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Ok thanks ncumbered. I wondered if I was doing something wrong. Guess they're designed for 14g.
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Aug 6, 2013 06:17
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XmasGiftFromWife posted:What are your fears about knob and tube? Houses built in the 20s that haven't been gutted to the studs will have live k&t SOMEWHERE. This. My home was built in 1915 and there is one k&t circuit remaining. Since its running through the ceiling between the main living area and finished attic, there's no practical way to take it out. It's perfectly safe if you inspect it and don't mess with it.
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Aug 6, 2013 12:32
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XmasGiftFromWife posted:Unless it has been extensively remodeled Well; on the inspector front I've lined up a guy whose known to be the best of the best for the city. (To answer the previous question: I'm not worried about the appraisal so much as not buying a house that's going to need a complete electrical gut or burn down on me in the next couple years - just trying to avoid nightmares). There's an attic and unfinished basement. I'm not particularly fearful of it aside form hearing it has the possibility of being dangerous if not inspected (and since it's a new house to me, I dont know what level of care it's had in the past). Just really looking for who to contact / what to check while I've still got my contingency to negotiate for repairs / etc.
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Aug 6, 2013 13:48
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You will want an electrician to make a bid at bringing the house up to code. This will be a few thousand dollars and the homeowners likely will not pay it. It is your prerogative as a buyer for these changes, but k&t is expected in a house of this age.
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Aug 6, 2013 14:05
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XmasGiftFromWife posted:You will want an electrician to make a bid at bringing the house up to code. This will be a few thousand dollars and the homeowners likely will not pay it. Unless you get "friend prices" expect between $3-5000 to bring a single-story house with crawlspace and attic up to code. This is best-case scenario. Of that cost, about $500 is parts, and the rest is labor. Rewiring a whole house takes a lot of time, especially if it's finished and you're not allowed to put big holes in the walls.
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Aug 6, 2013 14:19
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Long story short, my folks got air conditioning about 11 years ago and ditched the evaporative cooler. Only recently did I finally remove the old 2-speed cooler switch that was in the utility closet where the heater originally was. Originally, the switch operated two different circuits on the same outlet on the roof, one for the pump which operated on NEMA 5-15 standard household current, and a NEMA 6-15 that was for the two-speed motor. As I removed the switch, everything was dead as I expected except for a hot wire for the pump that was nothing more than a jumper from some hot wiring already in the box that feeds an outlet directly below the cooler switch. I removed the jumper, capped off the other three dead wires and put a blank plate over everything. Now I'm thinking of using the original pump wiring and installing a single round outlet in the cooler switch's place to have a third outlet in the room for an eventual drop amplifier for the cable system. The neutral wire is one of the wires I capped (that is, I think it's the neutral wire since it's the same gauge wire as the hot jumper but was black; the NEMA 6-15 wiring for the motor is definitely thicker and hard to mistake for the pump wiring), and there is also a ground wire for the original switch. All I would need to do is reinstall the hot jumper. Would this be feasible and safe? You Are A Werewolf fucked around with this message at 02:36 on Aug 7, 2013 |
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Aug 7, 2013 02:32
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Dumb question that I really should answer by getting a modern codebook. My copy is from 93 and very outdated. I am installing an auto transfer switch and a new main panel. What I have: 100A Generac ATS 100A Square D QO panel It's all HOPEFULLY going in the same corner of the basement the original, badly corroded, gunked up, lovely, undersized panel from the 80s was installed in. That being said, I'm worried about: workspace/free area around panel(s) ATS grounding/panel grounding/where I bond the neutral and ground (main panel? ATS?) height from ground lighting panel loading (I haven't rewired the rest of the house yet, so I'm going to have to figure this out later.) Basically I have a right angle inside corner, with a 2x4 foot section of 3/4" plywood screwed vertically to furring strips on each wall, AKA I have a total of 4x4 feet of plywood. Some of it is too far into the corner to be useful except for stapling cable to obviously. The ATS is 15" wide, 20" tall, and 7.5" deep. The breaker panel is 16" wide, 27.5" tall, and 4.5" deep. What are the work area requirements for free space around each panel/ATS? Can I mount the ATS on the right hand plywood sheet with the bottom 62" off the ground (the plywood starts 39" off the ground and goes to 87" off the ground) and the panel wherever I want (roughly chest height, vertically I have no problems here but I'm worried about interference with the ATS housing) on the left hand plywood sheet? Basically, how much space do I need between the boxes? The ATS gets bolted and locked closed so I'm not sure it needs workspace, but I'm worried I need x inches of free space around the breaker panel which may not be possible with it mounted where it's going to go. Unless it's permissible to put it under the ATS which would put the top of it ~60" off the ground and the bottom ~32" off the ground, which I strongly suspect is verboten. I can draw pictures and show dimensions if that'd make things easier, but I have limited power and internet access right now because the old panel's already torn out, the power is off, and running the generator past around 9-10pm is a great way to piss off my neighbors. Grounding: I have an existing ground stake right below the panel, no idea how far down it goes or how good a ground it is. I also have a copper water supply line with a proper grounding cable running to it. I intend to make use of both of these as well as a pair of 10 foot copper plated ground rods I will be driving into the ground outside directly below a downspout to improve soil conductivity. Oh, one last thing. If I can't mount the ATS and breaker panel where I want to, is it permissible to use a large (say one of the 16x16 ones from Home Depot) junction box and the same bolt style lugs or split bolts (if aluminum-certified) to splice in another length of SEC cable so I can move things over to another wall, or should I plan on installing all new SEC from the meter base to the ATS? If the latter, I'm probably going to just say hell with it and drop in a 2-3" conduit run, new meter base, and new conduit+weatherhead where I want them, then have the power company move the service over to it when they come back to put the meter back in. The old setup is SEC stapled to the wall, which I don't believe is quite as weather/animal-proof as what I have in mind (at least, when it's properly done.) kastein fucked around with this message at 00:17 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 00:12
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I'm pretty sure codes are public record once adopted, so you should be able to find a current copy of the code and you should definitely double check all of this for yourself. The ATS needs the same workspace as all electrical equipment, because even if it's not regularly accessed, it still would need to be opened up for maintenance. So off the top of my head, you need a width of 30" or the width of the equipment, whichever is greater, and a depth of 36" in front of it. The panel will need the same space (the space can be shared between the two). Again off the top of my head, the equipment needs to be mounted with a max height of 6'6" to the top of the equipment. No inspector that I've encountered would be okay with stacking the ATS and panel vertically. For your grounding question, I'm confused about where the ATS exists in relation to your building service disconnect. Is the ATS between a main panel and a sub-panel? In that case, grounding is simple, you just bring grounding conductors with your feeders like you would to any switch. If the ATS is ahead of the building disconnect, it introduces all sorts of other questions that I can't answer off the top of my head. Make sure you look up any required signage you may need indicating you have multiple power sources feeding the building.
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Aug 10, 2013 01:10
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Good to know. I assume the width of 30" or the equipment, whichever is greater, is to be centered around the panel, AKA 15" from the center of the panel to each side? Yes, the ATS will be upstream of the main panel, I decided if I'm going to do this generator thing at all I should do a whole-house generator and stop loving around, since I'm redoing everything else at the same time basically. So I'm not sure where I bond the neutral and ground - my assumption is at the panel not the ATS, but I want to make sure before I do anything more. Complicating this all is that there is another wing to the basement to the left of the left plywood panel, and a door to the right. And the drat hinge is on the side toward the panel. Here, I might as well just draw it:  The ATS on the right, the breaker panel at the top. Or I can switch them. But I think the cramped corner and the 30" rule are probably going to nuke that since each panel will reduce the width I have available (already pretty drat close to the limit) by its depth, and I'll need to move the breaker panel elsewhere. Annoying, but not unexpected. If the panel(s) don't need to be centered in the 30" width (since each is less than 30" wide) I should be fine, unless the open door is considered an obstruction even when closed, if that makes sense. I expected the veto on the above/below mounting, it didn't even seem close to right. As for public record - I couldn't find anywhere to get it free. If anyone knows, I'm all ears.
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Aug 10, 2013 01:45
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Regarding a copy of the code book, I've used my local library to order it for short term use.
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Aug 10, 2013 01:49
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For the CBC I use this site but I'm not sure how much of the NEC is on there: https://bulk.resource.org/codes.gov/ Inspectors are usually pretty lenient about the width requirement, I don't think I've ever had one get upset about the panel being offset within that width. I agree that I would expect to still tie neutral and ground at the main panel. But it will be important to look carefully at the service requirements because meeting the circuit length requirements for having a building disconnecting means may be tricky with the ATS. You may have to mount a main breaker in an enclosure next to the ATS and then feed the panel from there.
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Aug 10, 2013 01:54
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It won't break my heart if I have to put in a 200A panel, upgrade my service, then run a 100A breaker to the ATS to a 100A panel for all the regular house stuff, and just drop outlets for my welder, future shop, machine tools, etc in the remainder of the 200A panel. If that's what it will take, I'll do it. In fact I've been planning this setup specifically because I will be able to change to that setup in the future without modifying any of the wiring downstream of the ATS when I do those upgrades. If I can offset within that space I *think* I can pull this off - ATS up near the top of the left/upper (in that drawing) wall and as far from the corner as possible, as high as I can get it without exceeding 6'6", then ~1-2 feet of cable or conduit and separate wires from the ATS to the main panel on the other wall, again as far as possible from the corner. I'll go looking for the codebook on that site and do some research, thanks. e: to clarify - What I have right now: ----> triplex cable ----> lovely weatherhead clamped onto a chunk of SEC running down the side of the house ----> meter base, caked heavily in water sealant dope ----> chunk of SEC running into the house ----> crappy old woefully undersized 100A main panel What I plan to install: (first version) ----> triplex cable ----> lovely weatherhead clamped onto a chunk of SEC running down the side of the house ----> meter base, caked heavily in water sealant dope ----> chunk of SEC running into the house ----> ATS ----> new 100A panel (when funds and time permit) ----> newly upgraded triplex cable ----> weatherhead on 2" or 3" conduit ----> new 200A rated meter base ----> 2 or 3" conduit into house ----> 200A panel, extra 100A dedicated to detached shop + 30 or 50 amp 220V welder outlet + possibly lathe/mill, etc. 100A breaker feeds ----> ATS ----> new 100A panel The latter requires a few hundred bucks (the electric company wouldn't give me an exact quote, but said around 750 bucks estimate) to have the service upgraded to 200A, which isn't in the cards right now. So I'm just upgrading what I can afford to now and trying to avoid painting myself into a corner or wasting money on stuff that'll need to be torn out when I eventually do it. I want the 100A subpanel for all the actual house stuff so that I can put it downstream of the ATS and not really worry about power outages. The shop stuff I can do without, and I'm worried with the amount of equipment I want to bring in eventually I'll overload a 100A panel, so going to a 200A one kinda makes sense to me. I may be overengineering this, but I have a very reasonable building inspector who lets me do almost anything (aside from asbestos pipe insulation removal and plumbing) myself as long as he likes the result, so it basically just costs me time and materials. I enjoy this and consider it a hobby so time doesn't really cost me anything. Almost everything I build is either to code or ridiculously overbuilt (he told me outright to stop wasting money when I said I'd be using 3/4" ply and 19" overlapped 30# felt on my roof) so so far, he's just shaken his head and wondered why I am building things to last forever and handle anything. kastein fucked around with this message at 02:13 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 02:00
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Papercut posted:For the CBC I use this site but I'm not sure how much of the NEC is on there: Also: http://archive.org/details/gov.law.nfpa.nec.2011 (See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Electrical_Code#Public_access_to_the_NEC. It sure took them long enough.) One Day Fish Sale fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 02:27
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Couple bits of code: * You need to put a service-rater breaker between the meter and the ATS. * The neutral must be bonded once, and only once in the system. If it's a 2-pole ATS, you'll need to float the neutral-ground bond in the generator and bond it ONLY at the ATS or main panel. (3-pole will switch the neutral.) * If you have an ATS, your generator is required to be sized for 100% of your loads. In other words, really big. If you have a reasonably sized generator, you can only have an MTS. * You need working space for the ATS and panel. It must be 36" deep and 30" wide. It doesn't matter if the 30" is centered on the panel or begins at the edge of it, so long as you have a 30" wide working space to get into it. grover fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 03:52
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Papercut posted:
404.8(A) All switches and circuit breakers used as switches shall be located so that they may be operated from a readily accessible place. They shall be installed so that the center of the grip of the operating handle of the switch or circuit breaker, when in its highest position, is not more than 2.0 m (6 ft 7 in) above the floor or working platform. the equipment can be as high as you want as long as the highest breaker is at 6'7" or below.
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Aug 10, 2013 04:33
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grover posted:Couple bits of code: To further complicate things, if your ATS doesn't switch the neutral (most residential don't), then the neutral-ground bond is inside your main panel, only. You're forever and ever completely forbidden from ever allowing your generator to run when there's ever any possibility at all in any possible way of energizing the utility, no matter how remotely. Usually, this means some kind of locking cam inside your ATS that only your utility company is allowed to have keys for. If power drops, it's up to them to unlock your ATS for you to get back on the grid; until then, you're pouring gas in your generator to keep your steaks chilled. If it doesn't, then you have one neutral-ground bond on the line side of your ATS (your meter base, or close to it), and another at your generator (at its main breaker, or close to it). This makes it likely that you'd at some point be allowed to attempt to reclose your main breaker onto utility service without their permission, as you would completely and totally lose all power to your facility while doing so. The 30x36" can share a corner. IN that case, it's 36x36", and nothing can intrude on that space. You'd have to physically prevent the door from swinging open into that area for it to be code-legal, and the face of the door panel at its closest approach couldn't intrude into either 30x36" area. The 6'7" is with the handle of the device in the on position, but your electrical inspector may say in the off position. Don't mount any handles higher than 6'6" and you should be fine. We like to aim for 60" to the top of the main breaker or 72" to the top of the panel can, as those both line up with final finish pretty well. Finally, the utility company probably "owns" in the "is responsible for" sense all the cable from the transformer to the meter base at your house. This depends on locality and utility company. In some places, if you upgrade your service to 200A, the utility is required to re-run 200A triplex out to their pole for you, assuming you got permits and their OK first. Sometimes the other end of this service ends at your weatherhead. According to the 2011 NEC, the service disconnecting means must be readily accessible. That means the utility's responsibility for their conductors must terminate someplace that doesn't require a ladder for you to get to, unless modified by your service contract. Sometimes your service contract specifies their responsibility ends at the triplex termination at your weatherhead, sometimes it's the bottom of your meter base, sometimes it's their responsibility to terminate to the top of your meter socket, provided your meter socket meets their mounting criteria. Try to find out. Calling the service division of your utility company sometimes works; finding one of their trucks on the side of the road and asking for their blue book (or whatever) works MUCH better. A lot of the time, what the office tells you they will bill for and what the service department is allowed to charge for are two different things.
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Aug 10, 2013 06:05
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Not sure if this is the right thread, but I'm planning wiring of a home network right now and need some ideas. There's really only one good place to put the patch panel, which is a room in the basement. Pulling cat6 to the rest of the basement seems pretty easy, but for the floor above, I think I want to pull the wires from the attic. I'm considering drilling holes for pipes through the floor and ceiling of a wardrobe on the main floor, and then run the cat6 cables to the attic through there. Since I want to wire up 14 cat6 outlets on the main floor, there will be quite a few cables though... Whats normally the recommended approach for running cat6 wires in two story houses?
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Aug 10, 2013 10:41
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babyeatingpsychopath posted:To further complicate things, if your ATS doesn't switch the neutral (most residential don't), then the neutral-ground bond is inside your main panel, only. You're forever and ever completely forbidden from ever allowing your generator to run when there's ever any possibility at all in any possible way of energizing the utility, no matter how remotely. Usually, this means some kind of locking cam inside your ATS that only your utility company is allowed to have keys for. If power drops, it's up to them to unlock your ATS for you to get back on the grid; until then, you're pouring gas in your generator to keep your steaks chilled. Also, the 3-position ATS is considered to be enough to prevent backfeed for the power company I work for. We have no such POCO locking cams here. EDIT: here we go. In this instance, they installed a service disconnect after the meter, and it is now the "main service disconnecting means". This may be code, whether it is or not, it is a great idea to have a disconnect switch outside, just be aware that it is not protected by a breaker and will take a considerable fault to be cleared by the power company! Translation: the door on this switch should be locked. DOUBLEEDIT: Or instead of a disconnect switch, install a panel with a service rated breaker as Grover also said - then everything downstream is protected from fault current. Anyhow, you can see that the neutral-ground bond is now located in the disconnect switch, and the earth ground is terminated there. The ground is unbonded in the ATS and everywhere else. 
angryrobots fucked around with this message at 16:10 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 15:49
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Buffis posted:Not sure if this is the right thread, but I'm planning wiring of a home network right now and need some ideas. Actually, sticking a conduit in the corner of a cabinet that goes from basement to attic wouldn't be a bad idea. Make sure you leave a pull string in there in case you want to run additional low-voltage through there in the future.
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Aug 10, 2013 16:13
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I guess conduit was the word I was looking for instead of "pipe". English is not my first language  Anyways, since I want to run quite a few cables (14+), would my best bet be to try to find a pretty wide conduit, or just run several of them? I think the most common ones in Sweden are 20mm wide or less.
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Aug 10, 2013 16:16
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Buffis posted:I guess conduit was the word I was looking for instead of "pipe". English is not my first language Using a random cat5 I have here, 14 cables requires a trade size 27mm (1") PVC conduit. I'd go with the largest size you can find, to be honest. angryrobots posted:EDIT: here we go. In this instance, they installed a service disconnect after the meter, and it is now the "main service disconnecting means". This may be code, whether it is or not, it is a great idea to have a disconnect switch outside, just be aware that it is not protected by a breaker and will take a considerable fault to be cleared by the power company! Translation: the door on this switch should be locked. DOUBLEEDIT: Or instead of a disconnect switch, install a panel with a service rated breaker as Grover also said - then everything downstream is protected from fault current. This is one manner of installation. If you can get a 3-pole ATS, it will switch the neutral as well, and then you get different bonding points because you have a separately-derived system now, not a tied one. It really comes down to your locality, inspector, and how you choose to install it. There's certainly more than one way to skin this cat.
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Aug 10, 2013 16:32
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Cat6 is even wider than cat5, so your pipe would need to be even wider than that. As for routing that conduit through 2 stories of your house, that may be the most annoying part. There are several types of conduit you could use. If your wiring path is perfectly straight, then you will probably want to use a nonflexible option like Electrical Metallic Tubing (EMT). The hard part about routing no flexible conduit though walls and floors is that you can't bend it, so you have to be a little more creative... For two stories, you will probably have to assemble that run in 3 pieces with 2 couplers, with each section of conduit shorter than the floor-to-ceiling height of your rooms. They do make clamps for conduit so it can rest on floors and not fall straight down to your basement floor.
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Aug 10, 2013 17:16
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He's in europe, so their conduit sizes and names are different. I'd imagine 30, 40 and 50mm flexible conduit are available for this type of use.babyeatingpsychopath posted:To further complicate things, if your ATS doesn't switch the neutral (most residential don't), then the neutral-ground bond is inside your main panel, only. You're forever and ever completely forbidden from ever allowing your generator to run when there's ever any possibility at all in any possible way of energizing the utility, no matter how remotely. Usually, this means some kind of locking cam inside your ATS that only your utility company is allowed to have keys for. If power drops, it's up to them to unlock your ATS for you to get back on the grid; until then, you're pouring gas in your generator to keep your steaks chilled. In this case, he'd have to have a service disconnect breaker right after the meter, which is where the neutral-ground bond should be. The only difference between a switched neutral and hardwired neutral is whether the generator has its own N-G bond. Code permits either method. My recommendation is to hook up the generator to a 2-pole breaker on the main panel with a sliding sheet-metal interlock to prevent both the generator and main breaker from being simultaneously closed; simple, as effective as an MTS, code-legal, and dirt cheap. grover fucked around with this message at 18:05 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 18:00
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grover posted:My recommendation is to hook up the generator to a 2-pole breaker on the main panel with a sliding sheet-metal interlock to prevent both the generator and main breaker from being simultaneously closed; simple, as effective as an MTS, code-legal, and dirt cheap. Please install a separate transfer switch, for the safety of the workers trying to restore your power.
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Aug 10, 2013 20:01
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angryrobots posted:If that's legal, it shouldn't be. Way too easy for the unknowing next owner of the house to remove the panel cover and bypass the interlock. Philosophically, better to have a safe legal way of cheaply hooking up a generator than driving idiots to suicide plugs in the dryer outlet, ya know? e: here's one Cutler Hammer sells: https://www.platt.com/CutSheets/Eaton/Generators-MechanicalInterlockCovers.pdf grover fucked around with this message at 20:21 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 20:15
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I completely get it, but I still can't bring myself to recommend that kind of setup. Your average idiot is way way too willing to play roulette with their own life when their power is out, and much more play with my life. I'd say that 1/10 outdoor panel boxes here are missing their inner cover. Local yokel "electrician" installs a new breaker for a shed or whatever, and the interior cover never gets reinstalled. In this case, the interlock is now gone. The kind of person who will use a suicide plug, isn't going to provide any sort of legal disconnect means at all. The electric code shouldn't be written to appease the lowest common denominator. angryrobots fucked around with this message at 22:40 on Aug 10, 2013 |
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Aug 10, 2013 22:36
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angryrobots posted:The kind of person who will use a suicide plug, isn't going to provide any sort of legal disconnect means at all. The electric code shouldn't be written to appease the lowest common denominator. I am laughing at this right now. You're right. It shouldn't be. But it is. It so very totally is. Shamefully. This "tie multiphase breaker handles together if they share a neutral" is done only to protect (largely) industrial and commercial maintenance workers (I hesitate to use the word electrician) from getting shocked/electrocuted. When this code rule was passed, the vast majority of professionals I talked to said "this will just make idiots think that turning off all the breakers means all the wires in the box are dead, and the'll get shocked some other way." grover posted:What kind of weird paranoid utility does poo poo like that for open transition ATSs? El Paso Electric. The number of "I'll upgrade your service for $500" panel replacements down there is amazing. I know a guy that made seriously good money machining 5-point security torx bits for removing EPE meters. He'd buy a 5mm hex key socket for $3 from harbor freight, machine the pattern into the end, and sell them to shade-tree electricians for $50. The whole area is seriously shady. The only way EPE would allow you to run a generator hooked to your main panel was with an ATS that switched all three poles, so that when you were on "your" power, there was no conductor in common with any of their conductors. Their net-metering solutions for micropower generation were even more draconian. I think that at $.09/kWH, they just didn't really feel the need to play ball with other power generators.
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Aug 11, 2013 20:59
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Huh. We just have the minimum seal on meterbases, unless they get caught stealing or the cover is broken. We have a major problem getting homeowners to upgrade their deteriorated panel, or rotten and falling down service pole. Sometimes it comes down to cutting then loose until it's fixed. I've repaired plenty of customer-owned equipment myself, because that's the only way it would ever get done. Also, the inspectors here will approve anything, it seems, and it is next to impossible to implement our own standards. Sometimes it seems like we bow down to our members, at the expense of their safety. Sounds about just as opposite of your experience as possible eh? angryrobots fucked around with this message at 23:55 on Aug 11, 2013 |
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Aug 11, 2013 23:51
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Question: is there an industry (electrician) standard way to indicate on wires that they're not live? I have a few romex cables dangling in my basement which have been disconnected at the source and I'd like to indicate they're safe somehow. Of course I'd always touch them with a tester to make sure they're not live before working on them regardless but it's more for when I have an electrician in to have a look at things he can tell at a glance that it's probably not live.
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Aug 12, 2013 00:21
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Put wirenuts on the ends of each individual wire and bundle the whole set together. He will still test it though.
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Aug 12, 2013 13:41
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insta posted:Put wirenuts on the ends of each individual wire and bundle the whole set together. He will still test it though. No kidding, any electrician worth his wire strippers will always test wires before working on them. The only way to show that wires are absolutely not live is to remove them. Still, nutting and bundling are usually pretty acceptable. Maybe leave a label on them saying "abandoned" along with their previous use and where the other end of that cable is.
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Aug 12, 2013 17:46
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So the guys that did my landscaping reconnected the electrical to my detached garage. Since they cut one of the pavers in the wrong spot the PVC pipe and connector into the garage are all cockeyed. I have one pic of what it looks like now and a Photoshop of what I'd like it to look like. How it looks like now:  Photoshop corrected:  The current transition piece; http://www.lowes.com/pd_75783-223-E...tion&facetInfo= I've dug around for a transition piece with the outlet on the bottom instead of the end but have not had any luck. Any suggestions?
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Aug 12, 2013 20:19
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tomapot posted:Any suggestions? Either learn to love it, or get your landscapers back out to fix the pavers. You're forgetting that there are cables inside that PVC and fitting. In order to swap out that PVC and fitting, you would need to flip the breaker to your garage, find the box inside where that UF transitions to NM, detach them, work that UF back out where it comes in the wall, pull that old conduit and fitting off the NM, put a new one on, then put everything back together. It would be seriously easier and faster to cut new pavers and shove the pipe over. If you're dead set on doing it the hard way, You won't find any single conduit bodies off the shelf for a double right angle. You might be able to get away with modifying a Arlington Anybody to work for your situation. Even if you do, I can't guarantee that the spacing of its double right angle would end up with the vertical piece as vertical as you'd like.
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Aug 12, 2013 21:03
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Electrician goons, I have a problem- we had a nice little thunder storm last night, and when I woke up, the power was out. Or so I thought. Only the power in the bedroom was out. Everywhere else was fine. The breaker is outside, so I ventured out and found the tripped switch, but when I flip it, nothing happens. There is a "TEST" button on the switch in question, and when I flip it ON, it flips back OFF with the slightest touch. (EDIT: After closer inspection, it looks like it's not entirely OFF but floating somewhere in the middle...) Now.. I should probably say that I was fiddling with this switch a bit longer than I should have. I know nothing of electrical stuff. All I knew was "Hey, this is off and it should be on." But now I've Googled a bit and saw that I was not doing the right thing by fiddling with the switch. Oops. So what do I need to do to get power back in the bedroom? Here is a photo of the switch, plus the full setup.  
New Leaf fucked around with this message at 12:22 on Aug 13, 2013 |
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Aug 13, 2013 12:20
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kid sinister posted:Either learn to love it, or get your landscapers back out to fix the pavers. You're forgetting that there are cables inside that PVC and fitting. In order to swap out that PVC and fitting, you would need to flip the breaker to your garage, find the box inside where that UF transitions to NM, detach them, work that UF back out where it comes in the wall, pull that old conduit and fitting off the NM, put a new one on, then put everything back together. Thanks for the advice, I have a Grainger in town the sells the Arlington Anybody I'll take a look at that.
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Aug 13, 2013 13:17
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Did you turn the breaker completely to the OFF position before you tried to turn it back ON? Once a breaker is tripped (in the floating position like you described) you usually need to turn it to OFF and then back ON. If it trips again after that, you have other problems.
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Aug 13, 2013 13:20
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Religious Man posted:Did you turn the breaker completely to the OFF position before you tried to turn it back ON? Once a breaker is tripped (in the floating position like you described) you usually need to turn it to OFF and then back ON. If it trips again after that, you have other problems. It has always been floating in the middle. I can try to force it into the Off position, but I was afraid of messing something up.
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Aug 13, 2013 14:09
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New Leaf posted:It has always been floating in the middle. I can try to force it into the Off position, but I was afraid of messing something up. This is standard procedure. Turn it to off, then to on.
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Aug 13, 2013 14:12
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Guy Axlerod posted:This is standard procedure. Turn it to off, then to on. Thanks, I'll try that when I get home. This is my first house, I'm more gadget-technical, not house-technical. I've never had to deal with things like this. Thanks again folks!
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Aug 13, 2013 14:22
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grover posted:Couple bits of code: Good to know. Guess I'm shopping for a service rated breaker. The ATS I have is 2-pole, and has the neutral bus isolated from ground, so it's clearly designed to work with the N-G bond in the service panel or service disconnect breaker, with an option to bond at the ATS using a wire of course. That's fine. The generator will be a 15kw, 18kw surge setup, I bought a generator head on eBay and will be combining it with my own motor. 15kw is less than my total load if I turned everyfuckingthing on at the same time, but there's no chance I'd have everything on while away anyways, and the ATS controller supports a few load shedding contactors that I can use if required. Also, since I'm building the generator myself, I can arrange for the neutral to be floated at the generator no problem. My only real worry is where the 36" deep space from one panel interferes with the 30" wide space from the other. crocodile posted:404.8(A) All switches and circuit breakers used as switches shall be located so that they may be operated from a readily accessible place. They shall be installed so that the center of the grip of the operating handle of the switch or circuit breaker, when in its highest position, is not more than 2.0 m (6 ft 7 in) above the floor or working platform. Excellent. That was my interpretation of the code as well when I read it Sunday night. babyeatingpsychopath posted:To further complicate things, if your ATS doesn't switch the neutral (most residential don't), then the neutral-ground bond is inside your main panel, only. You're forever and ever completely forbidden from ever allowing your generator to run when there's ever any possibility at all in any possible way of energizing the utility, no matter how remotely. Usually, this means some kind of locking cam inside your ATS that only your utility company is allowed to have keys for. If power drops, it's up to them to unlock your ATS for you to get back on the grid; until then, you're pouring gas in your generator to keep your steaks chilled. Ooof. This all sounds like I'm simply going to relocate the main panel to another wall and stop worrying about it. I am gonna hate working in that corner if I stuff everything in there anyways. As far as I remember from my discussion with the poco, their equipment ends at the end of the triplex drop from the pole. They made no mention of any sort of locking devices or anything when I mentioned an ATS. That was a few years back now though, I should probably call them again. Wish I'd realized power cos were paranoid about some chucklefuck backfeeding the neutral, I would have just bought a 3 pole ATS in the first place. How the hell do you gently caress up so bad that the neutral gets backfed with line voltage? tomapot posted:So the guys that did my landscaping reconnected the electrical to my detached garage. Since they cut one of the pavers in the wrong spot the PVC pipe and connector into the garage are all cockeyed. I have one pic of what it looks like now and a Photoshop of what I'd like it to look like. I recommend a large potted plant.
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Aug 13, 2013 15:52
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