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Smeef posted:I went ahead and booked Flip-flop for a week. It's clean and easy and was the closest to the university. Ah, it's owned by Mix. Must be a new one, I don't remember it! They're good so it should be fine.
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Sep 3, 2013 06:39
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So white people. I'd like to learn some characters for a baseline if I move to somewhere that uses them. I'm not sure where though. China, HK, or Japan are all possible. So is it easier to learn traditional and figure out simplified or vice versa? I know the answer is learn the one for where you are going but I don't know. Also, I can learn hanja while I keep up with Korean studies here, those are traditional characters. I'm leaning that way since I need to keep working on Korean and that was I can do both, but looking for input from people who actually know things.
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Sep 3, 2013 06:40
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Heartbroken to see that the goon wechat group is full. 
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Sep 3, 2013 07:04
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Grand Fromage posted:So white people. I'd like to learn some characters for a baseline if I move to somewhere that uses them. I'm not sure where though. China, HK, or Japan are all possible. So is it easier to learn traditional and figure out simplified or vice versa? I know the answer is learn the one for where you are going but I don't know. Also, I can learn hanja while I keep up with Korean studies here, those are traditional characters. I'm leaning that way since I need to keep working on Korean and that was I can do both, but looking for input from people who actually know things. Start with traditional and simplified should be much easier for you.
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Sep 3, 2013 07:05
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It doesn't matter which set you start with so just do traditional since that's around you in Korea.
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Sep 3, 2013 07:11
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The Worst Muslim posted:Start with traditional and simplified should be much easier for you. Alternately, start with simplified and traditional will be much easier.
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Sep 3, 2013 07:19
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Grand Fromage posted:So white people. I'd like to learn some characters for a baseline if I move to somewhere that uses them. I'm not sure where though. China, HK, or Japan are all possible. So is it easier to learn traditional and figure out simplified or vice versa? I know the answer is learn the one for where you are going but I don't know. Also, I can learn hanja while I keep up with Korean studies here, those are traditional characters. I'm leaning that way since I need to keep working on Korean and that was I can do both, but looking for input from people who actually know things. I went Japanese first, with some traditional/Korean later, then simplified, and then seeing traditional all over the place in Hong Kong. It's mostly pretty easy to figure out what you're looking at from one to the other. Sometimes simplified can be pretty counterintuitive, and not every radical or other component gets simplified the same way every time (especially if you're comparing rare vs. common characters), which is what makes simplified less simple than it seems like it should be. But context usually solves those problems. I'd say it's probably easier to go from simplified to traditional...IF you've got some exposure to traditional first. That is...you have seen enough traditional to know how they're supposed to look, but you never really studied them; while you DID study simplified. If you don't, I dunno, probably not. I have known mainlanders who couldn't figure out traditional characters that I recognized. Hanja are almost entirely identical to traditional Chinese. I'd say just go with that, if you're studying Korean anyway. Going between Chinese character sets any way is easier than picking them up to begin with.
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Sep 3, 2013 07:20
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This is purely anecdotal but in my experience mainland students get the hang of traditional quicker than HK students get the hang of simplified. Probably has something to do with past exposure though. I teach texts of both persuasions to students from both backgrounds. Go simplified, give it thirty years and it's all anyone will be using in HK at least anyway.
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Sep 3, 2013 07:31
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Rabelais D posted:This is purely anecdotal but in my experience mainland students get the hang of traditional quicker than HK students get the hang of simplified. Probably has something to do with past exposure though. But traditional will be closer to the language of GLORIOUS NIPPON if he wants to go jack himself into oblivion.
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Sep 3, 2013 08:01
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I don't want my sacred language to be harmonized  Actually, that doesn't sound too bad because I hate pretentious jerks who use English words fake sophistication  I do like to make fun of crippled/tragic characters but it really doesn't matter so much. Like Bloodnose said, if you are in Korea and everything is in traditional then go work on that (except tourist signs, it's all in simplified  ). Regardless of whatever you learn, your proficiency is not static and you will eventually blend in to your environment. Most people don't get beyond a few basic phrases. Magna started learning traditional in Taiwan and maxed out on his HSK level 6. He even wrote an amazing paper in Chinese, but nowadays he is turning into a Chinese country bumpkin faux-hipster. Rabelais and Bloodnose were decent but spending time in HK atrophied their putonghua. MeramJert refuses to speak with me in Mandarin Actually no one really wants to  Except Argle, he can carry a conversation with MY GIRLFRIEND about current issues and higher level topics  I'm just bitter that I write Chinglish all the time.Just focus on listening skills, basic vocab, forming sentences. Sure it's fun to argue but most laowai's (and Hongers) speak poo poo Mandarin or give up too soon. You do enough Chinese cooking so I'm sure you already recognize Beef/Pork/Chicken/Fish. Recipe book proficiency 
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Sep 3, 2013 08:05
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Smeef posted:Heartbroken to see that the goon wechat group is full. We made a new goon room, message me caberham for invite
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Sep 3, 2013 08:21
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Copypaste from the Chinese Language Thread:quote:This is a pretty big question, especially if you're starting out. Which set to learn?! Well, the answer is easy: both! I'm thinking about getting to a conversational level (which I guess is HSK4?) so at least I can tell people to do things other than 肏你妈. Unfortunately the self-study part of the thread is empty 
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Sep 3, 2013 08:34
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If your goal is to become "conversational" then you probably shouldn't bother with the HSK at all.
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Sep 3, 2013 09:16
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Listen buddy, the more three letter acronyms I can slap on my resume, the bigger my ego.
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Sep 3, 2013 09:45
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Basically my idea was I can keep working on Korean vocab since I live here and it is thus useful, but if I learn hanja too then I can at least understand in writing and have a leg up if I move elsewhere. So I suppose I will stick to that plan.
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Sep 3, 2013 11:21
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Jeoh posted:Listen buddy, the more three letter acronyms I can slap on my resume, the bigger my ego. It's true all the ones that can increase your paycheck are 4+ letters. Just like the AAAAAA rated stuff on all the advertisements!
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Sep 3, 2013 11:27
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Grand Fromage posted:Basically my idea was I can keep working on Korean vocab since I live here and it is thus useful, but if I learn hanja too then I can at least understand in writing and have a leg up if I move elsewhere. So I suppose I will stick to that plan. Hanja will help you understand the Korean vocab better, too. I did well in my Korean classes with less work than my classmates because my Japanese let me (once I noticed the patterns in correlations between pronunciations) group words together by their hanja rather than just their pronunciation. I think I was driving some of my teachers a little nuts with always asking for the Hanja. Two of them hardly knew any, due to being of the generation where they weren't taught in school. (Two others used to teach Japanese, so they could Hanja circles around me.)
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Sep 3, 2013 11:35
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I was hoping it'd help me remember, I don't have a lot of trouble with Korean grammar but the words still all sound like the same long string of vowels to me even though I'm getting on three years here. I have a hell of a time remembering vocabulary. My kingdom for a consonant.
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Sep 3, 2013 13:41
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Grand Fromage posted:My kingdom for a consonant. And you wanna learn Chinese?
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Sep 3, 2013 14:45
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Moving to China is a realistic possibility, so I won't really have a choice. For now just written is all I'm going to work on. Chinese is also more interesting/useful than Korean so I'd be more motivated.
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Sep 3, 2013 15:03
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Jeoh posted:Listen buddy, the more three letter acronyms I can slap on my resume, the bigger my ego. You should make sure to put ISO9000, ISO9001 on there for good measure.
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Sep 3, 2013 15:48
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I'm in my second day of Chinese class and am already drowning in traditional characters. Almost everyone in the class had studied them as a kid and/or are Japanese, so they're all quickly taking notes in Chinese while me and my Thai buddy are just scribbling down the pinyin.
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Sep 3, 2013 16:46
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Hi there guys! I'm going back to China this year around the end of November but this will be my first time in Beijing. Someone suggested me this hostel: http://www.citytelinnhotelbeijing.cn/ Has anyone had any experience with it? Or do you have better suggestions? Also, I want to go see the great wall since it will most likely be my last opportunity to be in China for a while and I've never been. What is the best way to proceed? I've heard friends that feel like they got kind of ripped off so I'd be happy to hear about any tips/experiences. And finally, I'm going to Shanghai (and Kunshan) for work afterwards, is the bullet train a great option? Thanks!
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Sep 3, 2013 20:36
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Book a tour through a hostel and go to Mutianyu. Do not go to Badaling. I stay at Saga Youth International Hostel when I go to Beijing. It's not bad, and convenient, not far from the tube.
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Sep 4, 2013 01:43
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Simatai is a lot more fun than Mutianyu and way less crowded and a lot cooler. There's some pretty nice and cheap hotels nearby too so you can stay the night. The next morning at dawn, I went up and davened at the Great Wall. It was pretty great!  edit: that Wikipedia says it was closed in 2010. Is it still closed? That sucks. I was there in the fall of 2009.
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Sep 4, 2013 02:59
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Mutianyu is good if you don't want to make it a two day thing. There was barely anyone there when I went and nobody was watching, so you could get out to the less bullshit parts of the wall. Really as long as you don't go to Badaling you're making a good decision.
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Sep 4, 2013 03:01
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OK, so it is all happening and I will be in Shanghai in a couple of weeks. I posted this in the LAN thread but figured here's the more appropriate spot for it. On top of the cool touristy, cultural, technological, etc sights and places to visit, are there any other cool spots in Shanghai that you guys can recommend? It's looking like I will most likely be there for the duration of the 7 day holiday in early October, and while I was originally going to try fly to Hainan for a few days of surfing, the horrible cost of flights and the holidaymaker crowds have put me off. So on my Shanghai list so far is (thanks bad day and the other goons here and in the LAN thread):
Any other suggestions? I don't only mean touristy stuff at all - anything you guys have experienced that is awesome, I'll check it out. Unless it's creepy, because then I won't.
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Sep 4, 2013 15:43
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I'd go hit the lobby lounge of the Grand Hyatt in the Jinmao tower. They have live music in the afternoons and early evenings. The view to the top of the hotel is vertigo inducing. If you have time, the view from the Cloud 9 bar is pretty impressive. (I think there is a 100 rmb drink minimum per person in Cloud 9)
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Sep 4, 2013 17:04
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If you want to get that good old post apocalyptic feel you might take some sort of sunset boat ride/tour around the river/harbor. ChingMing Island is largest alluvial island in the world and is close by if you decide you want to get out of town briefly. You might check that out and it might not be utterly impossible during a holiday. I have never done that on a holiday. Taking boats places used to be a way to minimize the insane press of people, including boats between HK and Shanghai and such if you have time. You could also go inland this way. Don't know how much this is still a thing. Be sure to check out different times of day, particularly the very early crack of dawn morning.
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Sep 4, 2013 17:33
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BadAstronaut posted:OK, so it is all happening and I will be in Shanghai in a couple of weeks. I posted this in the LAN thread but figured here's the more appropriate spot for it. On top of the cool touristy, cultural, technological, etc sights and places to visit, are there any other cool spots in Shanghai that you guys can recommend? I'd say go to Xitang and enjoy a slice of (fully commercialised) 'old town China'. It's totally the Venice of the East. Alongside a billion other water towns. But because it's holiday time it will be mobbed and therefore unbearable. Instead enjoy your time in a city that is 90 odd years past its heyday and that has surprisingly little to see or do for such a large place. Hey, at least it's not Shenzhen!
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Sep 4, 2013 17:43
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I plan to fly to Shanghai around the 27/28th September to visit my parents and do some tourist stuff and am currently lost in the visa jungle. I'm from Austria, getting a tourist visa usually takes 5 days around here, but this is where the complication starts. My parents reside in Shanghai since 2 years and my father in law works as manager for a large German corp. So the first thing is that there are 2 different visa types, one for tourists and a separate one for visiting foreign relatives. If you apply for the latter then you need to hand in a ton of documents, including a marriage certificate of your parents to proof your relationship - +5 extra difficulty if one parent is your in-law and you have a different last name (plus I'm not adopted legally, since we never cared about that). Gonna try to reach someone at the embassy tomorrow and see if a regular tourist visa plus a letter of invitation is not enough.
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Sep 4, 2013 21:59
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Here's what you do: Get a tourist visa. Book a hotel and cancel it when you get your visa. When you arrive in China, go to the local PSB with two passport-sized photos, a copy of your ID and a copy of the ID of the person living there (you also bring this person) to register as a laowai tourist. Don't get the 'visiting relatives' visa, it's a big headache. You might be able to skip the registration but it just takes a few minutes and lets you experience Chinese bureaucracy!
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Sep 4, 2013 22:04
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Jeoh posted:Here's what you do: Get a tourist visa. Book a hotel and cancel it when you get your visa. When you arrive in China, go to the local PSB with two passport-sized photos, a copy of your ID and a copy of the ID of the person living there (you also bring this person) to register as a laowai tourist. Thanks for the tip. I was planning to apply for a tourist visa directly and give a letter of invitation to the embassy instead of the hotel reservation. But I'm kinda scared that they might freak out if I try to bypass parts of their almighty bureaucracy and could immediately black list me for trying to take the easy way. On the other hand I feel kinda safer if I settle this in my own county before having to answer questions about why I cancelled my hotel once I'm there. Sure takes a lot of  to sip martinis at a Shanghai sky bar and visit some museums.Also: is the seaquarium any good ? The pics on the internet look nice.
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Sep 4, 2013 22:21
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Hammerstein posted:Thanks for the tip. Just get the tourist visa, otherwise you'll just cause more headache for yourself. Don't do the letter thing if you don't have to. Just make a hotel reservation and cancel it later. They don't care and won't know if you cancel it. Then go register at the PSB and stay at your parents' place like you planned. Do what Jeoh said. If you decide to go to other cities or whatever as long as you stay in a hotel/hostel you won't need to register at the PSB. Those "visiting relatives" visas are probably more meant for those Chinese who no longer posses PRC citizenship with family still in China. SB35 fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Sep 4, 2013 |
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Sep 4, 2013 22:32
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BadAstronaut posted:OK, so it is all happening and I will be in Shanghai in a couple of weeks. I posted this in the LAN thread but figured here's the more appropriate spot for it. On top of the cool touristy, cultural, technological, etc sights and places to visit, are there any other cool spots in Shanghai that you guys can recommend? It's looking like I will most likely be there for the duration of the 7 day holiday in early October, and while I was originally going to try fly to Hainan for a few days of surfing, the horrible cost of flights and the holidaymaker crowds have put me off. If you're interested with computer gaming and you're there around november I'll be working at http://www.wcg.com/renew/index.asp in Kunshan (1hr away from Shanghai)... It's a fun place to attend, the city itself is pretty meh tho!
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Sep 4, 2013 23:06
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When you register, don't forget to have a photocopy of: the page of your passport with all your info on it your visa the page of your passport with your most recent entrance stamp into China You'll also probably need some proof of your parents address, a photocopy of their lease will probably work. You also might need a copy of your parents' landlords ID card.
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Sep 5, 2013 00:46
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Unless you're in Henan, in which case you need none of these things - because the police don't really know what is going on. There's a new, much simplified registration form on the go by the way. If, for any reason, anyone wants a digital copy then I suppose I could email it to you: PM me.
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Sep 5, 2013 01:24
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Rabelais D posted:I'd say go to Xitang and enjoy a slice of (fully commercialised) 'old town China'. It's totally the Venice of the East. Alongside a billion other water towns. My favorite Venice of the East is Tai O on Hong Kong's Lantau Island. I went there expecting to see something like the water towns of mainland China. I got there and it's literally a shanty town with all the stilt houses made out of tin and aluminum: 
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Sep 5, 2013 02:59
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Yeah, Tai O is really awesome, if a little bit depressing. The whole place stinks to high heaven of dried fish.
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Sep 5, 2013 03:50
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Spent an entire day in tai o, loved it
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Sep 5, 2013 05:36
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