prior to a japanese backstab sneak-attack that followed a DoF from Oda (my army was at my other border, it took a few turns to scramble back and he managed to take it with his last melee unit one turn before reinforcements...frown). I...guess it was technically an enemy capital? For the record, I don't think I've ever had the AI backstab me DURING a DoF before. But he got what he deserved, he was at war with Washington at the same time as marched to sack Jakarta, so his entire empire burned as I took it back. Smart move. The former one is funnier, though. You get it for having a city with Petra, the Colossus, a harbour and a caravanasary. I had no cities with any of those buildings/wonders, certainly none with all of them, and the Colossus hadn't even been built by anyone on the map. So...uh...yeah... Blogkb - because you too like video games, old and new (it's just a blog)
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Aug 1, 2013 19:11
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Dwarsen posted:
I got that one (legitimately) during my first Venice game. It was awesome. 
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Aug 1, 2013 20:00
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I unlocked "Greed is Good" by playing as landlocked poland, having none of the required buildings. I can recall getting random achievements before BNW but I'd have to check my steam page to find out.
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Aug 1, 2013 20:00
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a 16 year old girl posted:Haha, I bribed a couple of civs with some gold per turn in order to have them elect my religion as the world religion. But after the world congress convened it turned out that some of them didn't support the proposal with even a single vote and one of them even voted against it. I wish I was in a position to declare war, instead I'm apparently forced to hold up my end of the deal with these shitlords. Really? I have on numerous occasions bribed people to vote for my religion or ideology, when I'm the only one who has it, and I'm pretty sure they've always followed through. Did you have a mini war in between the bribe and the vote or something?
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Aug 1, 2013 20:14
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I wonder if the other AIs bribed them stronger in another direction, assuming they can do that.
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Aug 1, 2013 20:36
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Your votes are locked when you bribe/promise them, you can't change them (as the player). I know because I often go around selling my votes when I plan to vote a certain way, free money. They may have used their other votes to counteract it, since you sell and buy votes two at a time.
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Aug 1, 2013 20:44
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FISHMANPET posted:How does the game determine if my ranged unit can fire on an opponent or not? Do I need a non-rough tile between me and my target? From CaptainFargle's current LP: Captain Fargle posted:While we're on the topic, now is probably a good time to discuss the mechanics of how exactly our Unique Unit here works.
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Aug 1, 2013 21:31
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Dwarsen posted:The achievements in BNW unlock so screwy. I too unlocked Greed is Good last night playing as Poland with none of the buildings constructed. Something must be up with that Civ specifically unless it's just anecdotal, I was trying out the Poland fast expand strategy and got the achievement at something like turn 70
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Aug 1, 2013 21:58
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Scorps posted:I too unlocked Greed is Good last night playing as Poland with none of the buildings constructed. Something must be up with that Civ specifically unless it's just anecdotal, I was trying out the Poland fast expand strategy and got the achievement at something like turn 70 Well, I was Indonesia so... 
Blogkb - because you too like video games, old and new (it's just a blog)
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Aug 1, 2013 22:15
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Marketing New Brain posted:Your votes are locked when you bribe/promise them, you can't change them (as the player). I know because I often go around selling my votes when I plan to vote a certain way, free money. They may have used their other votes to counteract it, since you sell and buy votes two at a time. I didn't realize you only buy 2 votes at a time since it's my first time messing around with the voting system. The civs I bought the votes off were the ones who had the largest numbers of delegates so them voting for and against the proposal at the same time might be the reason for the weird result. They also denounced the civ who made the proposal (not me) in the meantime so that might also factor into it. The game with all the expansions tacked on is a lot of fun, but IMO it doesn't always really explain what's going on too well.
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Aug 1, 2013 22:23
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RagnarokAngel posted:I know it affects what tiles form. I believe it's like: A full list of stuff like this would be great. For instance, knowing how to make more marshes (POLDERS) spawn would be good to know. I just like playing with the civs that have UIs as your territory starts to look actively different than anyone else's and playing sandstorm starts for the Dutch can get dull after a while.
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Aug 1, 2013 22:24
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Alkydere posted:A full list of stuff like this would be great. For instance, knowing how to make more marshes (POLDERS) spawn would be good to know. I'd presume that "wet" would create more marshes. I don't know if any specific combination is required, but you could play around with mods/cheats that let you reveal the map to check it out and experiment.
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Aug 1, 2013 22:31
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Maybe wet and temperate is more marshland? And probably more jungle and snow in general, favoring neither.
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Aug 1, 2013 22:35
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Hot and wet gets you more jungles, temperate and wet should get more trees and marshes, cold and wet is obviously more snow and tundra, probably less grassland. Hot and arid will get more deserts, temperate and arid should get more plains and average trees, cold and arid lots of tundra. Normal rainfall will produce middling results, skewing towards the obvious temperature bias.
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Aug 1, 2013 23:24
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Speedball posted:Whenever the World's Fair gets proposed, I just drop everything and have all my cities build for it. I just can't take the chance of someone else out-culturing me and I really do want that extra policy. That stuff is worth missing out on a wonder or delaying other projects. I think it's a good idea to rush constructing world's fair and all the similar proposals because the sooner it's completed, the less opportunity the other civs have of getting the second place prize. Which is why I also divert caravans and cargo ships to provide hammers to my cities if their routes expire while I'm building it. I have no idea how effective a plan that is but it feels good to blast into first place.
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Aug 1, 2013 23:34
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Landmarks only grant the bonus culture and stuff if it is actually worked, right? It isn't an automatic culture is it? I ask because it seems kind of weird that you can have a site wayyyy out in the middle of no where and make it a landmark where it can't be worked. Can someone explain this?
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Aug 2, 2013 00:04
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Do you guys often leave "won games" ? It's turn 180, I've 450+ science and Pacal can just do whatever. Ever since Civ 3 I've been having most of my fun in the beginning. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Jastiger posted:Landmarks only grant the bonus culture and stuff if it is actually worked, right? It isn't an automatic culture is it? Isn't the point that you can grab the artifact and put it in one of your cities?
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Aug 2, 2013 00:05
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"The start is fun, the end sucks" is a huge problem with 4X games so youre not alone. The opening is full of possibilities and then it starts to converge into one point where the games all but won but you have another 4 hours to go. Edit: Daktari posted:
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Aug 2, 2013 00:08
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Also just had my first city flip. Is it required that once a city flips that the civ changes ideology? As soon as it flpped the Germans went Freedom like me.
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Aug 2, 2013 00:23
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RagnarokAngel posted:"The start is fun, the end sucks" is a huge problem with 4X games so youre not alone. This seems to be particular problem because 4x games generally lack sufficient "rubber band" mechanics (assuming they have any at all, most don't). The trade routes BNW introduced are a good start because they give more science to whichever trading partner has less tech, and if you're sufficiently ahead you get no science at all, just the gold. It's nice because it helps people who are behind catch up a bit but it isn't even close to preventing runaway leaders on it's own and there is very little else in the game that rubber bands players. What I'm saying is that more games need rubber band mechanics. Hell, even freakin Mario Kart on the god drat Super Nintendo realized that you should give people who are behind a slight speed boost because it's no fun if one guy dashes ahead and stays there the rest of the match. Admittedly in a game like Civ you don't want to just hand things to people who are behind, but like the trade route science bonuses you can work in ways to help the little guys that still make sense from a logical perspective and work with the gameplay.
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Aug 2, 2013 00:24
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Chomp8645 posted:This seems to be particular problem because 4x games generally lack sufficient "rubber band" mechanics (assuming they have any at all, most don't). The trade routes BNW introduced are a good start because they give more science to whichever trading partner has less tech, and if you're sufficiently ahead you get no science at all, just the gold. It's nice because it helps people who are behind catch up a bit but it isn't even close to preventing runaway leaders on it's own and there is very little else in the game that rubber bands players. Rather than rubber-banding, I'd be interested in a 4x game that focused on smaller, shorter games rather than long, sprawling ones. While it wouldn't fill the needs of Marathon or other heavily strategy-minded players, it'd definitely be interesting to see an entire game modeled around it (turning speed to Quick in Civ 5 just makes eras rush by a little too fast). Stuff like a radial tech tree rather than a linear one, an easier and quicker way to found cities with fewer penalties for doing so, etc. More built from the ground up than just scaled for smaller and faster stuff, really.
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Aug 2, 2013 00:35
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Jastiger posted:Also just had my first city flip. Is it required that once a city flips that the civ changes ideology? As soon as it flpped the Germans went Freedom like me. It's not required. It's just going to be the final straw for a lot of people, losing a city sucks.
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Aug 2, 2013 00:36
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RagnarokAngel posted:"The start is fun, the end sucks" is a huge problem with 4X games so youre not alone. This is a big reason why I'm excited for Jon Shafer's new game.
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Aug 2, 2013 00:40
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Chomp8645 posted:This seems to be particular problem because 4x games generally lack sufficient "rubber band" mechanics (assuming they have any at all, most don't). The trade routes BNW introduced are a good start because they give more science to whichever trading partner has less tech, and if you're sufficiently ahead you get no science at all, just the gold. It's nice because it helps people who are behind catch up a bit but it isn't even close to preventing runaway leaders on it's own and there is very little else in the game that rubber bands players. There's actually a huge rubber band mechanic built in: the more civs have discovered a tech, the less it costs. That said, it feels really insufficient, partially because it's really really good for people going deep in one side of the tech tree. It might be good to have a tech cost reduction based (nonlinearly!) based on your total value of techs (in beakers) vs. the tech leader's.
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Aug 2, 2013 00:55
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Heavy Lobster posted:Rather than rubber-banding, I'd be interested in a 4x game that focused on smaller, shorter games rather than long, sprawling ones. While it wouldn't fill the needs of Marathon or other heavily strategy-minded players, it'd definitely be interesting to see an entire game modeled around it (turning speed to Quick in Civ 5 just makes eras rush by a little too fast). Stuff like a radial tech tree rather than a linear one, an easier and quicker way to found cities with fewer penalties for doing so, etc. More built from the ground up than just scaled for smaller and faster stuff, really. Completely different kind of game, but I'm a pretty big fan of Through the Ages--it's heavily inspired by Civ and uses broadly similar systems, but it's about 20-21 turns long and feels tight and tense throughout the entire game. I think one big factor is that you can't gain a decisive advantage, say on the level of taking the enemy's capital in Civ, in the early game. The really crippling military cards don't become available until the last handful of turns, and as a result, some players may be ahead of others, but every player more or less stays relevant until the end.
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Aug 2, 2013 01:04
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Brannock posted:This is a big reason why I'm excited for Jon Shafer's new game. Yeah, a victory goal that doesn't have to do with dominating all other players, but dominating the omnipotent third party known as the Roman Empire. It's like a 4X game with a final boss. He makes it sound like the end game will be frantic as hell.
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Aug 2, 2013 01:04
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Tulip posted:There's actually a huge rubber band mechanic built in: the more civs have discovered a tech, the less it costs. That said, it feels really insufficient, partially because it's really really good for people going deep in one side of the tech tree. It might be good to have a tech cost reduction based (nonlinearly!) based on your total value of techs (in beakers) vs. the tech leader's. I don't think this is actually a thing in civ5. It was in civ 2-3-4 and AC but I think you have to get the world congress resolution for this? I haven't noticed it, at any rate. Consider: all AIs start with writing on deity but you don't get it any faster than on king.
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Aug 2, 2013 01:10
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There was no tech diffusion in Civ IV at all. It was added in a mod that ended up in a lot of mod packs, but not the game itself.
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Aug 2, 2013 01:23
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Verviticus posted:I don't think this is actually a thing in civ5. It was in civ 2-3-4 and AC but I think you have to get the world congress resolution for this? I haven't noticed it, at any rate. Consider: all AIs start with writing on deity but you don't get it any faster than on king. Herein lies the problem. It actually is a feature in Civ 5! Unfortunately the bonus is so loving small that it might at well not exist and it will never help anyone actually come back if they're behind in tech.
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Aug 2, 2013 01:26
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Don't forget about spies, the most significant come-from-behind technology mechanic! If you're the tech leader you're using spies as diplomats and maybe rigging elections, which is not quite as good as getting multiple free technologies every dozen turns. The reduction to technology cost for other civs who've already researched it really is very small. It can matter in the early game, but it's not really a big factor once someone's run away.
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Aug 2, 2013 01:40
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God I fucking love Diablo 3 gold, it even paid for this shitty title
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Spies are a potential rubberband mechanic, but it relies heavily on the initial steal attempt to be successful. If the tech leader catches the spy on the first attempt, they're basically untouchable for the rest of the game, since they have an elite agent in place while you're throwing rookies at them. On the other hand, if you're successful on the first attempt, you now have an elite agent that slips past their novice every time. They should probably rework how the Spy experience system works, it's not very good.
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Aug 2, 2013 02:04
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Chomp8645 posted:Herein lies the problem. It actually is a feature in Civ 5! Unfortunately the bonus is so loving small that it might at well not exist and it will never help anyone actually come back if they're behind in tech. It exists but it's mostly only noticeable in the very beginning of the campaign. It also only kicks in for civs you've already met. At most it shaves off one turn, that I've noticed.
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Aug 2, 2013 02:05
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isndl posted:Spies are a potential rubberband mechanic, but it relies heavily on the initial steal attempt to be successful. If the tech leader catches the spy on the first attempt, they're basically untouchable for the rest of the game, since they have an elite agent in place while you're throwing rookies at them. On the other hand, if you're successful on the first attempt, you now have an elite agent that slips past their novice every time. I agree. Maybe it should just be a flat 50/50 modified by buildings in the city. And maybe add some offensive spy buildings too to cancel out the police station, etc
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Aug 2, 2013 02:07
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isndl posted:Spies are a potential rubberband mechanic, but it relies heavily on the initial steal attempt to be successful. If the tech leader catches the spy on the first attempt, they're basically untouchable for the rest of the game, since they have an elite agent in place while you're throwing rookies at them. On the other hand, if you're successful on the first attempt, you now have an elite agent that slips past their novice every time. Don't send spies to a civ's capital! I learned that watching MadDjinn. If there's a chance to catch a spy in a secondary city, it's pretty small.
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Aug 2, 2013 02:07
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You can send spies to their capitals, but only until you get caught once, and only if they're not the tech leader. The tech leader almost always has a spy in their capital.
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Aug 2, 2013 02:10
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isndl posted:Spies are a potential rubberband mechanic, but it relies heavily on the initial steal attempt to be successful. If the tech leader catches the spy on the first attempt, they're basically untouchable for the rest of the game, since they have an elite agent in place while you're throwing rookies at them. On the other hand, if you're successful on the first attempt, you now have an elite agent that slips past their novice every time. I hate the spy system. It feels so tacked on and intangible. Giving them double duty as diplomats was a smart move.
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Aug 2, 2013 02:15
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