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ThomasPaine posted:I'm sure you can reform the Roman Empire in EU4? There's an achievement for doing it, at least. That achievement is given for getting all your cores back as Byzantium. You don't actually form the Roman Empire, which is normally only playable by converting a CK2 save. Edit: Woops. Not cores, but all the Greek provinces, Albania, and Bulgaria. Liberatore fucked around with this message at 23:55 on Sep 17, 2013 |
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Sep 17, 2013 23:44
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PleasingFungus posted:
Ah, fair enough. Seems odd that they didn't stick a decision to formally restore the empire in there though, given their fanbase (and, I guess, it wouldn't be entirely unthinkable historically).
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Sep 17, 2013 23:49
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PleasingFungus posted:It's for, as the Byzantines, reconquering the territories the original Roman Empire held. There isn't a decision to 'become rome' and swap tags/colors/ideas when and if you do so, though, which is what the poster you were quoting was complaining about a lack of. Honestly I like playing the Byzantines because there really isn't a underdog that has a clearly-defined path to become a world power quite like it.
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Sep 17, 2013 23:54
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Autonomous Monster posted:• Antarctica DLC for all games when ten million people live there. I am going to hold you to this, Paradox.  quote:• Sengoku failed because not enough people knew enough about Japanese history to add texture to the game. Well, honestly son, the game should be adding its own texture regardless of what the player is bringing to the table. quote:(seriously it's a bad game and a really, really, deathly boring period of history)
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Sep 18, 2013 00:09
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Wolfgang Pauli posted:Time to put Plan Kim Stanley Robinson into action Maybe something based on the Victoria POP system? Western Roman empire falls due to governing party refusing to encourage German POPs to assimilate, etc.
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Sep 18, 2013 00:51
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Wolfgang Pauli posted:Don't they mean the team here, not the players? Shogun was guilty of the same thing. Like I said upthread, I definitely interpreted the statement as referring to the players. But I fully admit that I could be wrong- Johan (bless his heart) is not the clearest speaker and my hearing is not the best. Wolfgang Pauli posted:Antiquity deathly boring if you're not willing to invest the time to do justice to each nation. There's simply no way of generalizing a system of government out of this period. It's also boring since Paradox will never ever figure out migrations. Really, I think it's just a personal quirk of mine. Something about spending so much time with the Romans in school, it all just seems incredibly sterile to me. Though, the period where the one empire did blob all over Europe does not seem to me terribly conducive to a dynamic geopolitical climate. Rincewind posted:Maybe something based on the Victoria POP system? Western Roman empire falls due to governing party refusing to encourage German POPs to assimilate, etc. Ahahaha. That sounds like something out of Peter Heather's book. I think I favour the Wickham model; less a collapse and more of a radical decentralisation brought about by a perfect storm of overstretch, economic instability and various domestic and foreign threats.
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Sep 18, 2013 01:23
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EU: Rome is boring because it's set during a period that doesn't really work for that style of gameplay. The fall of the Roman Empire would be a lot more fun than the rise, play as various factions in the city or as client kingdoms biding their time to declare independence could be a great game. Basically I want Alea Jacta Est as designed by not-AGEOD.
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Sep 18, 2013 01:30
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Autonomous Monster posted:Like I said upthread, I definitely interpreted the statement as referring to the players. But I fully admit that I could be wrong- Johan (bless his heart) is not the clearest speaker and my hearing is not the best. Yeah, I was being kind of flip there.  I do feel like any effort to make a Rome game would be better off trying to narrow its focus onto a specific part of Roman history-- ideally one where things weren't going so well and everything was in flux. The last years of the Western Empire would work. So would the Crisis of the Third Century, or the civil wars at the end of the Republic. The game could focus exclusively on the systems within the empire (or Republic) in that particular, instead of having the empire as a whole be just one playable faction among many, or try to model the Roman Republic's conquest of Italy, encirclement of the Mediterranean, transition into the Principate, the Antonine Golden Age, the crisis years, the Dominate, etc., etc. in one huge game.
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Sep 18, 2013 01:43
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Kheldragar posted:I was wondering why not have a game that spans from the time of the ancient Egyptions to 2050, but then I realised that it's too long a span, and would rapidly spiral into an alternate history. All of the scenarious would be fun to try, though. I'd like to play as the Romans. I was planning on doing an LP of a "Mega-campaign" starting from the earliest CKII mod date and working my way to Victoria II (if I finally learn how to play HoI by the time I reach there then I'll continue). Problem is people keep making earlier and earlier start dates. 
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Sep 18, 2013 02:46
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I think a game set in ancient Mesopotamia would be neat. One of the the bookmarked dates can be a huge coalition of ancient nations destroying Assyria 
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Sep 18, 2013 03:01
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Agean90 posted:I think a game set in ancient Mesopotamia would be neat. One of the the bookmarked dates can be a huge coalition of ancient nations destroying Assyria Nahum 3:18-19 posted:King of Assyria, your shepherds slumber; your nobles lie down to rest. Your people are scattered on the mountains with no one to gather them. Nothing can heal you; your wound is fatal. All who hear the news about you clap their hands at your fall, for who has not felt your endless cruelty? I love how smug Nahum is about gloating about the destruction of Nineveh and the end of the Assyrian Empire.
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Sep 18, 2013 03:48
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I don't understand a single person who characterizes the period of the rise of the Roman Empire as boring? The Punic Wars? The battles between the successor kingdoms? The invasion of Gaul? Don't mistake the game Rome being boring for the time period.
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Sep 18, 2013 03:53
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So, EvW is having a very special Beta test for those interested. I wanta be a Fox!
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Sep 18, 2013 04:18
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What do they define as a "narrow focus game"?
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Sep 18, 2013 05:10
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:What do they define as a "narrow focus game"? I think they're talking about stuff like Sengoku and March of the Eagles, which just focus on a few decades and nearly entirely on war.
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Sep 18, 2013 05:20
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I hope HoI isn't considered too narrow then.
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Sep 18, 2013 05:23
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Rincewind posted:Maybe something based on the Victoria POP system? Western Roman empire falls due to governing party refusing to encourage German POPs to assimilate, etc. Though what I was referring to were the radical differences between the Roman and Carthaginian republics, how Athenian democracy never looked anything like that, and how satrapies and Hellenic successors were nothing like vassalage relationships. It'd be neat if you could play through the mechanics of the Roman Senate/Assembly/religious government and tag over to Carthage and deal with the Hundred and Four and the shifting structures of power, or start a game hundreds of years earlier and deal with the Athenian agora. But you'd need to model a different government for each nation. Antiquity was way more diverse than practically any later period. Though I guess a POP system would be kind of a good way to represent Greco-Bactrians and Indo-Greeks.
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Sep 18, 2013 05:35
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:I hope HoI isn't considered too narrow then. God no, I bet once they get HOI4 out with their increased visibility, it'd sell way more than either CK2 or EU4. Really though I would love a space game... Or a fantasy game, even, with paradox mechanics.
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Sep 18, 2013 05:38
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:I hope HoI isn't considered too narrow then. It's reportedly their best-selling series, so... probably not.
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Sep 18, 2013 05:43
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Gorgo Primus posted:So, EvW is having a very special Beta test for those interested. I wanta be a Fox! quote:Prepare yourselves to take command in a time when all mankind shudders, chilled and poised to endure the final matching of bomb against bomb - a world could vanish in a sudden flare, doomed to eternal shadow. 
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Sep 18, 2013 06:32
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I really, really want EVW to be good, since a Paradox Cold War game would be the raddest thing ever, but I know it's going to be absolute poo poo. 
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Sep 18, 2013 06:40
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Rincewind posted:I do feel like any effort to make a Rome game would be better off trying to narrow its focus onto a specific part of Roman history-- ideally one where things weren't going so well and everything was in flux. The last years of the Western Empire would work. So would the Crisis of the Third Century, or the civil wars at the end of the Republic. The game could focus exclusively on the systems within the empire (or Republic) in that particular, instead of having the empire as a whole be just one playable faction among many, or try to model the Roman Republic's conquest of Italy, encirclement of the Mediterranean, transition into the Principate, the Antonine Golden Age, the crisis years, the Dominate, etc., etc. in one huge game. The problem is that if when you have a narrow focus you lose half the appeal of paradox games which is people going "well gently caress you history this time around its the ____'s time to shine."
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Sep 18, 2013 07:23
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uPen posted:EU: Rome is boring because it's set during a period that doesn't really work for that style of gameplay. The fall of the Roman Empire would be a lot more fun than the rise, play as various factions in the city or as client kingdoms biding their time to declare independence could be a great game. American Civil War as designed by not-AGEOD, even as a really big March of the Eagles DLC/expansion pack, would be great as well.
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Sep 18, 2013 09:12
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Wolfgang Pauli posted:Nothing changed when the Western Empire was ceded to the Germans, though. The Germans came in, replaced the Romans, and succeeded in emulating them for two centuries. They didn't want to destroy Rome, they wanted to take it over and keep the wheels turning. They wanted to be the benefactors of business as usual. Rome "fell" in 476 and nothing changed until the 600s-700s, when trade collapsed and the intense regional specialization that had evolved in the Empire hosed over everyone. The Western Emperor had basically been a puppet of the Germans for generations before it was handed over to Odoacer. It's ~~complex~~. Aaah, I think you go too far. The shift from tax-raising states with salaried armies to military service in return for land holding was a fairly radical shift in how the state was organised and in its capacity to act, and it happened almost immediately everywhere outside of Italy. And I now totally understand why Beamed thought you were me, the resemblance is uncanny.
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Sep 18, 2013 11:44
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What is the carnival of lust that the thread title refers to? Google had nothing.
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Sep 19, 2013 16:45
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Rapner posted:What is the carnival of lust that the thread title refers to? Google had nothing. http://www.world-stage.net/GameInfo/DeveloperDiary14.aspx
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Sep 19, 2013 16:47
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Goddamn, I haven't noticed this part before:quote:This story was inspired by the absolutely brilliant group Poets of the Fall, more specifically the song called: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKk1u5RMTn4"]CARNIVAL OF RUST. Listen to the music, drink the lyrics and marvell ate the videoclip. Then, you too can start to write metaphores...
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Sep 19, 2013 16:51
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fspades posted:Goddamn, I haven't noticed this part before: The gift that keeps on giving. Is World Stage still pushing for release, or is it dead for good?
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Sep 19, 2013 18:06
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dublish posted:The gift that keeps on giving. World Stage is already out, it's the game Paradox stole and relabeled Europa Universalis IV.
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Sep 19, 2013 18:47
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Fall Sick and Die posted:I don't understand a single person who characterizes the period of the rise of the Roman Empire as boring? The Punic Wars? The battles between the successor kingdoms? The invasion of Gaul? Don't mistake the game Rome being boring for the time period. It's interesting as poo poo, but you can't effectively model any of that in the existing Clausewitz engine.
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Sep 19, 2013 19:12
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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dublish posted:The gift that keeps on giving. I dunno, but the fact that the World Stage page is still up and hasn't been legally nuked in six months makes me wonder if Ubik really did have some contract loophole with Paradox. Or maybe they're just waiting for him to try a 'release', and don't care about the demo page.
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Sep 19, 2013 19:19
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Or they're enjoying the circus as much as we are.
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Sep 19, 2013 19:34
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RagnarokAngel posted:Or they're enjoying the circus as much as we are. Probably. And they can't say anything about it either I'm sure, which must be hard.
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Sep 19, 2013 21:17
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Rapner posted:What is the carnival of lust that the thread title refers to? Google had nothing. If you actually put 'Carnival of Lust' into Google you are a braver man than I. That could bring up anything.
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Sep 20, 2013 01:32
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Autonomous Monster posted:Aaah, I think you go too far. The shift from tax-raising states with salaried armies to military service in return for land holding was a fairly radical shift in how the state was organised and in its capacity to act, and it happened almost immediately everywhere outside of Italy. Oh yeah, I asked like a year ago, didn't I? Anyway, going to add another vote to an Ancient Mesopotamia Paradox game.
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Sep 20, 2013 02:09
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Autonomous Monster posted:Whenever this has come up previously, the answer has always been: Balkan nationalists. Or, to expound: modern history is highly contentious because it's still going on and people feel very strongly about it. We don't have the distance to take a properly historical perspective on it, and they don't want to deal with the enormous shitstorm that would inevitably descend on them were they to attempt to model something like the breakup of Yugoslavia. book: Lies My Teacher Told Me posted:... Consider how we read an account of an event we lived through, especially one in which we ourselves took part, whether a sporting event or the Iraq War. We read partly in a spirit of criticism, assessing what the author got wrong as well as agreeing with and perhaps learning from what they got right. When we study the more distant past, we may also read critically, but now our primary mode is ingestive. Especially if we are reading for the first time about an event, we have little ground of which to stand and criticize what we read.
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Sep 20, 2013 04:49
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Wolfgang Pauli posted:Don't they mean the team here, not the players? Shogun was guilty of the same thing. The problem with the the Sengoku Jidai is that it only goes so far as a setting. It's really great for a Total War game, since it presents a lot of cool fighting and a bunch of fairly balanced factions, any of whom could have historically come out on top; but if you go for a Paradox angle, where you don't fight the battles and war isn't such a focus, well, it's really just Japan vs. Different Japan. It loses its novelty fast. So the Nobunaga came out on top this time, whoop-de-poo poo. Not quite as interesting as Burgundy Florida, Ottoman Quebec, and Papal States Brazil, is it?
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Sep 20, 2013 07:09
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I am angry about Kaiserreich, but I think a large part of that is Europa Engine limitations. Are events purely limited by country in the Europa Engine? I decided to try out Syndicalist Ireland (and had pretty much zero events), so at the start I used 'freedom' and moved everything over. Of course, when the International came around I was ignored. When Syndicalist revolutions happened, I couldn't send aid like the big boys, France refused to let me into their alliance ('acceptall', assholes), and I ended up quitting when Ulster revolted and I couldn't put them down because I was trying to build IC (I guess I'm not good at the game). I'm not quite certain how combat works, my 1 group of 1921 infantry lost to their 1 group of 1918 militia, and their other group of 1 1918 militia won against my 2 groups of whatever the gently caress garrisons (after the battle was going in my favour for a long rear end time). One thing I don't think is a Europa Engine issue is every loving event notice popping up. If any significant event happens, I get two dozen popups telling me what every single country in the world selected. I don't remember that being an issue in previous versions.
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Sep 20, 2013 07:48
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catlord posted:I am angry about Kaiserreich, but I think a large part of that is Europa Engine limitations. Are events purely limited by country in the Europa Engine? I decided to try out Syndicalist Ireland (and had pretty much zero events), so at the start I used 'freedom' and moved everything over. Of course, when the International came around I was ignored. When Syndicalist revolutions happened, I couldn't send aid like the big boys, France refused to let me into their alliance ('acceptall', assholes), and I ended up quitting when Ulster revolted and I couldn't put them down because I was trying to build IC (I guess I'm not good at the game). I'm not quite certain how combat works, my 1 group of 1921 infantry lost to their 1 group of 1918 militia, and their other group of 1 1918 militia won against my 2 groups of whatever the gently caress garrisons (after the battle was going in my favour for a long rear end time). HOI2 is not a game for playing small countries. The game only spans about 10 years, there's no time to go from a backwater to a country that's able to project force onto mainland Europe. France denied your entry to their alliance because you would be invaded by a larger power and they would have to bail you out because you're so weak you would be completely unable to defend your shores. How would Ireland send aid to Russian revolutionaries trying to take over Russia? If anything you'd be the one receiving economic aid from France or Britain. As for messages they're modifiable like they are in every other Paradox game. The first thing I do every time I launch a new installation of a Paradox game is go into message settings and change basically everything.
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Sep 20, 2013 07:56
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uPen posted:snip All fair enough points, I suppose. I guess I'm trying to play it like other Paradox games? I keep on wishing there was more internal politics. Although if they announce HoI4 and the trailer is just "Darkest Hour in Clauswitz with some UI bits from more recent games" I'll be going through my neighbours couches for change. Paradox broke me, I think.
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Sep 20, 2013 09:07
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