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jsoh
Mar 24, 2007

O Muhammad, I seek your intercession with my Lord for the return of my eyesight
That entire paragraph is a lie, because eu2 had a built in fantasy scenario, called fantasy or fantasia or something.

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QuoProQuid
Jan 12, 2012

Tr*ckin' and F*ckin' all the way to tha
T O P

Ofaloaf posted:

I'd love to see someone mod a Germans-win-WWII mod where the first thing that happens is that all the Reichskommissariats become petty warlordships that barely acknowledge Berlin and anti-German partisans keep popping up goddamned everywhere, rather than just having a Big Grey Blob and leaving it to the US and maybe Britain to fight in some rather bland WWIII scenario.

I once read a short alternate history story about Hitler putting his megaprojects into action. He rebuilds Berlin into Germania. The process is long and sends the nation onto the brink of bankruptcy. Unfortunately, Berlin is built on top of swampland and the engineers working on the project have cut numerous corners to keep up with time constraints.

On opening day, as Hitler delivers a live address to the world about his supremacy, the entire city collapses on itself. The Volkshalle's impossible dome crumbles, killing Hitler, the entire Nazi political apparatus and representatives from foreign allies. By the next day, the city is a smoky ruin. The few surviving leaders make desperate power grabs, France and Russia immediately declare war and the Third Reich becomes a tattered union of petty warlordships.

csm141
Jul 19, 2010

i care, i'm listening, i can help you without giving any advice
Pillbug
My first ever full Paradox game was the Abyss as Sweden. :colbert:

NihilCredo
Jun 6, 2011

iram omni possibili modo preme:
plus una illa te diffamabit, quam multæ virtutes commendabunt

Meh, 20th century alt-history never felt terribly interesting to me because the real 20th century was already utterly ridiculous in its own right.

Patter Song
Mar 26, 2010

Hereby it is manifest that during the time men live without a common power to keep them all in awe, they are in that condition which is called war; and such a war as is of every man against every man.
Fun Shoe

Chief Savage Man posted:

My first ever full Paradox game was the Abyss as Sweden. :colbert:

I discovered the Armageddon scenario (I'd never played HOI2 before) when I was checking out the copy of Iron Cross that Wiz so generously got me. It seems hilariously poorly balanced and that absolutely everyone, right and left, hates the poor Bourbons (France+Spain+half of Africa is not enough to take on all of Europe at once nearly singlehandedly).

Liberatore
Nov 16, 2010

Would you like
to know more?


When (that's no) moon hits this guy like a big Twi'lek guy: Liberatore!

CharlieFoxtrot posted:

"For the first time ever, Paradox Development Studio is introducing a fantasy scenario in their strategy games with the Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion DLC for the critically praised strategy/RPG Crusader Kings II. It is a fantasy scenario where the blood drenched Aztec Civilization arose early and spread like a virulent plague, learning of Europe from exploring Northmen. Prepare to defend all you hold dear against the Sunset Invasion!"

"Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion is the third DLC expansion for the critically praised strategy/RPG Crusader Kings II. This fantasy scenario marks Paradox Development Studios first departure from history."

Say fantasy scenario one more time, I dare you.


NihilCredo posted:

Meh, 20th century alt-history never felt terribly interesting to me because the real 20th century was already utterly ridiculous in its own right.

Same. The only 20th century alt-history that really interests me is flipping the switch on the Cold War, which I'm glad more and more games are being based on.

Patter Song
Mar 26, 2010

Hereby it is manifest that during the time men live without a common power to keep them all in awe, they are in that condition which is called war; and such a war as is of every man against every man.
Fun Shoe

NihilCredo posted:

Meh, 20th century alt-history never felt terribly interesting to me because the real 20th century was already utterly ridiculous in its own right.

A lot of truth to this. Honestly, I've become less and less interested in the category of events of "things that happened after 1914."

Ofaloaf
Feb 15, 2013

NihilCredo posted:

Meh, 20th century alt-history never felt terribly interesting to me because the real 20th century was already utterly ridiculous in its own right.
Walt Disney elected President in '52 is the best 20th century alt-history there ever was and ever will be. :colbert:

Cycloneman
Feb 1, 2009
ASK ME ABOUT
SISTER FUCKING

Ofaloaf posted:

Walt Disney elected President in '52 is the best 20th century alt-history there ever was and ever will be. :colbert:
Counterpoint: Reds: A Revolutionary Timeline. :colbert:

reignonyourparade
Nov 15, 2012

Cycloneman posted:

Counterpoint: Reds: A Revolutionary Timeline. :colbert:

There's basically no way to beat a timeline that starts out by mentioning PBS7.

Randallteal
May 7, 2006

The tears of time
There are already some really great small-focus strategy-simulation games set in the 20th century: Crisis in the Kremlin, Hidden Agenda, Buzz Aldrin's Race into Space.

Everything since the early 90s has been a bloated mess like the superpower games, though. Modern politics, war and economics simulated on a global scale is too complicated. It would be like Victoria x 1, 000.

binge crotching
Apr 2, 2010

Fintilgin posted:

What you need to do is convert it and then play as any other country. Japan vs. Ultra-Rome.

Turn on Sunset Invasion and then play as the Aztecs

Mantis42
Jul 26, 2010
Probation
Can't post for 2 hours!
I'm trying to build the ultimate save game to convert into EU4, tag switching from one power to another. So far I'm thinking:

-Rebuilt Persian Empire as a Zoroastrian (Almost done)
-Reformed Norse (actually reform as many religions as possible) in Scandinavia, although I might split it up to avoid too much blobbing.
-Give the Jomskvikings a decent sized realm as well.
-Build up the Byzantines just enough to reclaim the Roman name then let the AI gently caress it up again.
-Muslim Republic of Hispania.
-Maybe successful Crusader States? I don't how to fit this in with the Roman thing though.
-One version with Aztecs, one version without.

Any other interesting ideas?

Yureina
Apr 28, 2013

Yeap. I found this out recently. Really turns me off the Palestinian cause to find out they basically consist entirely of raging racists.

Patter Song posted:

I discovered the Armageddon scenario (I'd never played HOI2 before) when I was checking out the copy of Iron Cross that Wiz so generously got me. It seems hilariously poorly balanced and that absolutely everyone, right and left, hates the poor Bourbons (France+Spain+half of Africa is not enough to take on all of Europe at once nearly singlehandedly).

The premise seemed ridiculous to me as well. I don't think I ever bothered trying out the two scenarios that came with HOI2 Armageddon. Now Doomsday on the other hand... I had alot of fun with that one.

Dr. Video Games 0031
Jul 17, 2004

I think one of the Armageddon scenarios was meant to just be a perfectly balanced MP setup where ever country got the same amount of resources, IC, and MP, but I'm not sure how well that worked out. In single player it was dull as hell.

PleasingFungus
Oct 10, 2012
idiot asshole bitch who should fuck off

Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:

Many of the old Paradox games barely even had AI, just a lot of scripting telling them which event options to take and then some military AI that takes over once the game declares war for them as part of an event. When I was watching the Idle Thumbs' CK2 streams (which are pretty great, they're totally clueless about the game and just roll with it) one of the AI characters actually assassinated someone out of spite. It made me realize how far their AI and general gameplay as come. The game reacted to an absurd situation in an almost perfect manner.

Failed assassinations fire an event for the target, which has an option to send your own assassins in retaliation. The 'improvement in the AI' you're celebrating here is... literally just 'some scripting telling them which event options to pick'.

I mean, I think I agree with your broader point, you just chose the worst possible example.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

The Nozzle posted:

Any other interesting ideas?

Build up a Kievan Rus that can withstand the Mongol invasions (assuming they haven't already triggered). Keep it Norse I guess too?

burnishedfume
Mar 8, 2011

You really are a louse...
Or keep Cumans/Mordvins/Pecheneg going into EUIV. Either get them to own some land far away from the Mongols (I'm sure Germany, Spain, or maybe England could shed some land for the cause!) or find some way to get one dynasty to rule enough of that region so that they will be allied when the Mongols come.

Sio
Jan 20, 2007

better red than dead

The Nozzle posted:

Any other interesting ideas?

I'm doing something similar and the first thing I did was form the HRE, as otherwise you'll be missing an entire regional mechanic in EU4. You don't necessarily have to place it where it normally is if you don't want to, though. Centering it around France would be pretty interesting, for instance.

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:

I think one of the Armageddon scenarios was meant to just be a perfectly balanced MP setup where ever country got the same amount of resources, IC, and MP, but I'm not sure how well that worked out. In single player it was dull as hell.

Yeah this is exactly it. The countries aren't supposed to make sense.

Luigi Thirty
Apr 30, 2006

Emergency confection port.

I do like that if an AI character is mentally ill they get an irrationality bonus that makes them even stupider.

Speaking of dumb AI, I'm having a lot of trouble with the MEIOU AI. I'm Mecklenburg. I'm allied with Denmark. Lübeck is between me and Denmark. I go to war with Pommerania on a mission CB, the Emperor gets involved even though he's at war with Poland, it's a mess. The drat Danish army, 16,000 strong, won't leave Denmark. The AI won't ask Lübeck for military access so they're stuck there!

Once I tagged over and asked for them (it was Very Likely, so a sure thing) they got it and we steamrolled Pommerania. This happens every time I go to war and it's annoying.

csm141
Jul 19, 2010

i care, i'm listening, i can help you without giving any advice
Pillbug

Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:

I think one of the Armageddon scenarios was meant to just be a perfectly balanced MP setup where ever country got the same amount of resources, IC, and MP, but I'm not sure how well that worked out. In single player it was dull as hell.

I don't know why I played it in SP. Me and the democratic guys beat up on all the fascists and communists, then I turned on my allies and ate them one by one, then I released tons of puppets, then decided I wanted to go for world conquest after that so I cancelled and attacked every puppet I released, then finally conquered the Americas, completing my first (and only) Paradox world conquest. I did it all without knowing what Strategic Redeployment was. I marched three million men across Siberia to attack China.

It's a miracle I became a fan of the games after that ordeal.

Wolfgang Pauli
Mar 26, 2008

One Three Seven

The Nozzle posted:

Its kind of funny to complain about Paradox games being Eurocentric and then to also want to swap out the Americas entirely with some kind of fantasy land.
This is my only real reservation about it. Not having a randomizer won't mean it's any less Eurocentric, though. Randomization is probably the only thing that's going to give the New World states a fighting chance. I'd love a "randomized tech advantage" setting because to suggest that technology in EU is anything but railroaded is a joke. My interpretation is that Paradox games start out as seriously distorted models of a given historical datum, and they're presented as sandboxes where you just run wild. I'd prefer more dumb poo poo to railroading. I just wish dumb poo poo was incorporated as mechanics rather than driven by events. I'd love a Magic poo poo DLC that lets you recruit Planeswalkers as generals and burn provinces as mana and gently caress up blobs with magic and open portals to the goblinlands and awaken the Deep Ones and have the whole thing narrated by Riff Raff, but it'd be really lame if it was all just based in events. Give that poo poo a menu, at least.

Fintilgin posted:

Nah. You can want the rest of the world to be represented in more detail while still enjoying a totally optional extra gameplay mode that emphasizes the "discovery" of the Americas from a European point of view. I mean, unless you're actively looking for something to be uptight about. :colbert:
I really want a Hearts of Darkness mini-DLC that randomizes rivers and resources and such in Africa (as well as making rivers and resources in Africa not totally pointless. most of the Congo basin is loving fruit and grain)

Chris Remo bumbling his way through CK2? :syoon:

Randallteal posted:

There are already some really great small-focus strategy-simulation games set in the 20th century: Crisis in the Kremlin, Hidden Agenda, Buzz Aldrin's Race into Space.

Everything since the early 90s has been a bloated mess like the superpower games, though. Modern politics, war and economics simulated on a global scale is too complicated. It would be like Victoria x 1, 000.
And the kind of people making those games would be too focused on statecraft. Sorry, but you're not going to properly model Cold War tensions, third world sabrerattling, or the evolution of the security state without the PFLP or RAF or Rev Cells or Japanese Red Army. You're not going to properly model the Western Hemisphere until corporations are able to act independently of states. poo poo, trying to model a Cold War Middle East without the Muslim Brotherhood would be a joke. Libya would be the most boring thing ever instead of having a really interesting game as the World's Belligerent rear end in a top hat. poo poo's too complex, mang. You need to reduce scope, like Hidden Agenda, or make it into a loose procedurally-generated genre game like Covert Action.

csm141
Jul 19, 2010

i care, i'm listening, i can help you without giving any advice
Pillbug
A good modern post cold war game would have the intense simulation of Victoria and the character focus of Crusader Kings, with various types of non state actors like corporations, terrorist networks and supranational poo poo like the EU or IMF.

Yureina
Apr 28, 2013

Yeap. I found this out recently. Really turns me off the Palestinian cause to find out they basically consist entirely of raging racists.

Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:

I think one of the Armageddon scenarios was meant to just be a perfectly balanced MP setup where ever country got the same amount of resources, IC, and MP, but I'm not sure how well that worked out. In single player it was dull as hell.

That is certainly what it looked like. Alas, I never played multiplayer HOI2. Actually aside from one relatively brief EU3 game that was never finished, I've never played any of Paradox's strategy games online. They are just too drat big for that, I think. Would be a real nightmare to set up.

Rurik
Mar 5, 2010

Thief
Warrior
Gladiator
Grand Prince

Beamed posted:

You have over a week, I'm sure it will be fine. :)

I found out what the problem was: usually the money goes automatically from my bank account to Moneybookers to Gamersgate. For some reason now it got stuck in the middle and I had to transfer it manually from there to Gamersgate. But I got the game now, yay! :)

I see no serial key to activate on Steam though. Will the key be given when the game is released?

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

Rurik posted:

I found out what the problem was: usually the money goes automatically from my bank account to Moneybookers to Gamersgate. For some reason now it got stuck in the middle and I had to transfer it manually from there to Gamersgate. But I got the game now, yay! :)

I see no serial key to activate on Steam though. Will the key be given when the game is released?

Yup. I've pre-ordered from GG before. The key will show up in your Games Library once its released/available.

KOGAHAZAN!!
Apr 29, 2013

a miserable failure as a person

an incredible success as a magical murder spider

Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:

When I was watching the Idle Thumbs' CK2 streams (which are pretty great, they're totally clueless about the game and just roll with it) one of the AI characters actually assassinated someone out of spite. It made me realize how far their AI and general gameplay as come. The game reacted to an absurd situation in an almost perfect manner. (the situation in question)

That's actually an event. The player can get it too, if someone tries to kill them.

code:
#Failed assasination attempt on us, reacations possible
character_event = {
	id = 40020
	desc = "EVTDESC40020"
	picture = "GFX_evt_shadow"
	
	is_triggered_only = yes 
	
	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA40020" #Inside same realm, go to top liege.
		trigger = {
			same_realm = FROMFROM
			independent = no
			NOT = { top_liege = { character = FROMFROM } }
		}
		ai_chance = {
			factor = 1000
		}
		top_liege = {
			character_event = { 
				id = 40021
				tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP40021"	#ask liege for help.
			}
		}
	}

	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTF40020" #Inside same realm, but its my top liege!
		trigger = {
			same_realm = FROMFROM
			independent = no
			top_liege = { character = FROMFROM }
		}
		ai_chance = {
			factor = 1000
		}
		top_liege = {
			character_event = { 
				id = 40026
				days = 2
				tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP40026"	#will be exposed.
			}
		}
	}
		
	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTB40020" #Are we his liege?
		trigger = {
			same_realm = FROMFROM
			independent = yes
			FROM = { FROM = { prisoner = no } }
		}
		ai_chance = {
			factor = 1000
		}
		if = {
		 	limit = { realm_intrigue = 16 }
			random = {
				chance = 70
				reverse_imprison = FROMFROM
			}
		}
		if = {
		 	limit = { 
		 		realm_intrigue = 9
		 		NOT = { realm_intrigue = 16 } 
		 	}
			random = {
				chance = 50
				reverse_imprison = FROMFROM
			}
		}
		if = {
		 	limit = { 
		 		NOT = { realm_intrigue = 9 } 
		 	}
			random = {
				chance = 30
				reverse_imprison = FROMFROM
			}
		}
	}
	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTC40020" #slay him, he is someone elses prisoner
		trigger = {
			same_realm = FROMFROM
			independent = yes
			FROM = { 
			 	FROM = {
			 		prisoner = yes
					NOT = { host = { character = ROOT } }
					NOT = { has_opinion_modifier = { who = ROOT  modifier = i_attempted_murder } }
				}
			}
		}
		ai_chance = {
			factor = 1000
		}
		FROM = { FROM = { opinion = { who = ROOT modifier = i_attempted_murder months = 2 } } }

		send_assassin = FROMFROM
	}	
	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTE40020"	#slay him, he is prisoner
		trigger = {
			same_realm = FROMFROM
			independent = yes
			FROM = { 
			 	FROM = {
			 		prisoner = yes
					host = { character = ROOT }
				}
			}			
		}
		ai_chance = {
			factor = 1000
		}
		FROM = { 
			FROM = { 
				death = {
					death_reason = death_execution
					killer = ROOT
				}
			}
		}
	}
	option = {
		trigger = {
			NOT = {	same_realm = FROMFROM }
			FROM = { 
			 	FROM = {
					NOT = { has_opinion_modifier = { who = ROOT  modifier = i_attempted_murder } }
				}
			}			
		}
		name = "EVTOPTC40020"		# Someone in another realm.
		ai_chance = {
			factor = 1000
		}
		
		FROM = { FROM = { opinion = { who = ROOT modifier = i_attempted_murder months = 2 } } }

		send_assassin = FROMFROM
	}
	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTD40020"		#we dont dare do anything..  (player option, incase of worry.)
		ai_chance = {
			factor = 1
		}
		piety = 5
	}
}

axeil
Feb 14, 2006

Patter Song posted:

Come on? You don't see the potential?

Forget a Theocracies DLC, Paradox needs to make this the next CK2 DLC. It's absolutely hilarious.

Riso
Oct 11, 2008

by merry exmarx
Would be worth it for the forums whining alone.

Beamed
Nov 26, 2010

Then you have a responsibility that no man has ever faced. You have your fear which could become reality, and you have Godzilla, which is reality.


Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:

I think one of the Armageddon scenarios was meant to just be a perfectly balanced MP setup where ever country got the same amount of resources, IC, and MP, but I'm not sure how well that worked out. In single player it was dull as hell.

The reason it didn't work out was just geography: The Axis was hosed by virtue of being bordered by everyone else, the Confederates included, etc.

Really the scenario, if it were rebalanced to have more resources (there were literally not enough to feed the industry), would have been badass as all hell.

Just like Fantasia was the best way to play EU2 :allears:

LP97S
Apr 25, 2008
If we're still talking about fantasy scenarios I would like to see a War of the Worlds scenario in Vicky, preferably with a post-war segment like the unauthorized sequel Edison's Conquest of Mars.

Patter Song
Mar 26, 2010

Hereby it is manifest that during the time men live without a common power to keep them all in awe, they are in that condition which is called war; and such a war as is of every man against every man.
Fun Shoe

axeil posted:

Forget a Theocracies DLC, Paradox needs to make this the next CK2 DLC. It's absolutely hilarious.

quote:

Your heir ran up to you, tears in his little eyes, as he blurted out the terrible words, "I saw Mommy kissing Santa Claus!" Your heart skipped a beat. He's taken your sovereignty, he's taken your dignity, but now your jolly fat liege lord has his eyes on taking your wife? A new resolve hardened in your heart.

We'll be dining on reindeer tonight!
Maybe her intercession will get me a better Christmas present this year?

canepazzo
May 29, 2006



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SCDhF2d3AE

Paradox Interactive ‏
We're proud to announce War of the Vikings! Watch the trailer: http://ow.ly/nFJYd Follow them on @WaroftheVikings!

http://www.paradoxplaza.com/press/2013/8/paradox-interactive-announces-war-of-the-vikings

:black101:

canepazzo fucked around with this message at 14:21 on Aug 6, 2013

Tomn
Aug 23, 2007

And the angel said unto him
"Stop hitting yourself. Stop hitting yourself."
But lo he could not. For the angel was hitting him with his own hands
I look forward to seeing how capable pickup games are of forming and maintaining a shield wall.

Darkrenown
Jul 18, 2012
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes
At least when terrible players are hitting two allies for every enemy with wild sweeps of their axe you can pretend they are just roleplaying a berserker :)

Inside Outside
Jul 31, 2005

The Nozzle posted:

I'm trying to build the ultimate save game to convert into EU4, tag switching from one power to another. So far I'm thinking:

-Rebuilt Persian Empire as a Zoroastrian (Almost done)
-Reformed Norse (actually reform as many religions as possible) in Scandinavia, although I might split it up to avoid too much blobbing.
-Give the Jomskvikings a decent sized realm as well.
-Build up the Byzantines just enough to reclaim the Roman name then let the AI gently caress it up again.
-Muslim Republic of Hispania.
-Maybe successful Crusader States? I don't how to fit this in with the Roman thing though.
-One version with Aztecs, one version without.

Any other interesting ideas?

For my save I've been building up a huge Russian Empire. After the hordes are defeated I'm going to start splitting off independent Suomenusko kingdoms all over the place with my dynasty ruling. Right now the Caliph and I are scrambling to mop up the Byzantines. It'll probably end with a Sunni Anatolia and a Suomenusko Greece.

Beamed
Nov 26, 2010

Then you have a responsibility that no man has ever faced. You have your fear which could become reality, and you have Godzilla, which is reality.


Are the forums practically down for anyone else?

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!
They're actually down now. Obviously too many people were looking at the Byzantine beta AAR in a state of feverish Byzantophilic joy.

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Skoll
Jul 26, 2013

Oh You'll Love My Toxic Love
Grimey Drawer

Darkrenown posted:

At least when terrible players are hitting two allies for every enemy with wild sweeps of their axe you can pretend they are just roleplaying a berserker :)

How are you gonna explain when the archer meta carries over too? :P

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