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I lusted after the srt8 magnum...till I drove one. I like trucks, but I don't have any use for a car that drives like a truck, with terrible viability. And despite being both dimensionally bigger and heavier than my 850, it felt more cramped inside.
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Sep 21, 2013 21:16
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toplitzin posted:What about the SRT8 version of the Magnum? Not sure what the question is but i'd venture their MPG is at least 10% worse than an IS300 because their motor is 100+% bigger.  angryrobots posted:And despite being both dimensionally bigger and heavier than my 850, it felt more cramped inside. I still like Magnums but i admit they are not 'box' wagons so they're not nearly as biased towards utility as a 90s volvo. They're not the kind of thing you go around telling stories about how you hauled your fridge home IN it. I assume since OP is considering an is300 sportcross that he's not stuck on box wagons necessarily. As for the truck thing, meh, disagree. I mean, it can tow as much as a truck (you can't fit an Airstream in an 850 but you can tow it with a Magnum).. that's all i saw in my 4 years of ownership and all the trucks i drove at work. 
Vigo327 fucked around with this message at 04:58 on Sep 22, 2013 |
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Sep 22, 2013 04:46
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angryrobots posted:I lusted after the srt8 magnum...till I drove one. I like trucks, but I don't have any use for a car that drives like a truck, with terrible viability. How exactly does it drive "like a truck" Vigo327 posted:Not sure what the question is but i'd venture their MPG is at least 10% worse than an IS300 because their motor is 100+% bigger. I averaged like 14.5mpg over 5 years of ownership with one. Best ever tank was 21mpg of pure highway worst was 7mpg (at a racetrack). Actually now that I think about it, that is one way in which an SRT8 drives "like a truck", terrible but justified mileage.
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Sep 22, 2013 20:46
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I drive my v6 magnum daily and after 8 years of daily driving an actual truck, I can say for sure the magnum is no truck. I'll give you the visabilty thing, but a backup cam helps immensely.
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Sep 23, 2013 01:14
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Ok, OK....a sporty truck! Granted, this was not my car that I test drove so I couldn't drive it hard...but I don't think I would have wanted to. I'm not a race car driver, but my impression was that it would have been much happier plowing straight ahead, than turning in at any speed. Maybe because of the weight it carries? I thought the steering was slow and heavy as well. Hey just my impression, by all means go drive one if it's what you like.....for me it was like the old saying, "never meet your heroes".
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Sep 23, 2013 02:04
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angryrobots posted:Ok, OK....a sporty truck! I only quoted these parts where you were being exceedingly reasonable and avoiding an argument to tell you i appreciate your reasonableness! It's nice when we can get on a car forum and disagree and not have it turn into a dick-waving match (of bench-racing station wagons). I like 850s pretty well. I would REALLY like a RWD whiteblock turbo box wagon. And after being around and working on the S80 i helped my mom buy for the last few years, one of my angsty-est feelings is the sadness that a true s80 wagon was never produced.  Such a thing would be way cooler than a Magnum or an 850, in my estimation. But alas..
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Sep 23, 2013 18:39
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I posted before that I am looking for a new wagon, and didn't even consider a jetta TDI sportwagen until I found out their price. I have always said I would not own a VAG car that does not have a warranty, but these are cheap enough I would consider buying one new. I know a couple people have posted them in here and I was wondering how you guys like them? They are fwd, and I was kinda leaning more towards a AWD car, but being in seattle it doesn't really matter. How reliable are they? Any big issues that I should know about before considering one?
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Sep 23, 2013 19:11
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Vigo327 posted:I only quoted these parts where you were being exceedingly reasonable and avoiding an argument to tell you i appreciate your reasonableness! It's nice when we can get on a car forum and disagree and not have it turn into a dick-waving match (of bench-racing station wagons) Ha, thanks. I'd like to point out that AI's favorite tv show is about 3 brits who make comedy about their vehicular differences of opinion....some may do well to keep that in mind. But I'd like to bust out the dick measuring tape real quick to say that my DD is a v8 tundra; my work DD is an f-750 with air brakes; and my personal toy is an e30 on bilsteins. If I say the magnum drives like a polish meat lorry then that's what it does. You pillocks.
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Sep 23, 2013 20:00
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angryrobots posted:Ha, thanks. I'd like to point out that AI's favorite tv show is about 3 brits who make comedy about their vehicular differences of opinion....some may do well to keep that in mind. v8 tundra you say? If it's a 4.7 then check your cooling fan bearing pulley for a pile of metal shavings right behind the bearing signaling impending PITA. If its a 5.7 get a tune that makes it shift harder. As for Top Gear, James May is my favorite of them. But i do manage to offend more often than he does. 
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Sep 23, 2013 22:04
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Negromancer posted:I posted before that I am looking for a new wagon, and didn't even consider a jetta TDI sportwagen until I found out their price. I have always said I would not own a VAG car that does not have a warranty, but these are cheap enough I would consider buying one new. I know a couple people have posted them in here and I was wondering how you guys like them? They are fwd, and I was kinda leaning more towards a AWD car, but being in seattle it doesn't really matter. How reliable are they? Any big issues that I should know about before considering one? My dad drives one now. I'm aware of no issues so far with regard to reliability, but it's not that old a car. It's extremely sensible, possibly the most sensible car currently on sale in the US. Lots of room for luggage, amazing unrefueled range, still manageable in tight spaces, not even that much noisier than the gasoline 2.0 turbo it shares a driveway with.
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Sep 23, 2013 22:43
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angryrobots posted:Ok, OK....a sporty truck! Its a big car, but the SRT's can definitely hustle through the corners. They also have great brakes if you use a good pad compound. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTG579ORDqo Holding on to a spec racer through a long right hander before blowing by it on the straight. Then later letting a lotus exige cup (on hoosiers) by and running him back down before hitting some traffic. Also me and another magnum driving terribly at Monticello motor club https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZPxV-Ws-7c I dont have one any more but its far from a pure straight line car or a truck
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Sep 23, 2013 22:49
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Hard to compare cars like that at a trackday - you could be balls-out and the car you're barely keeping up with is working on lines or something.
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Sep 23, 2013 23:02
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Vigo327 posted:I would REALLY like a RWD whiteblock turbo box wagon. And after being around and working on the S80 i helped my mom buy for the last few years, one of my angsty-est feelings is the sadness that a true s80 wagon was never produced. Are you under the mistaken impression that an S80 is RWD? Because the V70 made from 01 to 09 is on the same platform and pretty much an S80 wagon. Or did you mean S90/V90 which came as RWD whiteblocks but had no turbo.
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Sep 23, 2013 23:14
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 Has anyone ever driven one of these (the SS)? For some reason I was reading about them the other day and all the reviews were pretty glowing except for some visibility issues and the cheap interior.
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Sep 24, 2013 01:01
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BlackMK4 posted:Hard to compare cars like that at a trackday - you could be balls-out and the car you're barely keeping up with is working on lines or something. The guy in the exige was driving hard, we had a conversation about how a big wagon was filling his mirrors. If you want to use a real benchmark, AI's favorite little race car the spec miata will have qualifying times at that track of around a 1:20 there. My SRT8 was typically running 1:16-1:17's there with no traffic.
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Sep 24, 2013 03:13
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blk posted:
Exact same drivetrain as the Cobalt SS, with the same LSD (option) in the trans. The visibility is terrible, the ergonomics of various things, like the door locks and window switches, are incredibly frustrating.
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Sep 24, 2013 03:19
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Left Ventricle posted:Exact same drivetrain as the Cobalt SS, with the same LSD (option) in the trans. The visibility is terrible, the ergonomics of various things, like the door locks and window switches, are incredibly frustrating. So Chevy managed to copy every terrible aspect of the PT Cruiser. Good to know.
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Sep 24, 2013 03:35
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blk posted:
Because reasons. I'm just not a fan of GM's interior styling and use of materials. Kenny Rogers fucked around with this message at 03:52 on Sep 24, 2013 |
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Sep 24, 2013 03:46
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PhotoKirk posted:So Chevy managed to copy every terrible aspect of the PT Cruiser. Good to know. The exteriors were designed by the same dude so it's not so surprising. A friend of mine has a HHR that isn't a SS and it's like driving a loving tank, you can't see poo poo.
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Sep 25, 2013 00:25
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LloydDobler posted:Are you under the mistaken impression that an S80 is RWD? Because the V70 made from 01 to 09 is on the same platform and pretty much an S80 wagon. Or did you mean S90/V90 which came as RWD whiteblocks but had no turbo. I think i would have figured out the S80 was rwd while i was putting a timing belt on its transverse engine or installing control arms etc. So no. I would like something LIKE the v90/960 wagon but the front of that car kind of ruins it for me. I like the 850 styling so if you stuck that on a v90 with a turbo i would be tickled. I am in love with the styling of the original s80, which is why a v70 doesn't count as an s80 wagon to me: it doesn't look the same and it doesn't look near as good (to me. totally subjective). And of course if i'm going to dream up an s80 wagon it might as well be t6, gm 4t60, AND awd, which were never offered together in that car either. VVV- Not a problem at all my man, your v70 and turbo v90 points are perfectly valid and the only problem i have with either is styling (to each their own!). Vigo327 fucked around with this message at 18:22 on Sep 25, 2013 |
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Sep 25, 2013 15:03
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Sorry, didn't mean to sound judgy there, I was just really confused because I think the S80 looks really close to the V70, but I have the opposite taste as you (V70 > S80). To each their own.
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Sep 25, 2013 18:08
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So i anticipate i will be derided heavily on account of some people not considering this a station wagon, but Datsun (yes, Datsun) just revealed this bad boy, the Go+. It has a 1.2L gas engine and 5spd manual. If you were to seriously ask about hooking an automatic to that bad boy i would say you are shopping the wrong segment. But it seats 7 and lists for ~$8700 in India! I know i'm a little off by american car enthusiast standards but i do wish that they would sell stuff like this here, and that people would buy them. If they could make it hit our safety standards and sell for $12k new i'd think it was an important contributor to our market. There are probably a lot of young families that could use a tiny 3-row wagon-thing with current safety tech for a measly $200/mo financed. And to be honest.. I think this thing is slightly cooler than the cheapest nissan you can get here, the hideous Versa Sedan.
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Sep 25, 2013 21:53
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Vigo327 posted:
I think that actually, the vast majority of real car enthusiasts would poo poo bricks of joy upon the return of little econoboxes with minimal features and 4/5 speed sticks. Hell make it 5/6 speed cause it's 2013. We all need a tin can to get our asses to our day jobs so we can work on our Boss 427 Cleveland Hemi MustangCudas over the weekend Your problem segment is the other 98% of car owners that now evidently consider things like backup cameras and flip down DVD screens to be _standard_ equipment. They're not going to buy a $10k car when they can get a $35k Altima or whatever the gently caress for ;siren: the same monthly payment! 
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Sep 27, 2013 20:54
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Jonny 290 posted:Your problem segment is the other 98% of car owners that now evidently consider things like backup cameras and flip down DVD screens to be _standard_ equipment. I just got my first backup camera (on a used 07 model) and i find it is pretty useless in all but tight parallel parking, which only happens in all the places i try to avoid driving to. I was just reading an article about autonomous cars and they were talking about driver aids leading to a general decrease in driving prowess. A researcher stated "it's pretty well established in the aviation world that autopilot is decreasing piloting ability". I'm tempted to think that is the case with some of these non-safety electronic aids. I mean, lane departure warning is one thing. But parking aids are a crutch for not knowing how to drive. I'm not sure that's good for society.
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Sep 27, 2013 23:13
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Vigo327 posted:So i anticipate i will be derided heavily on account of some people not considering this a station wagon, but Datsun (yes, Datsun) just revealed this bad boy, the Go+. Dunno, 75 hp to move what must be at least 2000 lbs of car unladen (I base this guess on the Nissan Micra, a smaller car which shares platforms with this)? I think the standards for "dangerously slow" are often pretty overstated, but even I would be put off at getting something like that up to highway speeds if you're selling it as having seating for up to seven corn-fed Americans. Also, add in the cost of airbags, TPMS, and other required safety equipment and you're probably already going to start tickling the $10k mark. Pay a little more and you get a whole lot more car. Though I do agree that more utilitarian transport options would be cool - something that's intended for fleet buyers and has cost of running and ease of maintenance prioritized over stuff like styling. OXBALLS DOT COM fucked around with this message at 00:38 on Sep 28, 2013 |
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Sep 28, 2013 00:33
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Vigo327 posted:I just got my first backup camera (on a used 07 model) and i find it is pretty useless in all but tight parallel parking, which only happens in all the places i try to avoid driving to. Here, we think it's normal to drive, and to do so well, and we believe that it's a necessary skill. The truth, however, is that we as humans spent hundreds of thousands of years now knowing how to drive, just a few short decades where it is a skill that some people in some places have, and there are still huge, huge swaths of the planet where not knowing how to drive is not the slightest impediment to daily life. I don't see how stepping directly from "Don't have to know how to drive" to "STILL don't have to know how to drive" is a bad thing - particularly when 'not having to concentrate on operating the vehicle' is flat out safer for *everyone* involved in any and every circumstance. I don't care if you're Michael Schumacher - if you're going to parallel park in front of my car downtown, I'd *prefer* you have a car that will park itself. If that's not possible, I'd like for you to have as many loving parking assists as is technologically feasible, given that you (and by 'you', I mean 'everyone') have a non-zero parking error rate.
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Sep 28, 2013 03:04
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Kenny Rogers posted:When driving your own car, and being good at it (like almost all AI) is absolutely the norm, and not knowing how to drive (or driving "poorly" - i.e. "mostly good enough to not actually crash into anything but perhaps a handful of times per decade, but bad enough to have more than a few close calls") is reason for derision (like much of AI), then your point of view tends to be skewed by the subculture in which you "live" - it's a little tiny slice of the horrible subculture viewpoint-shifting that "PLM" fans, or furries, or Social Justice Warriors, or, hell, *astronomers* have for that matter. Your peers influence your own viewpoint, and when you have enough peers, that viewpoint becomes somewhat monolithic, at least when compared to the viewpoints of people not in that peer group. I suppose my last sentence opened up a can of worms? To be honest i feel that being able to accurately operate a motor vehicle when need be has a lot of overlap with other 'abilities' or competencies i consider important. Driving is a microcosm of high-stakes situations in general and i feel like someone who commits themselves to developing a level of competency that allows them to act decisively and confidently under threat of real consequences will carry some amount of that skillset into every high-stakes situation. I have been known to rant frequently about all the negative consequences that i feel result from the vast majority of society operating under a false 'assumption of safety'. But, to get any further into this whole topic would be even more OT than i already am in a Station Wagon Thread. Suffice to say i never backed my last wagon into anything in the absence of a backup camera, and i now actively try to ignore it in my current vehicle because i find it focuses your attention too narrowly and makes you lose spatial awareness due to its tiny field of vision.
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Sep 28, 2013 06:34
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Jonny 290 posted:I think that actually, the vast majority of real car enthusiasts would poo poo bricks of joy upon the return of little econoboxes with minimal features and 4/5 speed sticks. Hell make it 5/6 speed cause it's 2013. We all need a tin can to get our asses to our day jobs so we can work on our Boss 427 Cleveland Hemi MustangCudas over the weekend You can get a mazda 2 that has ac for like $13-14k out the door with a slick 5 speed. It even has monotube shocks and three digits of horsepower. Yet, no one, not even enthusiasts, bought them (except me and one other ai guy). Edit: It is even hilariously to parallel park.
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Sep 28, 2013 23:56
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The thing about "enthusiasts don't buy them" has killed many a good car. So many enthusiasts, myself included, are not going to spend new car money, regardless of the relative bargain. I'm happy to buy something cheap, and tinker on it. And so the car market is swayed toward what people who do buy and lease new vehicles want. Also it seems like vehicle prices have far outpaced inflation. My perception is that holy poo poo, 13 grand is a pile of money for a tiny car.
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Sep 29, 2013 01:08
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angryrobots posted:The thing about "enthusiasts don't buy them" has killed many a good car. So many enthusiasts, myself included, are not going to spend new car money, regardless of the relative bargain. I'm happy to buy something cheap, and tinker on it. And so the car market is swayed toward what people who do buy and lease new vehicles want. Now compare the features, utility, and reliability of a 1987 Yugo GV and a 2013 Mazda 2. $4000 worth of "better"? Probably. Kenny Rogers fucked around with this message at 01:29 on Sep 29, 2013 |
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Sep 29, 2013 01:27
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The Yugo was voted Car Talk's worst car of the millennium. So yeah without a doubt the mazda2 is the bargain there regardless of inflation.
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Sep 29, 2013 02:21
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The Yugo was/is a fine automobile of remarkable intelligence in engineering and packaging. It's fun to drive, easy to maintain, and inexpensive to operate. The Yugo, in fact, was/is a far better car than most people care to admit or realize. It's only problem was that it was not a car designed for the American market, and Americans didn't know how to take it. 
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Sep 29, 2013 19:24
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nm posted:You can get a mazda 2 that has ac for like $13-14k out the door with a slick 5 speed. It even has monotube shocks and three digits of horsepower. Yet, no one, not even enthusiasts, bought them (except me and one other ai guy). There is a whole cabal of people who bought Mazda2s on GRM forums where i'm pretty active. But, enthusiasm for them among owners seems to be tapering off now after a couple years. I think a Mazda2 is sort of like a base model CRX. It has the basics down and a lot of inherent goodness, but without a performance version you'll get bored of it after a while. Unfortunately for Mazda fans the performance version of the Mazda2 is a Ford (Fiesta ST).
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Sep 29, 2013 19:40
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As the other AI guy with a Mazda2, it will never become boring catching up with people in freeway on-ramps and 4 wheel drifting it. It is boring trying to merge into traffic though. t
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Sep 29, 2013 20:17
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Thread too dead. Here's a semi-cool wagon. I wouldn't mind owning this thing. http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/cto/4100174171.html  I'm newish here, how do you people do that thing where CL ads show up in a quote?  Or how about this? http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/cto/4103509255.html Vigo327 fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Oct 4, 2013 |
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Oct 4, 2013 17:33
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As a Mercedes wagon owner, I can only sing their praises of course. On the other hand, P1800s are well known as high mileage capable automobiles. Though I believe that one is more properly called a shooting brake.
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Oct 4, 2013 18:37
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Thread is a little dead. Here, have a picture of the new MINI, "Agent".  
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Oct 4, 2013 18:37
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Vigo327 posted:There is a whole cabal of people who bought Mazda2s on GRM forums where i'm pretty active. But, enthusiasm for them among owners seems to be tapering off now after a couple years. I think a Mazda2 is sort of like a base model CRX. It has the basics down and a lot of inherent goodness, but without a performance version you'll get bored of it after a while. 100hp has been fine for the B-segment in the past, and with good suspension and a 5 speed it still is. I do wonder how hard it would be to fit the 'skyactive' 2.0 in that little bastard. Hell, make that the only engine option, the mileage might not even change.
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Oct 4, 2013 19:13
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Here, have more wagon. Click for BIIIIIIIIIG
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Oct 4, 2013 22:18
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Ineptus Mechanicus posted:100hp has been fine for the B-segment in the past, and with good suspension and a 5 speed it still is. I do wonder how hard it would be to fit the 'skyactive' 2.0 in that little bastard. Hell, make that the only engine option, the mileage might not even change. It'd probably improve - one of the Mazda2's biggest strikes against it in the cost-is-everything market is that it comes in a bit on the thirty side, especially with the ancient automatic, and that's before you even get the 3cyl Fiesta to compare to.
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